全 98 件のコメント

[–]JirachiWishmaker 8ポイント9ポイント  (28子コメント)

...how is this NSFW?

[–]Sheadog369 2ポイント3ポイント  (26子コメント)

It's not, /u/atario is throwing a tantrum because someone told them to mark a post as NSFW.

[–]uss1701jb -2ポイント-1ポイント  (25子コメント)

"tantrum"

[–]Dannflor 3ポイント4ポイント  (24子コメント)

I mean, no. But he's being a bit childish about the whole thing.

[–]albro1 1ポイント2ポイント  (10子コメント)

"a bit"

Honestly, I don't come here to see Atario doing some "Occupy /r/ks" movement and NSFW tagging everything. I come here to look at the art, read people's posts, etc.

I've been here for quite a while, and before this "fiasco", I could safely and confidently browse this subreddit wherever I wanted. NSFW things were appropriately tagged, and if someone saw me looking at one of the SFW images, I was fine with that. It might even open up dialog about the game and get another person to experience it.

I just don't understand why all this has to happen. Tagging things as NSFW really is not hard. It isn't the most clearly defined line, but it is fairly visible. And in the case that you miss it and don't mark appropriately, then someone will surely let you know in the comments and you can fix it. Why can we not just get along?

I thought /u/Atario was pretty cool before all this. Now I can't see his name without sighing in frustration because I know I'm about to see some stupid shit.

It doesn't have to be this way. It really doesn't. Atario, man, can you stop? Just...stop doing all this. It isn't worth it. Just mark things that you believe are clearly NSFW, and appease people if they believe something should be marked. Can you do that?

[–]uss1701jb -2ポイント-1ポイント  (12子コメント)

Not as childish as the people who demanded NSFW tags.

[–]FoxtrotZero 2ポイント3ポイント  (11子コメント)

Horseshit. The tag exists for a reason. It's not childish to ask that it be used with reasonable discretion.

[–]uss1701jb -1ポイント0ポイント  (10子コメント)

Yes, which those people didn't do. Atario was using reasonable discretion; ergo, the prudes were childish.

[–]FoxtrotZero 0ポイント1ポイント  (9子コメント)

You should read the post I made in reply to another one of your comments. Definitions of reasonable discretion vary. A non-trivial number of people disagreed with his discretion. Instead of taking a suggestion and letting it go like some sort of a rational human being, Atario has to drag this out into a community-dividing conflict.

[–]uss1701jb -1ポイント0ポイント  (8子コメント)

It's a bad suggestion though.

[–]FoxtrotZero 2ポイント3ポイント  (7子コメント)

"The suggestion is good" is a subjective opinion.

"A significant section of active commenters deem this post NSFW-worthy" is an objective statement.

Now why don't you tell me which of these is a fallacious to use in a logically constructed argument?

[–]E-2-I -5ポイント-4ポイント  (0子コメント)

It is for someone somewhere!

[–]PabloTheOffender 8ポイント9ポイント  (27子コメント)

The NSFW tag got removed lmao

[–]Dannflor 3ポイント4ポイント  (24子コメント)

Good. It actually hurts more than it helps.

[–]Sheadog369 2ポイント3ポイント  (23子コメント)

Agreed, if everything is tagged NSFW, there's no way to tell what any of the content is.

[–]uss1701jb -4ポイント-3ポイント  (22子コメント)

Then don't browse this subreddit at work.

This isn't fucking hard, people. We only get a few posts a day, they can wait a few hours.

[–]albro1 1ポイント2ポイント  (21子コメント)

Or instead of trying to put a bandaid over the situation, we could actually try to resolve it...but Atario wants none of that.

[–]uss1701jb 0ポイント1ポイント  (17子コメント)

There was no "situation" until the prudes of this sub started one. They're the minority, they should stop trowing a fit an realize that most people don't mind seeing an ankle or even a few arms now and then.

[–]TheDwarfLard 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

... an ankle or even a few arms...

That's not what caused people to say something. And those people were merely asking if the posts could be tagged. Tagging isn't censorship.

[–]FoxtrotZero 0ポイント1ポイント  (15子コメント)

I complained about this post for not being tagged when it was posted. The girl is literally wearing nothing but an apron. The exposure is a little more than "an ankle or an arm". I want you to ask yourself if you think you'd be okay with just anyone, potentially your employer, walking up behind you and seeing this. If the answer is yes, you need to understand that you are in the minority and the world doesn't conform solely to your experiences.

You see, it's not fair and equitable for the subreddit at large to dictate when I decide to view content. I browse reddit throughout my day because I have a lot of downtime in a public setting. I like to know for sure what kind of content I'm opening beforehand, especially because thumbnails don't always load on a stressed mobile connection or public wifi network.

This is the textbook situation for which the NSFW tag exists, and the reddiquette, the standard by which the vast majority of this site abides and is held, specifically requests that Posts containing explicit material such as nudity, horrible injury etc, add NSFW (Not Safe For Work) for nudity, and tag.

Tagging a post takes no more than a couple of clicks. To determine what is and is not Safe for Work is takes no more than a moment's consideration. To consider, upon request, that perhaps one's judgement was imperfact and an NSFW tag would be prudent, carries no shame. It would be nigh effortless for Atario to tag his posts where applicable and we could all carry on with our day.

But he insists on childishly rebelling, disrupting the civility of a subreddit we all hold dear, attempting to make a point where no point need made and crying out against percieved tyrany when the moderator attempts to set him straight. This entire ordeal stems from some complex wherein Atario can't handle a simple suggestion.

[–]E-2-I -2ポイント-1ポイント  (5子コメント)

"Don't go on this subbreddit while on work or in public!" is s simple suggestion too, you know!

[–]albro1 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

That is a suggestion, yes, but it can't be enforced at all.

NSFW tags can. Though, if dubiousbro doesn't want to go through the trouble, he could just end this by issuing bans. idk

[–]FoxtrotZero 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

You see, it's not fair and equitable for the subreddit at large to dictate when I decide to view content. I browse reddit throughout my day because I have a lot of downtime in a public setting. I like to know for sure what kind of content I'm opening beforehand, especially because thumbnails don't always load on a stressed mobile connection or public wifi network. This is the textbook situation for which the NSFW tag exists.

But since you're interested in attempting to make points I've already refuted, I should add that I rarely, if ever, browse by the individual subreddit. I am subscribed to /r/KatawaShoujo and it's posts appear on my front page. I'm also not in the habit of meticulously checking what subreddit the post I'm about to open belongs to. If I see an NSFW post, I will check my surroundings, and often opt to wait and view the post at home.

I shouldn't have to have to worry about content in a single subreddit when every other subreddit follows the guidelines and enforces post tagging. Asking Atario to tag posts was not prudish or uncalled for. What is uncalled for is Atario's decision to blanket tag all posts. Aside from the disruptive arguments that now pervade this subreddit, I have no choice but to operate under the assumption that all of these posts actually are deserving of the NSFW tag, and thus my ability to enjoy content is impeded unnecessarily.

Neither you nor Atario nor anyone else get to enforce upon me when and where I view content. That is my decision. We, subscribers to /r/KatawaShoujo and redditors at large, do get to decide what posts are deserving of NSFW tags. That is how the reddit model works, and /u/dubiousbro should be commended for attempting to bring rationality to the situation where Atario insists on thowing it to the roadside.

[–]Atario[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I have no choice but to operate under the assumption that all of these posts actually are deserving of the NSFW tag, and thus my ability to enjoy content is impeded unnecessarily.

So all this digital ink you're spilling is over you being made to wait a few hours to look at a single post per day, when otherwise you'd only have to do that some days.

[–]uss1701jb -2ポイント-1ポイント  (6子コメント)

To determine what is and is not Safe for Work is takes no more than a moment's consideration.

And Atario decided against what you believe, which is why we needed a mod brought in in the first place. Mod told us to use NSFW tags, and now Atario does, and you continue to bitch!

[–]FoxtrotZero 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

Nobody faults Atario for thinking that the post didn't need an NSFW tag. To add the tag would be a simple request to comply with that would leave all parties happy if Atario did not have an unexplained pathological objection to the content. The only coherent defenses I've seen thus far is "Atario made a judgement" and "everyone who asked for an NSFW tag is a prude".

The sidebar clearly states:

You will be banned if you choose not to mark relevant posts as NSFW.

The operative term in this statement is "relevant". The moderator of the subreddit has sided against Atario's determination of what is and is not relevant. A hyperreactionary policy of blanket-tagging designed to seek attention and cause disruption does not quality as "tagging relevant posts". Much the same way that one may be considered an unsafe driver for being too far below the speed limit on the highway, Atario's childish rebellion runs him afoul of the subreddit rules and general civility.

[–]uss1701jb -2ポイント-1ポイント  (4子コメント)

There is no rule that states not to tag SFW posts as NSFW.

[–]Atario[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

You see, it's not fair and equitable for the subreddit at large to dictate when I decide to view content.

But it is fair and equitable for you to dictate to us what is and is not safe?

Posts containing explicit material such as nudity, horrible injury etc, add NSFW (Not Safe For Work) for nudity, and tag.

The question is what constitutes nudity (apparently). You seem to think being behind a large piece of cloth constitutes nudity. Whereas I do not.

But all that is water over the dam at this point, as we are now simply in a situation where no definitive way exists to determine what qualifies according to official rules — because at this point they seem simply to be not rules at all but mod tastes. And since it is the mod who holds the power to ban, that's the only taste that matters.

The only way to make oneself safe in such an indeterminate environment is to tag everything. And that's exactly why I'm doing it.

To consider, upon request, that perhaps one's judgement was imperfact and an NSFW tag would be prudent, carries no shame.

Indeed. And I did consider it, every time. There is also no shame in sticking by one's convictions, as it turns out. There is, however, danger in it.

It would be nigh effortless for Atario to tag his posts where applicable

And I do. Every post is potentially going to violate official tastes, therefore every post needs to be tagged. Simple as that.

and we could all carry on with our day.

You could do that right now. But no, everyone desperately needs to insult, attack, belittle, and in every other way jump down my throat. Apparently it's more important to certain people to force me to tag exactly as they wish than it is to act in a civil manner.

But he insists on childishly rebelling

I keep hearing this: childish. Funny, it seems to me that it is the exact opposite of childish to do what one can to comply with the rules and protect oneself. You want childish? Downvoting artist credit comments out of spite. That's childish. Throwing around epithets like "idiotic" and "tantrum" because someone is posting in a way that is not exactly attuned to one's own sensibilities. That's childish. Blocking people you disagree with on a policy matter. That's childish.

disrupting the civility

Nothing is disrupted till someone inevitably pipes up to call me a name. Which, as we have established, is amazingly mature, civil behavior.

attempting to make a point where no point need made

Interesting that as long as it's my point, it need not be made.

crying out against percieved tyrany

I defy you to point out anywhere I've done this. Because I haven't. What we have here is not a matter of tyranny, but of simple piss-poor management.

This entire ordeal stems from some complex wherein Atario can't handle a simple suggestion.

Quite the contrary, I've taken the "suggestion" to heart — since anything posted could get someone in trouble, everything must be tagged. Because apparently NSFW has never meant "this is definitely not safe", but rather "someone somewhere could conceivably find this not safe", and I just didn't know it all these decades.

[–]FoxtrotZero 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

But it is fair and equitable for you to dictate to us what is and is not safe?

You and I stand on the same level. Neither of us have authority here. I have dictated nothing. You, however, continue to fly in the face of the notion of that which is "safe" and "unsafe" derives from a group effort, not a personal vendetta.

But all that is water over the dam at this point, as we are now simply in a situation where no definitive way exists to determine what qualifies according to official rules — because at this point they seem simply to be not rules at all but mod tastes. And since it is the mod who holds the power to ban, that's the only taste that matters.

I will agree that a finer definition on what does and does not constitute NSFW content would be greatly helpful, and it's a shame the mods have not opted to provide for such a reference. The mod, however, seems to consider this unnecessary. With that in mind:

The only way to make oneself safe in such an indeterminate environment is to tag everything. And that's exactly why I'm doing it.

The difficulty is that you have taken the argument to the opposite exteme, which is more disruptive than it is helpful, and the argument of "it's unsafe for someone somewhere", which I can only envision delievered with an artifically sweet grin, is an intentional red herring. If you continue to deny that the primary motivation behind this tagging is protest, even if the protest is for the right reasons, we're simply not going to get anywhere and you will in all likelihood find yourself banned as our superior tires of the drama.

Indeed. And I did consider it, every time. There is also no shame in sticking by one's convictions, as it turns out. There is, however, danger in it.

I've fallen into the trap of letting this discussion be more personal than I should - verily, the same failing I've accused you of. I think we'll find this particular point is a values judgment, but if you'll explain what you gain by sticking to your guns versus conceding that the post might be worthy of an NSFW tag, we may begin to better understand one another.

To that point, there are several points I'm not going to counter because they're valid. In my annoyance I've made ad hominem attacks and soiled my attempt to be the better man.

crying out against percieved tyrany

I would not make this accusation if I didn't distinctly remember reading it, but to your credit, I cannot find the example in question. This hyperbolic post is the best I have found after a cursory search, but I do not submit it as evidence.

Quite the contrary, I've taken the "suggestion" to heart — since anything posted could get someone in trouble, everything must be tagged. Because apparently NSFW has never meant "this is definitely not safe", but rather "someone somewhere could conceivably find this not safe", and I just didn't know it all these decades.

You see, if you want to understand why you're having the accusation "childish" thrown against you so often, this is it. There has been a steadily escalating dispute over the definition of NSFW content. I think everyone would agree the mature way to handle a dispute is with level-headed discussion and compromise. Instead we have been met with overreaction and attention-garnering displays. It's the difference between sitting down in a meeting room to discuss an issue and picketing an establishment to force the issue.

The latter has it's place, but it is not before the former, and I am left to question it's utility. You claim the issue stems from a lack of clarification on the part of the moderator, but if you can show me an exchange - preferably before the issue was publicly addressed in the post stickied at the top of the subreddit - where clarification was asked for or rationally discussed, you would lend some justification to your actions. Meanwhile, there is no denying that this entire ordeal has been disruptive to the subreddit as a whole.

[–]Atario[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Right, no resolution to the situation. That's exactly what this is: me trying not to get some decently definitive rules enacted instead of the uselessly vague bullshit combined with dick-waving threats we have now.

[–]TheDwarfLard 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Did you see this?

Additionally, that's what Dubious has decided to use as the cutoff.

[–]Atario[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I didn't, thanks for pointing that out

[–]Joby05 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

This I like VERY much! <3

[–]Sheadog369 5ポイント6ポイント  (32子コメント)

Stop being such a goddamn baby.

[–]uss1701jb -1ポイント0ポイント  (14子コメント)

Where were you when the actual goddamn babies were being prudes about a bit of skin showing?

[–]Sheadog369 0ポイント1ポイント  (13子コメント)

When exactly did this happen? I'm looking through the posts for the week and can't find it.

[–]uss1701jb 3ポイント4ポイント  (12子コメント)

Started a few weeks back, has been brewing since, and DB obviously brought it up earlier this week

[–]Sheadog369 0ポイント1ポイント  (11子コメント)

Got a link? I know about DB's post, but my memory is pretty shit, can't remember the posts from that far back.

[–]chargersphinx 1ポイント2ポイント  (10子コメント)

[–]Sheadog369 0ポイント1ポイント  (9子コメント)

I meant the posts where "actual goddamn babies were being prudes about a bit of skin showing"

[–]chargersphinx 4ポイント5ポイント  (8子コメント)

[–]Parzivus 0ポイント1ポイント  (7子コメント)

All of those are pretty nsfw. I wouldn't want a boss/teacher/etc seeing that, particularly living in the Southern US. At home, no problem. Just because not every post sparks a fight means it doesn't need a nsfw tag.
Edit: meant the first three guys, thighs aren't NSFW.

[–]chargersphinx 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

Even the last one? I can understand where others are coming from if they think the first 3 need a tag, however it's up to the poster to decide what's NSFW or not as they are making the post, especially so when the rule for NSFW isn't (And cannot possibly be due to the amount of variance of images and art) particularly specific.

For example, the first one some might consider NSFW, I don't but others do, that's fine. If you're worried about what others will think of you looking at such images, it's probably a better idea altogether to wait until you feel comfortable to do so privately rather than rag on the OP incessantly for his/her foresight not being in line with the opinions of the populace.

I live in the Southern U.S. as well, however I choose what is and what isn't a good time to look at various images, but this being the internet there's always the chance something will slip, thus sometimes it's just better to wait for a more appropriate time.

[–]E-2-I 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

So thighs are NSFW now too, now i've seen it all!

[–]Parzivus 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

nsfw

TRIGGERED

[–]Headless_Cow 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Can everyone just chill the fuck out and stop complaining about NSFW in every thread? I mean sure it's a bit annoying, but it's no use derailing the entire subreddit over it.

[–]Mikey_MiG 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's only a problem on Atario posts. If it's going to stop, then he has to stop misusing the tag.

[–]Atario[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

"What's the problem, it's just a harmless tag"
— someone in here several days ago

[–]_blazepath 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is a cool pic. Looks like those anime figurines. Neat.

[–]superhanson2 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm a little out of the loop, what went down with nsfw tags?

[–]Atario[S] -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Artist = ???

[–]Atario[S] -5ポイント-4ポイント  (2子コメント)

NOTE: this post was created with a NSFW tag, but someone has silently removed it against my will. This has also been done to some prior posts.

[–]uss1701jb -3ポイント-2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well, at least he's living up to his flair.

[–]Atario[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ironically, he gave himself that flair during an incident during which he marked the whole subreddit NSFW. Honestly I'd prefer that at this point…