/
    Skip to main content
    Advertisement
    Support Casa LA

    Why should ‘manspreading’ be just for men?

    Zoe Jewell
    This word is now in the Oxford Dictionary – and as a woman who finds this sitting position rather comfortable, I think it’s an unnecessarily gendered issue
    Young couple sitting side by side at night club with man's legs wide apart
    ‘It seems to me that the man prefix compounds the idea that men are aggressive and women are always pleasing, always good, never in the way, and that they can’t act up sometimes themselves.’ Photograph: Alamy
    Yesterday, the term “manspreading” was added to the online Oxford Dictionary. It made the news and I felt surprisingly pissed off about it. On the way to work, I counted three women participating in fine examples of “manspreading”. Ever since I was a teenager, it has always irritated me that sitting with your legs open was seen to be the preserve of men. It seemed to be based on the outmoded assumption that women always wear skirts and that even in trousers they should be making themselves small and polite in public spaces. In an admittedly minor rebellion, I started to sit like that too.
    Of course, I don’t think anyone should ever stop someone else from sitting on a train because they need space for their own knees, but frankly when there’s room, it’s pretty comfortable to sit with your legs open. Just be good-mannered about it. Then yesterday’s win for the term “manspreading” made me think that even when a man or woman is doing it in an irritating way, when the body language isn’t exactly endearing, the word describing this seated position has become unnecessarily gendered.
    There are obviously bigger feminist battles to be fought and I write this very aware of the brilliantly feminist roots of “manspreading” and the need to highlight an action men feel entitled to and women often feel they can’t do. Squishing women on the tube isn’t cool. Other man-prefixed words work the same way.
    I laughed in recognition reading Rebecca Solnit’s essay Men Explain Things to Me, which later inspired the term “mansplaining”, and I too have been the victim of “manterrupting”. Others cite the scourge of “mandermining”, though I can’t say I’ve experienced “manslamming”, when men refuse to move out of the way on a crowded pavement. These terms are a useful and often funny way to point out behaviours that have become the norm for men in our working and social lives, shutting out women’s voices and their physical presence, often aggressively. You just need to look at the language of internet trolls for an example of all this. Women occasionally explain things patronisingly to me, but men do it more often and they think it’s more acceptable too.
    In the end, though, it seems to me that the man prefix compounds the idea that men are aggressive and women are always pleasing, always good, never in the way, and that they can’t act up sometimes themselves. Their knees always remain where they are meant to be, while assertive behaviour is still only associated with men.
    If as a woman you indulge in “manspreading”, “mansplaining” or any other type of “man” action, you’re not just doing something irritating, you’re doing something unfeminine too. These terms have a really important function to point out acts which silence women, but they risk reinforcing the supposed differences between men and women. There’s a danger that, though helpful now, in the long run they could start to shame women as well as the men they are aimed at.
    If my leg spreading annoys you, then tell me off for what it is, whether I’m male or female. Language has power and, despite the feminist intentions of the word, my 15-year-old self is unsure about having “manspreading” preserved in the annals of the Oxford Dictionary, even if it was just the online version.

    comments (289)

    Sign in or create your Guardian account to join the discussion.
    This discussion is closed for comments.
    We’re doing some maintenance right now. You can still read comments, but please come back later to add your own.
    Commenting has been disabled for this account (why?)
    • Guardian Pick
      Well said Zoe!
      I think the man-X terms are pretty unfair on everyone tbh though. They reinforce negative stereotypes about men, and as you say also reinforce stereotypes of what women SHOULDN'T do.
      If you wanna spread out on the seats 'cause it's comfy (and assuming of course you AREN'T wearing clothes that would expose your genderbits xD) then fuckin go for it. Aint no man gonna complain, and I'd hope no women either.
      Jump to comment
    • Guardian Pick
      If somebody is taking up too much room, be it a man with his legs open or a women with a large handbag, simply say excuse me and sit down. How bloody hard is that? How did this even become an issue?
      Jump to comment
    • Guardian Pick
      How typical that the overwhelming majority of people who respond to this article are men - that's always the case whenever an article pops about a man v. woman issue, feminist issue. It's nearly always men who rush on over to pontificate, whine, make strawman arguments, make jokes and of course never ever dare to actually engage with the substance and content of the article.
      No of course "manspreading" is not the most important "feminist" issue b…
      Jump to comment
    1 2 3 4 6 next
    Loading comments… Trouble loading?
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 61 62
      It seems to just be a synonym of 'sitting comfortably'.
      Of course, if it annoys some feminists on Twitter because one of them once had to actually say 'excuse me' before they sat down, it then turns into The War Against Women.
      It's not very polite to take up lots of room, but being impolite isn't an exclusive trait of males within our species. I don't think most women I know have ever even mentioned this as a thing.
      Reply |
      • 21 22
        You can sit as comfortably as you like, but see those arm-rests - your legs belong inside the space defined by them. And if there is someone opposite you then the centre-line of the carriage is where your entitlement ends. Great, we're ready to ride the Tube now.
        Reply |
      • 7 8
        Surely part of the explanation is that men are, on average, taller than women? It's probably not a full explanation, and I agree with you that entitlements are defined precisely enough by the lines of the arm-rests.
        Reply |
      • 16 17
        "sit as comfortably as you like" != "arm-rests - your legs belong inside the space defined by them"
        Yeah, because you're given loads of room.
        Seeing as you know nothing about them, stop talking bollocks.
        Reply |
    • 14 15
      Thank you for your article, Zoe. I have a horrible feeling it is too reasonable and balanced to be taken seriously here. More's the pity.
      Reply |
      • 61 62
        "Women occasionally explain things patronisingly to me, but men do it more often and they think it’s more acceptable too."
        Is that the balance you're referring to?
        Reply |
      • 8 9
        Is that the balance you're referring to?

        No. The balance is in recognising that the "crime" is not gendered, in the way the word implies it is. I haven't heard a single voice in the media acknowledge that rather obvious basic fact.
        Reply |
      • 6 7
        Fair comment, although I'm surprised that you've actually heard about this 'issue' before! It's a new one to me!
        Reply |
    • 52 53
      If my leg spreading annoys you
      Not a phrase that I've often heard from the women I have known.
      Reply |
      • 13 14
        Spread your legs women.... be free.
        Reply |
      • 9 10
        Our genitals get sweaty confined uncomfortable in close proximity. So we spread to destick
        Reply |
      • 32 33
        Our genitals get sweaty confined uncomfortable in close proximity. So we spread to destick
        ... I had always assumed this was the case plus also I thought it might be a bit uncomfortable given the genital 'structure' so - even as a feminist (and old-fashioned one I admit) - I've never really had a problem with 'manspreading'.
        The only problem I have is with the silly label "manspreading". Actually, I have a problem with all the other "man" prefixes, but then maybe it's because I'm old and it's simply a 'feminist' thing, but it ain't my type of feminism.
        Reply |
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 78 79
      'Manspreading' has to be one of the defining 'first world problems' of modern feminism - surely there must be something more important for feminists to focus their ire on than men sitting in a comfortable position (whether they do so to the detriment of others is more dependent on them being an arsehole than a man).
      Also
      I can’t say I’ve experienced “manslamming”, when men refuse to move out of the way on a crowded pavement.
      I can't particularly say I have either, in fact in my experience it tends to be women who refuse to move out of the way, almost as if they expect that because they're women that men should move out of their way. This isn't even on crowded pavements, on a number of occasions I've walked towards someone where we're the only ones in sight yet they carry on in a straight trajectory and expect me to move. The irony is that if I were to do the same thing, as a 6'3" man, they'd be more likely to get hurt. Not that I would do that, because it's really quite rude.
      Reply |
      • 35 36
        Are you trying to suggest that a person sitting with their knees not entirely pressed together (even though male genitals make this uncomfortable) is less important an issue than the routine rape and torture of women who show the cheek to try and enjoy basic human rights in other countries?
        Well, sir, I am outraged.
        Reply |
      • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
      • 21 22
        my Fiancee is the worst for this and always asks me "why do you move out of the way? they weren't gonna move for you" so she never moves. My response is that if we all worked by the lowest common denominator or tit for tat then nothing would ever get done and everyone would just be angry at everyone else. Then again how far from that is it now. A healthy dose of manners for everyone would be great.
        I've also noticed that people always remember when the incident happens because of the "other people". Be it man/female or any other division you can think about. I realized this and my own prejudices when snowboarding, I can always remember when a skier takes me out and you can guarantee I'll be angry about it, another snowboarder however and i'm quite happy to just pick myself up forget about it and carry on. This was my long winded way of saying gender actually has nothing to do with the issue.
        Reply |
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 12 13
      There is nothing I like less than seeing some twunt doing this on the tube. Oftentimes I choose to sit beside the idiot even if there are other seats available. Funny how they shift their knees when they realise that I'm not going to adjust the way I sit just 'cos they want to be a moron. A lot of manspreaders seem to be uncomfortable with man on man leg contact - well, tough, pal ... your choice. Must be hell for a woman tho', totally gross.
      Reply |
      • 10 11
        there really are some arseholes in the tube, slouching around, legs akimbo like the own the fucking thing. And yes I deliberately sit next to them. Will probably end in a punch up one day.
        Reply |
      • 19 20
        You sound short.
        Reply |
      • 27 28
        You've got to understand that some men have to sit like this because their testicles are just so massive, like a real man, and they need lots of room for their ginormous testicles and sitting like a little sssy girl would be tremendously painful for them.
        Reply |
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 2 3
      The bloke in the pic should tye his boot laces. Scruffy bugger.
      Reply |
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 74 75
      If somebody is taking up too much room, be it a man with his legs open or a women with a large handbag, simply say excuse me and sit down. How bloody hard is that? How did this even become an issue?
      Reply |
      • 23 24
        For some people it seems to make more sense to come online and moan about it.
        Unbelievable.
        If this is an issue in your life, you need to get a life.
        Reply |
      • 4 5
        If they take no notice, then what? People that do this are low life selfish and anti-social and highly unlikely to give a shit if you ask nicely. If you can move, best to do so, but why should you have to? and what if you cant, like on a flight where the flight attendendants do not wish to get involved as I experienced when flying utterly useless Emirates Airlines last night? Do not fly this airline. They let passengers around you do what they want!
        Reply |
      • 2 3
        What if they don't speak English? Is there an acceptable way of using sign language?
        Reply |
    • This comment was removed by a moderator because it didn't abide by our community standards. Replies may also be deleted. For more detail see our FAQs.
    • 25 26
      It's a bit like complaining that "dickhead" is unfairly male-centric.
      Reply |
    • 2 3
      I thought about this recently. A gender-specific sitting position is indeed ludicrous and I think it's perpetuated by parents who want to give their daughters a "proper" training early in life.
      Reply |
      • 2 3
        I thought about this recently. A gender-specific sitting position is indeed ludicrous and I think it's perpetuated by parents who want to give their daughters a "proper" training early in life.
        Working under the assumption that you are a woman: Next time you travel on public transport pop a courgette and a couple of large sprouts down the front of your pants (use a sock and some safety pins to keep them in place), then come back and let me know if 'gender-specific sitting position's' are still ludicrous.
        Reply |
      • 2 3
        I'm not a woman, sunshine! Now stick your courgette and sprouts where the sun doesn't shine.
        Reply |
      • 0 1
        So you're cock is constantly erect? Do you not wear underwear to keep it in place? Carrying around a loose hanging courgette all day would indeed be uncomfortable but let's not pretend you're all strutting about with 8inch semis all day long.
        Reply |
    • 13 14
      Jewell
      In the end, though, it seems to me that the man prefix compounds the idea that men are aggressive and women are always pleasing, always good, never in the way, and that they can’t act up sometimes themselves.
      Exactly. How long will it be before the man- prefix enters the OED with such a definition (or one that simply means 'stuff women don't like')?
      Reply |
    • 2 3
      Some men are boorish, it is true. The "mans_xxx" monikers identify some of those ways. It has never appeared to me at least that they make any distinctions based on gender. They simply seem to be oblivious to, what for most observers, are the obvious legitimate and reciprocal interests and desires of others.
      It seems to be a kind of blind self-centeredness, as in not seeing any other equivalent psychological reality than one's own. Quite unappealing and sometimes downright annoying.
      As to women sitting with their legs apart. They are obviously free to do so, however there is a prevailing social norm that this is indecorous. Equally obviously, there is nothing that says this norm is desirable but it does exist and hence there are consequences from non-compliance - if only very minor ones.
      Such a norm can be undermined in the usual way: people break it in ever larger numbers. On the other hand, maybe women actually value the "demure look"?
      Reply |
    • 39 40
      Just to clarify: you are complaining that, as a woman, you are discouraged from engaging in a type of behaviour that has been condemned as rude, boorish, selfish and anti-social?
      OK, I'm beaten. I don't even know how to take issue with logic like this.
      Reply |
    • 2 3
      It's not something I've ever really given any thought to however, I'd guess that men sit this way as they have more to accomodate between their legs. I mean I need to walk about like John Wayne just to avoid squashing my meat and two veg!
      Reply |
    • 21 22
      You moaners should check your privilege, some of us can't afford to get on a bus or a train these days;
      manspreading - first world elite problem.
      Reply |
    • 6 7
      I 100% agree with the Zoe Jewell. Having spent 14 hours on a flight last night where the 'man' (boy with iq of a chimpanzee and back to front baseball cap to match) spent most of the flight spreading his legs apart into my space I was contemplating corrective surgery on him.
      The options were:
      1. Labotomy to correct the defective mind that thinks it is ok to do this when it offends or inconveniences others or....
      2. If he had such infeasably large gonads that he needed to spread his legs to make room for them, (or even if he thought he did but didn't), I wondered whether removal could have corrected the problem.
      Frankly, I think both would have been well deserved, as his 'manspreading' caused me significant discomfort.
      At 6ft 4in I can cope without 'manspreading' so it clearly is not necessary. So perhaps it should be made illegal with the punishment being corrective surgery as suggested?
      Reply |
      • 47 48
        If you spent 14 hours gnashing your teeth about this and didn't think to politely point it out to the boy-chimp in question, then you've only got yourself to blame.
        Reply |
      • 3 4
        So you don't agree with Zoe then. She argues that she should be allowed to 'menspread' too.
        Reply |
      • 6 7
        At 6ft 4in I can cope without 'manspreading'

        Just assertively push back next time someone tries it on with you. A surprising number of men are uncomfortable with prolonged leg on leg contact. If pushing back with your leg doesn't work, try touching his leg with your hand. But be prepared for what might follow - it could go either way ...
        Reply |
    1 2 3 4 6 next
     
    SECURITY WARNING: Please treat the URL above as you would your password and do not share it with anyone. See the Facebook Help Center for more information.
    SECURITY WARNING: Please treat the URL above as you would your password and do not share it with anyone. See the Facebook Help Center for more information.
    desktop
    0%
    10%
    20%
    30%
    40%
    50%
    60%
    70%
    80%
    90%
    100%