Introducing Team Digital ChaosAnnouncement | eSports (youtube.com)

DobeTT が 7時間前投稿

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[–]SUNSfan -54ポイント-53ポイント-52ポイント 7時間前* (88子コメント)

It might seem weird that the video starts with my timeline, but you have to understand the audience. This was already leaked to reddit last week, so that's not exactly who we're trying to reach.

Posting a video about a team in this fashion makes zero sense for the channel unless our audience has some kind of context, which in this case is me. The video was also deliberately created in this way for people to see that this is not a DotaCinema team, but instead one owned my me.

I knew it would come off as narcissistic to a few, but again, think of the large audience we're trying to introduce this to, aka the DotaCinema youtube channel, many of whom don't follow the competitive scene at all.

edit: Well this seems to be going down the usual path. Feel free to pitchfork me, its not a new thing for me on reddit. All I'm going to say is that although you might disagree with me, I'd like to think I know our audience pretty well. Future content won't have this tone as the purpose of the intro was to bridge the gap for our casual audience, which again, is not reddit. Sorry if the video enrages you.

[–]notamccallister 53ポイント54ポイント55ポイント 7時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]SECRET FANFRIENDWannaBuildABIackMan 47ポイント48ポイント49ポイント 7時間前 (6子コメント)

[–]@leafeatorleafeator 23ポイント24ポイント25ポイント 6時間前 (5子コメント)

[+]#save polar bear flairmakisodamnkawaii スコアが基準値未満のコメント-18ポイント-17ポイント-16ポイント 5時間前 (3子コメント)

[–]GrmpMan 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 5時間前 (1子コメント)

[–]Secret are your TI5 Winners 3-2 vs Na'Vi!PhobozZz1 -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)

[+]Kapparapist スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 5時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]helpfuldan[🍰] 68ポイント69ポイント70ポイント 6時間前* (10子コメント)

I'm not sure why this is a "omg reddit hets me. Figures". I thought I had the wrong video. I'm older then you. I've been on the net longer then you (gopher Lynx pre-aol university user in da house), I've been gaming longer than you, I've been making money on the net since Netscape, and I went back twice to reload the video because I had no fucking clue what was going on. So if I'm fucking confused, maybe I'm a retard. Check comments, nope not retarded, that was fucking stupid.

How can you fuck up sponsoring a team? Nice sizing of the player cards. You let the 11 year old intern handle the player intro while you handled the look at me montage. I spent so much time trying to figure out wtf was going on I thought you were just promoting shit not actually sponsoring them.

Again, how does someone with average intelligence, fuck up a "we're sponsoring a team video"??? In 30 seconds I could have made a video saying "shit just got real. We're proud to announce we're sponsoring a Dota 2 team headed by ti5 champion aui_2000. We dug up the oldest carry in NA, dusted him off, the least savage guy in Dota TC. And because it's NA Dota offlane options were between Bulba, ixmike and a soda can, Bulba barely bested out the soda can in a tryout and he's manning the offlane".

I'm on mobile and my finger hurts but you get the fucking point.

[–]lookin' for a handbeezybvbblepop 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]i'm that guytsunami643 [スコア非表示] 49分前 (1子コメント)

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[–]Secret are your TI5 Winners 3-2 vs Na'Vi!PhobozZz1 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)

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[–]http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039475565/MrTheodore 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 2時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]Zentraedi 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 6時間前 (1子コメント)

[–]Jimbo727 [スコア非表示] 17分前 (0子コメント)

[–]FliccC 16ポイント17ポイント18ポイント 5時間前 (0子コメント)

OK, as a film maker, I'd like give some criticism.

1) What is your audience? The competitive scene, they don't care about your personal acomplishments. The casual scene, well I guess you pretty much scared them off because the video is badly paced, makes no sense and has a very awkward style.

2) What is your goal? You want to show off your own acomplishments? Jump in front of a camera, do it casually with a little smile in the corner of your eye. Be happy about what you do, but don't take yourself too seriously.

You want to introduce a competitive team? do it properly. Create some video footage of them, make short interviews about their motivation and goals, maybe combine it with ingame footage. In the current video there is literally nothing you can connect to.

3) Style. This isn't 1995 anymore. Up until 2000 this kind of style would've maybe been cool, but a 3D modeled room isn't going to impress anyone nowadays. It's impersonal, cold, doesn't say anything and looks generic aka like someone just finished his blender/maya/after effects tutorial. And again, if you'd really like to go this route, then do it right! Make it cheesy, add some 90s references, add anything that will make it look like there is an idea behind it. Also there was no background sound, the sound of the different videos playing were on the same level as everything else, destroying the illusion of a 3D room altogether.

The presentation of the players is as badly as it can get. A pretentious 3D style suddenly presents to us tiny photographs which were very badly taken. Faces with no impression on them in front of a white wall. You're not trying to check into the airport here. When you're introducing someone, the audience actually wants to know something about them other than a face which doesn't say anything and a name in an even tinier font. I think Videos would've been much better here, but again if you want to go with photos, do it right! rent a photo studio for a day, let them dress up, make a montage.

All in all this video gives you no information, no emotional connection to anything. SUNSfan, you're a personality, you've got humour, you're not saying a single word in this video. Just you talking to your audience in whatever way would've acomplished much much more than this video. Everything that's there only serves the purpose to distract from the lack of content that you have. 1:42 for nothing is too long.

I'm sorry to be so harsh, I like the team, I like SUNSfan but I don't like the video.

[–]Learn2Buy 16ポイント17ポイント18ポイント 6時間前 (11子コメント)

edit: Well this seems to be going down the usual path.

It's fucking sad that you know your reputation on reddit and do nothing to change it. You missed a huge opportunity here to actually show that you're not a douche and are passionate about this new project (assuming you are, I can't even tell anymore from this shitty video). All you had to do was appear on camera and not look like an asshole and say the message you were trying to get across in words and not through a shitty highlight reel that just looks like a resume. How hard is that? How is that way of presenting the message any less clear? You would think that actually speaking words and showing the audience a face to connect to things would actually strengthen your message, especially for the casual audience you're trying to target. Your video doesn't just fail on reddit, it fails for everyone. Your video doesn't just have the wrong tone, it has zero tone. It shows no soul or passion. It is completely uninspired and awful.

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-19ポイント-18ポイント-17ポイント 6時間前 (0子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-28ポイント-27ポイント-26ポイント 6時間前 (9子コメント)

[–]Learn2Buy 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 6時間前 (4子コメント)

Yeah we could have done that and it would have been much more personal, albeit with a lot less views.

How would that video get a lot less views??? Like I said before, potential viewers aren't going to know the difference if the title, description, and preview image the same. And you would think that a video that executes and delivers your intended message better, that goes better over the intended audience, would get more views. Please explain how that would not be the case.

My question is, lets say the video we made is complete shit. Why do you feel so offended by it?

Because I want to care about your team and I don't want to see it being undermined by shitty management? Because I'd like to see you rehabilitate your reddit reputation rather than consistently reinforce all the preconceived notions you cry about? Because when the only relevance you have on reddit is showing us how you've fucked up every single time, it gets really old. But at this point if you're going to insist on proving reddit right about you being a narcissistic jackass, then I'm not going to get offended anymore. I'm just not going to support you, your team, your organization, or anything you do in the future.

I guess I'm a little lost as to why you and other people are so worked up about it?

I'm lost as to how you could think the execution of this video was acceptable and how it was the best way to get views.

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-12ポイント-11ポイント-10ポイント 6時間前 (2子コメント)

[–]Learn2Buy 8ポイント9ポイント10ポイント 5時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]rawrifications 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 5時間前 (0子コメント)

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[–]zapXet 32ポイント33ポイント34ポイント 6時間前 (14子コメント)

edit: Well this seems to be going down the usual path. Feel free to pitchfork me, its not a new thing for me on reddit. All I'm going to say is that although you might disagree with me, I'd like to think I know our audience pretty well.

Holy shit dude, are you really that proud? Without reddit, would you have been able to grow your viewerbase to anywhere near the level it has become?

A significant amount of your precious 'audience' is literally telling you right now that you have approached something in the wrong way, but nooo, you can't suck it up and accept the criticism and admit that maybe it has merit, but instead escalate the negative feelings by basically telling us we don't know wtf we're talking about, and now you're gonna cry about how reddit is pitchforking you rather than even considering that maybe you don't always know best...

Not to mention most people, unlike myself, are actually being rather polite to you. I don't have the patience for it anymore.

[–]patrick_mcnam 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 6時間前 (2子コメント)

[–]zapXet 13ポイント14ポイント15ポイント 6時間前 (1子コメント)

[+]Minomos スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 3時間前 (0子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-19ポイント-18ポイント-17ポイント 6時間前 (10子コメント)

[–]zapXet 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 6時間前 (9子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-13ポイント-12ポイント-11ポイント 6時間前 (8子コメント)

[–]zapXet 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 6時間前* (7子コメント)

I can try explain how I see it. Not sure how well that translates for everyone else.

It might seem weird that the video starts with my timeline, but you have to understand the audience. This was already leaked to reddit last week, so that's not exactly who we're trying to reach.

First thing you say is weird here. You say that 'it might seem' that the video starts with your timeline. But that's not really a matter of it 'seeming' that way. That's the very clear intention of the whole first minute of the video isn't it? So this immediately puts you in the position where you are telling the people who don't like this apparent self-promotional approach of the first minute that they just aren't interpreting your video in the 'right way'. AKA, the way you intend it to be taken.

After that you say 'you have to understand the audience'. Again, the tone here is that the people who have already taken issue with the video just don't get it. Well, the thing is, they've already reacted negatively. Telling them that they don't get it ain't gonna make them feel better.

You then say it was already leaked and it wasn't meant for us. Again, the video has appeared here, today, and this is the first time most people are seeing it (like me, and I have this subreddit open like, all day). So it continues with the theme where you're saying that our opinion doesn't count because it's not meant for us. Problem is, it's here. We just saw it, so clearly in some way, we are your audience.

Posting a video about a team in this fashion makes zero sense for the channel unless our audience has some kind of context, which in this case is me. The video was also deliberately created in this way for people to see that this is not a DotaCinema team, but instead one owned my me.

I knew it would come off as narcissistic to a few, but again, think of the large audience we're trying to introduce this to, aka the DotaCinema youtube channel, many of whom don't follow the competitive scene at all.

More along the same line. You're continuing to defend your decision, saying it makes zero sense to put a video on your channel that may be different from this one, and introduce the teams in a different way. The people in this thread who disagree aren't going to change their minds because you continue to insist that your normal viewers somehow wouldn't respond to a more straightforward approach. People won't understand this. It doesn't come off as an actual argument, but just a kneejerk defensive response where you're saying 'trust me, i know what i'm doing.' Keep in mind there are several responses to the video in this thread where people say they are 'massive fans' of yours, but they still don't like how this video was presented.

In another (heavily downvoted) comment you respond as such to someone who says your video sucks:

You're entitled to your opinion, but a video such as that will not get the same amount of views. In the future we are planning to have things similar to what you're describing but it didn't make sense for the launch.

Once again, you're defending your decision here with what appears to be faulty reasoning. Why would a video that's more straightforward and cuts to the chase faster somehow get less views? Wouldn't it be more interesting for people to get a smaller intro of the studio background and a more comprehensive overview of who these new people and this new team might be? After all, your audience already knows who you are. Why not focus more on this new thing you are introducing to them. People who know your channel shouldn't need such a lengthy recap in this format.

So, yeh, I guess that's the gist of my opinion on that.

Edit: And of course there's your edit where you go on about the reddit pitchfork brigade. If that's not self-evidently defensive, I don't know what is. Responding to criticism by basically calling everyone haters is not very productive.

[+]tico01 スコアが基準値未満のコメント-7ポイント-6ポイント-5ポイント 5時間前 (1子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-11ポイント-10ポイント-9ポイント 6時間前 (3子コメント)

[–]socrates111 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 5時間前 (0子コメント)

An upvoted comment on Youtube really doesn't mean much. We have stats to back that up.

I just wanted to comment that the above quote sound pretty ridiculous. I assume by "mean much" you are talking about getting views. Saddly, I think all this is about youtube views, hence revenue for yourself (and not, say, good PR for this team). So if you're claiming to have stats that show that lots of negative, upvoted comments on the youtube video won't hurt your views --- you would need to show that a particular video that lots of people dislike are viewed just as much or more than a video that lost of people like. This is tough to show. If your stats is simply "here's a video with 1 million views that a bunch of people dislike" than that's not relevant because there could be more views if ppl like it.

We also have stats to backup my claim that a video of a different nature would typically garner less views.

Really? Like if you replace the first minute with a highlight real of the players? You have stats that show that this would result in fewer views.

[–]klopjobacid -1ポイント0ポイント1ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]helpfuldan[🍰] 4ポイント5ポイント6ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)

Finally watched it on a desktop, honestly it's even worse. It's not even clear if you own the team, sponsoring, official highlight/interviewer person, promoter, ????. You're a play by play guy, who can bring a little hype/excitement, and there's a new team with aui you're involved with (maybe? sorta), and you can't even mention ti5 champion, can't even get a proper sized image? Aui is marketing gold right now, and somehow, a new team with Aui, you can't even do that?

I don't care about self promotion, if you don't self promote you're an idiot. But the fact people are reloading the video, thinking they have the wrong video, don't understand how you're involved with it, what the other projects have to do with the team, and generally causing mass confusing isn't "reddits fault, you're not the demo, you're not the target, you don't get it". No one gets it, because it's not even remotely clear. On any level. To any demo. People aren't hating it because you're self promoting, they're hating it because it makes no sense, and the player "intro" part looked like shit, was slapped in, and carry fucking Sven. Good job leading with TC first, because of course you're target knows the first guy is the #1 on the team. Despite the fact Aui is marketing gold ATM, lets roll with TC first. You managed to underhype aui's new team. Srsly.

I actually like your casting and videos. But the whole coming here and going "you guys don't get it". Which is funny, because you don't even get the fact there's fundamental flaws in the video that leave people confused as fuck. Was there a rush? Those intros were slightly below Starladder quality. Enough said.

[–]socrates111 7ポイント8ポイント9ポイント 6時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]Learn2Buy 15ポイント16ポイント17ポイント 7時間前 (8子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-35ポイント-34ポイント-33ポイント 7時間前 (7子コメント)

[–]socrates111 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 7時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]Learn2Buy 15ポイント16ポイント17ポイント 7時間前 (0子コメント)

You're entitled to your opinion, but a video such as that will not get the same amount of views.

Yeah that's bullshit. Why does nearly every kickstarter introduction video always show the founder/creator in person explaining things? Because it's the best way to introduce something and make a personal connection with the viewer. I don't see how this shitty video would get more views than any other kind of video. Please explain the logic there, because literally the only reason someone would click the video in the first place is because of the video title, description, and preview image. That is what is going to get anyone watching the video in the first place. How is the useless subpar content in the middle that we're criticizing here attracting more views when a viewer has already started watching the video? If you're that desperate for views why isn't your preview image just a picture of boobs? I'm sure that would get you more views than a shitty highlight reel.

[–]Rip Jackdjmoneygrabber 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 6時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]zapXet 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 7時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]http://www.dotabuff.com/players/46398245 4.5k randomerMJawn 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 6時間前 (1子コメント)

[+]SUNSfan スコアが基準値未満のコメント-9ポイント-8ポイント-7ポイント 6時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]Jimbo727 [スコア非表示] 3分前 (0子コメント)

OK SUNSfan this is pretty late now, but I like you dude. I became a keyboard warrior and argued for hours about the NoobfromUA thing, because you were in the right. I've defended you a lot, and I watch almost all of your content. This is coming from a fan.

Drop the whole "that wouldn't get as many views" thing. I know you are telling yourself that you have your data and that you know your audience, but it would. Or how about just have the player's part, and then have you talking? Look, there were countless suggestions here, but the point is that you've kind of dropped the ball. I'm not going to reiterate everybody's arguments, but actually take them on board. Don't counter them or tell yourself what they've missed, Reddit's actually somewhat correct for once.

I'm not saying that this isn't a huge overreaction, people have been dicks and gone way overboard. You have still dug yourself into a pit though, and you've handled this kind of shitily too. There's no 100% right party in this scenario, but in this case the public's feedback is pretty much spot on and you are far off the mark. I'm not flaming you, we all make mistakes, nobody with a brain has a serious issue with you. Just sometimes you need to suck it up and say "Sorry for the confusion, this was not our intent" even if you don't believe it's bad, as it will at least not fuck yourself over.

Who cares anyway, the internet will have forgotten in 3 days time. Also more RNG challenge pls bby.

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I think the main reason people find the video offputting is the length of time it took to get through the 'Sunsfan timeline'. If instead of pausing for several seconds at each station as a screen popped up, showed the entry, then shut down again, the camera had just smoothly panned across the room with the screens showing each entry as it passed I think it would have been better received.

It's not as much that people mind the inclusion of those items, but the heavy time emphasis put on each one. When the actual goal of the video (introducing the new team) is less than half of the actual length you can pretty safely say the introduction is too long. When that introduction by and large is a description of your accomplishments, you are then moving to the realm of people shouting 'narcissism'.

Personally I don't agree with most of the hate you get on Reddit, and I enjoy your presence as a DotA personality. In this case though, while I think people are getting too emotional and angry with you, I can't help but agree that this was a poorly directed video. Had the intro sequence been 20 seconds rather than a minute long it would have been fine, but it is not so. I'm sure you do know your audience, but regardless of your intentions in structuring the video this way, was the execution something that was able to achieve those goals? I think not, and I would just advise that you try to objectively look at where the complaints are focusing, and decide for yourself whether it truly was ideal.

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