上位 200 件のコメント全て表示する 241

[–]weavvesNew Brunswick 211ポイント212ポイント  (63子コメント)

I'm pretty confused by the banning of mohawks. The hairstyle has been a part of popular culture, especially punk culture, for decades. I don't think many people sporting a mohawk are doing so because "oh man look at this cool Indian haircut hiya hoya hiya hoya" or whatever the hell the university expects.

Like, I see kids at the playground with mohawks. Kids my son's age, like 2-4. And I'm pretty sure the celts rocked mohawks a thousand years before first nations, anyway. It's not anyone's hairstyle to appropriate because it's out in the ether.

The other stuff, sure, yeah. Makes sense to me. That is toeing the line of being offensive and is definitely appropriative. But mohawks? Seriously?

[–]limited8Ontario 102ポイント103ポイント  (14子コメント)

The banning of mohawks wasn't really because of cultural appropriation. It was because frosh leaders were being pressured to shave their hair into a mohawk to be part of the "team," even if they didn't want to.

Source: went to Western.

[–]llama_herder 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

I suppose it's an easy way to deal with it, but you think they could spend some more time whipping up a "Don't force leaders to do stupid hair things" rule.

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

but that's not a good story that gets people riled up BOUT POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE TOO FAR!

everyone ignore this post and keep pretending mohawks were banned because of cultural sensitivity!

[–]Tkins 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Mohawks are also not a first nations only hair cut. They have been around in other cultures for a long long time.

[–]MannoSlimminsCanada 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Dreadlocks are the same thing. Hell, even the fucking bible mentions dreadlocks (Samson and his vow never to cut his hair).

Celts, Greeks, Viking... the list goes on and on

[–]subvertcAlberta 25ポイント26ポイント  (17子コメント)

Its a ban for only one event and limited to frosh week student leaders.

[–]weavvesNew Brunswick 13ポイント14ポイント  (5子コメント)

And when I was in school I had a friend who was a frosh leader two years in a row who had a bright blue mohawk. It was her look, her thing. Would they have made her shave her head, or what?

[–]jelloisnotacrime 20ポイント21ポイント  (0子コメント)

Something tells me she would be fine. The way this article reads, it's more of an advisory from the planning committee, they probably don't have the power to actually say, you have to change your haircut to be a Soph this week.

[–]David-PuddyQuébec 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not supporting or decrying their codes, but she would probably just need to not gel it up into a mohawk.

It would look silly, but she would just need to comb it flat

[–]procor1 -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Although I 100% agree with you. As I also have a mohawk. And I think its stupid to think it's some sort of appropriation ( aswell I dont see dreadlocks as appropriation eaither). But she could just wear it down. Down to one side for the event and be fine, although she shoudent have to ( if she was in this situation)

[–]ironicmurse 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think the part that isn't coming across clearly in articles on this issue is that it's a ban on making these part of the team uniform. If someone wants to have a mohawk it's fine, they just can't make everyone on the soph team get one.

[–]procor1 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh true. That makes a lot more sense.

[–]diableauxvaches 12ポイント13ポイント  (10子コメント)

Not sure what difference that makes, if you can justify it once you can justify it all the time. It's a fucking university not a daycare, if people are still that susceptible to butthurt at that age then they got bigger problems to deal with than hairstyle.

[–]SpoonfeedmeAlberta 7ポイント8ポイント  (21子コメント)

How are any of these things offensive, really, to anyone with more than a paper thin constitution?

[–]maldio 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Ditto, I don't feel offended when I see people from non-plaid kilt wearing heritages donning them. It's certainly not worth restricting peoples freedom of expression over. If someone wants to reveal themselves as overtly racist and offensive, let them wear it for all the world, to see them as they are.

[–]randomfact8472 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Exactly. If someone wants to be an asshole, let them.

[–]starpot 5ポイント6ポイント  (18子コメント)

A) Head dresses

To be able to wear War Bonnets is a Plains Indian tradition. To get one, you had to have earned each individual feather. When someone wears one they bought in a shop that was made in China, it cheapens the accomplishment. The same level of disgust that some people had when that guy dressed up as a war veteran and got interviewed on Remembrance day.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/fake-soldier-franck-gervais-pleads-guilty

B) Dreadlocks:

For Rastafarians, dreadlocks are representative of the Lion of Judah. When Bob Marley became popular in the USA, "Rasta Style" also became popular. Dreadlocks were a symbol of Black empowerment. Imagine the Rastafarians as the Hudderites, and dreadlocks like riding in a horse and buggy. So you show up with a horse and buggy to school because you think it's fashionable, and decide that you're not going to bother learning anything about the Hudderites. The other kids at University who happen to be from the prairies are going to know who the Hudderites are, and are going to know that you're not one. Everyone at school will see that you've got a horse and buggy, but the folks who know who Hudderites are will think you're an impostor.

Edit: Just answering the guy above me's question. Paper thin constitutions are pretty easy to find IMO

[–]cmperry51 7ポイント8ポイント  (14子コメント)

The Hutterites hereabouts drive things like Tahoes and Silverados. They still go in for traditional dress, though, which I wouldn't mind appropriating myself. Pants that fit and last? Comfortable work shirts? What's not to like? The hats? Hmmmm...

[–]geotuul -2ポイント-1ポイント  (13子コメント)

What you're referring to is legitimate cultural exchange. Wearing a head dress for the sake of broadcasting "look at me, I'm dressed like an In'jun, isn't that silly" is in no way comparable. You wouldn't be wearing that clothing to make fun of the Hutterites, and especially not just because you could get away with it.

[–]thencaapawardgoestoAlberta 6ポイント7ポイント  (12子コメント)

No kidding. Aboriginal people have plenty of things they're actually legitimately okay with other people wearing - like moccasins.

But certain elements of regalia are reserved only for a select few who have earned it. It's sacred and special and not something they're welcoming everyone to participate in.

[–]randomfact8472 -2ポイント-1ポイント  (11子コメント)

Who gives a fuck. If some asshole wears a fucking oak leaf on his collar I'm not going to bitch about him appropriating our militaristic traditions.

I sure as fuck hope you're being sarcastic. If you're not you're a sorry sack of shit.

[–]thencaapawardgoestoAlberta 0ポイント1ポイント  (10子コメント)

Then I'm a sorry sack of shit I guess.

Rather than than whatever it is that you are.

[–]Hatsee [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

A head dress is more or less a party decoration now. Think about when they tossed one on Harper, how many feathers could he possibly earn? I'd give him a couple duck feathers covered in oil probably.

[–]SpoonfeedmeAlberta 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

it cheapens the accomplishment. The same level of disgust that some people had when that guy dressed up as a war veteran and got interviewed on Remembrance day.

What a horrible false analogy. There is a huge difference between wearing a head dress at a party as a fashion item, and pretending to be a veteran at a celebration of veterans.

B) Dreadlocks:

Exhibit A

Exhibit B

So we have an middle-eastern mummy and a depiction of a white Celt (as well as descriptions of them wearing dreads).

[–]maldio 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, dreadlocks is a really bad choice, in Jamaica it's been common from the get-go for non-Rastafarians to wear them as a style, even back in the day it was common to say someone was a Dread not a Rasta. Besides which, aspects of Rastafarian culture had a lot of influence in all of the West Indies and everywhere else... the dreadlocks are as much an affiliation with a style of music and herb as they are of the religion.

[–]PropaCanadaPanda 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

They are just using culture as an excuse to ban stuff they do not like. Since thats how its done these days. EDIT: grammar.

[–]Detox1337 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'd have my Mohawk back so fast and dust off the steel toes. Fuck these PC bitches. Canada is about appropriating culture, cultural mosaic blah blah blah. Maybe they shouldn't teach Algebra because it was a cultural appropriation.

[–]QueerandLoathinginTO 16ポイント17ポイント  (0子コメント)

No. This is a ban on student leaders doing these things while they are leading frosh week.

The right wing can't help but blow these things out of proportion. Ironically, they are running amok blowing things out of proportion while they try to police the "PC police".

[–]MaurdakarCanada 97ポイント98ポイント  (20子コメント)

What if I wear a Mohawk out of respect for my Celtic heritage? Wait what if I wear dreadlocks because its part of my Nordic/Gaul/Celt heritage. I'm so confused.

(I am Hispanic)

These non-European students need to be expelled from university for appropriating the culture of higher education, or rights for women, or free speech, or the scientific method, or every piece of technology they use.

As a Peruvian I must say no one else is now allowed to wear lama wool or own lamas. Those are OUR LAMA'S and you may not APPROPRIATE THEM SHITLORDS!

[–]driusanQuébec 33ポイント34ポイント  (2子コメント)

Anyone should be able to wear a mohawk out of respect for their punk heritage.

[–]ironicmurse 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

They are. What's not allowed is take make everyone on a team get one. Everyone is still allowed to do their own hair thing.

[–]MaurdakarCanada 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Fighting the power is part of my spirituality man, so is smokin doobies and wearin pink spikey mohawks.

[–]MannoSlimminsCanada 53ポイント54ポイント  (5子コメント)

Silly Maurdakar, didn't you get the memo? White people don't have culture /s

edit: In response to your edit:

If any student claims to be anti-violence, they need to be expelled for culturally appropriating Mennonite views against violence. Only Mennonites and other anabaptists are allowed to be against violence

[–]Matt_MGQuébec 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Anabaptists in Munster were pretty violent.

[–]MannoSlimminsCanada 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Funny you mention Munster. That was (one of) the events that lead to the formation of the Mennonites. Menno Simmons (Who my username is based off of) was one of many Dutch Anabaptist leaders who denounced the actions of the Munster Anabaptists. That group of leaders went on to form the Mennonites, named after Menno Simmons.

Anabaptists have certain tenants agreed upon in 1527 (Ironically, before Munster happened). One of them being "The Sword", AKA Christian Pacifism/nonresistance

Violence must not be used in any circumstance. The way of nonviolence is patterned after the example of Christ who never exhibited violence in the face of persecution or as a punishment for sin. A Christian should not pass judgment in worldly disputes. It is not appropriate for a Christian to serve as a magistrate; a magistrate acts according to the rules of the world, not according to the rules of heaven; their weapons are worldly, but the weapons of a Christian are spiritual.

Mennonites expand on this in their confessions of faith. I'll paste the commentary from the page instead of the official article, as it's less religion-y

he biblical concept of peace embraces personal peace with God, peace in human relations, peace among nations, and peace with God's creation. The Old Testament word for peace (shalom) includes healing, reconciliation, and well-being. Peace is more than the absence of war; it includes the restoration of right relationship. [...]

Nonresistance means "not resisting." Our example is Jesus, who endured accusation and abuse without retaliating. Jesus did sometimes confront wrongdoers (Matt. 23:1-36; John 2:13-22), but he did so in a nonviolent way that shows us how to overcome evil with good

Peace and justice are not optional teachings, counsel that Christians can take or leave.

. In continuity with previous Mennonite confessions of faith, we affirm that nonparticipation in warfare involves conscientious objection to military service and a nonresistant response to violence. Our peace witness also includes peacemaking and working for justice. Peace witness is needed even when the nations in which we live are not at war. Ministries of mediation, conciliation, and nonviolent resolution of everyday conflict can express our commitment to Christ's way of peace.

One notable way that certain Mennonite groups have been attempted non-resistance peace initiatives is in the Israel-Palestine conflict, where Mennonites would stand between Israel and Palestine forces to try and prevent hostilities. This, of course, led to this wonderful article entitled "Key Mennonite Institutions against Israel"

But, that's enough of my menno-splaining

[–]David-PuddyQuébec 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

Please, the Mennonites appropriated it from the Jains

[–]MannoSlimminsCanada 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ah, but you see, Jainism allows self defense against a robber, murderer, or any other criminal.

Mennonites are supposed to offer peaceful resistance, but not supposed to use force, even in self-defense.

So, it's totally unique, guys!

[–]SwissPies 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

well it is Western, the whitest school in canada

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia 5ポイント6ポイント  (5子コメント)

Are you a frosh week student leader? No? Then you can do all those things to your heart's content!

Also the ban is specifically against fake dreadlocks, ie. those rasta hats that come with dreadlocks attached. No one could claim to be honouring their Nordic heritage with a Jamaican hat. If you had real dreadlocks they would be fine.

[–]iprobablyneedahobbyNova Scotia 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

So are Jamaicans banned from wearing kilts or natives banned from wearing lederhosen or horned helmets? What about blue jeans and tee-shirts which come from white cultures? I get that people shouldn't mock other cultures but if I want a mohawk than fuck them, I'm having a mohawk. Cultural appropriation is a one way street and is a fucking joke of a concept. All cultures adapt and pick up things they like from their neighbours, and I am writing this in an alphabet that originated in Phoencia, spread to Greece and was adopted by Rome.

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia -3ポイント-2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Cultural appropriation refers to the majority culture appropriating bits and pieces of a minority culture while the actual members of that minority face real discrimination and are often pressured not to embrace their own culture for fear of ridicule.

Can you not understand why to a First Nations person it is offensive to see a white guy parading around in traditional headdress as a fashion statement or a joke, while actual First Nations are the most discriminated against people in Canadian society? How after generations of being told their culture was inferior and they would be better off fully assimilated, it is infuriating to see the majority culture pick one part of their culture they think is cool and decide to make it their own?

And can you not see how due to the power imbalance between the Euro-culture majority and the First Nations minority, cultural appropriation in this scenario by definition can only be a one-way street? A First Nations or Jamaican wearing lederhosen is not damaging cultural appropriation because in modern Canada people of German descent are not a visible minority group that is discriminated against nor is their culture disparaged. Canadians of German descent are in the European-culture majority that dominates this country. Thus the issues of cultural appropriation really don't apply when a First Nations puts on lederhosen.

[–]siddysid 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Other comments on this thread were pissing me off. You nailed it.

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thank you. I love how I was downvoted for the sin of just providing the other side of the argument regarding the issue at hand. Amazing how sensitive the people who think the world is too sensitive can be.

[–]c0pypastry -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

You can wear whatever you want, because as poc you cannot be racist.

Edit: oops, forgot my /s

[–]quackmeister 25ポイント26ポイント  (3子コメント)

I was actually president of one of the residence students councils when I went to Western a bunch of years ago.

My limited interactions with broader student government (both students and university staff) led me to believe that they were often completely out of touch with students and overly sensitive about anything that could even be remotely perceived, by any individual, to be offensive.

I remember sitting through a discussion on St. Patrick's Day (before which I'd had a few green pints at The Spoke Club on campus) silently facepalming as they talked about how alcohol shouldn't be part of the student experience and that, by golly, we should do more to limit access to it.

So... yeah. I'm not surprised by this idiocy.

[–]sensibleheels 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Having my own connections to several student governments, I can say you're completely right. It's also pretty surprising how much influence activist groups have on student government at some universities.

[–]sinsyder- 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

This is the Progressive Era all over again.

[–]gbinasia -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Socio-conservatism seems like a neologism that needs to be created.

[–]subvertcAlberta 50ポイント51ポイント  (33子コメント)

ITT: people confusing the banning of apparel for student leaders for a single event with banning of apparel for everyone year round.

They are banning it during frosh.

"Orientation Week student leaders at Western, called Sophs, are divided into teams that help first-year students move in, get to know campus and adjust to student life. In the past, Soph teams have dressed in similar colours or costumes to stand out from the crowd and build team spirit.But the act of dressing in attire or headwear worn by other cultures — native headdresses with elaborate feathers or fake dreadlocks to mimic Rastafarian culture, for example — has been criticized recently in popular culture."

[–]GodzillaaaaaOntario 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Most people won't read the article and the title could've been more clear. Probably accounts for most of the confusion.

[–]barkusmuhl 37ポイント38ポイント  (2子コメント)

It is a sign of a growing trend. That is why people a bristling at this.

[–]sinsyder- 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

It reminds me of the Progressive Movement of the late 19th/early 20th century. Where activists sought to legislate or ban "immoral" activities which lead famously to the Prohibition of alcohol.

[–]randomfact8472 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

For some odd reason I never put two and two together on that one. That is exactly what's happening. Bunch of nancy fucking morons banning shit they don't like. Yeah dingy saloons and drunkards suck, so do racists and assholes. Don't make me side with the libertarians you dumb shits, don't make them right.

[–]sesoyez 15ポイント16ポイント  (12子コメント)

It's still silly. Why should universities cuddle their students so much? There's a real world out there.

[–]SornosQuébec 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

Because universities are businesses. They exist solely to make money. By banning "offensive" things, they'll have more people enrol. The people who are annoyed by this type of frivolous things aren't going to stop attending over it, but the people who are for these bans would indeed change schools over it, or least be more likely to do so than the former group.

[–]themusicgod1Saskatchewan 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

They exist solely to make money.

Hell no. Universities are a necessary part of a liberal democracy: they promote and develop enlightenment ideals and are an environment where open discussion on topics of scientific importance is possible.

The people who are annoyed by this type of frivolous things aren't going to stop attending over it,

Yet it pushes people that one more step towards that point. Note when CLASSE did exactly this in quebec, people were complaining of exactly the opposite -- that students weren't attending and were busy causing a ruckus when they could be consuming. I'm not saying you personally want it both ways but it's impossible to please everyone in this context.

[–]Atheist101Canada [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Almost all universities in Canada are public and therefore NOT businesses.

[–]canad93 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

This isn't the university, it's student council who made this decision.

[–]Awkward-Bear 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

University is just grade 13,14,15 and 16 now.

[–]mshel016 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Likely so the university doesn't have to respond to SJWs crying their garbage all over twitter

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia -3ポイント-2ポイント  (2子コメント)

ya i can't tell you how often i'm out in the REAL WORLD and my boss comes into work with a rasta hat and fake dreadlocks. Thank god I wasn't coddled by my university who made sure I had a frosh week leader with a rasta hat and fake dreadlocks. It totally prepared me for the REAL WORLD.

Now these coddled millenials aren't gonna know how to react when their boss comes to work with a rasta hat and fake dreadlocks which I assure you happens all the time in the REAL WORLD.

[–]sesoyez 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Are you actually that dense?

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Do you even live in the REAL WORLD? You sound like a coddled millenial to me.

[–]tojoso [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It has to start somewhere. And it is absurd.

[–]satanicwaffles 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I get the headdress dreadlocks and bandanas over the face.

On the other hand, banning mohawks, short-shorts, and tank tops for effectively 5 days or so is just silly. I don't get the logic in the school saying "these are bad and aren't welcoming" and then saying "yup, these are a-okay" for the next 8 months. If the school truely finds them not welcoming or offensive, ban them from school property period.

I wonder why, if the school finds it so offensive and unwelcoming, they don't apply to the frosh, as you don't want some frosh scaring away others. I'm sure they'll feel real welcome when they get shamed for wearing shorts and a tank top. Or tell the kid who has a Mohawk to shave his head on the first day of school. I'm sure that'll help him pick up the school spirit.

[–]windsostrangeOntario 35ポイント36ポイント  (5子コメント)

Haha, jesus, this thread is a cesspool.

[–]randomfact8472 -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

Didn't cuck enough up to PC bullshit for your standards?

You fucks would have been with the morons banning liquor.

[–]windsostrangeOntario 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Did your childhood home have lead pipes or something?

[–]Infathomable -5ポイント-4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Read about three comments in. Yes.

[–]Shasato -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

this was 3 comments in

[–]kenazoCanada 28ポイント29ポイント  (11子コメント)

Did they also band smoking tobacco, wearing moccasins, and jazz? (sorry, that's not a well balanced list).

Our PC pendulum has swung so far to the left that things are getting a bit ridiculous. What happened to just using common sense and respecting those around you? Surely we don't need to legislate things to this level.

[–]nome_sayeen 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

I also think chop-sticks should be banned on campus, to show respect for Asian international students. Having chop-sticks on campus is just another example of "orientalism" committed by a country with a history of white supremacy. If you disagree, you are a white supremacist and should go to prison for thought crime.

[–]I_ConquerCanada 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

Moccasins would be more akin to a business suit. While they are both products which play into cultural norms, they are not seen as representative of the culture - they're bought and sold with little spiritual or cultural significance.

You'd think it wouldn't require regulating. I'm sure the administration would rather focus on other matters. But here we are, living in a world where educated people, who should know better!, require rules to practice respect for other cultures.

Is it conceivable that we go overboard with political correctness? Of course it is. Is asking the organisers of a party to avoid wearing culturally sensitive decor crossing that line? It is not.

[–]Amir616Canada 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Being politically correct is just the same as treating people with respect.

[–]I_ConquerCanada 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ideally, yes.

But there are a few things to keep in mind:

1) There times when we self-righteously want to seem smarter or better than their friends, and will (either consciously or not) convolute and complicate political correctness / respect (/ religion) in order to achieve this. It's incredibly difficult for others to cut through this when we do it, because we build it up to seem racists, sexist, ableist, etc. to disagree. It seems to me that most people - especially educated, 'generally-liberal' people (like me!) - do this far more than we realise we're doing it. We call people out - not with the intention of improving anything, but to look good.

2) There are times when we want to be offended and we are willing to convolute or complicate possible solutions or restitutions for the offence so that we may revel in our victimhood. Again, I think educated liberals (like me!) are prone to this without realising it.

3) Being politically correct has a general implication that we trust various authorities to have the conversation for us about what is respectful and what isn't, whereas general respect is more of a personal flavour. Political correctness implies that we look to our leaders to protect our interests in how people in other cultures treat us and our values, and we look to them for cues on how to treat others of different values, creeds, backgrounds, conditions, etc. If you are white and you have a black friend who wants to be treated in a certain way, respect dictates that (unless you have a good and appropriate reason not to), you'll accommodate to the best of your ability. A white person having a black friend doesn't entitle the white person to treat all black people in the same way as they do their one black friend (or, similarly, how a black person would treat their all white people the same way as they do their one white friend...). So where to be politically correct, trusted leaders in the black (disabled/differently abled, trans, female / trans, etc....) communities and trusted leaders in the white (able bodied, cis, male, etc...) communities are tasked with determining appropriate for their members to treat each other and for society to accommodate them as best as possible. The leaders become advocates and communicators. Respect, again, is a personal action based on personal experience - politically correct is intended to set a default for us to use in situations where our personal experience to show respect is inadequate.

[–]winterbourne 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Hey man you don't get to decide what is or is not culturally sensitive garb. I as a British person get to do that especially in regards to suits, ties and clan tartans. Frankly I'm horribly offended when other cultures wear suits. My great great grandfather was a bespoke tailor in London and as such a proper suit holds a lot of cultural significance to me. Only proper (British) gentlemen should be allowed to wear suits.

...literally the same argument given by people against headdresses.

[–]I_ConquerCanada -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

They aren't the same argument.

You're allowed to be offended if people from other cultures wear suits, because you're a person and people are allowed to feel how they feel. And an individual North American Aboriginal would be allowed to be offended because people from other cultures wear moccasins, because they're a person and people are allowed to feel how they feel.

But that offence, while legitimate, doesn't mean that the people who wear suits or moccasins are being culturally insensitive. British Cultural and Spiritual authorities don't explain to authorities of other cultures that they take offence to casual or commercial uses for these items. If your taking of offence is sincere (and I suspect that it isn't, but that you're trying to make a point), then you're more than welcome to explain to your non-British friends that you find them wearing a suit offensive. You're even allowed to choose to not be friends with non-British people if they choose ignore your offence, should you believe that the offence is so grievous as to escalate to that. And your offence, if sincere, would be legitimate. Similarly, if you befriend a Cree person gifts you moccasins and explains that they're prefer that you only wear them inside or one Saturdays or something, it doesn't make you culturally insensitive to wear them outside or on Mondays, although it might make your friend angry to hear that you disrespected their personal wishes.

However, if there were, say, a black immigrant to Wales who began to 'appropriate' the title "Sir" for himself without having been knighted, that would be culturally insensitive. British authorities have indicated that title has cultural significance, and should be held apart in a way that a suit needn't be. You're allowed to not take offence to this use, but it would still be an undue and insensitive cultural appropriation, on account of this.

Essentially, chances are good that you don't, personally, have the power, influence, or support that your personal convictions require the recognition of people beyond your loved ones. However, you're fortunate enough to live in a democracy! And as a result you get a vote for - and, should you so choose, the chance to run to be - an official to represent you in the cultural sphere, to determine and protect those British things which you think ought to be set apart. It would probably be too late to convince the world that wearing suits is culturally insensitive - Britain has had many years to make a claim and has, to the best of my knowledge, never officially done so. First Nations groups have indicated their official reproach to the misuse of headdresses since the practice was begun. Their cultural offence has the legitimacy of time, yours doesn't.

But, at the end of the day, it comes down to the fact that White Canadian leaders recognise and understand the reasons that Aboriginal Canadian leaders claim offence at the misuse of the headress, and they implore White Canadians to not misuse it. And we should listen. Because why would we want to offend someone just for the sake of offending them? It's not cultural disobedience to wear a headdress in contravention. You wouldn't be proving a point. You'd just be an immature, insensitive dick, demonstrating why our leaders are so tempted to crush us with unnecessary rules. We don't have crazy, overbearing rules like this because of the politically correct people. We have rules like this because of the asshats who don't understand the difference between wearing a suit and wearing a headdress.

[–]subvertcAlberta -3ポイント-2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Its a ban for only one event (frosh) and limited to frosh week student leaders. Read the article.

[–]sinsyder- 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Even Jerry Seinfeld won't perform at universities because of the current social activism climate. His act is as tame as it comes but even a single joke can have a devastating effect on someones career.

[–]randomfact8472 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The bitching should be devastating to those assholes ever getting a job. Anyone with skin that thin or with that much impotent, pointless hatred for shit that doesn't matter deserves poverty.

[–]SculpinSam 10ポイント11ポイント  (8子コメント)

What are "fake" dreadlocks?

And it sounds like you can have real dreadlocks, even if you're not actually a Rastafaraian, but a real Mohawk, as pictured, is banned?

[–]ironicmurse 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Mohawks or dreads aren't banned in and of themselves, what's banned is making them part of a soph team uniform, ie. forcing all the o-week leaders on a team to have one.

[–]sinsyder- -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Jesus Christ what a fucking joke. I wouldn't even leave my room if I was a university student these days for fear of being expelled for "triggering" some brainwashed teenagers special feelings.

[–]thelonious_skunk 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Fake dreadlocks are those novelty hats with fake dreadlocks attached.

Real dreadlocks are the ones made out of or attached to your real hair.

[–]willanthony 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Imagine extensions, but brutal looking braids

[–]GiantSquiddCanada -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

I work with a girl who has real dreds and has a few extensions... I suppose she'd be allowed to wear her hair as usual but without the extensions? ...this is so stupid and pointless.

[–]Tal-IGNBritish Columbia 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

No she wouldn't have to. The ban is very obviously against those novelty rasta hats that come with fake dreadlocks sticking out the back. People with real dreads that have extensions are not gonna have to take their extensions out lol. Don't be ridiculous.

[–]tristanimator 20ポイント21ポイント  (7子コメント)

In some countries, what we call "culture appropriation" is actually a sign of respect.

If only we could appropriate that mindset.

[–]PalpzCanada 19ポイント20ポイント  (1子コメント)

Sure, when used respectfully.

This isn't an example of respectful appreciation of someone else's culture.

[–]feb914Canada 20ポイント21ポイント  (0子コメント)

i have the same opinion with those people who claim to be irish only just on st Patrick's day. sure if you want to drink gallons of beer go ahead, but don't misrepresent a culture by claiming to be one

[–]jeff744Saskatchewan 12ポイント13ポイント  (3子コメント)

They usually retain the original meaning or don't take things of significant cultural value. It is the equivalent of people walking around wearing Victoria Crosses in uniform without having earned them.

[–]diego_moitaAlberta 13ポイント14ポイント  (1子コメント)

Your argument implies that Portuguese people have the right demand that bike gangs should stop using the Order of Christ Cross on their tattoos and logos. As someone with Portuguese heritage I'd say that is bullshit.

People do have the right to appropriate symbols and redefine their meaning. It is part of the right for free speech.

[–]I_ConquerCanada 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

I suspect that if bike gangs in Canada were to decorate themselves, publicly, with a medal of the Victoria Cross, or if a student who wasn't a soldier managed to acquire a Victoria Cross and decides to where it to frosh week, someone would have something to say.

What's apt about this metaphor is how resilient it is to absurdity. The VC Medal is not, to Canadians, like a tattoo of a foreign honour.

You are correct to point out that there is a fine line between acceptable an unacceptable. But most people aren't going to be near the line. Someone who could demonstrate that they always wore a Mohawk, or, much less likely, that they did it to respect the Celts, might reasonably ask for and be granted an exception.

[–]winterbourne 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

There's a difference between people wearing a headdress and claiming to be Indian and people wearing a headdress cause they are drunk/high as fuck at frosh and they think it makes them look cool.

Having gone to a variety of festivals and seen hundreds of people wearing feathers, headdresses holding giant totem / shaman poles I can safely say none of those people (of varying skin colours) was attempting to make fun of or disrespect another culture.

They are high as fuck said "shit I look awesome, let's take more MDMA and go dance"

[–]Thucydides1987Outside Canada 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

Oh Frosh...what a bullshit event.

[–]I_ConquerCanada 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

Quit trampling on my culture, Brah.

[–]Buscat 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well I suppose toga parties are right out for everyone but Greeks and Italians then, eh?

[–]Unknown_OneBritish Columbia 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

Normally I'm against this kind of political correctness, but this applies only to the dress code of student orientation leaders. It's mostly illogical, but not overly restrictive.

[–]feb914Canada -5ポイント-4ポイント  (2子コメント)

it's very reasonable, except the bandana part.

[–]Arina222 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

I thought it was specifically bandanas over the face?

[–]feb914Canada -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

as in.... closing mouth and nose?

i read "over the face" and for some reason i thought it's about how it's normally worn (i guess it's called "over the head" instead). my bad.

[–]van_throwaway 4ポイント5ポイント  (5子コメント)

I'm pretty progressive but 'cultural appropriation' is sensitivity gone too far.

Do white westerners get offended when other cultures eat burgers in suits? No, its not an inherently harmful act unless you feel oppressed and want something to complain about.

Those minorities do have legit complaints and face challenges but white middle class college students wearing a headdress to a rave isn't one of them

[–]leafyleafygreens 11ポイント12ポイント  (4子コメント)

do white westerners get offended when other cultures eat burgers in suits?

That argument represents a fundamental lack of understanding of what cultural appropriation is.

[–]theDeletedTruth 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is how the world ends. Not with a bang but with endless whining.

[–]crasher555 3ポイント4ポイント  (5子コメント)

Immigrate to Canada to escape tyranny only to find myself fighting a soft but creeping leftist tyranny.

[–]MonsoonAndStone 15ポイント16ポイント  (1子コメント)

Drama queen

[–]crasher555 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thats my culture man don't offend me.

[–]kochevnikov -3ポイント-2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Leftist?

What does this have to do with the left?

The left is traditionally iconoclastic, it doesn't give a shit about the religious meaning of symbols and it has a history of cosmopolitanism and internationalism.

On the other hand, the defence of traditional cultural values, the defence of religion, and the idea that cultures have hard boundaries which should not overlap, is classic conservatism.

Multiculturalism is inherently conservative. It's simply a variation on monoculturalism. The actual leftist response is a cosmopolitan rejection of culture as a means of exclusion.

Remember, Marx said workers of the world unite. He didn't say workers of this culture go unite with other workers of this culture, and workers from this other culture unite with your own kind, etc.

[–]Pharmax 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

The fact of the matter remains that people who use terms like cultural appropriation mostly associate with traditionally left values. Despite ideologies, this political correctness wave belongs to the left, much to my dismay.

[–]kochevnikov 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

True, and really we need to realize that there are more than simply two political positions, but I was playing off that kind of binary thinking expressed by the person I was replying to. Part of my goal of my post was to demonstrate that we simply can't say left or right, and things are much more complex than that.

[–]themasterkser 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

We've gone from having separate boys' and girls' uniforms at schools, to a new liberal age of wearing whatever you like, and now to this bullshit? How pathetic is our society when we start banning clothing because of the possibility of somebody getting offended.

This is really sad

[–]GravitySkies 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Native headdresses sure. But dreadlocks and mohawks? Seriously?

[–]gbinasia 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe Canada should ban the word Canada 'cause it's appropriated from French-Canadian culture, who appropriated from the Iroquois.../s

[–]MikmagooOntario 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you wear pants youre appropriating the early European tribes who had to wear them to survive the cold of the north cishest scum.

[–]sidoZe 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

so much for multiculturalism. Everyone stick to your own, separate schools and washrooms for all.

[–]tojoso [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"Cultural appropriation" is the term that arises when political correctness jumps the shark. It wasn't that long ago that people were encouraged to assimilate.

[–]realpigasus -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

About time!

[–]sidoZe 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Headdresses sure..but dreadlocks? That's a bit of a stretch. Dreads don't hold 'religious significance' in the same way, and they are not unique to any one group. Don't wash your hair for long enough and anyone's hair will go like that.

[–]OwenFinnn 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

No sombreros, por favor.

[–]winterbourne 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

New rule since suits and ties were invented by white people (the British specifically) only white people can wear them. I'm horrified that people are appropriating my culture!

Same with jeans! Jeans are only wearable by Americans or French people from Nime!

How dare anyone wear stuff they think looks "cool" for "fun". No Indian ever wore a headdress for "fun"! How dare anyone imply any different!

Fuck this PC bullshit.

[–]Gunnerdogg244 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hey white people, you are too insensitive.

[–]Crazyants 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Froshing still sounds like the dumbest thing to me

[–]AmethystFae 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

The celtic cultures have a long history of dreadlocks. When I was in school a Jamaican SJW girl insisted they were appropriating her culture.

It's fucking PC stupidity.

[–]Echochamber52 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Next time I see non-Europeans in denim, Gortex coats, suits, t-shirts, sneakers, etc I'll be sure to let them know they are culturally appropriating my European heritage.

[–]deepwatermako 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

This shit is going on in Fargo ND right now with UND and the nickname The Fighting Sioux. NCAA is attempting to fine them and the current president is backing down. Despite the fact the name was 'given' to UND by the Sioux in the mid 1930's and is seen as an honor by the Sioux.

[–]nome_sayeen -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Heh, something funny about that is that I see lots of natives where I live wearing jerseys and hats with Cleveland Indians and Blackhawks logos.

[–]MikmagooOntario -2ポイント-1ポイント  (3子コメント)

I get the headdresses. But banning dreadlocks or any hairstyle is ridiculous. White people and black people both have historically had dreadlocks and its sad that its instantly associated with one race and anyone else wearing them is 'appropriating'

[–]Grumblepuffs 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

just to clarify they banned fake dreadlocks which usually come with silly jamaican flag hat over top. you are right though not even close to same level as headdresses, the fake dreads just look stupid

[–]themusicgod1Saskatchewan -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

just look stupid

Banning people from looking stupid is not going to work. Sorry.

[–]Grumblepuffs 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh I know that, and personally the only thing on the list that without a doubt should be banned is the headdress

[–]captainpotty 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I have mixed feelings about sensitivity surrounding "cultural appropriation". I think that cultures, my own and that of others, should be allowed to take on aspects of one another and morph and grow into all sorts of weird and wonderful tapestries.

It's culture's nature to borrow and integrate other cultures. That doesn't mean that either culture is devalued because they didn't "remain pure". If someone wants to adopt something from my culture and understand its meaning, that's fantastic. If they want to adopt it and give it their own meaning, that's fine too. I only draw the line at mocking cultures.

This sort of "otherizing" of cultures only drives them further apart. If we shared and celebrated the similarities between cultures, we would all feel closer to one another.

[–]olafthebent 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can hardly wait for St Patrick's Day

[–]redundanteaterBritish Columbia -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Western? LOL. It's not like anyone gives a shit about Western.

[–]trudeau2015 -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

The committee decided to also ban bandanas worn over the face because that is “unwelcoming,” she said.

The feelz are strong in this one.

The ban on groups of frosh leaders wearing tank tops and short shorts is a few years old. It was developed to avoid making attendees feel uncomfortable by wearing revealing clothing, Scripnick said.

I can instantly tell the person making this ban was a fat woman.

[–]DMPunk -5ポイント-4ポイント  (0子コメント)

It is idiocy, but all it takes is one student to complain and they would be fucked. They're just covering their asses

[–]TinFoilWizardHat -5ポイント-4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ah Canada. Keep being silly.

[–]Yummsexxz -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Boooo the world is turning into a bunch of prudes and pussies