全 177 件のコメント

[–]NovaeCain 28ポイント29ポイント  (0子コメント)

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I've seen this be able to real for many people. I'm glad to see this cartoon about it because it is the truth.

[–][deleted] 30ポイント31ポイント  (45子コメント)

ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

The problem with this is that there are so many ways that people understand "working together." Feminists will say that only feminism can solve gender problems; MRAs will disagree with this idea and say that feminism doesn't do very much for men. And so the cycle continues.

The only way out is to see other people as individuals and not as representatives of their gender (whatever gender they identify as). But fat chance on that happening. People love to fight each other.

[–]DiggingNoMore 2ポイント3ポイント  (39子コメント)

ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

Here's the solution: treat everybody the same, regardless of their sex. It's literally that simple.

[–]emmanlop 28ポイント29ポイント  (37子コメント)

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But that's part of the inherent issue at hand. Is that you cannot treat everyone equally simply based on their sex. There are a multitude of complex issues that are present simply because sex exists.

It would be great if we could treat everyone in the world perfectly equally, but if we treat men and women equally in the workplace, for example, then a woman would be fired for being pregnant and taking some leave for birthing/raising a child. In the eyes of the employer, lost time is lost money.

What you might be saying is to give everyone the same, equal rights and opportunities, regardless of sex or gender. If this is the case, then I totally agree with you, but that is a lot easier said than done.

[–]Supercoolguy7 16ポイント17ポイント  (10子コメント)

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Okay I'm going to combat your argument on the employer firing a women for getting pregnant and getting time off. There is a thing called family leave and that is when a man or a women can take time off for having a child. Allowing men to take family leave as well would be treating everyone equal, and I think would be a wonderful solution

[–]emmanlop 9ポイント10ポイント  (7子コメント)

ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

You're absolutely right, that would be a wonderful solution. Sadly, the ideal typically does not occur in our world. A lot of European states are super progressive about this because they care about rearing a child and ensuring the well-being of the family; sadly, this is not the opinion held by many companies in the US. The amount of time that parents get with paternal/maternal leave would be considered deplorable in Sweden.

I hope that we could have such a nice solution in the future.

[–]Supercoolguy7 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

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well while I know the time off is really short, I know some states like california have family leave. California employees can take 6 weeks paid off to bond with a new child, or take care of a seriously ill child, spouse, parent or registered domestic partner.

edit: actually found out that only four countries have no national law mandating paid time off for new parents: Liberia, Papua New Guinea, Swaziland, and the United States. so that's disconcerting but yeah apparently it does happen often in industrialized countries except in the US. although a few states have mandated it.

[–]emmanlop 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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You're a super cool guy for acknowledging that. It totally sucks because we want the ideal, but that sadly isn't the status quo.

[–]dissent9 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

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actually found out that only four countries have no national law mandating paid time off for new parents: Liberia, Papua New Guinea, Swaziland, and the United States. so that's disconcerting...

The reason the US doesn't have such a law is because the states are supposed to have power to make their own laws.

You even stated it yourself: "although a few states have mandated it."

[–]Supercoolguy7 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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I really don't think that's why. The federal gov't has made many laws.

[–]--o 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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You aren't wrong but you did move the goalpost from "women would be fired for having children".

[–]FinickyPenance 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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Hell, I think the amount of time off that most parents get with their newborn kid is deplorable in the US. My best friend uses her 45 minute lunch break to drive 15 minutes to a daycare, breastfeed her newborn, and drive 15 minutes back while eating in the car. And if she doesn't like it, well, tough shit.

I doubt many people would defend that.

[–]CuilRunnings -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

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I think would be a wonderful solution

You would think that, until the feminists see that individual families will largely choose to let the women take the majority of time, which causes the feminists to complain that social sexism still exists because how dare women prioritize their family.

[–]Supercoolguy7 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

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or they will be pissed when you complain about things that they will do, and that you will vilify them. Source am a feminist. Also a dude.

[–]DiggingNoMore 4ポイント5ポイント  (25子コメント)

ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

you cannot treat everyone equally simply based on their sex.

Yes, I can.

if we treat men and women equally in the workplace, for example, then a woman would be fired for being pregnant and taking some leave for birthing/raising a child.

How is that treating people the same? The rule could be: "If you have a child, you can take time off" or "No time off for having a child." The same benefit needs to be applied to men and women. Everything, absolutely everything needs to be applied to both men and women identically.

[–][削除されました]  (13子コメント)

ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

[deleted]

    [–]DiggingNoMore -1ポイント0ポイント  (12子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Prove it.

    I want to know if you personally, when you think someone is attractive, go up to them and ask them to confirm that they are of the sex you think they are.

    Or, do you personally find people attractive without confirming with them their genitalia and/or chromosomal makeup?

    This is not a rhetorical question. Which one do you do?

    [–][deleted] 5ポイント6ポイント  (11子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Prove it.

    Prove what? If you're a straight man and you treat women and men exactly the same, you're either going to really, really confuse all your straight male friends ("Are you...flirting with me? Dude, you're making me uncomfortable.") or you're never going to get laid because no woman has any idea you're interested in her.

    It's really kind of obvious.

    I want to know if you personally, when you think someone is attractive, go up to them and ask them to confirm that they are of the sex you think they are.

    What? Why did this suddenly turn into a thing about transsexuals? What does that have to do with anything?

    [–]DiggingNoMore -4ポイント-3ポイント  (10子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Answer the question. When you find a person attractive, do you ask them to confirm their sex?

    [–][deleted] 7ポイント8ポイント  (9子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    When you find a person attractive, do you ask them to confirm their sex?

    No, but that has zero relevance to my comment. I have never asked anyone to confirm their sex (because that's really fucking rude), but it has also never been relevant ever. I mean I've never been wrong about someone's sex.

    And this literally has nothing to do with my comment. You've just randomly changed the topic to transsexuals for no reason at all. I'd really love an explanation.

    [–]DiggingNoMore -4ポイント-3ポイント  (8子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    No

    And there we have it. You treat people the same, regardless of their sex. You just find people that are attractive, in your own way of defining attractiveness.

    but it has also never been relevant ever

    And there you said it yourself. [Sex] has also never been relevant ever - MadMasculinist.

    My point holds. Even in hetero- or homosexual attraction, you treat people the same without regard to their sex, and just seek out the people you find attractive. Different people find different traits attractive, sure, but you don't know that's due to their sex.

    I mean I've never been wrong about someone's sex.

    Ha, you already said you don't go around asking people their sex, so that's a baseless claim.

    Sorry, but you lose. Good day.

    [–]emmanlop -5ポイント-4ポイント  (10子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I don't really think that you understand how the human body works.

    "If you have a child, you can take time off" or "No time off for having a child." The same benefit needs to be applied to men and women.

    This argument is what is known as a false dichotomy: in essence, you give two options and make it seem like they're the only options. So, no, that's absolutely not the right decision. Giving time off for a woman while she's in the last few strides of her pregnancy and then giving both father and mother time off to be able to start raising the child and figuring out their situations.

    I understand where you're coming from, but we don't live in a world where the sexes are identical and where everyone is androgynous. There are biological differences b/w sexes and there are normative beliefs that state what gender "should" be. So, go ahead, treat everyone exactly the same and just watch how ineffective it will be.

    [–]DiggingNoMore 3ポイント4ポイント  (9子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Giving time off for a woman while she's in the last few strides of her pregnancy and then giving both father and mother time off to be able to start raising the child and figuring out their situations.

    Give the father and mother time off during the last few strides of the pregnancy. Then give the father and mother time off to be able to start raising the child and figuring out their situations.

    If something is needed by either sex (for biological or any other reason), both sexes get it. Problem solved.

    [–]--o 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Also, once it. gets physically difficult to perform the job standard issue medical protections can be applied. Companies don't have to give anyone time off because they are eight months pregnant, just to people who need medical leave as determined by a doctor.

    [–]redwhiskeredbubul 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    There's such a thing as inequality of condition. If women need more healthcare than men, giving men and women the same amount of healthcare reproduces that inequality.

    [–]snyper7 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    That's a very odd example, given that women already tend to live longer than men do. Wouldn't the other way around be more relevant?

    [–]redwhiskeredbubul -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I think it's very difficult to judge. If you mean that we should try equalize average lifespans, that's a good goal but not all of medicine is based on longevity, there's quality of life, for example. Giving birth and pregnancy involve a lot of medical care up front right there. At the same time, we've become more aware of men's health as a serious issue as women's heath has grown. So it's very difficult to give an overall picture.

    [–]DiggingNoMore 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Make every medicine/surgery/etc available to anybody who needs it, provided they pay for it (in cash, via health insurance, whatever), regardless of their sex. If a woman wants to pay for a prostate exam, go ahead. The exam might not go so well, but, hey, it's available to you. If a man wants to see an ob/gyn, go ahead. Again, might not work out very well, but it's available.

    Problem solved. What else you got?

    [–]redwhiskeredbubul -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    You mean single payer? You must be a Maoist or Canadian or something.

    [–]DiggingNoMore 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Not remotely. I mean everybody can pay for any medical procedure/service they want. Or anybody can pay for insurance coverage of any procedure they want.

    A person should be able to buy health insurance coverage for stomach cancer, skin cancer, HIV, and influenza. Or for measles, infertility, and breast cancer. So on and so forth.

    Alternatively, any person should be able to walk into a doctor office or hospital and request any particular service and pay in cash for it.

    [–]emmanlop -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    That is almost exactly what I said, except you're giving the father time off during maternity leave as well.

    [–]DiggingNoMore 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Yes, because that would be part of "treating everybody the same, regardless of their sex."

    [–]MRB2012 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    The problem with this is that there are so many ways that people understand "working together." Feminists will say that only feminism can solve gender problems;

    Feminism caused a fair amount of today's present gender problems. I doubt feminism is the solution to them.

    [–]FinickyPenance 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I think you missed the point.

    [–]yakityyakblah 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    And the bickering continues...

    [–][deleted] -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Not really. I don't agree with all of his opinions but the fact is that bickering in this field would only come about due to people going on the offensive because something negative was said about gender feminism.

    [–]yakityyakblah 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    So long as one side blames the other for all of the problems with gender, there will always be bickering. If you have any concern for actually accomplishing anything, which an alarming amount of people on both sides appear not to, you will drop it. I don't care if you think it's true, face the fact a movement against feminism will never succeed in bringing equality because to too many people that will read as anti equality. Internalize that fact and just deal with it.

    [–]Bannedfromfun 80ポイント81ポイント  (34子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Believe it or not, for most people IRL it isn't a war.

    Reddit and such just fall prey to the vocal minorities.

    [–]NovaeCain 37ポイント38ポイント  (6子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    The unfortunate truth is, for a lot of people, it is a war and saying things like this only hurt those who are struggling with it more.

    [–]Kareem_Jordan 15ポイント16ポイント  (2子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    The "war" used in the context of the comic refers to a war between those interested in female issues and those interested in male issues.

    That war exists online.

    In the real world, many in first world countries are sympathetic to both while not thrilled about being around people who dedicate their life to either one (simply because those dedicated their life to causes tend to be annoying and condescending), that's very far from a war.

    [–]ponyrides 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    That war exists online

    It exists in the real world too. It just doesn't get brought up/discussed as much. Similar to politics/religion.

    [–]Kareem_Jordan 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    If it does, then (at least in the first world) it's small groups of people fighting each other. It's not how it is on Reddit where every other sub either belongs to /r/ShitRedditSays or /r/MensRights .

    Even here, I think people are still annoyed by both.

    [–]HeartyBeast 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I'm here to be educated. Who are the types of people who are struggling, and what are they struggling with?

    [–]Sparkybear -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Most people who make it a war have never been affected by it and are always bouncing between social issues to carry the flag for. This FOTM is "feminism", before that it was legalization of weed, before that it was equality for gays.

    Feminism in quotes because what feminism has become is moving further away than what it was supposed to be. It was supposed to be about equal treatment regardless of gender, now it's turning into the demonization of men and this cycle of creating fear of the oppressive male figure while emasculating the ones who don't fit that figure and who also don't conform exactly to their idea of the perfect male figure. It's not about empowering women to put them on equal footing, it's about tearing down men in revenge for all the injustices they believe are being perpetrated by the entire male community.

    The people who are actually affected by it, for the most part, are the ones who know it's not about creating more division, it's about creating unity and equality and a safe environment for everyone regardless of gender or other preferences.

    [–]HeartyBeast 4ポイント5ポイント  (24子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I was going to say exactly the same. It isn't a war, as far as I can see, I can't even see why people think it is a war.

    [–]anonlymouse -2ポイント-1ポイント  (21子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Because it is. It's just not as overt as you'd expect.

    [–]HeartyBeast 2ポイント3ポイント  (20子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Well, it may be a war for you, but for the vast majority of people it isn't. Who precisely are the combatants, in your mind? There may be the occasional skirmish. But a war? really?

    [–]anonlymouse -2ポイント-1ポイント  (19子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    It's not about the combatants, it's about the casualties. And the casualties (to start) are the hundreds of millions of men worldwide who aren't able to get help for the violence they receive at the hands of their female partners because of (very successful) feminist efforts to hide that they even exist.

    [–]HeartyBeast 0ポイント1ポイント  (18子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    No. that's a series of serious crimes. Calling it a war is to make the same mistake that people make devising the names 'The War on Terror' and 'The War on Drugs'.

    If a crime has been committed, deal with it. If it is being systematically hushed up, campaign against it. But don't try to frame it as some over-arching war where the two genders are combatants, because you'll devalue any valid arguments you have.

    [–]tjmburns 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Or "The War on Women."

    [–]anonlymouse -2ポイント-1ポイント  (16子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    A war is a series of serious crimes (namely murder).

    [–]HeartyBeast 0ポイント1ポイント  (15子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Well, if we're going to travel down the semantic road, you need more than just a series of serious crimes to call something a war. Otherwise every serial killer would be involved in a war.

    [–]anonlymouse -2ポイント-1ポイント  (14子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Many people committing it.

    [–]HeartyBeast 0ポイント1ポイント  (13子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Many people committing murder. Many people causing death by dangerous driving. Clearly they're all at war.

    [–]Lolzgic 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    You must have went to a great high school.

    [–]Bannedfromfun 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Canadian.

    [–]williammc 29ポイント30ポイント  (4子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Why does every comic like this have to be so deferential to women? Like, "this shit hurts men too"!

    There's no too. Men are hurt and shamed and everyone is ok with it. Men being raped is a joke that people laugh at. Men being abused is a joke that people laugh at. When men speak up they are mocked and shamed and laughed at. I'm pretty sick of the way I've been treated by women in my life who were supposed to support me, and I'm not going to complain about it under the umbrella of how hard it is for them.

    It's hard for me, dammit. Let that be enough sometimes.

    [–]NUMBERS2357 25ポイント26ポイント  (16子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I think this is an incomplete telling of sexism against men. Some sexism against men isn't pressure to act manly, but rather sexism against people for acting manly. Part of the reason this sometimes seems like a "war" is that the same people with this comic's sentiment, ignore or even perpetuate that second type of sexism against men.

    [–]ponyrides 15ポイント16ポイント  (15子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I think this is an incomplete telling of sexism against men

    It is like a 10 page comic. So of course it isn't complete. But it get's the point across that sexism and rigid gender roles are harmful to all genders even if indirectly.

    [–]NUMBERS2357 8ポイント9ポイント  (14子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    I bet that even if it were 100 pages it still wouldn't mention that stuff. Many people, including many of those who repeat the message in this comic and say that both sides should work together, simply don't recognize that second type of sexism.

    To me the implication is clear - they believe that what they discuss is the only type of sexism against men. To be fair I'm partially basing this on what I hear others say, but I've seen much rhetoric & comics decrying sexism against both genders, and how we should all work together, and it never discusses the things I mentioned. At some point that's a meaningful omission.

    [–]joecarrot -5ポイント-4ポイント  (13子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Perhaps it is because 'acting manly' is typically quite damaging to both the actor and those around them. There is nothing good to be said about any part of 'masculinity' that can't also be said to be part of 'being a good person'. Since all the good parts of masculinity can also be parts of being a good person, we are left only with the toxic aspects of masculinity.

    One could of course say the same about femininity. Gender roles are bullshit through and through.

    [–]NUMBERS2357 12ポイント13ポイント  (7子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Your first sentence is IMO wrong, and also contradicts what you later say about there being good parts of acting masculine (the fact that "good masculinity" is advisable to everyone doesn't change the fact that its a part of "acting manly", to the extent that phrase has any meaning). And I think that part of the problem is that you cant divide "masculinity" into "good" and "bad" like this. People don't agree on what is which, and more importantly, some traits are neither good nor bad. They're just differences. Some masculine traits, which are neither good nor bad, are nonetheless viewed negatively.

    For example...introverts v extroverts. Men are more likely to be the former, and its more of a "masculine" trait (though not too strongly so). Introversion shouldn't be considered toxic, but its also not considered a "good" trait that's part of being a good person. But some of the things people say abojt "toxic masculinity" - about men not talking about emotions - is partially an argument in favor of extroverts who want to discuss that stuff, and against introverts, who tend not to.

    one could of course say the same thing about femininity

    The thing is, this comic also isn't a complete description of sexism against women. The difference is, people more readily recognize sexism against women that is outside its scope.

    [–][deleted] 10ポイント11ポイント  (4子コメント)

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    There is nothing good to be said about any part of 'masculinity' that can't also be said to be part of 'being a good person'. Since all the good parts of masculinity can also be parts of being a good person, we are left only with the toxic aspects of masculinity.

    You so completely fundamentally misunderstand what masculinity is, and what gender is, it's astonishing. Masculinity is being a man. When you strip every positive aspect from masculinity, and reduce masculinity to the "toxic aspects" what you end up communicating to boys is being a man means embracing the toxic aspects!

    So many men are stuck in delayed adolescene, acting like teenage boys into their thirties, their forties, lost and confused, unable to become adults because all they know about masculinity is that its toxic.

    Gender roles are bullshit through and through.

    Gender roles are as necessary to human society as language. Society breaks down and ceases to function when gender roles break down. People stop knowing how to find mates, reproduce and raise children.

    A society cannot function without gender roles. When feminists declared war on gender, they declared war on the ability of society to function meaningfully. While its certainly true that gender roles had stagnated by the 1950s and needed to change, feminists decided change wasn't enough -- that gender needs to be destroyed. But that's impossible, you can't destroy gender. People need it to mate.

    [–]villianboy 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

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    People forget we are all just people, and the sex or race or beliefs of that person doesn't change that

    [–]iceforts -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

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    1000 killed Palestinians this month. Tribalism - needed but sometimes irrational.

    [–]scruggsdl 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

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    Awesome.

    [–]MadderThanMad 7ポイント8ポイント  (36子コメント)

    ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

    Guys who are virgins are sad. Source: I'm a sad virgin.

    [–]CokeHeadRob 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

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    I'm one of those and I'm not sad by either definition. You gotta step your game up.

    [–]punkerdante182 3ポイント4ポイント  (15子コメント)

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    Why are you a sad virgin?

    [–]MadderThanMad 0ポイント1ポイント  (13子コメント)

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    Because I want to have sex and can't

    [–]punkerdante182 1ポイント2ポイント  (12子コメント)

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    Well why can't you have sex? Do you not go out? Are you a eunuch? Are you unmotivated to pursue your wants? Why specifically can't you have sex?

    [–]MadderThanMad 0ポイント1ポイント  (11子コメント)

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    Because it requires that someone want me and no one does

    [–]punkerdante182 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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    Well thats just statistically improbable you're talking about 7billion to 1 odds there. Do you go out at all? To places where other girls congregate?

    [–][削除されました]  (9子コメント)

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    [deleted]

      [–]MadderThanMad -4ポイント-3ポイント  (8子コメント)

      ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

      then your problem isn't sex - it's relating to other people.

      I'm pretty sure my problem is still sex. What does relating to people have to do with them wanting to have sex with me?

      have you ever thought about a life coach or a counselor?

      I can't afford a life coach and even if I could afford one what do they even accomplish?

      [–][削除されました]  (7子コメント)

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      [deleted]

        [–]MadderThanMad 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

        ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

        No, I think you're the one who is confused. I'm saying that relating to people doesn't mean someone will want to have sex with me. You're suggesting that people don't relate to me and if I could change that then they'd be interested in sex. I'm saying people do relate and find me funny, charming, smart, and witty. Put me in a room with 20 people and odds are I'll end up being the one telling stories with all eyes on me. Everyone has a good time but none of those girls want anything to do with me romantically.

        [–][削除されました]  (4子コメント)

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        [deleted]

          [–]MadderThanMad -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Because I'd like to have sex and can't

          [–]Grimpillmage 11ポイント12ポイント  (4子コメント)

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          Sad in that context means pathetic and pitiful, not unhappy. I'm sure you're not pathetic by any means.

          [–]MadderThanMad 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Pathetic just means deserving of pity. To pity is to feel sadness for someone else's misfortune. If I knew someone was in my shoes and feeling as I do I would certainly feel sad they were suffering. It is almost the literal definition of pathetic.

          [–]Supercoolguy7 9ポイント10ポイント  (2子コメント)

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          bro look I don't think all of us feel as you. Being a virgin doesn't mean that I'm suffering or that I"m sad. I just say fuck it and go on with life. For a while yeah did it make me feel sad that I hadn't ever done something that so many other people had. yeah but then I realized that it really isn't a big deal.

          [–]yeahrightdude_ 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

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          you're like a super cool guy

          [–]Supercoolguy7 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          yeah right dude. There are like 6 other guys even cooler than me

          [–]pantone13-0752 11ポイント12ポイント  (3子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Girls who are virgins can be sad too. Source: I was a sad virgin for years and years.

          [–]CUNTBERT_RAPINGTON 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

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          Girls that are virgins don't have nearly the same stigma. It's the opposite side of the coin of the whole "guys are studs and women are sluts" thing that everybody always seems to forget.

          [–]Supercoolguy7 19ポイント20ポイント  (0子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Girls that are virgins do actually have a stigma. It's weird everyone expects them to have sex, if not they are a prude, but while thinking it's bad for them to have sex, because that's what sluts do. It's weird, both are bad and counter productive

          [–]fuchsiamatter 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          No, that is absolutely not true. Girls are supposed to be desirable. Perhaps there is no stigma against girls who are in relationships but choose not to have sex (although I think most people I know would find it weird), but girls who are not perceived as desirable struggle with a bunch of issues.

          [–]real_fuzzy_bums 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          Not really, my best friend is a virgin and just wants a partner he can connect with. He doesn't care about busting his first, and he's not asexual and he's not sad or ashamed.

          [–]nmhunate -3ポイント-2ポイント  (7子コメント)

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          I dont think being a being a virgin should be a source of sadness. If you think there is a problem, then being a virgin is just a symptom of that problem. Nothing more.

          The point being, is that I could have sex with you tonight , and you would be no longer a virgin, that act of sex will not change anything. (If there are underlying issues, those don't go away when you get sex)

          Virginity isn't a source of sadness

          [–]MadderThanMad 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Virginity isn't a source of sadness

          Yes it is. It is very sad to have urges that can never be satisfied. It makes me feel like shit that no one wants me and I keep thinking I'll die before this changes.

          I could have sex with you tonight , and you would be no longer a virgin, that act of sex will not change anything.

          I will feel relieved knowing that I was able to experience something humanizing at least once in my life.

          [–]nmhunate -4ポイント-3ポイント  (1子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Why don't you pay for sex then? You will fulfill a need and experience something humanizing.

          I've been with a couple of prostitutes, it's the worlds oldest profession. You will commune with people like Julius Caesar and Charlemagne by purchasing one. It's not that bad.

          [–]MadderThanMad 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          Yeah, it looks like that is what I'll end up doing. Don't have the cash right now but I finish grad school in a year and should have the money then. It will be my gift to me.

          [–]inyouraeroplane 8ポイント9ポイント  (3子コメント)

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          Way to erase his feelings. You told him he had zero right to feel upset for never having sex.

          Of course, that's pretty typical from the crowd this comes from. A man gets upset and we hear about "manfeelz" and "male tears".

          [–]SacreBleuMe 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          Small nitpick, the reason men are shamed for not being masculine is exactly that - as opposed to being like women. Being like a woman is being un-masculine, but being un-masculine isn't necessarily being like a woman. It's not that women are bad and that's why you shouldn't be like them, it's that men are expected to only be men, and nothing else.

          [–]mkk123 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          There IS a war, but it's not one of men vs women. It's one of oppression vs equality, of ignorance vs understanding.

          [Edit] can someone give me an explanation of downvoting? I was just saying that we shouldn't be pitting gender vs gender but it's true that we are constantly fighting against ignorance.

          [–]Brain_Pal 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

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          Are any of those "because"s grammatically correct?

          [–]punkerdante182 -3ポイント-2ポイント  (10子コメント)

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          Thank you, I needed this. My Fiance and I were discussing this just yesterday. There's a MRA conference in our hometown and just....gah so much blood boiling. But sexism hurts everybody and it sucks.

          [–][deleted] 14ポイント15ポイント  (9子コメント)

          ごめんなさい。これは既にアーカイブしてあり、もう投票はできません。

          I can't help but wonder if your blood would boil the same way if it were a feminist conference instead.