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A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines Reddiquette Comment Formatting Guide New to reddit? click here! Join us on IRC #Europe on irc.snoonet.org List of European English-language news sources Other European subreddits: Q&A - /r/AskEurope InterRail - /r/Interrail Pictures - /r/europics In-depth - /r/Europeans Culture - /r/europeanculture EU Parliament - /r/EuropeanParliament Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop EU Law - /r/eulaw List of all European location reddits Interesting threads from the past: "What do you know about ... ?" "Which places should you visit in ... ?" "What happened in your country this week?" "... of Europe"
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
Comment Formatting Guide
New to reddit? click here!
Join us on IRC #Europe on irc.snoonet.org
List of European English-language news sources
Other European subreddits:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
EU Parliament - /r/EuropeanParliament
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
EU Law - /r/eulaw
List of all European location reddits
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?"
"Which places should you visit in ... ?"
"What happened in your country this week?"
"... of Europe"
Is the flag of your region not available? Message the mods so we can add it!
Immigration Megathread - Part IMegathread (self.europe)
European UnionModeratorsOfEurope が 5時間 前 投稿 - stickied post
残りのコメントをみる →
[–]United Kingdom15243asd1 39ポイント40ポイント41ポイント 5時間 前 (46子コメント)
Well this is a very creative way to censor the anti-immigration feeling
[–]Augusto_Franco [スコア非表示] 1時間 前* (0子コメント)
Between this an the "controversial" tag they used it's blatantly obvious that the mods here are trying to stifle views they dislike.
And a few weeks ago they censored threads about the terrorist attacks in France because "the best answer to terrorism is indifference"
Going even further back, a few months ago they removed 6 threads about Muslim 'refugees' murdering Christians who were on the same ship.
Despite what they're saying in this thread, the mods of /r/europe are trying to push an agenda. One would need to be blind to not notice it.
[–]an Old World-er in the New WorldQuirkyQuarQ -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 4時間 前* (2子コメント)
Well this is a very pragmatic way to aggregate the pro/anti-immigration feeling.
FTFY.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet[M] -16ポイント-15ポイント-14ポイント 4時間 前 (1子コメント)
FYI: I really don't care if you're pro or against immigration. I don't moderate to advance my political beliefs, and nor do any other moderators on the team.
Our one goal is a sub which is filled with interesting and insightful discussion and content, and perhaps even be a little bit entertaining.
The omnipresence of immigration threads is causing a drop in quality. I don't care that it's immigration. It could be any political issue. We would undertake the same action, because this is the way to ensure a variety of high quality discussion (rather than a single discussion which is low quality and regurgitative).
[–]an Old World-er in the New WorldQuirkyQuarQ -5ポイント-4ポイント-3ポイント 4時間 前 (0子コメント)
Agreed completely, I was just trying to not change parent's wording too much for an FTFY. But will FTFTFY.
[+]United States of Americawadcann スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 4時間 前 (1子コメント)
How is it censoring it? You've got a stickied post in a unique color up top. It's available to anyone who wants to read all the material they want. It just means that a single topic doesn't drown out everything else, while still keeping that topic available to everyone.
[–]insuranceclaiminsp 15ポイント16ポイント17ポイント 4時間 前 (0子コメント)
The mods have have said before that try to limit the impact stories by creating megathreads for them. When they removed threads about the terrorist attack in France during Ramadan and set-up a megathread, one mod said:
Yep. This is why we did setup a megathread: /r/Europe is hence not giving the appearance of being obnubilated. The best answer to terrorism is indifference.
and they said other threads on the incident were removed because:
Censure or visible islamophobia. One has to choose.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet[M] -17ポイント-16ポイント-15ポイント 5時間 前 (39子コメント)
I don't care what you guys talk about, so long as it's not the same thing five times a day, every day, forever, to the exclusion of everything else. Everything in everyone of those threads was nothing new. The same old arguments by both sides regurgitated over and over again.
Now you can all have that same regurgitative arguments in one place so that it doesn't annoy the rest of the community.
[–]Swabiagenitaliban 30ポイント31ポイント32ポイント 2時間 前 (4子コメント)
Most frequent words on /r/europe since 27. Jun:
Posts: 172337 Avg. Words / Post: 43 Unique Users: 9553 Avg. Posts / User: 18 32216 - Greece 20812 - Greek 17956 - Eu 14581 - Money 13559 - Debt 12922 - Government 12501 - Countries 12119 - Europe 11037 - Germany 9684 - Euro 9608 - Pay 9493 - Because 9399 - European 8802 - Problem 8781 - German 8531 - State 7892 - Lot 7709 - Happen 6980 - Better 6163 - Economy 5980 - Fuck 5846 - Against 5675 - Vote 5485 - Reason 5484 - Economic 5434 - Interest 5414 - Deal 5394 - Already 5340 - Bad 5315 - Really 5301 - Austerity 5301 - Pretty 5293 - War 5218 - Fact 5206 - Uk 5182 - Political 5131 - Nothing 5010 - Different 4996 - Tax 4904 - Least 4855 - Case 4807 - Union 4798 - Russia 4560 - Everyone 4552 - Banks 4535 - Support 4524 - Situation 4500 - Both 4421 - Referendum 4408 - Eurozone 4360 - Agree 4338 - Always 4292 - Enough 4206 - Believe 4205 - Understand 4191 - Whole 4188 - Talk 4139 - Another 4131 - Law 4096 - Idea 4031 - Bank 4016 - Party 4012 - Public 4000 - System 3989 - Example 3975 - Feel 3975 - Power 3953 - Issue 3941 - France 3900 - Course 3874 - Wrong 3854 - Someone 3817 - Crisis 3780 - Around 3773 - Syriza 3762 - Russian 3651 - Shit 3625 - Matter 3615 - Bailout 3570 - Having 3565 - Actually 3508 - True 3505 - Done 3493 - Into 3471 - Seem 3462 - Instead 3460 - Opinion 3433 - Member 3399 - Post 3398 - Currency 3391 - Cut 3384 - Quite 3381 - Job 3377 - Guy 3373 - Comment 3372 - Leave 3370 - Question 3362 - Bit 3351 - Gdp 3315 - Getting
Doesn't look that immigration-focused to me, in fact I don't think there's a single immigration-related result in there. Rather a lot of economics.
[–]United States of Americawadcann [スコア非表示] 1時間 前 (3子コメント)
Just out of curiosity, how did you gather that data?
[–]Swabiagenitaliban [スコア非表示] 34分 前 (2子コメント)
I've got a bot running that periodically fetches new posts and condenses them into a word frequency database. It's been up for a month now and generates the same statistics as above for each flair and country. But the data isn't that interesting yet - people mostly talk about Greece and their own country. It'll get more interesting over time, I think.
[–]United States of Americawadcann [スコア非表示] 31分 前 (1子コメント)
Last I looked, the Reddit API had a cap of a request about every second or so. Is the frequency of posts on /r/europe not high enough to crash into that?
I have a search engine that I've set up to run against Reddit, because Reddit's search engine absolutely sucks, but I'd only been having it index my comments (since I always have a hard time finding my old comments). However, I might consider expanding the scope of the thing if it's viable to pull down more text.
[–]Swabiagenitaliban [スコア非表示] 27分 前 (0子コメント)
Cap of 2s it's now, but the frequency on reddit in general is tiny. Each of those requests nets you 100 items (max), and I've not found a sub that wasn't far from that. Fetching all posts on all of reddit, though, as you would need for a proper search engine - that could become a problem. I've already got to be mindful of memory usage etc. from pulling a few hundred smaller subs, the data just adds up even though I discard the heavier items like post body quickly.
[–]Brexit_Brutal_Jerk_Off_ 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 4時間 前 (1子コメント)
In that case is a Russia megathread needed? Considering how many posts there are about Russia, just in the past week.
[–]indigo-alien 6ポイント7ポイント8ポイント 3時間 前 (0子コメント)
A Moscowtimes megathread is certainly needed.
[–]Germanyhomemadecookies 23ポイント24ポイント25ポイント 4時間 前 (31子コメント)
You could pretty much make the exact same statement about any topic in any subreddit ever.
I take you got a lot of complaints then?
[+]pies n gravySlyRatchet スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 4時間 前 (29子コメント)
Many users have left the subreddit because instead of this being /r/europe it became /r/europeanimmigration. This is people from all over the political spectrum too, not just people who were for/against immigration.
Personally, I think the quality of the subreddit was objectively deteriorating due to the overwhelming prevalence of one issue which was being constantly jumped upon by a sizeable minority of users, quite possibly with outside agitators who were brigading.
It's not just that it was all on the same issue. It was that the arguments being thrashed out in the comments section were always the same.
And I don't buy into the idea that you could say that about every topic on every subreddit ever. /r/europe is quite news focused and frequently discussed an ever changing variety of things. But for some reason immigration just stuck. And stayed stuck, despite the majority of users being not particularly interested.
[–]Germanyhomemadecookies 8ポイント9ポイント10ポイント 3時間 前 (1子コメント)
I just don't understand the need for a sticky post. If a lot of posts about immigration come up, it probably just means that that's a hot topic atm and that people wish to discuss it. Just like Greece in the past weeks or Russia (basically permanantly).
I come across a lot of links or posts I personally don't care about but as it is with everything on the internet, I do not have to click it. I do not have to read it, I do not have to agree with it and posting European contect on r/Europe - even if it is something I don't care about - seems pretty natural and doesn't exactly come as a surprise.
So instead of giving in to people who feel there are too many posts on a certain subject and even go to such great lengths as to complain to mods about it, why not deal with it the adult way and tell them that that's life (or in this case, the internet) and that removing that content is not a moderator's job?
[–]Benthetraveler [スコア非表示] たった今 (0子コメント)
4 racist subreddits are currently brigading this thread. Please tell again how topics "probably just come up".
[–]indigo-alien 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 4時間 前* (6子コメント)
Many users have left the subreddit because...
I hate to go all wiki on ya, but... "citation needed".
Personally, I think the quality of the subreddit was objectively deteriorating due to the overwhelming prevalence of one issue
Then perhaps you need to speak to a certain Frenchmen who keeps deleting other topics for not being European enough, or for being "local news".
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet[M] 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 3時間 前 (4子コメント)
I'm basing this largely off the huge number of PMs we've been getting, and it would be a violation of their privacy to share them with you, or anyone.
Then perhaps you need to speak to a certain Frenchmen who keeps deleting other topics for not being European enough.
/u/dClauzel is a good mod. Does he make controversial decisions? Yes. I've even spoken to him and discussed how I would moderate differently. But what I know is that /u/dClauzel does an amazing amount of work for this subreddit. He spends more time clearing through the mod queue than I do, and was a major asset in the lovely visual redesign of the subreddit that you see before you.
So, will you always agree with him? Of course not. But does he do a good job? Hell yes. I don't know many people who would be willing to put in so much work to make a site operate smoothly and get so much hate for it.
/u/dClauzel is not the reason for the drop in quality. In fact, he is part of the reason it hasn't dropped off faster. The reason for the drop in quality is because we, as moderators, have not been pro-active enough in providing that all the issues of the day get adequate space on this subreddit, and have allowed brigades to have undue influence.
I hope that we can do more in future to prevent this, not less.
[–]United Kingdomtwisted_grump [スコア非表示] 15分 前 (0子コメント)
discussed how I would moderate differently
Make the mod logs public.
[–]_NYARLATHOTEP_ 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 3時間 前 (2子コメント)
/u/dClauzel is a good mod
No he isn't. It's ridiculous that someone who can't speak English is moderating an English-language subreddit.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet[M] -1ポイント0ポイント1ポイント 3時間 前 (1子コメント)
He can speak English pretty well. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but every single one of his comments is written in English (but nobody seems to notice that, instead they just see that it's two languages instead of one and insta-downvote).
Plus, I think somebody who actually works with dClauzel every day, such as myself and my co-mods, are in a much better position to determine his ability at the job or otherwise. What I've seen of him tells me he's pretty good.
[–]Czechiaferoslav 7ポイント8ポイント9ポイント 1時間 前 (0子コメント)
You can't be surpised that he is getting downvoted all the time, no one likes attention whoring.
[–]CAPS_4_FUN -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 4時間 前 (0子コメント)
Many users have left the subreddit because instead of this being /r/europe it became /r/europeanimmigration.
This mass invasion as many of us see, is one of the biggest problems in Europe right now. Why wouldn't the discussion about it be all over this sub?
[–]Baden-WurttembergKetchupTubeAble19 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 4時間 前 (0子コメント)
Thanks, now I can finally look at stuff on /r/europe again without having to check if I'm on /r/european every 2 minutes.
[–]BestoniaStrukkStar 14ポイント15ポイント16ポイント 4時間 前 (16子コメント)
Many users have left the subreddit
Isn't the amount of subscribers to /r/europe constantly growing, instead of declining?
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet[M] -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 4時間 前 (15子コメント)
Subscribers =/= users.
The number of subscribers to /r/europe constantly rises by about a hundred people per day, but few of those people actually participate. It's the same way I'm subbed to /r/technology, but I can't honestly say that I've ever looked at it, so it'd be ridiculous to call me a user of /r/technology despite the fact I'm a subscriber.
That's why this is so sad. To have a long time user PM you and tell you that they're not angry, but they're disappointed and that they're leaving... It's not good. I would take one actual user over ten thousand subscribers easily.
We're losing good users because of the complete excess of this immigration content. It's not even because the sub is growing in subscribers. We've been growing for a long time and the content stayed broadly the same (in fact, it got better IHMO for a time because we had even more real users being engaged). Fortunately, we have a simple solution, and maybe by doing this we can win some of those lost users back and possibly even win more that we never had in the first place. That's my dream.
[–]The NetherlandsXeran_ 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 4時間 前 (8子コメント)
What if we actually would look at the users numbers? The number of unique users is slowly but steadily increasing over time. Also funny how you accurately can see the sub primarily consists of European users.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 4時間 前 (7子コメント)
Unique page views isn't a good metric either. It's about having users who are engaged, comment and read comments regularly. And not only that, but are constructive (there's a lot of sock puppet accounts which read and comment but are totally unconstructive).
It's a very difficult thing to measure and it's something you can only do by really watching users everyday, with the full force of the statistics and controls behind you.
[–]AnarchyObeyStatusQuo 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 3時間 前 (6子コメント)
True. Those numbers don't mean much. /r/soccer has 30k less subscribers but 5x more online users at any given time. /r/europe's growth is mostly artificial and while defaulting probably brought a few users here I'm sure the majority of those who made new accounts don't even know this subreddit exists.
[–]United Kingdom15243asd1 -1ポイント0ポイント1ポイント 2時間 前 (5子コメント)
defaulting?
[–]BestoniaStrukkStar 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 4時間 前 (5子コメント)
Why not go to the /r/worldnews route instead? And have filters for certain topics?
[–]The NetherlandsPhalanx300 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 2時間 前 (0子コメント)
This is the best solution really, that will at least mean that your opinion is taken somewhat seriously and not hidden away in a place no one is going to talk about the subject really. Much better then this megathread which as mentioned serves a minor censorship role.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 4時間 前 (2子コメント)
It's a bit of a coin toss between the two options. The flair-filter system is one we've implemented before for the Ukraine Crisis. Both options have a lot of merit, but we decided to do a megathread for a variety of small reasons. One of which was that we felt the discussions in 99% of the immigration submissions were relevant to any of the other submissions. So we feel as though there is real merit in not only putting the submissions in one place, but the comments too. That way you can have a comprehensive discussion about immigration rather than 50 different small ones. If you compare that with something like Ukraine, there were a lot of stories within stories. Domestic Ukrainian political situation, domestic Russian politics, Crimea, the Donbass, the Baltics, the NATO summits, position of Western soldiers, the creation of the Eurasian Union, and so on: all unique narratives in their own right where the discussion is not immediately relevant to the wider discussion in the same way immigration sub themes are. So that's one significant advantage of a megathread in this instance. Another significant one worth mentioning is that flairs aren't often used. For instance, I would say that about half or less of the users read the sidebar, and about the same amount regularly read flairs. So they're unlikely to become aware of the fact that the flairs exist and are therefore going to continue to be unhappy with the way the subreddit is. It's essentially a communication issue, but one that we're unable to solve sufficiently. However megathreads are clearly visible and fit into the general way subreddits work seamlessly. A third reason is that I think there is a lot of benefit in actually cataloguing these immigration stories to try and get a holistic view of the situation. This is a similar reason to the comprehensive conversation reason I mentioned earlier, but instead of having a whole conversation it's about having a whole grasp of the news.
So, the reasons are quite numerous.
[–]Swabiagenitaliban 4ポイント5ポイント6ポイント 2時間 前 (1子コメント)
That way you can have a comprehensive discussion about immigration rather than 50 different small ones.
That's how it would work on Usenet or 4chan, but the problem is that reddit's ranking algorithm includes age and is pretty destructive for sustained discussion, especially when you add downvotes into the mix. It's great for debating individual items like news stories or questions, but bad for anything else. You're trying to force traditional forum behavior onto a system that was made specifically to provide a different approach, which IMHO just doesn't work. I'd be very much in favor of the filter solution as well, I constantly use them on /r/worldNews.
[–]pies n gravySlyRatchet -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 2時間 前 (0子コメント)
I'd like to give a lot more depth to this reply, but I really need to get to bed (I've been awake for about 30 hours and counting). I just wanna point out that we're gonna be refreshing this megathread like we did with the greece one every 500 comments or every day or two. This will keep it fresh.
[–]an Old World-er in the New WorldQuirkyQuarQ 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 4時間 前 (0子コメント)
That's a binary solution. I imagine the vast majority of users are still interested in keeping an eye on what's going on with immigration; they just don't want to be forced to choose between seeing it all or seeing nothing at all.
π Rendered by PID 5737 on app-75 at 2015-07-27 21:30:57.163416+00:00 running eefde69 country code: JP.
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