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Coinffeine launches the worlds first decentralized Bitcoin exchange in 70 countries (blog.coinffeine.com)

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[–]flix2 34ポイント35ポイント  (13子コメント)

This is pretty amazing. We have been waiting for true P2P exchanges for years. If this works as intended you can kiss the Bitlicense and other regulatory interference goodbye, they will be as irrelevant as attempts to shut down BitTorrent.

[–]MurderousKirk 28ポイント29ポイント  (4子コメント)

If this works as intended

[–]directTrade 3ポイント4ポイント  (3子コメント)

First www.BitSquare.io and now www.Coinffeine.com. None of them have been able to eradicate the dependency on anonymous escrows or centralized gateways. These are just variants of current centralized ones like www.LocalBitcoins.com, www.100bit.co.in or www.PaxFul.com under the disguise of decentralization. Bitcoin's concept of decentralization worked because it was trust less by architecture. For these so called decentralized exchanges, we have to trust some common party... and there it fails. Sorry.

[–]flix2 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I am more optimistic. Each of these steps has added one more degree of decentralisation.

Coinffeine goes one step further... but it could still do more.

Obviously if you touch digital fiat you are going to have to go through a mainstream financial gatekeeper.

You could stick to physical cash <--> btc

(either in person or via ATMs)... but this reduces reach and speed enormously.

[–]flix2 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

https://twitter.com/flix1/status/623511609256886272

[–]TweetsInCommentsBot 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

@flix1

2015-07-21 15:15 UTC

P2P Exchange Whack-a-mole #Bitcoin has become much more resilient. @Coinffeine @LocalBitcoins @paxful @100bitcoin

[Attached pic] [Imgur rehost]

This message was created by a bot

[Contact creator][Source code]

[–]Helferleinchen 22ポイント23ポイント  (7子コメント)

Not that amazing.

Limited to OkPay. (centralized)

Limited by this weird microtransaction system so they can only use a single(?) payment processor.

Stupid name.

Bank sponsored.

Easily indentifiable transactions.

[–]janjko 8ポイント9ポイント  (4子コメント)

Is there a better decentralized exchange?

[–]Sukrim 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Depends on your definition of "decentralized".

Ripple, localbitcoins, BitShares' BitUSD... they all are on a certain scale of decentralization.

[–]flix2 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

BitUSD is not fiat. It does not provide an on/off ramp to crypto world.

Ripple is super centralised with gatekeepers and account blocking.

Only Locabitcoins.com allows you to exchange fiat <-> Bitcoin between peers. But it is very limited, is still somewhat centralised (because lbc keeps escrow funds) and is slow. Fraud is still a big issue.

Once Coinffeine reaches its full potential, with multiple payment processors connected, multiple currencies and enough liquidity... it will provide a much better market than anything we have right now.

...and especially a much more resilient one, that cannot be taken down or regulated into irrelevance.

[–]Sukrim 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

BitUSD is not fiat. It does not provide an on/off ramp to crypto world.

Not natively, yes.

Ripple is super centralised with gatekeepers and account blocking.

Not really, it is about as "centralized" as OkPay being able to freeze funds on their platform. Accounts can't be blocked, only issuers can freeze the assets they issued themselves (e.g. Bitstamp froze about 1 million USD recently). Coinffeine apparently only has a single fiat gateway, Ripple has several.

Only Locabitcoins.com allows you to exchange fiat <-> Bitcoin between peers.

Also not really, you can exchange fiat on several platforms OR actual money (cash) against Localbitcoin BTC-denominated balances/IOUs that you might or might not be able to redeem.

...and especially a much more resilient one, that cannot be taken down or regulated into irrelevance.

Those multiple payment processors verly likely will have to be heavily regulated and can freeze accounts, cancel transactions, refuse to transact or refuse to pay out at will or at the whim of a regulative body.

[–]Helferleinchen -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

not yet...

[–]flix2 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

-Limited to OKPay for now (It's a Beta!). Multiple payment processors can and will be added.

-Leverages Bitcoin payment channels to limit risk to a tiny fraction. First good use of this feature I've seen so far.

-Bank sponsored? It's a startup. They managed to get funding from a bank for a Bitcoin company? That is incredible.

[–]io_Stream 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The "microtransactions" you named a game theory based feature. I just set the software up and will place an order.

Yes OKPay will know that I sent some random dude a series of transactions that could be assumed to be a BTC purchase but no one besides me and the BTC seller are aware of the transaction and the seller doesn't have my private info.

Anything short of cash will ALWAYS have a traditional institution as an on ramp... I am very intrigued by coinffeine's concept. I want to see how it works out.

[–]Mikheilm 46ポイント47ポイント  (30子コメント)

Im sorry if this is unproductive, but who is naming these exchanges and startups? They are so uninspired and often make no god damn sense. Coinffeine?! Buttercoin?!

How are those names to inspire a level of professional confidence or even a hint of what those companies provide?

I see this all over the Bitcoin ecosystem and it boggles my mind.

[–]ianpurton 19ポイント20ポイント  (9子コメント)

Getting a relevant domain name is hard and expensive. Most of the bitcoin domains have been taken by squatters.

Try it for yourself.

[–]grabberfish 6ポイント7ポイント  (8子コメント)

Try different TLDs. It's typically the .com domains that are taken. British Indian Ocean Territory .io TLD is very popular in the technology space.

[–]WinkleviBitcoinTrust 8ポイント9ポイント  (7子コメント)

Why is that? Is .io supposed to mean input/output?

[–]VP_Marketing_Bitcoin 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Basically, and brevity. Plus it's fun to say "dot io". :)

[–]maskedgenius 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think it's because io looks like a one and zero, like binary.

[–]BTC_Bradley 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

I thought it meant Indian Ocean

[–]blazes816 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Technically it does. It's the TLD for the Indian Ocean region, but hipster tech startups think it means "we run a tech business".

[–]mrpg_ 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's the TLD for the Indian Ocean region

Nope. It’s the TLD for the British Indian Ocean Territory. I doubt that many Indian Ocean region people applaud the use of the .io TLD considering what the Brits did to the BIOT.

[–]blazes816 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Interesting. Not that I don't believe most people on the internet but I check and you are correct, only for the British IO Territory.

[–]mrpg_ 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

But I am not most people on the internet! I am a very special snowflake.

[–]xbtdev 4ポイント5ポイント  (6子コメント)

You just gave me an idea - Butterffeine. For people who only have time to eat a sandwich or drink coffee, but not do both.

[–]chabes 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

they could probably benefit from regular helpings of energy milk, or perhaps some energy jerky (with guarana), followed by some sleepytime pork to round things out

[–]bitocoino 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I kind of like "energy milk"!

[–]chabes 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

effervesced or original?

[–]McCl3lland 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Naw, those people would drink bullet coffee (which your name still works with).

[–]xbtdev 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

bullet coffee

Sounds more like bitterfeine.

[–]McCl3lland 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

As someone who hates coffee, I'd agree. But as someone who loves butter..... lol

[–]sagesex 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

That name is so bad, it might just be remembered. Which is all it needs to be.

[–]Noosterdam 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

But it's awkward to say.

[–]btcbot 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

CoinFiend! I like it...

[–]AManBeatenByJacks 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

The tech industry in general does this slack, uber, google, amazon, twitter, these are weird names if they werent household names.

[–]zeusa1mighty 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Uber means "great" in German. Google is the name of a very large number. Amazon is the name of an enormous river (implies trade). Twitter is the sound of a bird. Slack means to be loose.

Coinffeinne? That's not a word.

[–]AManBeatenByJacks 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Caffine the drug mispelled like google is mispelled.

[–]joshontheweb 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

If anyone wants coinpeach.com I'll sell it for a reasonable price. Beats the heck out of coinffeine.com

[–]tasmanoide 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I like that name.

[–]HostFat[S] -3ポイント-2ポイント  (3子コメント)

I continue to hear these funny arguments even about the "Bitcoin" name.

[–]zeusa1mighty -5ポイント-4ポイント  (2子コメント)

Bitcoin is a bad name IMO.

[–]bearjewpacabra 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Andreas hates it.

[–]zeusa1mighty 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It just sounds like a kid toy. Maybe the connotation will fade, but I always feel like I'm telling someone about the latest mmorpg when I tell them about bitcoin.

[–]silkroadreloaded -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's probably because the masses like stupid names which are irrelevant to the platform/product.

[–]Introshine 13ポイント14ポイント  (28子コメント)

OK, so.

  • Bob wants coins.
  • Sarah is selling coins
  • They put X coins in escrow as collateral
  • "The local currency is transferred through a payment processor that supports non-reversible payments" << This does not exist - at least not instantly - SEPA can be manually reversed for days, weeks - except for Bitcoin or Cash. With a court order it's even worse. source
  • They move amounts the size of <X each time.

I'm not so sure.

[–]libertariandictator 9ポイント10ポイント  (4子コメント)

A SEPA transaction can not just be reversed. Only when the receiver initializes the transaction and takes the money from the other person's account.

[–]Max_LocalBitcoins 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

A SEPA transaction can be reversed. Not to mention OKpay which they currently use.

[–]Introshine 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

http://help.sap.com/saphelp_pme70/helpdata/en/f4/7e7970ab0545debf2ecaeeeb55d071/content.htm

[–]libertariandictator 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Thanks for pointing out that there is a whole system in place where the bank is involved and the sender can't just reverse the transaction. On the contrary are Sepa Direct Debit transactions, which is a pull transaction, not a push transaction, and can easily be reversed by the payer.

[–]btcdrak 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sender can claim fraudulent payment and it can be reversed.

Prerequisites The SEPA credit transfer is a duplicate, is technically incorrect, or has been triggered with fraudulent intent. The originator bank triggers the recall within 10 bank working days of the settlement of the SEPA credit transfer.

emphasis mine.

[–]dskloet 4ポイント5ポイント  (6子コメント)

It does exist in some countries. In the Netherlands there is iDeal, for example.

Edit: but I don't think it works consumer to consumer.

[–]jerguismi 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

Nope. All centralized (trust-based) electronic payments are reversable, if there is enough political will. There are lots of payment systems, which are very rarely reversed or advertised as irreversible, but it doesn't mean the same as real technical irreversibility, which bitcoin has.

[–]libertariandictator 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

True, but that's not the point at the moment.

Sepa can be used safely to receive money. As long as you're not banking in Greece at the moment.

I live in the Netherlands and a SEPA transaction is practically unreversible. Theoretically it might be, but you can use a SEPA safely.

European banks will sometimes block a transaction to protect against theft, but if it goes through it's unrealistic to worry about the transaction being cancelled.

[–]jerguismi 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

Netherlands might be a place where SEPA transfers are blocked very rarely. However in many other EU countries I've heard SEPA transfers reversed/blocked quite regurarly (or the assets frozen, whatever, essentially you don't have access to the money in some form or other).

"Sepa can be used safely to receive money."

For common/normal use, yes. For bitcoin trading, I wouldn't agree. I don't know if it makes sense to argue about the topic because it is pretty much up to your and my personal empirical information.

[–]HostFat[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Anyway Coinffeine isn't using SEPA, it's using Okpay.

And it seems that Okpay is still difficult to chargeback.

[–]jerguismi 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, to my knowledge OKPay is very difficult to chargeback, much more difficult than SEPA. However it is still technically possible if OKPay guys decide that they want to reverse some payments (they try to guarantee you that they never want that). With bitcoin chargebacks aren't techically possible. My point was to demonstrate the difference, as the marketing speak often doesn't make the distinction very clear.

[–]Introshine 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

iDeal is for companies (like Bitonic.nl already using). Not for P2P exchanging.

[–]notreddingit 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Lots of interbank instant domestic transfers are effectively non-reversible. Not like Bitcoin is trustless and non-reversible, but they're not like credit cards that can easily be charged back. And if you get scammed the chances of recovering your money are close to zero and they specifically warn you when you send money not to send to people you don't know because if it's a scam you're out of luck.

For an example of this in action compare the spreads on different countries 'national bank transfers' on Localbitcoins to trades with Paypal(which of course we all know is reversible). You'll notice that the national bank transfers option tends to have the lowest spreads, implying the least risk. While Paypal has extremely high spreads so traders can attempt to offset the fraud they'll inevitably run in to.

I'll note that Americans don't have any sort of national bank transfer system now, as it comes up often in these discussions.

And while different countries will have different policies, in my experience national bank transfers have been the most secure way for people to trade Bitcoin. I'm sure they're not perfect, it's a big world and knowing banks I'm sure there are some horror stories out there. But the success of national bank transfers on Localbitcoins lends pretty good evidence that they tend to be a good way to trade BTC.

[–]fcktheussa 3ポイント4ポイント  (11子コメント)

Is sepa reversible? Never heard of it.

[–]Introshine 0ポイント1ポイント  (10子コメント)

http://help.sap.com/saphelp_pme70/helpdata/en/f4/7e7970ab0545debf2ecaeeeb55d071/content.htm

[–]Helferleinchen 0ポイント1ポイント  (9子コメント)

can you read?

Prerequisites

The SEPA credit transfer is a duplicate, is technically incorrect, or has been triggered with fraudulent intent.

The originator bank triggers the recall within 10 bank working days of the settlement of the SEPA credit transfer.

please tell me how you ever reversed a sepa transfer.

[–]Introshine 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

or has been triggered with fraudulent intent.

You have never been scammed on Paypal, have you? I have been scammed. They claim fraud and PP reverses the payment like regulation says they should.

[–]Helferleinchen 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

???

SEPA has nothing to do with Paypal. Paypal is not recommendable, of course.

[–]Introshine 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

OK, it goes like this:

  • They send you Euros via SEPA (sometimes using a hacked account even, or a strawman)
  • You send them bitcoins
  • They claim fraud with the bank (or the hacked user claims fraud) - When they mention the term "bitcoins" in a fraud report most compliance departments get really, really cautious.
  • SEPA is reversed
  • You got scammed.

[–]Helferleinchen 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I guess that might work once or twice with one account, but I'm really not sure how easily the bank would accept your claim. You'd have to provide some form of proof I believe.

If you trade small amounts (maybe up to a couple of hundred euro) that wouldn't be very profitable for a professional scammer and a lot of hassle for a one timer.

Bank accounts can be seen as a rare good. You can't just open up 100s at will. If you manage to steal some (or many) they get closed down pretty quickly.

I can't imagine this to be profitable, but I don't have lots of criminal intent, so I might be missing out.

[–]Introshine 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I guess that might work once or twice with one account

Well that is how criminals work. They collect hacked accounts, or lure other people into paying money - anything so they can get the bitcoins. 1 BTC is like 1,5 months of wage in some East-Europe countries.

I don't have lots of criminal intent, so I might be missing out.

Don't get me wrong here, but it's just a bit naive. Please read this:

http://blog.bitbargain.com/post/111412279142/on-verification

They went to a new level. They published false job positions offers in some parts of France where people are desesperate to get a job. Basically a receptionnist position in a hotel. Then they tell job applicants they will be paid using some kind of new electronic money, and that the first step of the process would be to open an account on our service (using a webmail they provide, on which they control the passwords).

Truly evil. THis is just an example of how creative these criminals are.

[–]Helferleinchen 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I was aware of that article and I know there are some really mean crooks out there.

I still haven't heard of a reversed SEPA transaction and I would trade bitcoin for euro via SEPA any time.

Btw. bitcoin.de do these kind of trades (btc/euro sepa) sucessfully for years.

[–]btcdrak 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Claim fraud or mistaken transfer. Search reddit, there are dozens of examples of localbitcoin transactions paid by SEPA being subsequently reversed.

[–]Helferleinchen -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

searched for sepa, localbitcoins, fraud with 0 cases of fraudulent chargebacks. Just did a very quick search cause i gotta run but Zero.

Really, to me, SEPA chargebacks are a myth. Maybe you can poit me to a thread?

[–]Zyklon87 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

OKPay, they say you can't chargeback :)

[–]btcdrak 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Except for fraud...

[–]investor2020 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Agree... Fishy...

[–]waxwing 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Coinffeine's solution to the conundrum of fiat-crypto decentralization is interesting. It seems to me they have come closer to making trustless fiat-crypto trading, but not so much decentralized - at least not yet.

Basically the way to solve the unsolvable is to cheat somehow. Bitcoin cheated in "solving" the Byzantine Generals problem, but it worked. Coinffeine's solution to the apparently intractable game theoretic problem was to assume that fiat could be made to behave like crypto (and indeed crypto-crypto decentralised trade is a more-or-less solved problem). They found a way to make a fast fiat micropayments channel with zero or low fees. The tradeoff was that they had to find a specific provider that would give them that, and it is (so far) OKPay. To use OKPay, from my investigations, you have to have a verified account with them (except maybe for very small amounts?).

I wonder if it'll get much traction. Most people don't really want to use OKPay, don't want to give them ID details etc. It's noticeable that not much localbitcoins trade is done over OKPay. Could we get other payment services offering something similar? That would help with the decentralization, but it's the same old story: the only thing stopping businesses from offering cheap, frictionless instant digital transfer of money is the same good old regulation that makes trading via banks such a pain.

[–]peque2 5ポイント6ポイント  (8子コメント)

So it works using okpay, what advantages does this have over using a major exchange? I have to trust okpay and I don't want to have an account there.

[–]HostFat[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

Okpay doesn't know what you are doing with the money, doesn't know anything about your bitcoin transactions.

Okpay can't block your Bitcoin, that are on your local wallet of Coinffeine software.

[–]investor2020 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Okpay does know.

[–]HostFat[S] 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

No it doesn't.

It has NOT connection with the data/informations that are on Coinffeine network.

[–]waxwing 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I don't understand, doesn't the system work by having lots of micropayments of fiat through OKPay? How could they not know about those payments?

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

They know about they payments on EUR, but they don't know for what they are being used.

[–]investor2020 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Through the escrow...

[–]flix2 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

escrow is in btc.

There is no OKPay escrow. Just the api.

[–]investor2020 7ポイント8ポイント  (6子コメント)

You claim no kyc or aml it's needed, but that is just because you subsidize it to okpay, btw the only available option... No liquidity.

[–]sQtWLgK 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

you subsidize it

outsource

[–]peque2 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

okpay is going to require you everything to verify an account and you have to send all that information to russians...

[–]Alchemy333 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

unverified accounts for smaller amounts works

[–]waxwing 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I may remember it wrong, but I looked into it and it's really small - like $30 maybe?

[–]esxbtc -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

They will get rekt with this flawed business plan and nonsense

[–]btcdrak -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

yup. Scores of people got burned on localbitcoins with SEPA transfers for bitcoins getting reversed.

[–]Zyklon87 4ポイント5ポイント  (12子コメント)

Why they say its avaliable in 70+ countries?

Isn't basically avaliable for everyone who has an OKPay verified account ?

[–]HostFat[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (11子コメント)

Yes, it seems that other payment processors are coming.

[–]somedude721 13ポイント14ポイント  (10子コメント)

Also means you trust a centralised entity and require AML/KYC. So both claims of 'Decentralised' and 'No AML/KYC' are wrong.

[–]flix2 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

You don't have to trust anyone with your bitcoins. You keep them in your own wallet.

There's no KYC/AML on Coinffeine's side, since they are just a software provider.

Payment processors do require verification. (Although you can use an unverified OKPay account for small amounts).

[–]fulltimegeek 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

What does OKPay consider a small amount to be?

  • < $1?
  • < $10 ?
  • < $100 ?

[–]HostFat[S] 4ポイント5ポイント  (7子コメント)

It's decentralized because isn't based on a central server that has your Bitcoin.

You Bitcoin are on the local wallet on the Coinffeine software.

Moreover, Okpay doesn't know anything on what you are doing with the fiat money.

[–]somedude721 6ポイント7ポイント  (6子コメント)

This is no different to having you own wallet and sending BTC to an exchange when you want to exchange for fiat. If you want to exchange for fiat you need AML/KYC and to trust a third party entity that charges a 2-3% fee to fund your account in fiat.

[–]HostFat[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

https://www.okpay.com/it/services/online-banking/fees.html

SEPA transfer: 1 euro

[–]somedude721 4ポイント5ポイント  (4子コメント)

With a 1% withdrawal fee for SEPA + 4-50 EUR also need a European account in EUR. Swift fees inwards ~30 USD and a 1% + Swift outward too.

Localbitcoins is more decentralised than this.

[–]HostFat[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Localbitcoins always asks 1% for your Bitcoin, and you have NOT control over them.

Still, Coinffeine is out from today, and they will probably add other payment processors

[–]caveden 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Localbitcoins always asks 1% for your Bitcoin, and you have NOT control over them.

Only if you go through them. If you transfer from the seller's phone directly to the buyer's phone there's no fee. And you still can mark the other party as trustworthy, although the trade doesn't get logged for your reputation.

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are you talking about an exchange online or face 2 face?

Coinffeine is a decentraliced online exchange.

[–]Sovereign_Curtis 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Localbitcoins always asks 1% for your Bitcoin

asks.

I've never had a problem using the LocalBitcoins site to advertise that I'm buying or selling, and then just meeting people in person and never paying LBC a fee.

[–]Coineda 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfils the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things."

-Winston Churchill

Guys, go try the app, come back and provide feedback. The worst that could happen is that you'd be giving an informed opinion.

See you in the market!

[–]Introshine 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

“We want our customers to be those who simply have a PayPal like account and want to buy or sell bitcoins in a simple and effective way”

Inb4 people getting scammed. Don't use Paypal for bitcoins people. Please.

[–]paulmadore 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Still waiting for the day I get burned. Dunno why I'm so lucky. Could be I just DGAF and always am quite careful. But listings like this one have worked out numerous times for me.

[–]Max_LocalBitcoins 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

When you buy or sell Bitcoins with PayPal to sellers on our site that are trusted there usually isn't a problem. But we still deem it a high risk payment method due to how many scammers use PayPal (mainly because PayPal's fraud detection and support isn't the best).

[–]MurderousKirk 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

Three Screenshots Here

Looks like a broken wallet to me.

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

You have to set correctly your Okpay API token.

[–]MurderousKirk -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

http://i.imgur.com/2vkPvds.png

Can this not be used in the US?

[–]HostFat[S] -3ポイント-2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm not sure, but maybe now it only support euro.

[–]boonies4u 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

AFAIK OKpay does not support new accounts from peopl in the US. This is following the liberty reserve scandal in 2013.

[–]homad 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

i'm not installing that until i hear word from the community that it's amazing, and everything they'd hoped for

[–]Manidos 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Are they open-source?

[–]whoistheenemy 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

What an unfortunate name.

[–]mtaborsky 2ポイント3ポイント  (4子コメント)

It's cool and all, but I have a hard time believing a piece of software, that is supposed to handle money, downloaded over plain HTTP.

Please, Coinffeine team, do something about it. Thanks.

[–]apoloval 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

The link is https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/...

You need a coffee cup ;-)

[–]nostdal_org 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

This doesn't help when the page where the link itself is hosted isn't HTTPS also; it can easily be changed in transfer to point somewhere else.

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, the download is through HTTPS.

[–]investor2020 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Rather trade and send my bitcoins from bitstamp or bitfinex to my trezor than keeping them on a beta pc only available software...

[–]boonies4u 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Which 70 countries? Does okpay not allow US citizens to create accounts.... or do they simply not accept payments from US banks?

[–]bitcoinrole 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

[Solved]

OKPay API token?

(in step 3 of initial setup)

It says Obtaining the token ...

then the window refreshes to a new form -Your account id -Your token

There is no any token that I can find.

Solved by this

in the setup window Configure your OKPay account

Type in the credetials (email and password) that you use for OKPay. (double authentication should be disabled for setup to work). If you typed them correctly you should see Token retrieved successfully

[–]waxwing 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I looked into this a while back (not for Coinffeine) and I have a memory that you need a verified account to get an API token. I may be remembering wrong though.

[–]flix2 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

30 peers online https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CKcA4KuUMAA8Q05.jpg:large

[–]BobAlison 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Really nice work on a tough problem.

Are there any videos that show how transactions work from both the buyer and seller side?

[–]yuneeq 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

They announced that coinffeine is available in 70 countries, but nowhere on their website do I see which countries it's available in.

WTF

[–]prelsidente 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm guessing it's the same countries where okpay works?

[–]niceargent 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Why doesn't it use nubits instead of okpay?

[–]prelsidente 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why instead? Why not both?

[–]bitdoggy 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Is there a list of supported countries?

[–]somedude721 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Obivously not decentralised if there is a 'list of countries'. Also has Paypal and OKpay lol.....Its like a worse version of an exchange.

Strip out the fiat stuff, make it for altcoins and you are onto something.

[–]investor2020 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Good point, decentralized but 70 countries? LOL

[–]investor2020 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why is "gotoalberto" deleting it's responses? Isn't he the CEO?

[–]Vaultoro 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Cool work guys! Looking forward to seeing this evolve.

[–]yoshiosikun 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Coinffeine takes advantage of the P2P model to avoid accepting deposits in bitcoins or FIAT money, making it unnecessary to identify users or fulfill costly money laundering laws in each country.

I believe this is only partially true. By avoiding accepting deposits and KYC/AML checks they basically outsource this process, along with all related risks, to their users. They only do the matchmaking and have their hands clean - it's the users who conduct transactions.

So you're an user and want to sell bitcoins for fiat. You send your bitcoins and you accept a money transfer from someone you don't know. Everything goes smoothly, you're happy with the service and you join all these people calling the exchange amazing. Then few months later you have FBI agents at your door because you accepted dirty money and essentially helped launder this money.

Thanks, but no thanks.

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you know a payment processor that doesn't ask for KYC/AML you are welcome to suggest it.

Anyway, FBI agents are mainly a problem for US citizens ;)

[–]bedeho 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well done guys, next time I need some btc, I will try this first! Keep going, I think you have the right solution to this problem, paychans for the win!

[–]HostFat[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Follow the instructions here:

http://support.coinffeine.com/knowledgebase/articles/626628-how-to-set-up-your-okpay-account-in-coinffeine

[–]thieflar -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm not going to lie, the arbitrary capitalization of "FIAT" in the article just rubs me the wrong way. I think it's /u/nobodybelievesyou who normally points out how stupid this looks, but in his absence I suppose a hero needs to step up.

[–]nobodybelievesyou 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm still waiting for someone to give me a solid answer on why they do that. It remains a mystery.

I think at some point some weird libertarian/freeman on the land website must have done it and everyone else just rolled with it.

[–]Acura360 -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

Cool Idea, but I'm waiting for the launch of Instantdex - decentralized exchange. Low Fee's www.instantdex.net www.instantdex.org

[–]barbierir 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

This is a different thing, Instantdex is crypto to crypto, Coinffeine is for fiat/crypto exchange

[–]Acura360 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ahh :) - Thx for Info

[–]esxbtc -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Stop the Spam, they have been spamming this reddit since years promoting this software. It brings nothing new to the market, it does not innovate properly and of course is a just a very basic software who jumps on the hypetrain toget some funding. Please man.

[–]oakpacific -2ポイント-1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Look, here is the problem with Coinffeine-if you have to launch it, it's not a decentralized exchange.

[–]vegardt 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

That is just not true at all.

[–]btcnooby -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Whoever named this exchange is completely clueless and out of touch with reality.