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Guys get shot at while making a video on their porch.Loud (youtube.com)

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[–]vanguard_anon 99ポイント100ポイント  (88子コメント)

This culture of violence in the poverty stricken areas of this nation is really frightening, and disgusting.

At the risk of looking racist, do you really think this guy is innocent? Your statement makes it sound like the poor fellow just happens to be in the wrong place. I'd bet money that he's the sort of guy that makes it the wrong place.

[–]lookxdontxtouch 17ポイント18ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm pretty sure this guy was talking about having a gun on him when he says "I'd rather get caught with it than without it".

[–]houssc 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yea... but I don't live in the hood, unless you consider Houston to be one big hood, which it kind of is, and I'm not a violent criminal, but I also generally always have a gun.

[–]stakoverflo 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Even if he did something wrong, still shitty for his family who might be trying to love honestly, or neighbors who can't afford to get out of there either.

[–]LeDarion 64ポイント65ポイント  (34子コメント)

Maybe so, but he has just as much of a right to not be shot at as you and I.

[–]Batmaners 17ポイント18ポイント  (15子コメント)

Even if the reason he got fired at is because he fired at them first? Because his suspicion seems to tell that he was expecting shit to go down.

[–]hooah212002 8ポイント9ポイント  (11子コメント)

Never been to the hood, eh?

[–]SevenFingerStud 21ポイント22ポイント  (5子コメント)

Does Canada have some pretty thug hoods? I watched Degrassi and saw Drake get paralyzed but that was at school so idk.

[–]ThatKidStyn 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I WAS RUNNIN THROUGH THE 6 WITH MY WO'S

[–]mwmwmwmwmmdw 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

we dont have places like east saint louis but we do have the intersection of jane and finch in toronto and east vancouver in BC which can be pretty bad

[–]Wesside 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

The ridiculous things is that on the news you occasionally hear;

A man was shot in Toronto today by another man.

There's a solid chance both of those men are black and 25 or younger.

But when you hear;

A man was shot in southern Ontario today by another man.

There's a really good chance both the shooter and person who was shot are both white and 40+, generally in regards to the shooters wife leaving him.

One day it'd be nice to no longer hear either story on the news. But I feel like we are a few generations away from that.

[–]mwmwmwmwmmdw 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

well because i dont think as many black people live in milton or lincoln ontario as they do in toronto

[–]Wesside 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

You're correct, but there are millions of people in Toronto and its largely only black men that are shooting at each other. All demographics live there though.

[–]matjoeh -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

why would anybody?

[–]invincibleme 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

because they live there.

[–]LeDarion 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's never justified to shoot at somebody on their front porch in broad daylight.

[–]TheMegaBenson -3ポイント-2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Did you even watch the video?

[–]Steve_the_Stevedore 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

He meant on another occasion like a week before or so

[–]Powerspawn 18ポイント19ポイント  (10子コメント)

That is the classic just-world fallacy. Just because the people in the video got shot at does not mean that they deserved to get shot.

[–]Dekar173 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

The assumption people make simply because he was being wary... I was 10 when I lived in a shit neighborhood and I was still wary. If I got shot would it have been because I deserved it? lmao. Some people are terribly disconnected from reality.

[–]kconnell1 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Well there is a lot of difference between a 10 year old in a bad neighborhood and a military aged male in a bad neighborhood.

[–]Dekar173 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, a few more years of developing and continuing to be conditioned there. I lucked out and left before high school- which are the years which greatly dictate what kind of person you turn into in the future.

I'm sorry, but the person may be at fault on a sort of 'micro' level but if you don't think people are products of their surroundings you've got a ton of reading to do regarding behavioral science.

[–]DenverBowie -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

Are you saying that all "military aged males" should be in the military?

[–]Booshanky 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

That term is a common one used by anyone who dismisses the deaths of people. If he's "military aged", then it's easier for people to assume he did something to deserve it.

It's more than just a little bit racist and fucked up.

[–]yerbamate3 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

How can you call it a fallacy when you don't know the guy? I'm not saying he did deserve it or whether he was guilty or innocent, because I don't know. The same as how you don't know.

So how does this fallacy say anything? It literally is completely independent of that guys moral character.

[–]thepulloutmethod -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

The problem is your point doesn't change anything. These people, innocent included, live in fear. Mob rule isn't known for being very good at discerning who "deserves" to be punished and who doesn't.

[–]Eor75 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly? I believe if the people in the video were white, people would not be so quick to assume they were involved

[–]Solid_Waste 4ポイント5ポイント  (7子コメント)

So what are you basing that on, this claim they are not innocent?

[–]hatewrecked2 -1ポイント0ポイント  (6子コメント)

The notion that you don't pull a gun on a group of people without there being some sort of motive. It could just be one guy on the porch who was sought out by the guys in the car and the rest were hanging around the wrong person at the wrong time, but I think someone up there was meant to be a target.

I mean what's the other argument? That these poor areas are basically shooting galleries? Last month we had top comments in another thread argue hoods are plenty safe and saying otherwise is sheltered racism. What side of reddit am I on today?

[–]johnthomas911 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

The thing is that hood justice isn't necessarily eye-for-eye. You can't assume that whatever made him a target is even logical.

[–]Booshanky -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

The notion that you don't pull a gun on a group of people without there being some sort of motive.

Do women deserve to be raped for wearing sexy clothing too?

Your blame the victim mentality is really gross.

[–]arkasha 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Can we blame the victim sometimes though? For instance, that dude that disregarded the "No swimming: Alligators" sign and got eaten by an alligator. Did he deserve to get eaten? Probably not, was it his fault? Mostly. Same with people who hang out with people known to get shot at. Do they deserve it? Probably not. Could they have avoided the situation? Most likely. Does it make it victim blaming if I say it was a bit their fault?

[–]Booshanky 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's victim blaming, in this instance anyway, because people here are ALL assuming that he must have had it coming without a single shred of evidence aside from his speech and the way he's acting nervous.

Before I write any more, am I missing something there? Is there some other evidence of his guilt aside from those two factors?

[–]arkasha 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Nope, you pretty much got the whole of it. I'd agree with you had this been a video of a BBQ with people just relaxing and then shots were fired but in this case it just feels more probable that he was expecting something to happen. It all comes down to people making a judgement based on limited evidence and people tend to be more lenient/empathetic toward people they can relate to and a shifty dude on his front porch who looks like he's expecting trouble, alludes to having an illegal firearm, and then gets shot at is not someone most people relate to. Now you can say its because he's black and maybe for some people it is but I'm pretty sure that if this was a middle-class black family having a picnic you'd get very different reactions.

[–]Booshanky 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

people tend to be more lenient/empathetic toward people they can relate to

That's one of the problems with Reddit and the internet in general. There are way more white and middle class people here than there are poor people, for obvious reasons.

Regardless though, whatever happened to compassion? You know why people carry guns and have their head on a swivel all the time in neighborhoods like that? Because they know that there is no protection for them by legal means. The cops don't care, and the rest of society just ignores the death.

Why not try having a little compassion instead? Because regardless, he IS a human being and deserves more than what he's getting here.

[–]UNB3KANNT 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think that makes you look racist, and maybe the guy isn't innocent, or maybe he is on guard because of the conditions in which he lives in. Fallen has a very good point, and it is very sad to see.

I'm from the Detroit area and there are reports all the time of innocent bystanders, children, elderly, who get shot and killed for no reason. Once your in the suburbs you hear about it and it's appalling, but ACTUALLY living in those conditions where that threat is very real, here in the good ol' USA, is something you have to experience to fully understand.

Some major cities are really like a warzone, and Detroit outside of downtown can be a very depressing sight to see, considering it was once such a great city.

[–]mdcsd 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

If the point were a toilet, you would have peed on the floor.

[–]ILAMTM 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Innocent".

Revenge is never okay and a culture (gang culture I guess) where shooting at someone (killing them occasionally) due to DISRESPECT is fucking retarded. Like "yo niggah tried hitting on mah GF, lets shoot him"

[–]Gizortnik 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

If by innocent you mean not deserving to get shot to death in an ambush, yes. What they may or may not be guilty of is up for the courts to decide. If I lived in a neighborhood that has shit like that happening, I'd have my head on a swivel too.

[–]sneezylee -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Well most of the time its retaliation. So its probably safe to assume this dude did something to deserve being shot at. Very rarely are drive by shootings completely random. Want to avoid being shot? Dont be a dick.

[–]thepulloutmethod 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

What if the people doing the drive by are mistaken and they got the wrong guy, or any other number of reasons why your comment is unfortunately very misguided?

[–]Booshanky 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Way to write off the potential death of another human being just because he's different from you.

[–]ConspiracyFox -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

HE A GOOD BOY

[–]vichina -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I will say that he might not be innocent. Probably know that he's done someone wrong at some point in his life. But this is what his statement is talking about. "Culture" He's been wronged, probably did something wrong back, and then the cycle of hatred and violence continues.