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HinduismSomething troubling that my Hindu biology teacher said when I was in gesamtschule. (self.DebateReligion)

KrankyKrautatheist が 投稿

This happened 4 or 5 years ago, but it is still troubling me to this day. I was in high school (in Germany), in a biology class about evolution. .

Our biology teacher was Indian, a Hindu. She made mention to the class that some religious groups didn't accept evolution and made specific mention of Christians. We don't talk about religion much, but I'm guessing that most of the class were either atheists or non-practicing Christians. Anyway, to cut a long story short, nobody had any major problems with evolution.

One of the kid thought to ask the teacher what she believed as a Hindu viz-a-viz evolution. I'll never forget how uncomfortable she looked, shuffling her feet where she stood:

Hindus did not evolve, there were somehow (this part was not explained) introduced to the world in their current form. But non-Hindus (meaning us) evolved from monkeys. So what we have is creationism for Hindus and evolution for everyone else. We asked, "Is this what you believe or what your religion teaches?" Again, more shuffling on the spot, very uncomfortable. The answer was both, it's what Hinduism teaches and what she believe.

But it gets worse. Because then, when explaining the evolution of non-Hindus, she said (I'll never forget these words), "Non-Hindu is just pink and intelligent monkeys. But not real human with soul".

Hindus of Reddit. Please explain, because this strikes me as being pretty disgusting.

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[–]N0CLASS 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

Hinduism is a blanket term used to describe a very diverse range of beliefs. Your teacher is not an authoritative voice. I have to ask though: given your status as an atheist, why do you care if your teacher doesn't think non Hindus are soulless monkeys? Is that not the exact worldview espoused by materialists?

[–]RuroniHSBelieves in the me that believes in me 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

I don't think it's the fact that she believed that non-Hindu's had no soul that was troubling. I think it was the fact that she believed that Hindu's were "real" humans, and everybody else isn't. This is more or less an admission of cultural superiority. It's only a step away from claiming to be a "master race" and is a dangerous way of thinking.

[–]N0CLASS 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I've rarely encountered cultures that do not think they are superior or their worldview is the objective truth. Look at the way contemporary industrial culture refers to others who chose not to industrialize or are just working it out, they are given a lesser status most notably: third world, developing, primitive etc etc.

If individuals want to take offense to this behavior when it is carried out by a foreign culture, particularly a theistic one, that's fine, but their offense should be tempered I think with some attempt at objectivity here regarding human nature. Especially with its tendency to view ones own values as better than the rest.

[–]RuroniHSBelieves in the me that believes in me 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

First, let me say I agree. However, there is a difference in what you are describing and what this teacher admitted to believing. You are talking about one society thinking that certain aspects of their culture are better than certain aspects of other cultures. While this can be problematic, it does not equate to believing that one is a superior human being than someone else because of that culture. From the teacher's perspective, there is no amount of cultural "education" that could make non-Hindus equal to Hindus.

[–]N0CLASS 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

That individuals should be "educated" to see the light of one's own prefered culture is in my view, just as harsh dogmatic and intolerant as what this women believes about Hindus and non Hindus.

[–]Arjun_Brahmin in disguise 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

There is not even a single theological truth in her statement. According to Hindu theology time is cyclic

[–]ShakaUVMMod | Duelist[M] 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

I am not convinced this is not a troll, but I have tentatively approved it.

[–]GlobalscholarSecular Hindu(Atheist for all practical purposes) 4ポイント5ポイント  (3子コメント)

I went took classes for years at a hindu temple and never heard this, I think she is a bit confused. Hinduism is a massively broad set of philosophies, but I don't think this belief is from any of them. I hope you don't think this reflects badly on hinduism, it just reflects badly on you teacher.

[–]KrankyKrautatheist[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I went took classes for years at a hindu temple and never heard this

Maybe there are things about Hinduism that you are simply unaware of? Maybe the monks or whatever they are called were rightfully too ashamed to teach this?

[–]N831YIgnostic | Deist 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think you're getting too hung up on this non-hindu/hindu evolution thing. That is just your teacher's personal belief. Similarly, some white people believe that all non-whites are inferior yet this is not a shared belief of all white people.

As an Indian who grew up learning the philosophies and teachings of Hinduism, I have never heard of this as a specific belief of Hinduism and I see it as more of a superiority complex that your teacher possesses.

[–]MountainsOfMiami 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe there are things about Hinduism that you are simply unaware of?

/u/Globalscholar wrote:

Hinduism is a massively broad set of philosophies

There are things somewhere in some corner of Hinduism that everyone outside of that little corner of Hinduism is unaware of.

[–]thenotoriousbtb 3ポイント4ポイント  (6子コメント)

Not practicing, but born and raised Hindu. Your teacher is a clueless nutjob.

[–]GlobalscholarSecular Hindu(Atheist for all practical purposes) 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

I second this opinion(I was also raised hindu, and this teacher is making stuff up.)

[–]KrankyKrautatheist[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Before ad homing her as "making stuff up", can you provide some evidence that what she was saying is not a doctrinal teaching of Hinduism?

[–]thetrickstyhobbitbuddhist- vajrayana 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sorry to nit pick but the burden of proof is not on them, it's on her. For instance, it would be unfair to ask a Christian to provide scriptural evidence that Odin is the father of Thor. If it is not a part of their religious scripture, as they claim it is not, then there is no way to demonstrate that short of reading the entire scriptural canon of Hinduism. Though I bet that would be an interesting project!

[–]KrankyKrautatheist[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm sure she was a nutjob, but before ad homing her as being "clueless", can you provide some evidence that what she was saying is not a doctrinal teaching of Hinduism?

[–]thenotoriousbtb 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, there is no evidence that it is a doctrinal teaching of Hinduism. The onus is on her to provide the evidence for her claims. Google Hinduism creation myth and let us know what you find.

[–]GlobalscholarSecular Hindu(Atheist for all practical purposes) 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Where does it say that hindus are literally more evolved than non-hindus in any hindu text? Maybe some school of hinduism does say this, but none that I am familiar with.

[–]MountainsOfMiami 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Non-Hindu soulless monkey signing in.

I have no problem at all with identifying as any of those things.

[–]MountainsOfMiami 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Non-Hindu is just pink and intelligent monkeys. But not real human with soul".

Presumably relevant:

Reincarnation – known as Punarjanma – it is one of the core beliefs of Hinduism that is generally accepted by many of its practitioners.[92]

Reincarnation is the natural process of birth, death and rebirth. Hindus believe that the Jiva or Atman (soul) is intrinsically pure. However, because of the layers of I-ness and My-ness, the jiva goes through transmigration in the cycle of births and deaths. Death destroys the physical body, but not the jiva. The jiva is eternal. It takes on another body[93] with respect to its karmas. ...

There is no permanent heaven or hell in Hinduism. After services in the afterlife, the jiva enters the karma and rebirth system, reborn as an animal, a human or a divinity. This reincarnation continues until mokṣa, the final release, is gained.[94]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reincarnation#Hinduism

(This is just as an intro - I'm sure we can find lots of other pages about this.)

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As far as I know, Hinduism says that no animal (including human beings) is "soulless".

Every living animal (including human beings) has a jiva / atman, and at death, this "soul" is reincarnated into the body of a different animal or human.

tl;dr:

AFAIK standard Hindu doctrine couldn't say that any human or animal is "soulless".

[–]bunker_manMessian 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Non-Hindu is just pink and intelligent monkeys. But not real human with soul".

Looks like u got rekt, m8.

[–]ScalSaverDiscordian + Karma + Compatibilism. My own personal sauce ! -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Looks like bare and gross intolerance, from where I am.

Maybe she is right : Soulless pink monkeys in grey suits an ties.

[–]bogittybillLibtard atheist 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe she thinks Europeans are Vanara?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0a/Sampati%27s_Find.jpg

Interesting to read that Vanara are supposed to be shapeshifters, maybe an allegorical description of evolution?

Maybe Hinduism is capturing some histories of humans and neanderthal coexisting? I dunno, I'm making this shit up as I go along.

[–]NushifAn old red Subaru Legacy with an exhaust rattle 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Is Gesamtschule like Grundschule?

I don't remember even touching religion in any serious capacity when I went to Grundschule, and in Gymnasium the courses were significantly more involved and nuanced than that.

How old were these kids she was talking to anyways?

[–]cygx 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Is Gesamtschule like Grundschule?

No. Traditionally, the secondary school system in Germany is tripartite (Hauptschule, Realschule, Gymnasium, and only attending the latter qualifies for University). A 'Gesamtschule' combines all of them under the same roof to make switching easier.

[–]NushifAn old red Subaru Legacy with an exhaust rattle 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

That might be a bit of a contributor, then. I can assure you this is not Gymnasium teaching levels.