上位 200 件のコメント表示する 500

[–]desmunda1 4664ポイント4665ポイント  (1002子コメント)

So anyway why did you go on to give detailed statements to thirdparty newsfeeds first, before speaking to us? The place with the tagline 'the frontpage of the internet'? The people you slighted in the first place? Hell even buzzfeed got info before this statement from you...

Edit: Ellen responded to me, but I anticipate she will be heavily downvoted so here's the reply

"It was hard to communicate on the site, because my comments were being downvoted. I did comment here and was communicating on a private subreddit. I'm here now."

[–]Phrostbite 1641ポイント1642ポイント  (90子コメント)

The buzzfeed one hurt the most.

[–]Protuhj 3126ポイント3127ポイント  (75子コメント)

10 Ways You Won't Believe That reddit Users Can Go Fuck Themselves!

[–]JustAPaddy 326ポイント327ポイント  (32子コメント)

Number 4 will shock you!

[–]Protuhj 195ポイント196ポイント  (9子コメント)

(Just be sure to click 'Next' 3 times, so we can improve our pageview count.)

[–]Butcher_Of_Hope 34ポイント35ポイント  (2子コメント)

They had to post something. I mean so many defaults closed for the day they had to get news and other bits from somewhere.

[–]protatoe 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hit them in the money and you get a CEO response. That's always how these things work.

[–]Llim 668ポイント669ポイント  (179子コメント)

Publicity. Trying to do immediate damage control for the media

[–]-impostura- 262ポイント263ポイント  (81子コメント)

And it did work, partially. Many 3rd part sites wrote articles that portrayed redditors as the evil and Ellen Pao/admins as the victimized admins.

[–]PainMatrix 143ポイント144ポイント  (65子コメント)

Really? Everything that I saw was more sympathetic to the redditors. Then again I only get my news from reddit.

[–]res0nat0r 159ポイント160ポイント  (62子コメント)

Downvoting legit replies, and other outrageous nonsense by the redditors here in fact to me shows them as not being evil, just stupid and childish.

[–]helloimwilliamholden 103ポイント104ポイント  (51子コメント)

Totally agree. Most of the comments here are very immature. What do people expect? The OP said, "We fucked up and we've had a long series of fuck ups that we want to correct. Here's what we're doing about it." What else do they want?

And to keep asking what happened to Victoria is just fucking stupid. They can't talk about, so they need to fucking stop asking about it.

[–]anticapitalist 140ポイント141ポイント  (70子コメント)

Worse, I don't see this as an apology to the users, but an apology to the mods.

To the users, reddit is slowly becoming more controlled by a small group of well connected mods. They censor anything they dislike & ruin reddit.

[–]coopdude 79ポイント80ポイント  (14子コメント)

This is absolutely an apology to the mods. While the mods were slighted in several ways (bearing in mind that moderation is a volunteer activity that benefits the site when done properly), the users lost confidence and had issues with the quality of content/site trust as well, and the users are a large part of contributing.

The discussion on the improvements doesn't seem to even be transparent and is instead hidden behind closed doors. This lack of transparency creates a rift between the users and the mods/site owners.

[–]itty53 4ポイント5ポイント  (5子コメント)

When will reddit users get that they, as users, are the lowest of the low on the totem-pole of importance to the admins?

You can say 'without the users the site won't exist' but that's not really valid at all: The site began with single users posting content over and over, making their own puppet accounts to appear more busy.

The single users simply come and go. They aren't very important to the admins and shouldn't be more important than mods. Mods put more effort and energy into making this site what it is than any other group. Mods absolutely deserve the apology, not the users.

[–]Vesploogie 66ポイント67ポイント  (4子コメント)

Which makes me think this announcement is mostly just baseless pandering to a user base she doesn't care about.

[–]wachet 160ポイント161ポイント  (19子コメント)

Because she didn't want the media wildfire to spread any faster, and the damage was already done with us.

The mods are the ones that really deserved to be addressed first though.

[–]alienith 80ポイント81ポイント  (12子コメント)

Agreed. Just look at the comments so far. Even after everyones gotten the chance to cool down a bit, they're still very bitter and hateful. The admins probably wanted to go and do some outside damage control while waiting for the userbase to relax a little.

The truth is they don't have a fix ready for the problems at the moment. So pretty much the best that they can do is say "We're sorry, we're going to fix this". Personally, I think thats fair. The admins at least deserve a chance to fix these problems (even though, yes, they have been given plenty of time before)

[–]BrotherClear 15ポイント16ポイント  (0子コメント)

Weren't these things already mentioned in the "Welcome Back" post over at /r/iama?

[–]Quaintrelle914 278ポイント279ポイント  (23子コメント)

Because going to a thread immediately just got -1000 votes and lots of, "Ellen Pao is a cunt" replies. No one is under any obligation to engage when that's whats being thrown at them.

[–]NowThatsAwkward 49ポイント50ポイント  (0子コメント)

You haven't truly participated in an admin post until at least one of your comments is downvoted into oblivion!

I can't even imagine how much worse it would be if it was all personally directed at you though.

[–]usernameJW 32ポイント33ポイント  (2子コメント)

You read the news though, right?

I suspect the answer might have something to do with good reporters at major news outlets having their contact information, calling over and over to get a response and giving Reddit a deadline along the lines of "If I don't hear from you before [this time], we'll have to run the story without your input."

[–]fridgetarian 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yeah, this is a perfectly good explanation for why it appeared in print first. It doesn't really explain the lack of response on reddit itself.

[–]chirpbirdchirp 141ポイント142ポイント  (17子コメント)

They went down the list of who was more important to apologize to. News organizations came first, we came last.

[–]cahaseler 663ポイント664ポイント  (103子コメント)

Hi Ellen,

/r/IAMA mod here. First, thank you for finally making a statement about this on reddit.

Second, can you go into more detail about the direction you see for celebrity participation on Reddit in a post-Victoria age? Alexis has made some comments to us behind the scenes about your ideas to encourage celebrity participation beyond AMAs, but I'd love to have the conversation in a more public space where everyone can participate.

[–]MarkNUUTTTT 57ポイント58ポイント  (2子コメント)

And if we could call this the Reddit post-Victorian Era, I would be soooooo happy.

[–]myempireofdust 51ポイント52ポイント  (1子コメント)

Haha, this is golden. An /r/IAMA moderator trying to use a public announcement to ask concrete questions to the admins. What's next? Facebook's CFO using a press Q&A to ask Zuckerberg about the directions of the company? You admins should be licking this guy's sweat and calling him every week to make sure he's eating vegetables, not alienate him to the point where this is where he feels is the most appropriate place to communicate with you.

[–]cahaseler 43ポイント44ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't want to misrepresent things here. We have had a fairly productive email exchange with Alexis since shortly before we brought the IAMA subreddit back online. We do consider those emails private, as we need to have a solid line of communication, so I'm not going to leak them. I was hoping we could have a public conversation about the admin's future direction regarding celebrity promotion, which seems to be happening here.

[–]CaptnRonn 957ポイント958ポイント  (50子コメント)

A few things beyond a PR statement that would restore my faith in the admins:

  1. Stop shadowbanning users - It was a tool made for spam bots, not to silence dissent. The mere fact that a perfectly legitimate user can be shadowbanned without their knowledge is ridiculous, and it has been happening more and more in the past few months/year

  2. Stop subreddit favoritism - You want to have anti-harassment rules? Great. Enforce them in every. sub. equally. Other meta-reddit subs have to use np links. Why does SRS get away with being able to post direct links with obvious brigading?

Also, /u/ekjp, as much as I would like to think that things are business as usual with you as CEO, you have made some very questionable statements regarding free speech and sexism in tech from a position that is seemingly vacant in logic. The fact that you feel you must talk to major news sites before actually acknowledging your userbase is troubling to say the least. You have done nothing to earn my trust or support, and in fact have done several things to reinforce the opposite. So... prove me wrong?

[–]AntonioOfVenice 216ポイント217ポイント  (9子コメント)

Other meta-reddit subs have to use np links.

Even though it's not a meta-reddit sub, /r/KotakuInAction doesn't even use np-links - we have to use archives, or we'd be accused of "brigading" and banned. And yet SRS is permitted to openly brigade every other sub on Reddit. Not to mention the fact that SRS is openly dedicated to destroy Reddit. Why does that not fall under 'breaking Reddit'?

[–]matthewhale 23ポイント24ポイント  (1子コメント)

Lets not forget we were told we couldn't publish email addresses of PUBLIC PR email addresses or contact emails for companies for a while too, until that was finally clarified and allowed again yesterday...

[–]016Bramble 29ポイント30ポイント  (2子コメント)

How about /r/bestof? They brigade too, but it's usually an upvote brigade. Should that be allowed? (genuine question)

[–]goatsareeverywhere 37ポイント38ポイント  (0子コメント)

They're also a downvote brigade too. If you have a different opinion than the bestof'd comment, prepare for -1000 karma.

[–]JackalKing 54ポイント55ポイント  (1子コメント)

Other meta-reddit subs have to use np links.

KiA was told they aren't even allowed to us np links. Links inside reddit are automatically deleted by a bot now to be on the safe side because they know that the admins are looking for any reason they can to delete that sub.

Meanwhile, SRS still continues to brigade, and have been brigading for years now.

[–]Mumberthrax 47ポイント48ポイント  (5子コメント)

Stop shadowbanning users

for example, this sort of person: http://www.reddit.com/r/tifu/comments/351buo/tifu_by_posting_for_three_years_and_just_now/

Stop subreddit favoritism - You want to have anti-harassment rules? Great. Enforce them in every. sub. equally. Other meta-reddit subs have to use np links. Why does SRS get away with being able to post direct links with obvious brigading?

np links are not a reddit thing, they're a derpy css hack and the admins have stated (well at least some of them) that they don't support them. they've said they're working on anti-brigading tools, but I don't know more than that.

edit: funnily enough, one of the biggest issues I have with reddit is the abuses of power/tools that reddit grants to moderators (ironic because a lot of mods and powerusers controlling the discussion are making out that the biggest problem is that mods need MORE tools. tools are fine and can be used for good, and they are used for bad a lot). so regarding NP links, /r/politics for example was banning users who never posted to /r/politics simply for participating in /r/modlog which does not use NP links because they are a derpy CSS hack, and linking to other parts of reddit shouldn't be discouraged, participating as part of the greater reddit community shouldn't be discouraged. It's kind of nuts.

[–]Infamously_Unknown 19ポイント20ポイント  (3子コメント)

Holy shit, active user shadowbanned for three years? All the time spent typing comments nobody will ever see... that's just evil.

[–]nodthenbow 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

NP is just a css trick that is not enforced by the admins.

[–]SingularTier 92ポイント93ポイント  (3子コメント)

Hey Ellen,

Although I disagree with the direction reddit HQ is taking with the website, I understand that monetizing a platform such as reddit can be a daunting task. To that effect, I have some questions that I hope you will take some time to address. These represent some of the more pressing issues for me as a user.

1) Can we have a clear, objective, and enforceable definition of harassment? For example, some subs have been told that publicizing PR contacts to organize boycotts and campaigns is harassment and will get the sub banned - while others continue to do so unabated. I know /u/kn0thing touched on this subject recently, but I would like you to elaborate.

2) Why was the person who was combative and hyper-critical of Rev. Jackson shadowbanned (/u/huhaskldasdpo)? I understand he was rude and disrespectful and I would have cared less if he was banned from /r/IAMA, but could you shed some light on the reasoning for the site-wide ban?

3) What are some of the plans that reddit HQ has for monetizing the web site? Will advertisements and sponsored content be labelled as such?

4) Could you share some of your beliefs and principles that you plan on using to guide the site's future?

I believe that communication is key to reddit (as we know it) surviving its transition in to a profitable website. While I am distraught over how long it took for a site-wide announcement to come out (forcing many users to get statements from NYT/Buzzfeed/etc.), I can relate not wanting to approach a topic before people have had a chance to calm down.

The unfortunate side-effect of this is that it breeds wild speculation. Silence reinforces tinfoil. For example, every time a user post gets caught in auto-mod, someone screams censorship. The admins took no time to address the community outside of the mods of large subreddits. All we, as normal users, heard came from hearsay and cropped image leaks. The failure to understand that a large vocal subset of users are upset of Victoria's firing is a huge misstep in regaining the community's trust.

[–]Aldfrith 14ポイント15ポイント  (1子コメント)

These are polite, specific questions, which deserve answers.

[–]DoctorDank 1683ポイント1684ポイント  (63子コメント)

Your second to last paragraph is spot on.

These are just words.

You haven't actually instituted any reforms yet. To be honest, this just feels like corporate newspeak. You're just telling us what we want to hear. I think you'd ve a better response if you actually instituted the reforms you speak of, instead of just talking about how you're going to do them.

Because talk is cheap.

But, at least you acknowledge that the way you went about dismissing Victoria was utterly tone-deaf, and very disrespectful to the (unpaid, hard-working) moderators who relied on her in order to make their subreddits the very best.

Oh wait no, you totally didn't do that either. You just say you're acknowledging a "long history" of mistakes, without actually acknowledging them at all!

More newspeak.

So, I don't really know what to make of this "announcement." Guess we'll just have to wait and see if you put your money where your mouth is, won't we?

Edit: much thanks to /u/alloutpenguinwar for guilding my comment!

[–]FlacidPhil 245ポイント246ポイント  (12子コメント)

This is basically just repeating what /u/kn0thing has already said. No more news, just 'tools are coming and we'll make more announcements at you'.

[–]evess_arudem 80ポイント81ポイント  (14子コメント)

OK, but would you rather they implement the reforms and then post about them? That's exactly what people were complaining about before.

[–]DoctorDank 58ポイント59ポイント  (12子コメント)

I'd much rather this post give us some sort of timetable, instead of vague promises of nebulous "reforms."

[–]tthorwoaways 43ポイント44ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm not trying to play devil's advocate (though I may be unintentionally), but working out anything like an accurate or reliable timetable probably wouldn't be possible for a while. If they're sincere in what they've said, they will probably want to communicate with the moderators a lot more before making concrete plans, and even that could take a few days.

Though I'm judging the announcement as an immediate response. If no timeline or definite ideas are announced within a few weeks, forget everything I've said above.

[–]GYP-rotmg 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

because it has only been 3-4 days since the debacle? And most of it fell on weekend? Talk is cheap, but action takes time.

reddit users are so eager for drama. Ellen Pao had an interview (?) with some news outlet, and spreading message to their investors and the mass; then reddit said oh why don't admins apologize using reddit means? now admins apologize in reddit, and people will say oh but you still didn't do much.

And the leaked image between kn0thing and mods of science regarding an AMA where obviously kn0wthing didn't have a good answer had a title of "admin power grip." Of course a mod of science came in and explain they were trying to figure things out, and admin was not informative or helpful enough, but nothing about power grip. People just love to criticize and jump on the hate bandwagon.

[–]dschneider 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Guess we'll just have to wait and see if you put your money where your mouth is, won't we?

Um, yes actually. That's sort of the whole point. She stated she's aware it will take time to deliver, and she knows it's going to be hard for her.

Holy shit man, what could she have said to make you happy? Or can you admit you were going to go full pitchfork no matter what?

[–]ucantsimee 513ポイント514ポイント  (26子コメント)

You've been promising mod tools for longer than I care to remember and they are still "coming soon." At this point your word alone means nothing. Actions will be the way to make it up to the community. Not words. Get to work.

[–]bananinhao 58ポイント59ポイント  (3子コメント)

And there are no details... nor Ideas...

I bet they're massive user controlling tools. There won't be a next blackout.

[–]PsychMarketing 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

doesn't look like they've been working on them at all - she says there are people now assigned to begin talking about what tools to build...

[–]vorpib 1903ポイント1904ポイント  (345子コメント)

How about apologizing for calling your strongest user base insignificant ?

[–]solidfox535 326ポイント327ポイント  (34子コメント)

170,000 people and growing.

Petition here.

[–]adremeaux 82ポイント83ポイント  (23子コメント)

Double it up and it will represent 1% of the site's traffic! We did it, reddit!

edit: People, I know the 1% rule. But that rule doesn't mean that the other 99%'s opinions aren't valid.

[–]ekjp[S,A] 1272ポイント1273ポイント  (259子コメント)

I assume you’re referring to the NYT quote. I want to clarify the quote's context. The reporter asked about the people who are posting and commenting really negatively about me, not about the mods and content creators. That's what I was referring to when I talked about them being a vocal minority. I do understand that the site is built on the content and voting, and I know that we and the community owe a lot to our mods and core users.

[–]good_jarsh_jerker 1937ポイント1938ポイント x3 (73子コメント)

Guys think really hard before downvoting everything she says. This is a reasonable response.

People were literally calling her a cunt, Hitler, and all sorts of really vile racist shit. She was saying those people are insignificant. That's actually an important fucking distinction, because she's saying the average redditor isn't calling her a vile cunt, and those are just a cruel minority.

For fucks sake guys. Come on, if you want credibility you need to respond to what Ellen actually says, not just downvote everything and only and always assume the worst.

[–]YankeeQuebec 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Over on change.org there was a successful petition to strip the NFL of it's non-profit status. This petition had about 400k signatures, and the NFL voluntarily gave up their non profit status. During an average month, almost 400 million people in the US will watch an NFL game. That means that with 0.1% of NFL viewers, the NFL changed their entire corporate structure, which will cost them tens of millions of dollars.

The petition to remove you from your position, or for you to step down, at this moment has about 175k signatures. With about 19 million unique visitors a month, 1%, or 10 times the percentage of reddit users signed a petition to have you step down, or fired, than got the NFL to change their corporate structure.

Since you are CEO of an internet company, you should know that only about 1% of the people on the internet, actually do something, meaning that the petition for you to step down has significantly more supporters than it looks.

Why this is important, is that an extremely small vocal minority successfully petitioned a multibillion dollar corporation to change their corporate tax structure which will cost them dearly, where as an even larger minority has called for you to step down, or be fired. Here you are just pandering to us, and trying to say that you said something else.

Ms. Pao, your comments were extremely rude to the people who make this site what it is. They show how completely out of touch you are with this community, of which you make your salary off of. And frankly, show how vain, and disconnected you are.

Here is the petition for you to step down or be removed.

[–]JonLuca 86ポイント87ポイント  (0子コメント)

While I do not agree with a lot of the recent decisions, and the history of communication, I do have to agree with you on this - it was clear that you were talking about the extremely vocal minority who is issuing hate mail and death threats over a website and the slight changes within.

[–]TheGreatRayPape 171ポイント172ポイント  (5子コメント)

I like how your apology over a lack of communication wasn't delivered to the people who needed it until you told every other press outlet first.

This has nothing to do with your race, gender, sexual orientation, weight, height, eye color, or any other physical attribute or personal preference in any arena; no matter what light your behavior and decision-making is used to examine your choices here, they universally identify you as completely incompetent as a CEO of a site built on community data aggregation.

[–]54CymruBeats 1179ポイント1180ポイント  (104子コメント)

Okay.

[–]Sorabella 155ポイント156ポイント  (9子コメント)

"We're sorry you're angry, but also the angry people are an insignificant majority that don't really matter."

[–]AdamKeiper 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

Dear Ms. Pao –

In the interest of transparency, I wonder if you might answer a question or two. Setting aside any personnel matters that you understandably cannot discuss, would you please confirm or deny the claim made several days ago that Reddit, under your leadership, wishes to undertake "a bunch of highly commercial things around AMAs"? Is that characterization correct, partially correct, or entirely incorrect? And, while still eschewing any discussion of individual personnel, would you say that your colleagues — the administrators of Reddit — have largely shared that goal, or has there been substantial pushback and disagreement?

Thank you.

[–]novum_vipera 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

/u/ekjp - Look, we get it. We actually do understand why you've had such a hard time running things. We understand that you aren't part of the old-school internet crowd that spawned places like reddit, 4chan, digg, and any number of other less successful imageboards and discussion boards. To put it in a flattering way, you're a bit too "normal" to get what's going on here half the time.

Now the above might come across as insulting, but it wasn't meant to be. It's a defence of your actions, and those of your team. That being said I do have to question the wisdom of continuing with your current strategy given the disasters that have befallen reddit so far:

  • Did you really think fatpeoplehate was big enough (no joke intended) and problematic enough to merit the chaos shutting it down caused? If they ever harassed anyone, it sure as hell didn't happen frequently enough to be noticed by the rest of reddit (except by SRS, and even you don't take them seriously). All you did was create the image of a social justice campaign being fought against anything not seen as "accepting". More to the point, if you didn't see that response coming then you're still not "getting" how internet communities work.

  • You've apologised for the communication issues, but the fact your team got into that mess in the first place once again demonstrates that your underlying strategy is unsound. Did it never really occur to you, or anyone at the executive level that there might be blow-back from suddenly taking away a key point of community contact? If you had worked with the admin in question to at least stage manage her departure (like any major business does with it's recognisable staff), none of this would have happened.

  • You can't monetize what doesn't exist. Creating a "safe space" might make advertisers and celebrity partners more willing to endorse the product, but since this product has legs it might very well walk off and leave them with nothing to endorse. By all means ban subs like r /jailbait if there's a legal threat to reddit, but don't poke the reddit-bear^ over something as trivial as r/fph.

imagine a ferocious Snoo with a pitchfork

[–]rfbandit 745ポイント746ポイント  (72子コメント)

Thank you for finally apologizing on here, instead of through media interviews. Should've come to your community first, instead of the press. But you also miss the point. You say a majority of reddit users don't care. But, those of us who create content for the lurkers care. Acting flippant isn't a good way to get us on your side.

[–]UpstateBrah 948ポイント949ポイント  (25子コメント)

Well this doesn't sound like an HR memo at all. /s

[–]funkenspine 344ポイント345ポイント  (9子コメント)

  • Copies the previous posts goals to fill space - Check
  • BIG SORRY - Check
  • "WE" - Check
  • "Were commited, starting now" - Check, also what the fuck does that mean.

NOW YOURE COMMITTED? ALL YOU HAVE IS COMMUNITY! THATS THE WHOLE ENTIRE THING!

[–]maurosmane 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Playing Devil's advocate here: Can you imagine how fucking intense facing this kind of pressure. People literally signing a document demanding that you quit your job. I couldn't do it.

That being said if you can't do the job then get out of the way and let someone who can.

[–]BassheadPanda 61ポイント62ポイント  (1子コメント)

How do you feel about this comment by /u/CaptainObviousMC.

The thing is... She's absolutely right, I 100% don't care at all about this situation, reddit, or the moderators. I'm a pretty apathetic content sponge.

That fact is deadly dangerous to reddit, because the moment the content creators jump ship, I'll follow them like the fair weather fan I am, because I don't care -- at all -- where I get my content, or about which corporation or moderators are involved. If reddit compromises its content stream by having moderators jump ship, I'm out too, not because I care, but because I don't.

So she's right -- most reddit users absolutely don't care a bit about this, or the site, or really anything. And that's why she can't afford to piss off the moderators, who are the people who do care.

What's hilarious is that the reddit administration seems unable to see that most people not caring is precisely what makes the moderators caring so dangerous: they're wielding my caring by proxy, because they hold the keys to content.

[–]BellyFullOfSwans 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Krispykrackers is the Admin who shadowbanned my first account for posting a business' phone number and called it "doxxing".

I had a 3 year old account with over 30K karma, over 10 Redditgifts gift exchanges, months of gold given and received (with years still on the books I never got back), a large friends list, etc...banned because I posted the number of a business. I didnt start a witch hunt or say anything bad about the business....I wasnt promoting the business....still, it was seen as doxxing and without anybody else hearing my case, I was shadowbanned (and not notified about it).

When I did figure out what had happened and why I was suddenly talking to myself, I had to look up ways of getting a hold of Reddit. They dont exactly have a customer service hotline (you know, like real businesses with real customers do).

That was a pain, but was able to finally reach somebody. It was Krispykrackers. Her one word reply? "Why do you think it is OK to post personal information?"

And that was it....I never heard another word, I never got an answer back from Reddit Gold about my paid-for months of gold I still had...and /u/gekokujo was lost to me over a non-issue.

There was no accountability, no transparency, and no recourse for grievance. As a Reddit Gold user at the time, I was a PAYING CUSTOMER...and as you could have seen from my comment history then (or now), I am not a troll.

Leaving Krispykrackers in charge of fixing your out-of-control staff and unfair practices is worse than letting the fox run the henhouse. Foxes arent evil, they just eat chickens. On the other hand, humans like Krispykrackers have their own sense of social justice and a license to be judge/jury/executioner with no witnesses and only the shadowbanned-mute voices of her opposition to speak up.

There is no solution as long as Krispykrackers is playing a major part. She is as big of a part of the problem as Pao herself and I can prove that (with my own experience and that of others...some involving chat logs from past controversies).

Fix the problem....dont promote the problem to a place where she will further abuse her power and your site.

[–]stagecraftman 933ポイント934ポイント  (440子コメント)

Why was Victoria fired?

[–]JimmytheCreep 284ポイント285ポイント  (11子コメント)

I know everyone really wants the answer to this question, but it's extremely unprofessional for an employer to discuss the circumstances of someone's departure from their company. I work in an itty-bitty family-owned restaurant and the boss still never talks about why people leave. He doesn't even tell us if they quit or were fired. I can almost guarantee that we'll never get the answer to this question, and that's the way it should be.

[–]TheChrisCrash 13ポイント14ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, I don't get why people think it's their business and why they think they have a right to know. People really need to get over themselves and find a hobby.

[–]Cereal_Junior 214ポイント215ポイント  (28子コメント)

I believe it's against the law for an employer to disclose that. Correct me if I'm wrong

[–]this_is_balls 282ポイント283ポイント  (11子コメント)

Not against the law, but standard business etiquette. Similar to giving an employer 2 weeks notice before quitting.

[–]RedDawn1989 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Also. It's to shield the employer from any potential lawsuits for damages. It's much easier to say nothing, than it is to even release a single sentence explanation that could be picked apart in a civil court.

I worked for one of the largest corporations in the world that had the following policy. You provide the employees social security and we provide either "yes that's in the system." or "no that's not in the system." At that point if yes, we provide date of hire, last / current title, and if applicable end of employment or "current."

That's it. Any necessary licensing / certification transfer goes through HR.

No other information. Period. Not even the name. Just based on social security #.

[–]tahlyn 19ポイント20ポイント  (1子コメント)

It can result in slander/libel lawsuits and could break any contracts they have in place from the time of hire or any sort of NDA contracts for their separation. I do not think there is anything explicit in US law that says the reasons behind an employee firing must be kept private. It's other laws you incidentally break break by disclosing it.

[–]glass_table_girl 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's also worth considering that Victoria herself may not want that information out there, and we should respect that privacy and confidentiality.

Not to mention that having public information on her dismissal could hurt Victoria's future employment prospects, which one should consider if they are worried about Victoria's employment situation.

[–]sonofaitch 59ポイント60ポイント  (11子コメント)

The main issue, clearly, is the divide between Reddit the website and Reddit the business. Finding a balance to please both can obviously be quite difficult, but you'd be surprised to see the positive feedback and ideas the communities will have that could prop up the business side if you actively listen. I hope we can better the site thru this.

Some ideas, of course, are crazy (https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyIdeas/comments/3cauxn/community_buyout_of_reddit/) but at least some are trying

[–]JesusPimpHand 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

/u/ekjp

You know, as monetization goes, if you had just ran a reddit wide poll that asked which of the top ten monetization ideas (plus a "no monetization, but you make this kitten cry" option), rated by intrusiveness, we could have tolerated it. We might have gone along with it, we're semi reasonable and we understand the website needs to make money. But it's too late now, you already gave us the finger. You should think about asking the users before you take things offsite, after all We are your Product.

Any schmuck can link a cat video, it takes an autistically persistent one to do it day in day out for free. And the best ones migrate to the biggest site they can find like a farm boy trying to get into the Imperial Academy.

To be fair, this attitude is what I and others asked for, and a step in the right direction

IF

you actually follow through on these... words.

You could have considered rolling out an actual change along with the words, so forgive me if I don't hold my breath waiting for the implementation of this pile of PR.

You better deliver OP

[–]Anon2971 150ポイント151ポイント  (3子コメント)

You're right. They're just words. The same kind of words you've been saying for years.

It's appreciated that you're now apologizing and try to make amends, but I personally won't be believing it until I start to actually see these changes happen, like an explicit explanation/timeline/development details of what tools are being made, or the moderators themselves saying that communication has improved.

Also, a direct response to the Victoria scandal would be good. You don't need to tell us why /u/chooter got fired, but you could at least say if there's now a new point of contact for mods to go to when it comes to arranging these AMAs rather than leaving them high and dry.

[–]Bike_shop_owner 16ポイント17ポイント  (2子コメント)

Why are you tip toeing around the huge issue that is a 170,000 signature petition to have you step down?

[–]Garethp 110ポイント111ポイント  (8子コメント)

Thanks for the announcement. I wasn't expecting it to actually come. Quick question: Will those devs be communicating with us at /r/Toolbox?

[–]agentlame 3ポイント4ポイント  (5子コメント)

If it's /u/deimorz, I'm not too concerned. He has always been cooperative and open with us. It's just that he wasn't in a position to help with moderation tools.

[–]MaskedxAvenger 1042ポイント1043ポイント  (93子コメント)

It's absurd how many days it took for this to happen.

[–]trollsalot1234 25ポイント26ポイント  (0子コメント)

You do realize how many interviews they had to give first right? I mean you gotta prioritize these things...

[–]ThePatrickSays 26ポイント27ポイント  (1子コメント)

But remember: most of us aren't interested in this.

[–]SpontaneousLightBulb 172ポイント173ポイント  (12子コメント)

What about censorship? Your post is all about placating moderators (which are essentially unpaid employees and do deserve attention). However there is NOTHING about the overt censorship occurring on Reddit. Posts about Ellen Pao suddenly disappear, Reddit censorship, and other issues that are most certainly NOT harassing anyone end up in shadowbans for users.

Your apology is not accepted.

edit: spelling

[–]Wakers 286ポイント287ポイント  (15子コメント)

We screwed up. Not just on July 2, but also over the past several years

Already trying to deflect criticism away from your own regime within the opening sentence.

It's not sincere.

Talking to major media outlets before addressing the community on your own social platform demonstrates incompetence.

Not a good start.

"It was hard to communicate on Reddit because of the downvotes."

I'm sorry, what?

You know that people have to read your post before it gets downvoted, right? If you'd have posted anything addressing the concerns it would be at the top of /r/all within an hour, easily.

[–]SabashChandraBose 38ポイント39ポイント  (2子コメント)

TIL that Reddit gods can't sticky their posts.

[–]fightlinker 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

"We'll work on fixing sticky functionality, check back with us in 6 months"

[–]elitegamerbros 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just hire a few more marketing and business majors, that will speed up the process.

[–]tumbler_fluff 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

In fairness, she also said the buck stops with her.

It's either been going on for several years or it hasn't, and if she had isolated it to only the last few months I'm sure many would have been quick to point that out.

[–]thejellydude 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

Look, I'm not the most active mod of /r/funny, but I've been around for a while, and I pay attention to the backroom when things like this happen. Are you really acknowledging all the issues here? And I don't just mean mine as a mod, but those of the users. Mind explaining to me how you're going to handle:

Shadowbanning and how it negatively affects content producers in niche subreddits?

The constant lack of listening to mod requests by the admins? (I still remember how much we had to fight to let /u/Kylde moderate more than just 3 defaults. That was insane.)

Restructuring the reddit site-wide rules to be more transparent and clear?

Why you aren't working with the current modtools providers on how to integrate their product? (They've said time and again they would love for you to steal from them)

How you think Krispykrackers, working alone, will be enough for 6,000+ mods? We've already said we don't think this is going to work, and I've heard no response to this.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. It's hard for me to take a post like this serious when you don't address any of the issues that have been outstanding, but only the ones brought up by the recent event.

[–]karmaranovermydogma 337ポイント338ポイント  (31子コメント)

I know it's minor, but I appreciate how direct the wording of the apology was. No "I'm sorry if you were upset" or "I'm sorry you feel that way" unlike many "political" apologies; rather it was a straight to the point nostra culpa "We screwed up."

Be interesting to see where this goes.

[–]dewfeathers 95ポイント96ポイント  (20子コメント)

I also appreciate the direct wording. I am hopeful, and would like to remain cautiously optimistic, that the changes mentioned will happen. I hope that as they roll out they will be posted in r/announcements.

[–]Cockatoo010 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Please Resign

[–]Aegent 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just in case anyone is buying her bullshit, here's some required reading on Ellen Pao. I take no credit for the original post.

This text for the self-post text is available in raw from pastebin

SEARCH ALL ELLEN PAO FACTS - GO HERE FIRST!

What can you do?

  1. Repost each title to a new and suitable sub, and help others by commenting and making a reasoned discussion on all the titles they post to other subs too.
  2. Install uBlock
  3. Do not gild or buy reddit gold until Ellen Pao is out on her ear

Subreddit mods: Sticky a random fact that finds its way into your sub, ensure this text is there, and rotate them sometimes

Ellen Pao Fact 1: Ellen Pao is a misogynist who spent 7 years giving ALL her female colleagues scathing reviews so they wouldn't be promoted. 12 women suffered.

Ellen Pao Fact 2: Ellen Pao is implicated in stealing $150,000,000 in a ponzi scheme, stealing from firefighters pension funds since 2007/8 with hubby Buddy Fletcher.

Ellen Pao Fact 3: Ellen Pao tried to sue KPCB fraudulently after spending SEVEN YEARS painstaking leaving one-sided paper trails to the tune of 200,000 pages

Ellen Pao Fact 4: Ellen Pao tried to blackmail KPCB into paying her 2.7 million to cover unpaid legal bills for her husband Buddy Fletcher

Ellen Pao Fact 5: Ellen Pao libeled Arnold Schwarzenegger, PROVEN FALSE in court she made up the names of people and dates of events claiming some people told her "Arnie touched someone's ass".

Ellen Pao Fact 6: Ellen Pao defrauded reddit investors by colluding and blackmailing Yishan Wong (the last CEO) into giving her the CEO title for her court trial

Ellen Pao Fact 7: Ellen Pao is building a one-sided file on Alexis Ohanian (kn0thing) and plans to sue him/reddit as a last dash attempt to get cash

Ellen Pao Fact 8: Ellen Pao wants to use some big media event to launch a non-profit to "help women", but really to try and get cash to steal away to pay legal fees

Ellen Pao is a misogynist, the people attacking what she has done are not attacking her, but her actions. WHEN Ellen Pao claims this is sexism, she is doing a massive and expected injustice to women everywhere who face real sexism. Pretending people are attacking you for your gender and not all the manipulative and despicable things you've done is offensive to all men and women Ellen Pao, and you can't get away with it again.

Here are the sources, citations, court docs and news articles that back all this up

Here are links to the FBI and SEC crime reporting pages (one requires clicking the link twice after accept) - post them a message that "you want to see Ellen Pao investigated in role of ponzi scheme and defrauding reddit investors recently by colluding with previous reddit CEO Yishan Wong"

[–]errl_dabbingtons 40ポイント41ポイント  (2子コメント)

i don't want your team to respond to comments, why are you apologizing for "the past"? reddit has taken a sharp downturn since you took the helm and envisioned some new Utopian hug palace, removed freedom of thought, and employed shady tactics. You have a history of throwing a hissy fit when you don't get your way but I, along with plenty of other users of this site don't want "change" we want you to stop trying to fix something that isn't broken.

You are such a narcissist that you think that you can fix what's "Wrong" with the internet, but you're only fanning the flames against you. You took control of a beast of a website for resume fodder and it's not going your way. listen to what the actual complaints are.

Censorship needs to cease. you know that word, it's the word that comes before "desist" in all of those letters you've been sent in your life. i'm not saying stopping removing ILLEGAL content, but to completely do an about-face in the way reddit has ALWAYS been communicated is a great way to ostracize the community.

Mass deletions of negative stories about you, SHADOW-BANNING those who dare dissent needs to stop.

I know i'll probaby be shadow-banned for the past two comments i've made in regard to you. and I'm prepared for that. It's a good thing i'm archiving the post right now. so when in the future I can join the thousands you've had silenced like a discount dictator.

[–]swolejusticewarrior 151ポイント152ポイント  (6子コメント)

Why did you talk to everyone but reddit, we are the community and you ignored us. Its obvious you don't know much about the community here at all. Why don't you keep working on these positive changes but you yourself should make a real effort to become apart of and involved in the wonderful thing called reddit.

[–]gitykinz 1710ポイント1711ポイント  (215子コメント)

I don't really care what you have to say. This is PR bullshit and you don't have a leg to stand on.

[–]razorsheldon 152ポイント153ポイント  (6子コメント)

How can you demand a response from somebody but then not care what they have to say? It's one thing to disagree, but not caring at all and not even bothering to listen is like a child throwing a tantrum.

[–]Litig8 242ポイント243ポイント  (51子コメント)

What would you have liked her to say? Seriously? Give us your ideal "apology". I'd love to hear this.

[–]WarOnErrorism 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah I was pissed at them but this apology seems like a step in the right direction.

[–]LectureModeOff 630ポイント631ポイント  (92子コメント)

This apology is so half-hearted.

[–]N8theGr8 657ポイント658ポイント  (60子コメント)

You guys would complain no matter what she said.

What are you looking for? How could she have improved her statement? She acknowledged that there was a problem and gave some steps they're taking. Any actual change is going to take time anyway. If you have any actual criticism you should have included that.

edit If you really want to see reactionary responses, check the timestamps. The top few comments were posted within two minutes of this post being made. Do you think those users had enough time to read the post, consider it and what they wanted to say, and type it out in that amount of time?

[–]tomrhod 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

What are you looking for? How could she have improved her statement?

Based on the mood here, people wanted her to fall on her sword and say, "I resign."

[–]slumdogbillionaire 351ポイント352ポイント  (23子コメント)

If there's any evidence that reddit is adolescent, this is it.

I don't care what you have to say. I hate you.

Productive. /s

[–]llsmithll 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Popcorn tastes good.

[–]Ephidrineon 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

So... When do you plan on resigning, Ellen?

[–]wasmachien 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Your three points are all directed towards the mods. What about regular users?

[–]AllDepressedChips 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

All hail KrispyKrackers our trigger happy shadowbanning moderator overlord!

Voat, for love of all that is holy BUY SOME SERVERS!

[–]Simple_Tymes 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

The average users don't care about moderator tools. What matters to the passionate non-mod reddit community is:

PAID CONTENT: Will AMA and other reddit subs have content paid by sponsors? Will you disclose if reddit receives money for specific corporate posts to receive higher placement/votes? How far are you willing to go to monetize reddit?

CENSORSHIP: Will you delete subs based on advertisers' requests? Will you ban users who don't agree with specific speech/content guidelines?

POOR MANAGEMENT: The firing of Victoria may, in fact, be completely justified. But the pure business of of firing the head of AMAs (arguably Reddit's highest profile sub) was simply terrible management. Why didn't you know how your business is run? Why didn't you have a transition strategy in place for Victoria's departure? Why didn't she introduce her replacement to her important clients/mods? How is this not business 101?

TRUST: Reddit is run by the good will of unpaid moderators. How can they trust you that their content won't be regulated based on corporate sponsorship? The rumors regarding Victoria's firing over disagreement about turning AMA into a money machine must be addressed. And "we don't discuss firings" isn't good enough -- what is Reddit's plan for the future of the AMAs? And why should we trust you to continue to support a site that doesn't seem to respect your intelligence?

Simply, if these issues aren't addressed, then it's time to move somewhere else. If Reddit wants to turn the community into an advertiser platform (and do it in the most unprofessional, mismanaged way) then there's no sense in supporting a site that no longer shares our beliefs. Why should we trust you to do the right thing?

[–]MarshallMelon 15ポイント16ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hmm.

Provide some more info as to why exactly the events of July 2nd even needed to occur in the first place and maybe then we'll take you seriously.

[–]UnholyDemigod 27ポイント28ポイント  (47子コメント)

(please note: my status as a mod has zero bearing on my comment. This is from me, and me alone.)

Ellen - /u/ekjp - I have defended you (and the entire admin staff) for a long time. When people made comments about how you were turning reddit into a SJW haven, I told them to shut the fuck up. When the FPH people made you out to be a nazi, I went through threads and did my best to tell these people how they were wrong, and you were actually doing good by reddit. But with your recent comments to the media, you have made it very hard to continue to defend you. For example, you say it's only the vocal minority who cares about this. This and other things you have said lead me to believe one of two things: you either do not understand the reddit userbase, or you do not care. If the former is true, do you plan to rectify this? If the latter is true, and you don't care about this site, why did you take the job?

[–]brzt6060 25ポイント26ポイント  (0子コメント)

You missed the most important points, censorship and transparency.

[–]zerogeesus 176ポイント177ポイント  (19子コメント)

Several Questions:

Can you respond to the change.org petition which is (as of this moment) currently at 170K~ signers and growing?

Will you step down as most redditors currently see you as the problem, not the solution?

How do you plan to gain back the community's trust?

[–]wafflecakes 48ポイント49ポイント  (0子コメント)

Stop it. You were already going to push these new changes onto us, regardless of our actions or not, so please stop patronizing us.

You DON'T have the answers, you DID shit on your community, via news outlets, and you DON'T have the respect, nor ability to post such a self-serving message.

Get out of here. I'm starting to already.

[–]jupigare 32ポイント33ポイント  (1子コメント)

I appreciate that you guys are acknowledging the problem and at least saying you'll try to fix it. That's certainly better than ignoring the problem or, worse, outright saying one doesn't exist.

I just hope this all isn't a "Please understand" a la Nintendo. Words are better than silence, but they aren't as good as actual tangible change.

[–]immolated_ 322ポイント323ポイント x4 (72子コメント)

REMINDER EVERYONE: DO NOT BUY GOLD IN THIS THREAD

[–]BroadCityChessClub 59ポイント60ポイント  (12子コメント)

Quit trying to trick people into buying you gold, that never works anymore. apparently it still works, but it's a bad look.

[–]pie_pig3 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

Tbh it gets really annoying, spend the money on something else. Like donate to a charity instead

[–]jdalex 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

I like how you say we've "lost" trust in you, implying that we trusted you at some point. Given your history, I don't think redditors had much trust in you in the first place.

[–]PavementOnWheels 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

Fine, whatever. Cover your ass after the storm passes. This doesn't seem all that apologetic to me.

My biggest question is this: why have so many valid Reddit posts that speak out against you and other staff members been removed as of late? Seems far too much like censorship for my taste. I think the community has grown more accustomed to a more censored atmosphere, but if something like this had happened even a few months ago the uproar it would've caused would've been on par with the current fiasco.

[–]saganispoetry 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't understand how you thought it was a good idea to talk to NYT, Buzzfeed, and NPR before issuing a statement on /r/announcements of the site you are CEO of. Do you really care THAT LITTLE for your users? It has been FOUR DAYS.

[–]The_Great_Grahambino 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

So it seems like you're just throwing us a bone. The forefront of this issue is, at the bottom line, about communication, you're right. However if you communicate after the fact, then what good is it? Let us know your plans when it directly affects us rather than after the fact when we all find out and blow up about it. How about you take reddit back to the original free speech forum that it was, rather than the heavily moderated speech forum it is today? You lack the fundamental understanding of your users and that's why we're against your stances. We know your plan for reddit is big money which is why subs get taken down rather than hidden. Be straight up with us rather than lying, because it's the damn internet, you will get found out.

This is a step in the right direction, however you have a long way to go.

[–]011010110 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

So it takes CNN reporting on a petition, for you to be removed from your position, reaching 150k signatures for you to respond directly to your users.

Imagine what could be achieved with another 100k signatures.

[–]professorthrowaweigh 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Hi Ellen Pao,

The dynamic between leadership and volunteers changes once money is injected. I haven't seen anyone else make this point publicly. It's one thing to put up with a shoestring user experience when the business is running a shoestring budget. It's entirely different if there's an infusion of $50 mil. That's a lot of money for everyone, and people generating content and user experience start to wonder (consciously or unconsciously) "Where's mine?"

Perhaps the most significant problem you inherited was the (perceived) collapse of the plan to share the wealth of reddit. Site participation as usufruct (e.g., all renting includes a small % of rent to own). Take that away, replace it with silence, and you get the current issues. My analysis, for whatever it's worth.

I think community members will start investing in you if (1) you demonstrate materially that you are investing in them, and (2) you actively build your own visible personality on the site.

Regarding (1), did the change to ssl happen on your watch? I don't recall. That's a big deal, maybe the most important thing, to a user like me. What are your visible victories, how have you improved the experience of the mundane user?

Best wishes going forward.

[–]tcdshh 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

When are you going to sue Reddit for you incompetence? Just saying....

[–]Aldrahill 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

This was a lot of nothing, honestly.

It's just newspeak :(

How about discussing why Victoria was fired? It's not that we really care about her personal life, but her firing represents eliminating a position and replacing it with a catch-all email.

Is there going to be a move towards commercialising AMAs? Are we going to see a shit-ton more of driven traffic, of the ability to pay to beat the reddit algorithms?

I know you must make a profit, but at least be honest with us first!

[–]grandmacaesar 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

You fucked us over when you changed the up/down voting system.

[–]Eliteer 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think this post helps with anything at all

[–]ScubaTwinn 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

You screwed up. Not "we". You are in charge. That's what you get paid the big bucks for.

It's hard for me as a manager myself to understand how you handled this. Why didn't you just apologize directly to us when it happened? I still don't see an I'm sorry at all in your post - only we acknowledge mistakes. We screwed up. We want meaningful ongoing discussions. A simple I'M SORRY from you might have helped you in the beginning.

[–]bundys 218ポイント219ポイント  (11子コメント)

So you are not resigning?

[–]Prahasaurus 114ポイント115ポイント  (3子コメント)

Cold, dead fingers, etc., etc., etc.

Besides, she must finish what she's started. There are no doubt more Reddit employees struggling with cancer that need to be fired.

[–]Bidda26 255ポイント256ポイント  (43子コメント)

Where the fuck is Victoria?

[–]beernerd 30ポイント31ポイント  (10子コメント)

I spoke to her this morning. She's at home and seems to be in high spirits.

[–]Mutt1223 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

So she's drunk? Good for her.

[–]PMMeYourDeadUnicorns 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

I would be to if I was a legit commodity in the PR world, Victoria is going to bank off all this.

[–]sealfoss 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

WHERE'S VICTORIA, STRING!?! WHERE'S VICTORIA AT!?!

[–]Potss 165ポイント166ポイント  (9子コメント)

Too little too late, you've shown your true colors.

[–]wachet 37ポイント38ポイント  (0子コメント)

She's shown her colours a few times already. Now she just doesn't give a shit and is going to listen to feedback less and less.

[–]B1gWh17 272ポイント273ポイント  (45子コメント)

Don't gild! Use AdBlock!

Just say NOPE on July 10th

/r/JustsayNope/

EDIT: Whoops, deleted the 0 when I was adding /r/. Thanks peeps

And it got gilded; ya'll are some odd folks.

[–]pornjesus 26ポイント27ポイント  (1子コメント)

It's a good thing to apologize and acknowledge you fucked up. Now don't be like that episode of South Park and keep fucking up and keep apologizing. It only works once, okay?

[–]mudclog 36ポイント37ポイント  (0子コメント)

Looking forward to the improvements in the coming months! And if not, I'm looking forward to the implosion!