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SOCJUS[SocJus] Remember the Magic: the Gathering player who was witchhunted for being a sex offender? He got permabanned from the game right now. (self.KotakuInAction)

Smolda が 投稿

https://archive.is/7fp1k

Comment from the Wizards employee, along with a reacton from one of the most known pro players - https://archive.is/Fd2we

Original story - https://archive.is/qvIt8

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[–]Mr_Miltank 65ポイント66ポイント  (15子コメント)

reports are going around he has had his magic online account banned also

for the people that don't know about magic the gathering there is one player that is even a member of the magic hall of fame that has been in jail for drug dealing but nobody has tried to get him banned

this all came from a player called Drew Levin making a big uproar and starting a witch hunt, he has since made his tweets private

[–]Beefus_of_Canada44444, quints GET! 39ポイント40ポイント  (12子コメント)

Drew Levin

Fucking cancerous cunt, why am I not surprised?

[–]louisknapsack 24ポイント25ポイント  (0子コメント)

I mean, his twitter bio does say San Francisco...

[–]frozen-silver 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

Has Drew done other things in the past like that before? I haven't heard of him until now. I'm just glad Evan Erwin and Brad Nelson haven't stooped this low...

[–]Beefus_of_Canada44444, quints GET! 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's just a general eceleb cunt in the MTG community, I haven't played in years but kept up with the scene since my friends regularly play. Every time his name comes up in some drama, he's usually the PC cunt making things worse.

[–]OGDasme [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Drew is not exactly the best person in the world, hes definitely led quite a few witchhunts if I remember correctly.

[–]paulpiercethetruth [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Fucking cancerous cunt, why am I not surprised?

Zoe Quinn's ex was lauded by GG as a hero for dumping her dirty laundry. Dirty laundry that even if it is true is not a reason to publicly shame her and ruin her life like GG did.

Here, a guy warns women that a rapist is competing in gaming tournaments, i.e. airing the rapists dirty laundry, and GG calls him a cancerous cunt? I fail to see how GG is against airing dirty laundry of a rapist, when GG was all for publicly shaming a woman because her ex called her a slut.

[–]Beefus_of_Canada44444, quints GET! [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Oh look its a Cancerous Cunt from the Cancer that is SRS.

My reactions to your post

[–]paulpiercethetruth [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

As I expected, ignoring the points I bring up because you'd rather call people cunts for not supporting your precious rapists.

[–]Beefus_of_Canada44444, quints GET! [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Whatever sweetheart, go brigade elsewhere.

[–]Jarka_Ruus 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

I also was told that my Magic Online account had been frozen with the intention that it would be deleted.

[–]Earl_of_sandwiches 38ポイント39ポイント  (4子コメント)

SJWs are all about extra-legal punishment.

People are held in check by the law and fear of the state. If you want to supercede that position of authorithy, you need to develop new avenues of shame and punishment outside of the written law. Social media, like mob justice before it, allows zealots to create and enforce new standards above and beyond those of our democratically crafted legislation. Then, having enthroned themselves as higher arbiters who mete out still-severe punishment (loss of income, freedom, so forth), they are free to control the masses while skirting pesky checks and balances - such as election.

[–]bozahrking 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

The parallels to religious extremism are uncanny.

[–]Levy_Wilson 17ポイント18ポイント  (8子コメント)

How... do you get banned from a card game?

[–]chikin_llama 23ポイント24ポイント  (1子コメント)

Your registration number, which you need to enter in official events at both a local and a professional level is banned. This also means that since your number is associated with your online account (which has online cards that you buy individually with real money), your online account is frozen and all the money you sank into it is essentially stolen by the company. They can't steal your physical cards, but good luck finding someone to play with outside of your friend group since most events you can play at are officially sanctioned events that require your number.

[–]GoldStarBrother 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

your online account is frozen

This isn't usually the case, AFAIK this is the first time they've taken someone's MTGO account over a ban.

[–]Smolda[S] 10ポイント11ポイント  (3子コメント)

He is banned from all officialy reported tournaments. Which is every organized play nowadays.

[–]HammableOfCarthage 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

Except for a certain tour known for more SJW buggery that is unaffiliated with Hasbro and the ProTour.

[–]Tarhoraan 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Which also goes by the same DCI ban list.

[–]HammableOfCarthage 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Lets do something, tell them to ban all felons. That includes Chapin otherwise we'll create our own anti-SJW league that will refuse to cease or desist to them.

[–]DrunkenOni 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's banned from officially sanctioned tournaments. DCI is the central authority for managing MTG tournaments and he's had his DCI account suspended meaning he effectively can't participate in official events. This includes most local events like Friday Night Magic. Of course they can't stop him from playing with friends or what not, just official events.

[–]Fedorable_Lapras 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

By playing card games on motorcycles.

[–]Jarka_Ruus 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Zach Jesse's response to his ban.

[–]Limon_LimeSeven-37k Get. Eleven more drug deals. 21ポイント22ポイント  (74子コメント)

Was he a sex offender?

[–]porygonzguy 62ポイント63ポイント  (32子コメント)

He was charged with aggravated sexual assault when he was 18-19, entered a plea deal, and served a 3 months sentence.

That was a while ago and he's said that he's made strives to repay his debt and become a better person. Many people, especially pro players, are of the opinion that he's done his time and deserves a second chance.

This is a weird thing for WoTC to do, especially considering one of their other pro players, Patrick Chapin, was arrested years ago for drug trafficing. Under their logic he should received a lifetime ban as well, for making players feel "unsafe".

[–]frozen-silver 13ポイント14ポイント  (4子コメント)

Holy shit, I never knew Patrick Chapin was a drug trafficker. Yeah, it does seem a bit hypocritical when you put it that way.

Anyways, I can understand not wanting having a sex offender in your game, but that doesn't necessarily mean he'll do it again during an organized event. Plus, what's the point of banning his MTGO account? That seems unreasonable.

[–]HammableOfCarthage 5ポイント6ポイント  (3子コメント)

Yes, he tried smuggling drugs into Japan and struggles to get visas for tournaments played there as a result.

[–]porygonzguy 14ポイント15ポイント  (2子コメント)

No, that's not it.

He was arrested for drug related charges in the US. He attempted to go to Japan to play in an even, and was denied entrance because of that arrest - Japan has weird laws regarding who they let into their country and who they don't. If you have an arrest record in your home country you need to apply for a certain visa and because of the nature of his record Chapin doubts he'd be able to get it.

[–]HammableOfCarthage 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think the idea of banning all felons from DCI should be a good threat to get the SJWs out of Magic. Simply, they won't like it when some guy who used drugs will be banned from their hobby just because of drug usage.

[–]bobcat 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Japan has weird laws regarding who they let into their country and who they don't.

The USA has the same laws, as do many countries. Felony conviction == no visa.

[–]Limon_LimeSeven-37k Get. Eleven more drug deals. 21ポイント22ポイント  (23子コメント)

The more I learn about this guy, the more I see it as an unwarranted witchhunt. I hope the ban doesn't stick because some asshole decided their "fee fees" were hurt.

[–]porygonzguy 30ポイント31ポイント  (3子コメント)

Especially when you remember that he has his civil liberties restored.

When the government is saying "hey, this guy's good now", maybe you should take that as evidence that he's not a problem?

[–]Limon_LimeSeven-37k Get. Eleven more drug deals. 16ポイント17ポイント  (0子コメント)

But hey, SJWs live in the realm of public opinion so they can publicly shame all they want.

[–]eatingonthetoilet 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

SJWs like drug dealers though, it's how they come up with 9/10ths of everything they say.

[–]vonmonologue 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Dude is trying to get his life back together and here they are, slamming a door in his face.

and then wonder why prison recidivism is so damn high.

[–]Folsomdsf 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

3 months sentence that was delayed 'for his convenience' to finish his semester in school. He also was on a work release program, so whatever he did exactly wasn't bad enough to even ACTUALLY jail him in a fucking jail.

[–]shillingintensify 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

Kinda the key question.

[–]kalphis 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

He never seemed to want to refute any of the accusations, so i'd assume he takes guilt for his actions.

[–]DrunkenOni 10ポイント11ポイント  (2子コメント)

Granted Hasbro is a private company and can ban whoever they want for whatever reasons they want (it's even in the MTGO TOS) that's pretty irrelevant unless he's committing these crimes while on tour. As others have pointed out in the comments there's other convicted felons on tour.

[–]Alopixgg 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Covering their ass legally doesn't make it any less wrong.

[–]Niwjere 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not wrong. Just inconsistent, hypocritical, and possibly despicable. Sort of like Nexon.

[–]SMDYFB 8ポイント9ポイント  (34子コメント)

Here

[–]Limon_LimeSeven-37k Get. Eleven more drug deals. 25ポイント26ポイント  (28子コメント)

So he made a mistake as a teenager and then paid for it, and worked hard to better himself. Once again, outrage culture strikes again.

[–]SMDYFB 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's what it seems like after a quick skim, and it happened 12 years ago.

[–]ggburner23 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

Wait, so the governor pardoned him or something? I don't understand.

[–]zaphas 15ポイント16ポイント  (1子コメント)

When you're guilty of a felony, you lose several civil rights, like voting, etc. Sometimes those rights can be restored by the Gov.

[–]ggburner23 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thanks! The most trouble I have ever got in was being pulled over for a burned out tail light.

[–]SMDYFB 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not quite sure what he meant by that either, but I think he meant he got the charges expunged.

[–]Folsomdsf 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Actually, that's a pretty good way to think of it. After being a felon you lose right s to vote and hold a lot of employee licenses like being a lawyer and the like. You can't hold public office either. A gov can reinstate in any state, but some stats setup an application/investigation/hearing setup like florida where you apply and they consider it.

[–]hellofriendo1234 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

In an effort to make Magic a "safe space" for women, Drew Levin, LSV, and others have instead created an insanely toxic environment that will keep many more players away from the game than the existence of a sex offender.

Smooth move, SJW cretins.

[–]uberwolf0Actual Boogie 9ポイント10ポイント  (8子コメント)

I will never defend a rapist, honestly. Even one that has redeemed himself in the eyes of the law.

That said, I think this is pretty heavy handed of Wotc and absolutely not necessary. But they are a private company and can choose to do what they want.

But to enforce this arbitrarily is absurd. It's is likely not possible that this is the only rapist to ever play magic. Will they ban them all?

What about other moral judgments? What about other lawbreakers?

This is a quagmire that I hate to see the dci mire themselves in and I think choosing to do so is a dangerous decision.

[–]Killroyomega [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

In all likelyhood Zach Jesse wasn't banned for being a convicted felon but instead was banned because his case was being pushed into the spotlight and Wizards of the Coast reasoned that if they banned him they could use that as leverage as to create positive publicity or dispel negative publicity.

It's not a question of "condoning" anything, and never was.

In MTG pro circuits the players do not representatives of WotC, although some are hired for that role. If WotC are worried about "safety" at their tournaments then why have they not used this opportunity to ban all felons from their events and instead have focused on only one?

Though, it's not as if that's a normal thing for "sporting" events.

Just look at the NFL and you'll see active players that have been convicted for everything from domestic violence, to sexual assault, to running underground dogfighting rings.

[–]Skamberin 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

Being put in the sex offenders register in America seems to be worse than just being shot point blank after being convicted. Why try to live a life when shitheels on twitter or tumblr can fuck it up based on events far far into the past.

[–]paulpiercethetruth [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

You know what's even worse? Being raped. If the worst thing you have to fear for raping someone is 3 months in jail and being banned from a card game, then I would say rapists get off pretty damn easily. If he didn't want his feelz hurt that when people Google his name the sex offender registry comes up, maybe he shouldn't have raped someone!

GG ruined Zoe Quinn's life because her ex boyfriend claimed she cheated on him, yet here everyone is defending a fucking rapist.

[–]Huitzil37 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"GG ruined Zoe Quinn's life"?

Zoe Quinn is a professional victim. Victimhood is her profession. She does everything in her power to become and to remain a victim, and to broadcast this victimhood to everyone in sensory range.

Almost everything she has claimed about GG victimizing her has turned out to be a lie. She told these lies about GG victimizing her because she wants and needs to be a victim, and if she is not a victim, she won't be able to write her fucking rent check.

[–]donnadinotte 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm not too familiar with US law, but from what I understand, isn't accepting a plea bargain different from being convicted of a crime? I was under the assumption that it was the kind of thing that happened when either the defense didn't have the resources to take a case to trial, and/or the prosecution felt they didn't necessarily have a guaranteed conviction. If that is the case, why is everyone, even the people defending Jesse, referring to him as a convicted criminal? IDK, maybe I'm missing something semantically.

I will say that right now I'm not impressed with Drew Levin, Sheldon Menery, or WotC as a whole because of their conduct.

[–]InternetEvil 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

isn't accepting a plea bargain different from being convicted of a crime

Accepting a plea bargain (which means pleading guilty to a criminal charge) is effectively the same as being found guilty by a jury. It is being convicted of a crime - he is a convicted criminal.

[–]sedemon 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wow, considering how MTG literally raped me in High School, took my money and left me battered and broken, they should just ban themselves. I can't even... (/s? Homelands was pretty bad. Minotaurs lol)

[–]mnemosyne-0000#BotYourShield 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Archive links for this post:

I am Mnemosyne, goddess of memory. I remember so you don't have to.

[–]liquid_j 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

On the one hand he's done his time, but on the other hand wotc is a private company that can do what ever they want. So although i think the dude should be allowed to play,( its playing cards, not babysitting children) it aint my company.

But banning him for mtgo? Thats retarded. Wh

[–]APGJesseAPGNation 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I never knew anything about this

[–]lessthan3yorkies 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I support WotC's right to ban people for whatever reason, but I support anyone who wants to stop playing the game for whatever reason. I'm just going to sit and mutter the words 'free market' to myself until everyone calms down.

[–]tsudonimh 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

There's more to consider than just that.

Yes they can ban whoever they like, but they do need to follow their terms of use. Do they have a clause about banning a user for a crime that happened before they registered? If not, then the company may be opening themselves up to a legal spanking, especially if he has paid for things he is now deprived from using.

I'm as libertarian as Ron Swanson, but when you sell stuff that you can subsequently take away from the purchaser, you have to follow your own stated rules and not just make shit up as you go along.

[–]SuperFLEB 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Reading the thread, I get the impression they had the usual "Fuck you, that's why" clause, that they gave themselves discretion to ban for whatever they wanted. While it's an understandable addition-- it keeps people from griefing in ways that exploit loopholes-- it places a lot of social trust on the company not to screw people over, and that's breakable.

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    [–]madhousechild 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    along with a reacton from one of the most known pro players -

    I take that this is the statement from the employee: ""We work hard to make sure all players feel welcomed..."

    Which of the 818 comments on this page is the reaction from one of the most known pro players?

    [–]czechvarmander 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

    This was a no win situation for the company, but if they choose to ban certain convicted felons, they're well within their rights to do so....even if it was completely arbitrary and reactionary in this case.

    A lot of people are going on in here and on the Magic subreddit about how since he served his time, he should not be subject to punishment post his sentence. I don't quite agree.

    Even if a private company didn't ban him from their card game, which everyone is up in arms about, he was disenfranchised, may not be able to serve on a jury, cannot possess a firearm, will be banned from obtaining visas to travel to multiple countries, I also believe that Virginia will not grant him the bar even though he has gone through legal school, all even though he's served his time. All much more severe restrictions to his rights that no one is protesting.

    Registered sex offenders also have severe restrictions to their rights after they've served their time.

    The government already severely restricts the rights of felons, so I do not necessarily feel that private citizens or companies are completely outside the lines when they take actions such as these on individuals who have completed their sentence, but remain convicted felons.

    [–]pleurocarp[🍰] 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

    People actually do protest against those things. They're just a small minority.

    [–]czechvarmander [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    No you're right. I meant I hadn't seen anyone protesting against those restrictions in these threads.

    I think it's a defensible argument to make that convicted felons should have no restrictions post-parole, but it's not one I see made often. Particularly compared to the large uproar issues such as this one can cause for more minor (imo) violations of the felons rights.

    [–]Aurondarklord -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

    To be fair, I can kinda understand a company's decision to rid themselves of a violent felon. It's not like this is some SJW shitstorm where they're calling somebody a rapist for some stupid comment or unfounded accusation. This guy is ACTUALLY a rapist. If you do that, you're scum, and no shit people are gonna think terribly of you and not want to give you a chance, you deserve it.

    [–]barrinmw 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Yes, raping people is bad, mmkay. But that isn't what we are talking about.

    We are talking about a person who did something horrible, the victim was kind enough to want to show him mercy, he used that mercy to turn his life around and become a productive member of society over the decade after. We should not continue to ostracize criminals after they have completed their punishment. That leads to super high recidivism rates that we have in this country, because felons are not able to become reintegrated in society, and yes, Magic the Gathering is a part of our society.