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Lawyers trolling me on reddit (self.help)

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[–]V2Blast 3ポイント4ポイント  (46子コメント)

Read the sitewide rules of reddit. #2:

Don't ask for votes or engage in vote manipulation.

[–] What does vote manipulation look like?

  • NOT OK: Buying votes or using services to vote.
  • OK: Sharing reddit links with your friends.
  • NOT OK: Sharing links with your friends or coworkers and asking them to vote.
  • NOT OK: Creating submissions such as "For every upvote I will ..." or "... please upvote this!", regardless of the cause.

I'm guessing you linked to the submission somewhere outside reddit (or in another subreddit), which can be considered vote manipulation, and can indeed get you shadowbanned - though the admins will generally only notice that sort of thing when it's reported to them by a regular user or a subreddit moderator. It doesn't automatically mean you're definitely going to be shadowbanned; just don't do it again.

(Also, I'd suggest that you not complain about this in 4 different subreddits; people aren't going to feel particularly sympathetic for you just because you didn't read the rules.)

[–]rhubey 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

This guy pm'd me after I removed his post saying specifically he was using reddit for SEO.

I have just started implementing SEO tactics to get more views on my page. So I decided to use reddit.

No mystery behind his one issue. As for his others, those are beyond the scope of Any subreddit.

[–]xcannabis[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (7子コメント)

Right I understand that. Im not sure how it pertains to me.
I have had this account for 6 years. I use it very little. I am not asking for votes.

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (6子コメント)

I have had this account for 6 years. I use it very little.

I am not sure how this is relevant to anything.

In any case, linking to your post from other subreddits or websites is likely to be seen as vote manipulation, even if you don't explicitly ask for upvotes.

Mods have no way of seeing where the votes are coming from - only admins can - so mods tend to err on the side of caution and remove any potentially suspicious post.

[–]xcannabis[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (5子コメント)

you don't explicitly ask for upvotes.

I guess it best to walk on eggshells. I am still confused where I went wrong, where I asked for upvotes, or how I violated any rules?

My post got 38 upvotes. That doesn't even seem like very much. My personal website that has much less users, gets a lot more interaction than that.

Anyhow, thank you for the advice. I am still not sure how to apply it to my situation.

As for me mentioning my "6 years on reddit", I am just pointing out that I have a lot of experience here, and I have never seen anything like this. I suspect that what is going on is a false report, by people trolling. I hope reddit eventually sees this abuse and takes care of it.

[–]V2Blast 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

My post got 38 upvotes. That doesn't even seem like very much. My personal website that has much less users, gets a lot more interaction than that.

38 upvotes is a lot for a small subreddit. And regardless, whether or not you were successful is irrelevant to determining whether you were attempting vote manipulation (I'm not saying you were).

Again, I'm not saying you were guilty of vote manipulation, I'm just pointing out that moderators can't tell where votes are coming from, so they are likely to remove anything that might be a result of vote manipulation. If you have any questions about why a post was removed, you will have to take it up with those mods.

Hope that clarified things a bit.

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Yup, thanks. I still suspect trolling. But I will wait for their reply. I have already written them. Again, you have been helpful on some of my concerns.

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Glad to help!

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

You have been very polite, prompt and indeed helpful. Have a good rest of your day. I have been up all night sort of stressing on this. So I am going to take a nap. :)

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sounds like a good idea. Naps are always good :D

[–]xcannabis[S] -3ポイント-2ポイント  (35子コメント)

Also, the trolling is really what I am worried about. I have a group of lawyers downvoting everything I post. I have -77 down votes in a matter of hours from these trolls. It's killing this experience for me.

[–]V2Blast 2ポイント3ポイント  (34子コメント)

I don't understand why you are confused by the fact that insulting public defenders as a whole in a subreddit full of lawyers (trying to help people) is resulting in downvotes.

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (19子コメント)

I had a problem with my lawyer, I asked for advice. I did not insult anyone on reddit, not yet a group of people.

Here is my last response on the issue at that subreddit;

After making a slight about "public defenders", which is just me being silly. I got a mountain of "bad karma". Which I really could care less. I mean look at my account, I have been here for 6 years, and I have barely used Reddit. Not really my thing. Too many restrictions and too many trolls. Right now there is a big falling out about fat people or something? I dunno, it's always something. Whether censorship, rule enforcement, or trolling. But I did want to give props to the Public Defenders out there. I am not one to be in trouble, and this is my first use of a public defender. But I realize that they get paid less, and typically do a great job. I just read this about public defenders. http://defensehelp.com/russo-russo-lawyer-qualifications/private-lawyer-public-defender I guess it is the work load that they must take, to make up for the lower pay that has got me upset. It's not their fault necessarily that they get too busy. But my only major problem is that last week my PD told me that he would be in court for me on my court date (pretrial thing), and then I called yesterday to follow up to find out a few surprises. He was on vacation and could not take my call (I JUST recently spoke to him, I had no idea) That he said he would appear in court for me, and I wouldn't have to drive 2600 miles to be there. That when I called, the secretary had no new notes about my case, and she informed me that I would in fact have to appear in court on my next court date, and that a lawyer would not be appearing for me, as I was just told less than a week ago. My PD only had to update his notes, and inform the prosecutors office. I mean nevermind telling me all of this about the vacation and such. But at very least, the appropriate people could have/should have been informed, so that when I don't show up for court (thinking that my PD will be there for me), that I don't have a bench warrant for my arrest. I mean it appears to me (and I have the conversation recorded with my CallX app) that no one was in the loop about what was going on with my next court date, and everyone that mattered was thinking that I would personally be appearing (which is not what me and my PD had agreed to). So now I get all of the hate and trolling because of my humor. "public pretender". I haven't defamed anyone, mentioned anyone by name, and all of my media is also censored with no names given. Come on, don't take yourselves so bloody seriously. I didn't slight you. But I do have a reason to be upset that my case is sort of being ignored, and that I almost ended up with a bench warrant due to no mistake of my own. You may sympathize with that. You may not. My guess is, there will be more trolling to come. Is this about justice or revenge?

[–]V2Blast 2ポイント3ポイント  (18子コメント)

I had a problem with my lawyer, I asked for advice. I did not insult anyone on reddit, not yet a group of people.

You made an offhand insulting remark about your lawyer in which you called him a "public pretender". I'm guessing this isn't the first time public defenders have been insulted in this way. Thus, other public defenders (and lawyers in general) were probably personally offended by that.

My guess is, there will be more trolling to come.

I doubt it. People were annoyed about your comments in that post, so they downvoted you. I doubt they're going to bother following you around outside that post. You haven't gotten a single downvote on this submission yet (though, to be fair, it is pretty new).

Also, I'm pretty sure people would have stopped downvoting you if you had just apologized for offending anyone, and made it clear that you only had a problem with your specific lawyer.

Anyway, I've answered your question about the whole vote-manipulation thing. This whole discussion about whether or not /r/legaladvice was right to feel insulted by your comment is totally tangential. Let me know if you have any other questions about reddit in general.

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (16子コメント)

Well, and since about 12am, there has been no activity on the other sub-reddit either. So I suspect people must be sleeping. It's now 5am or so, and for the last 5 hours, there has been no trolling here, nor there. But to be fair, you do have to admit that -77 downvotes, on benign comments that were not at all offensive, is typical of trolling. I mean I could have posted "hi, thank you for all of your help" (which is basically the content of one of my original posts) and it would get downvoted by -10 or so. There was nothing offensive in about 95% of my posts.
The post in question got less than -10 downvotes. But they picked out everything I posted, and trolled it. Not just one post, but every post.

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (15子コメント)

If you annoy a group of people in one thread, they might downvote most of your comments in that thread - but unless they continue to downvote you in other, totally unrelated threads, it's not really that much of an issue.

[–]AppellofmyEye 1ポイント2ポイント  (14子コメント)

He didn't get a slew of suspicious downvotes in /r/assistance. Downvotes wouldn't have been suspicious at all. He received over 50 upvotes (for a score of 38 with 7x% score) in under 40 minutes. I don't think I've seen that ever happen in recent history, and definitely not with requests there (even less likely for a request for legal fees).

As an aside, the guy has a crappy case and sounds delusional (or at least highly uninformed about the first amendment).

[–]xcannabis[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (13子コメント)

In actuality, I have had this account for 6 years, and I have never heard of "upvote manipulation" nor have I been reprimanded about it", and I have a large social network outside of Reddit. I have over 13,000 members on my own forums, and over 60,000 facebook members in my facebook groups and pages. The reason I don't use reddit, is because it's very time consuming, without much productivity. My network is already huge.

And I did get a slew of downvotes in /r/legaladvice , which is what I was talking about.

[–]AppellofmyEye 3ポイント4ポイント  (9子コメント)

Great. Sounds like there's no reason for you to be on reddit when you and should be asking your network for legal advice and funding to get you a lawyer.

[–]Chicagooan 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

1.) Not our fault you don't know Reddit's rules. You prob should, you've been here for six years, as you keep mentioning.

2.) People are allowed to downvote you. You not thinking they have good reason to is irrelevant. The article you keep referencing is off topic.

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Anyway, I've answered your question about the whole vote-manipulation thing. This whole discussion about whether or not /r/legaladvice was right to feel insulted by your comment is totally tangential. Let me know if you have any other questions about reddit in general.

Ya my question was basically how is trolling handled? Thanks though.

[–]xcannabis[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (13子コメント)

I don't feel like any insults have been given. I was complaining about an incident with my particular lawyer. I offered no insults to anyone, especially no one on reddit. What insult was given?

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (12子コメント)

You didn't say "I have a bad lawyer"; you said "I have a public pretender". Obviously, people saw this as a slight against public defenders in general (though I'm not sure insulting a state-provided public defender would have been taken well even if you were just insulting the individual).

[–]xcannabis[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (11子コメント)

It was a humorous slight about a personal issue that I have with one particular person (not on reddit). Anyway, let the trolling continue I suppose. It is sort of humorous. I guess I expected people to act more responsible and respectable, rather than like petty trolls.

[–]V2Blast 1ポイント2ポイント  (10子コメント)

One more clarification: "acting in a way that I disagree with" is not what trolling is. The generally-accepted definition of trolling:

The art of deliberately, cleverly, and secretly pissing people off, usually via the internet, using dialogue. Trolling does not mean just making rude remarks: Shouting swear words at someone doesn't count as trolling; it's just flaming, and isn't funny. Spam isn't trolling either; it pisses people off, but it's lame.

The most essential part of trolling is convincing your victim that either a) truly believe in what you are saying, no matter how outrageous, or b) give your victim malicious instructions, under the guise of help.
Trolling requires decieving; any trolling that doesn't involve decieving someone isn't trolling at all; it's just stupid. As such, your victim must not know that you are trolling; if he does, you are an unsuccesful troll.

[–]xcannabis[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (9子コメント)

Of course there is also a definition of "downvote trolling" which is defined specifically for reddit/by reddit. Ref; http://www.dailydot.com/news/reddit-negative-comment-karma-trolls/

[–]V2Blast 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

"Downvote trolls" are not people who downvote you; they're people who intentionally leave inflammatory or provocative comments with the intention of pissing people off.

None of that is relevant to this situation (assuming you're not actually trolling).

[–]xcannabis[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

suming you're not actually trolling).

I can't imagine why I would troll, and try to bring negative attention to something that is very important to me. Free speech is one thing that I take very seriously. I realize this is a fraction of a concern to other people, you know, my civil rights. But it is very important to me, and I have no need, and there is no benefit to me, to troll or bring negative attention to my cause here.

As for the definition of a downvote troll, I have saw many definitions for a downvote troll, and none of them match or even come close to how you describe it.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Downvote%20Troll

[–]Chicagooan -1ポイント0ポイント  (5子コメント)

So leave.

[–]xcannabis[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

I guess that was the point to begin with. The trolling was probably an attempt to make me leave? I dunno. I will mind my own biscuits and everything will be gravy, I suggest the same for my trolls.