全 131 件のコメント

[–]Thebestaround555 90ポイント91ポイント  (4子コメント)

Alright Leffen's pretty good.

[–]xSwiperx 24ポイント25ポイント  (0子コメント)

This was my thought exactly, I've been fooling myself for the longest but I can't deny it any longer.

[–]needuhLee 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Winner's Finals was such a high level ditto. I haven't seen a ditto so electrifying since Silent Wolf / Hax at DYFWI.

[–]Derpspecops 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I called that leffen was gonna win CEO. I bet he gets top 5 at EVO too

[–]SlySkills 21ポイント22ポイント  (11子コメント)

No Interview. What's up with that lately?

[–]Gliffie 27ポイント28ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, that's pretty disappointing. Leffen always has good interviews and this was his biggest win so far. I hope some kinda eSports outlet gets a talk with him.

[–]Psychowafflez 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

Time constraints possibly.

[–]MamaSexyEggs 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

On the stream. Tafo is gonna post an interview with him, hbox, and mango later. Separately obv.

[–]00ubermensch 2ポイント3ポイント  (7子コメント)

Seriously, it's not like it had to take a half hour or anything. Just a quick 5 minute interview with the champ to talk about his win and his plans for the future.

[–]needuhLee 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

It's important to have things run on time though. 5-10 minutes may not seem like a lot but 10 minutes for every event on finals day, when you may possibly already be runnnig behind on time?

[–]ikahjalmr 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Better to have an interview with no rush than one with barely time to say anything meaningful and risk delaying events on top of that

[–]JadnidBobson 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

There was a lot of downtime before sm4sh started though, I get that you might need to set up the new console and stuff but they should have been able to squeeze it in.

[–]needuhLee 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah I was just playing devil's advocate

[–]TurdSandwich252 -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

There was a ton of downtime between the end of melee and beginning of smash4. They could have easily done it

[–]pseudomac 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You say that but you have no idea what work needed to be done to switch inbetween games.

[–]Xrmy 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Plans for future: leffen will for sure say "win evo" no question

[–]Rayburnmelee 29ポイント30ポイント  (23子コメント)

Absolutely incredible play. His persistence in the recovery on dreamland before the stream cut out was remarkable. https://youtu.be/TU8f7U0Y4MY just after the 2 minute mark, he resets the same situation FIVE TIMES and on the last one armada chokes. HUGE PROPS. I'm glad he seems to be out of his slump- makes things more interesting going into EVO. Glad we finally got to see a mango armada fox ditto. PPMD is a very interesting variable to add to this. EVO will no doubt be a banger of a tourney

[–]reese_ridley 29ポイント30ポイント  (16子コメント)

I'm loving how the top of the ranking chart is looking more and more like a web; Mango always has Hbox's number, but Hbox has gotten the better of Leffen recently, but Leffen proved he can go head to head with Armada now, but Armada can still pull out Peach and beat Mango... makes for some really interesting matchups now

[–]white015 27ポイント28ポイント  (0子コメント)

hbox wouldnt have beaten leffen at this tournament. You saw what leffen did to armada and hbox was dropping WAY too many edgegaurds vs mango and armada

[–]f1predictions 1ポイント2ポイント  (14子コメント)

hbox only beat him at sandstorm, otherwise leffen has been dominating him. The bias against leffen has been ridiculous, going as far as suggesting that hbox was better than him and that leffen wasnt even a god, when he clearly is.

[–]reese_ridley -1ポイント0ポイント  (12子コメント)

I do think leffen is better than hbox now, but leffen isn't a god and never will be

the "god" title refers to a certain era (that's coming to an end). call leffen a god slayer or whatever you want but those five will always be the gods of smash, just like Ken is still the King

[–]1CH1B4N 21ポイント22ポイント  (5子コメント)

oh no not this again

[–]ahipotion 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Leffen isn't a god and never will be. It was a title given to five players who never lost unless against each other. Stop trying to put Leffen in a time that's no longer accurate.

[–]Zoler -4ポイント-3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yeah, it's hard to press up-b.

[–]Rayburnmelee 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

Ok but I'm just saying- the persistence is impressive on both ends. I could've just said armada choked like he always does in grands- would that be better? Fuck off

[–]TurdSandwich252 -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I get what you are saying. If mango was in that situation he would have side b off screen

[–]ahipotion 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I don't see why Armada didn't use his shine

[–]mysticslash 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

it would give him a tech opportunity

[–]itsNick_ 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Like Toph said leffen could have wall teched if armada tried to shine

[–]white015 12ポイント13ポイント  (5子コメント)

Until today, I was really skeptical of tafo's theory about the armada "curse", where he simply can't clutch out wins in the really big tournaments, but now I'm a believer. I thought armada had this in the bag, but it looked like leffen barely even broke a sweat. This kinda even reminded me of the 6-0 at RoF last year

[–]samurairocketshark 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's more like Armada chokes in big tournaments after being figured out. There's a reason that people compare him to Mew2king. Even though he doesn't have M2k's emo side, he still has trouble mixing up his style when someone has a read on him. You could see that here, Apex 2015, and Evo 2014. In the Apex example, PPMD took set 2 against Armada 3-0, because he figured out Armada's approach and escape options and Armada didn't adapt at all. In fact, Armada outplayed PP in the punish game, but PP clutched it by reading Armada in neutral.

[–]Coolthulu 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

It wasn't hard to outpunish Apex 2015 PPMD. His punish game was REALLY off the whole tournament. I think most top 100 players were punishing harder than PP that whole tournament.

Luckily no one can freaking hit him, so he got about five or six punishes for every one of Armada's.

[–]samurairocketshark 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, that pow-wow/training with Cactuar really made his neutral look leagues ahead of the rest of the Top 100. It'd be really interesting to see whether PP will have whipped his punish game back into shape come Evo time. Although his Falco punishes were looking good at Apex so we could see Falco as well

[–]Hariooo 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

he simply can't clutch out wins in the really big tournaments

He won Apex 2012 after being up 2-0 GF1 and losing the next 3 into the bracket reset.

He won Apex 2013 after losing GF1 as well.

Note that this was how he lost both Genesis and Pound 5 so you'd think there'd be a mental block. He still clutched both Apexes out.

So I personally don't agree with the theory. Sometimes you just get outplayed and lose.

[–]samurairocketshark 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think he does have a tough time adapting in general. Armada's punishment is so amazing that a lot of the time the opponent gets overwhelmed and loses all momentum, but when the opponent has a read on Armada he struggles. Even when he struggles though he has the easiest time making it close because of his punishes and edgeguards. If you look at history, Armada got past Mango, Leffen, and Hbox's periods of dominance over him through character switching, not just through straight adaptation.

[–]G0bln 36ポイント37ポイント  (25子コメント)

Mang0 cheesed his way into Loser Finals, though him vs Westballz looked pretty good.

Evo is going to be really fun this year.

[–]crievertiem 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well deserved, no matter who you are rooting for

[–]LWD3 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is really a big deal.

We all love the gods but people stepping up in this sort of way is so important to keeping this game relevant through the years.

[–]jinzo2222 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

this makes the evo storyline much more interesting

[–]trapsloth 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Leffen played amazing, congrats to him.

I'm curious to hear what you guys think about armada possibly playing against leffen with peach again, any thoughts? I know leffen is fantastic at the peach matchup, and has a losing record against armadas fox, but I'm just wondering if anyone thinks it's a possibility soon

[–]needuhLee 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I doubt it. I think he's really set on just making his Fox better rather than having to resort to Peach. Maybe he'll do it as a desperation if this streak continues, but I doubt it.

[–]PreCum-Tsunami 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

when is crew battle ceo??

[–]JonahTargaryen 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

what was prize money?

[–]kaabistar 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

We don't have exact numbers, but it's over $7500. (483 entrants*$10 + $3000 pot bonus)

[–]Liimbo 5ポイント6ポイント  (33子コメント)

Armada, Leffen, and PPMD (in no order) are the top 3 in the world right now imo. Mango has been a buster a little too often this year so far.

[–]buttsoupjets 12ポイント13ポイント  (10子コメント)

He won Press Start and placed better than Leffen at I'm Not Yelling, and placed in the same place with Leffen at Sandstorm.

Apply the same criteria to Leffen that you do Mango, and you wouldn't say such silly things

[–]unchartedcubes 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

To be frank, everyone played like trash at Press Start.

[–]Shwagzamaxima 26ポイント27ポイント  (11子コメント)

You can't count PP. He attended one tournament. If Mango attended one tournament and won (let's say, EVO), would you say that he's amazing? Come on. Don't be biased.

[–]neros_neurosis 17ポイント18ポイント  (1子コメント)

Dude, PP won the only tournament this year to have all the top six. He beat Armada twice (pretty unarguably best in the world) and Leffen once (arguably second or third best). There's no way he's not top three.

[–]Jofzar_ 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

To play devil's advocate here, the tourney he entered was the only one with top six because he entered.

[–]Liimbo 13ポイント14ポイント  (1子コメント)

If Mango had only entered a supermajor like Evo/Apex and won, then yes I would count him, but he didn't. He has lost a few tournaments he was expected to win (including Mayhem, a local. Albeit a stacked local, but he was still expected to win), or at least get 2nd. With his performance so far this year I can't put him top 3, and PP is the only other player I really can. And bias? Lol, Mango is my favorite player, I am just being realistic and not basing this off of legacy. I do still think he has the highest level of play in the world when he's on, but he hasn't been on very much recently.

[–]FirePuff12 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

He did get 2nd at Mayhem

[–]itsNick_ 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't understand this argument at all and people keep bringing it up. If a golfer shows up to the Masters and wins he doesn't have to play anything else to at least be mentioned with the top of the current scene. It would be different if people tried to pin him as the definitive #1 but they aren't.

[–]needuhLee 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yes, I would say he's amazing if his level of play impressed me.

PP entered APEX and absolutely wrecked. Until he shows otherwise, I'm going to assume that he's still that good or better, even if he doesn't enter other tournaments.

Though, your comment seems to be saying two different things. I agree with you that I wouldn't include him in a current top 3 in the world since he hasn't entered in a while. But I would still say that he's amazing.

[–]samurairocketshark 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

He didn't absolutely wreck at all. Leffen took him to last game last hit. PPU and S2J took him to last game. He almost lost to Reno. He dropped a set to Armada. It was an amazing achievement that he won, but he certainly didn't wreck. Even his 3-0 against Armada had every game go to last stock.

[–]Tuna-kid -4ポイント-3ポイント  (3子コメント)

PP went undefeated and almost didn't drop any games. He didn't just 'attend one tournament and win'.

[–]TurdSandwich252 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

He lost a set to armada in grand finals and it reset. He lost many games on his way there also, just clutched out the set

[–]Hariooo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

he dropped like at least ~8 games at Apex =\

[–]Coolthulu 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You're probably thinking of Apex 2014, where PPMD looked really dominant.

[–]samurairocketshark 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

Talk about recency bias. Mango is 4-0 against Leffen in their last 4 sets. He also almost beat Armada at INY as well. Also you can't rank PPMD top 3 if he hasn't been to anything in the last six months. Our means of ranking should encourage players to got to more tournaments, not just the ones that they win. That's like awarding a sports player 3rd place in the MVP race after being injured for 3/4 of the season

[–]Liimbo -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

Recency bias when I clearly stated RIGHT NOW the top 3? Of course that will weigh recent tournaments more heavily lol.

[–]samurairocketshark 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

To be fair, Mango has outplaced and/or outplayed Leffen at every tournament since Apex. One tournament win doesn't put Mango at 4th suddenly. I was arguing the against the buster argument when Leffen has been way more of a Buster this year than Mango. Also PPMD shouldn't be top 3 in the world right now when he's attended 1 tournament since Evo 2014 even if he won it

[–]TwitOne 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

after reading this thread I actually thought I was browsing /r/smashbros

[–]gf2tw -1ポイント0ポイント  (5子コメント)

lmao not even 2 days ago everyone was saying "oh man the top 3 is definitely mango armada PPMd with leffen m2k hbox in the second tier."

[–]HT_F8 19ポイント20ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well yeah opinions tend to change as majors happen... lol. That's kinda how it works.

[–]syc06 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Well leffen did just win a major but I agree, people draw conclusions way too fast. Hbox struggles a bit and immediately people count him out. Same with mango. Leffen and armada get hot and all of a sudden they're unbeatable. And I love PP but c'mon you really can't draw many conclusions for him. I think the top 10 or so of melee is becoming much less predictable and people are putting too much weight on streaks. Three months from now I bet everyone will have completely different opinions.

[–]buttsoupjets 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

They'll have different opinions, but PPMD has won 3 of the last 5 nationals/majors/super-majors he's entered.

[–]ItsNotMineISwear 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

And the two that he didn't win were MLG and Evo ;)

[–]Liimbo -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I haven't said that once this year lol. But since I am also on reddit I clearly share the same opinion as every other redditor right?

[–]HallowedBeThyBrain 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Came back from vacation, avoided Reddit and Twitter, finished VODS. Good shit Leffen, and good tournament. I'm really happy Leffen won, and surprised. I would've bet all the money in my wallet on Armada winning. FC next weekend should be interesting.

[–]Ribo19 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

Leffen is sooooooooo good it's insane. But am I the only one who thought Armada kinda choked, there was much less consistency then we're used to from him

[–]syc06 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

Honestly I think everyone kinda choked this tourny. Props to leffen of course but the top 8 looked full of people performing worse than their best. I think shroomed and leffen are really the only ones that was on par with what's expected of them. Plup possibly, too.

[–]mysticslash 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Plup was not playing as well as he usually does but this is likely due to the high stakes environment (he hasn't played this extremely hard, reaction based sheik game 5 against someone like Mango at a major before)

[–]samurairocketshark 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

It seemed like Armada choked because it looks like Leffen studied his habits and Armada really had no answer because his fox uses a fairly one-dimensional approach (doesn't mean that it's bad, just that Armada has a hard time adapting when he gets outplayed in neutral)

[–]gibisee4 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

FINALLY SOMEONE SAYS THIS! You can even go on youtube and watch Leffen analyze some of Mango-Armada's sets. Armada kept on going unpunished for his full-hop nairs in that set, and it looked like Leffen was at least shutting that down today. I really think he studied Armada.

[–]jumbowumbo -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think the era of the Gods is over, i just like to think of Leffen as the God-killer. Bring on that change.