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To Blythe Masters, the fellows at Hyperledger, Blockstack, JP Morgan, and everyone else who is going to "use the underlying technology behind Bitcoin" This Is For You (imgur.com)

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[–]BitBurst 30ポイント31ポイント  (4子コメント)

http://imgur.com/DJDuxVO

[–]RaptorXP -5ポイント-4ポイント  (1子コメント)

What they got wrong is that they think they need a blockchain when they don't. But what they got right is that they don't need Bitcoin.

[–]Noosterdam 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Exactly. Not sure why you got downvoted, maybe comment was confusing. What Hyperledger is doing is unrelated to Bitcoin, though of course using Bitcoin/blockchain buzz to hype itself (following in the proud footsteps of Ripple).

[–]AnalyzerX7 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

We got your Block Chain tokens right here, get them while they are hot!

[–]abarn004 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Mockchains.

[–]probablytom 1ポイント2ポイント  (24子コメント)

Hey, now -- Bitcoin's great, but blockchains as a data structure have a lot of implications that are important for these people. They may well not have the best of intentions, but they may also fund research that helps us understand how to use blockchains.

I sometimes feel like there's a bitcoin-good-other-use-bad mindset here when it comes to blockchains, and that's something I can't explain.

[–]rplevy 21ポイント22ポイント  (12子コメント)

Ok, please explain why a private blockchain is exciting and interesting? The whole reason anyone cares about blockchains is that it creates a trust-free system enabling open-ended participation and use. A private blockchain system is just a database. It's almost as if the hype is being capitalized while removing the cause for hype.

[–]BlockchainOfFools 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

The "Decentralize All The (Internet of) Things!" VC funding meme is on the market for a new piece of mental real estate to call home now that "bitcoin" is looking more and more like a candidate superfund site

[–]hietheiy -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

Immutable ledgers. Cryptostock asset tokens. Blockstream sidechains will most likely be the leader in this technology.

[–]zcc0nonA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

a government backed digital urrency, citi bank said that digital currency is inevitable but they don't liek btc because htey can't control it

[–]OpenPodBayDoorsHAL 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Bitcoin is a good "bearer" asset. To own a registered asset (like a stock or bond or colored coin) however, nearly every jurisdiction says you have to know who certifies the validity of the ledger it sits on. If it's an anonymous guy in a cave in China...tough to enforce in the courts that it is a valid asset. That's why people are setting up private ledgers

[–]knight222 12ポイント13ポイント  (4子コメント)

You didn't address the question. Why use a blockchain as a private ledger in the first place?

[–]fast5alive 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

read hyperledger's home page. financial institutions have a need for smart contracts and private keys. I'm not sure how secure it will be though

[–]inthenameofmine 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Blockchains (even centralized one's) make it possible to do independent state and state transition verification of the data on the blockchain. It's essentially a database which records each and every change to it with a verifiable GIT hash. If you then upload some checkpoint or block header hash to another notarizing blockchain (like BTC for example) you get all the upsides of BTC without any of its downsides. That is what BitPay's ChainDB, Eris' ErisDB, and the Singapore hackathon OmniChain propose and do.

There's tons of other purposes though. At Bitsapphire we regularly talk to people with the most varying use cases.

[–]aboyandhisdog 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

Can't you do that with a simple log file?

[–]inthenameofmine -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

The log file isn't independently provable, just like a log file of GIT changes without a hash-chain isn't provable.

[–]jon_smyth 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

There's a spectrum of use cases between "private" and "fully decentralized." A consortium of 5 banks may want a trust-less way to share data between themselves. It may be that an adaptation of "blockchain technology" which does not rely on "bitcoin" is a well suited tool for that purpose. Funding research towards building that tool doesn't seem any more or less valuable to me than funding research towards any technology.

I honestly don't understand all the hate on this subreddit directed towards even the mention of "Blockchain without bitcoin" - it's either a viable technology or it isn't. And if it isn't viable, that will become clear as all these funded companies collapse.

[–]Noosterdam 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It was Hyperledger's choice to try to hitch a ride on the Bitcoin/blockchain buzz when it's really an unrelated product. It might be a viable/interesting product (though their misleading marketing strategy certainly doesn't make it seem like a product that can stand on its own merits), but it has nothing to do with Bitcoin and doesn't deserve special attention here other than mockery for its cheap coattail-surfing attempt.

[–]handsomechandler -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

and that's something I can't explain

It generally comes from an insecurity that there might be a way that blockchain technology succeeds without making bitcoin holders rich.

[–]Worle1bm -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Voicing this opinion in /r/bitcoin is pointless. The groupthink here is too strong.

[–]SundoshiNakatoto 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well said

[–]intentional_feeding 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

explain this meme please

[–]Taviiiiii 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Just bitcoin fanboys being elitist again

[–]Half-X 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Knowing the difference between decentralized consensus systems and databases isn't funboyism ...

[–]jon_smyth 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

That's a false dichotomy. Not all use cases require fully decentralized consensus. There may be usecases in which a limited set of actors need to achieve consensus in a trust-less way. In such a limited case (e.g. a consortium of banks clearing payments amongst themselves) "bitcoin as a currency" may not be needed to incentivize participation.

Regardless of whether this proves warranted, the idea that there might be usecases that don't require fully decentralized consensus and which aren't served by standard, private databases is hardly ever discussed on this sub, and when it is is often met with fairly aggressive suppression. As /u/Taviiiiii mentioned, to an outsider this does look like elitist fanboyism.

[–]Noosterdam 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Either voting participants are specifically designated or they aren't. If they are, you don't need a blockchain. If they aren't, your blockchain can be easily attacked with outside mining power (even if hired by someone on the inside).

[–]Half-X -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

People in this sub don't discuss about pseudo-decentralized schemes just like they don't discuss about badminton. This is /r/bitcoin. Also we don't really care about what kind of database scheme banks will use to facilitate fiat transfers. They already have pretty sophisticated systems anyway.

[–]intentional_feeding 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

but the spaceghost reference? i was here for hodl and gentleman, but i might've been asleep for this one.

[–]its_bitney_bitch 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

You might be reading too much into it. It's just meant to be a superhero type of pic.

[–]fast5alive 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

at first it looks like a great idea for them, but the question is which one of these crooks will run it? and would they even trust one another? Blythe is covering her bases by acquiring HL but in the long run, I don't see how this will outweigh trustworthiness based on some honor system that Digital Assets is swearing by and how other financial institutions will agree to all use this centralized ledger, though private, is still public to a single entity

[–]Half-X -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Google docs is for them also...

[–]ThePiachu -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

And your counterargument is?

[–]yourliestopshere -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yea, anything ms masters touches I won't.