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How The Pardon Of Alan Turing Is An Attack Against Male Heterosexuality

alan-turing
schopenbecq
Schopenbecq is the author of the blog The Antifeminist, interpreting feminism as a kind of trade union for low sexual market value women, growing stronger just as new technology and globalization lowers the average SMV of women.
January 19, 2014 127 Comments History
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After years of campaigning, a royal pardon has been granted to computer pioneer and wartime codebreaker Alan Turing, overturning his conviction over half-a-century ago for ‘gross indecency’ with a 19 year old boy.
For the ‘enlightened classes’, this act of official state forgiveness for a secular homosexual martyr symbolizes the victory of liberal progress over the backward and prejudiced attitudes of the past. In reality, as with same sex marriage and sodomite rights in general, the Alan Turing story is merely a tool that the progressive elite is manipulating in order to disguise the brutal feminist war upon ordinary male heterosexuality.
Alan_Turing_plaque

Rewriting History

The pardoning of Alan Turing should be set against the background of a modern witch hunt that is taking place presently in the United Kingdom, and that began in the aftermath of the Jimmy Savile scandal that engulfed the BBC a year ago. It involves the hounding of aged celebrities accused of historic sex crimes – mostly against teenage groupies in the sexually anarchic 60’s and 70’s, when the age of consent was largely considered to be a legal fiction. The day before Turing’s pardon, the much loved Anglo-Australian celebrity Rolf Harris, aged 83, was informed that he was facing further charges for alleged sex crimes against young girls, some dating back to the 1960’s.
While the British state attempts to re-write history by airbrushing the astonishingly liberal heterosexual attitudes of the 1960’s out of existence through the persecutions of aged celebrities of that period, it seeks to simultaneously confirm that past sexual mores were ‘backward’ through the Royal pardoning of Alan Turing. But how different was Alan Turing to the old men now being hounded by the British state without pity or mercy, and was he really the victim of ‘discrimination’?

Alan Turing was the criminal, his lover the victim

First of all, Turing was not prosecuted for homosexuality, but for ‘gross indecency’ –  against a teenage boy. The 19 year old labourer that Alan Turing was found guilty of buggering, was not convicted of any crime, and was below the age of majority in the UK at the time (21).  He was seen as the child victim of Alan Turing, and the law against homosexuality, or rather ‘gross indecency’, was seen as protecting children and young people against sexual abuse.
Now this might not cut any ice with the ‘liberal’ champions of their ex post facto gay martyr. After all, as we see with the indignation and fury provoked by the Russian law against homosexual propaganda aimed at minors, even laws protecting children from sexual abuse are the work of the devil if they are judged to ‘discriminate’ against homosexuals.
When Alan Turing, at the age of 40, had anal sex with his 19 year old toy, homosexual sodomy was illegal, while at the same time the heterosexual age of consent was 16. The age of consent had been raised from 13 in the very same 1885 Victorian bill that had made homosexuality illegal as ‘gross indecency’ (the bill was largely the work of puritanical Suffragettes). It is not known whether Alan Turing had sex with any other teenage boys (we can assume that he did), and whether, for some peculiar reason, unlike other homosexuals of the period, he stringently adhered to the heterosexual age of consent. Liberal progressives appear to assume that Alan Turing, genius that he was, could foresee that in 60 years time society would have come to the correct moral conclusion that Victorian feminists got it completely right about the age of consent, but completely wrong about the morality of gay sex.
why-women-wanted-the-vote

An abuse of power?

Homosexuality was decriminalized in 1967 but with a higher age of consent (21) than for heterosexuals. It was then lowered to 18 in 1994 and finally ‘equalized’ in the year 2000. Does an unequal age of consent discriminate against homosexuals? First of all, as we know that the legal system effectively treats the age of consent as applying only to male ‘predators’, then we should not see an unequal age of consent as being between homosexuals and heterosexuals, but rather as applying different ages for boys and girls. And this inequality does have the rationality of recognizing the established truth that teenage boys develop significantly slower towards their physical, sexual, and psychological maturity than do teenage girls. Unequal treatment based upon sex or ‘sexual orientation’ is not discriminatory if it discriminates upon the basis of a relevant difference. As emotional and sexual maturity is the primary justification for the age of consent in the first place, the scientific fact that boys reach maturity later than girls means that, actually, an equal age of consent discriminates against heterosexuals.
We should also note the ‘imbalance in power’ that existed between Alan Turing, 40 year old computer genius and professor of mathematics, and his 19 year old sex partner – a mere labourer. This is the other, related, feminist justification for the age of consent, and it does not shine a favourable moral light upon Turing’s relationship with the boy.

Did Alan Turing try to frame his boy lover?

There are further problematic issues in regarding Alan Turing as a secular saint and a martyr to the evils of ‘discrimination’. These involve the circumstances of how his affair with his young lover came to the attention of the police – circumstances which are, to say the least, both cloudy and morally dubious. Turing’s home was apparently burgled, and the chief suspect in his eyes was the boy he had been having sex with. Turing confronted the young lad and threatened to go to the police. The teenager promptly broke down in tears and, in desperation at the fear of being arrested, threatened Turing with revealing their affair.
Our pioneer of computer logic and liberal martyr calmed the boy down, handed him a glass filled with alcohol, watched him drink it, then took him to bed for a sexual encounter. After sending him home, he went straight to the police with the glass that had the boy’s fingerprints as ‘evidence’ that he had committed the burglary. Turing knew that the boy would reveal to the police that he was a homosexual criminal and that they had been having sex, but he gambled on the police believing that the boy was lying in order to cover up a burglary (against a wartime hero). In fact, as history records, they did not believe Turing, and he was convicted of gross indecency.
It is quite possible, although we will never know, that Turing even faked the burglary in the first place after fearing that his homosexuality was about to be made public – as a means of preemptively discrediting the boy’s story. In any case, the historical fact remains that Alan Turing was convicted of having illegal sex with a 19 year old boy of far inferior status and intellect, as well as age, and that not only did he act immorally in putting the much younger person at risk of a traumatic legal process, he intentionally did so – even to the extent of blaming him on the basis of no evidence for a burglary (and that he may even have faked in order to escape prosecution for sexually abusing the boy). The liberal elite cannot re-write this aspect of Turing’s history.
alan-turing-statue

How far have we really progressed?

Another final point to consider is that Alan Turing suffered far less than sex offenders, both heterosexual and homosexual, do today – many of them under insane feminist sex laws as backward as any laws against homosexual ‘gross indecency’. Homosexuals today can and are going to prison for merely looking at pictures online of 19 year old teenagers that ‘appear’ under 18 (as a good deal of gay porn actors do, and are employed because they do). This is still called possession of ‘indecent’ images. In the EU, including the UK, homosexuals caught viewing such ‘virtual child pornography’ will soon face a minimum of 1 year in prison, decades on the sex offender’s register (the modern feminist version of the ‘Pink Triangle’ branding), and be virtually unemployable for the rest of their lives.
Alan Turing knowingly broke child protection laws by sexually engaging a 19 year old lad, and did not even go to prison for it. He was required to take a course of hormonal treatment to reduce his sexual urges towards teenage boys, but he appeared to have suffered no long term effects, and shortly after his punishment was ended, embarked upon a successful fitness and weight loss regime, and before long was seemingly both healthy and content. Because he was an obvious security risk, he was no longer allowed to work for the British government, but he was able to resume his academic career at the prestigious University of Manchester.

The myth of the forbidden fruit

Even his final act of martyrdom, his ‘suicide’ through the eating of a cyanide coated apple, may be an invention of history. There was no sign of depression in the days before his death and his close family were shocked when discovering his body, assuming it to be an accident. Although the coroner recorded a verdict of suicide, his biographer believes that it was likely an accident, as Turing had been conducting scientific experiments with cyanide on the day of his death. It is likely he had either inhaled too much cyanide, or he had accidentally gotten some of the deadly material on to his hands when he took a fatal bite of the apple.
alan-turing-apple
 
Even to the final mythical act of martyrdom, the Alan Turing story is an attempt to re-write the past in order to control and mask the present – the brutal feminist ‘liberal progressive’ war upon ordinary male sexuality. The myth of Alan Turing is the myth of liberal progress.
schopenbecq
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        • Gen a year ago
          This is like a mirror image of a feminist screed. We've all seen those shaming pieces written against men having sex with adult women twenty years their junior being branded as pedophiles. I take issue with the subtle manipulation of language in this article. A nineteen year-old may be legally a minor but in now way are they a child.
          As for Turing himself who cares if he was gay? I don't see how it effects your life in anyway, except that, without Turning, you may well have been a human lampshade. They castrated a war hero, that's a crime against masculinity, gay or straight. I would expect red pill men to look deeper than the surface. Turing could have well been one of us.
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            • theantifeminist > Gen a year ago
              The point of the article is to highlight the obvious double standards being shamelessly exploited by the feminist liberal elite.
              Do I think men should be punished for having sex with 19 year olds? No of course I don't. Do I really think Alan Turing is a paedophile? No, of course not. But he's hardly less of a paedophile or a 'child abuser' than the heterosexual celebrities in their 80's now being hounded by the same British state that has pardoned HIM for screwing a 19 year old lad. AND there are moral questions regarding his treatment of the boy in relation to the burglary and how their affair came to light.
              Do you think that it's right that Alan Turing should be held up as a martyr because he had to undergo 9 months mild hormonal treatment as punishment for having anal sex with a 19 year old (child) and yet at the same time we lock up homosexuals (and heterosexuals) and put them on the sex offenders register for decades for merely looking at pornographic pictures of 19 year olds (who might look 17) when 19 year olds are no longer considered children? Is that progress?
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              • Senior Sherlock > Gen a year ago
                Younger than 12 = pedophile. Nothing else factors into that.
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                  • Cui Pertinebit > Senior Sherlock a year ago
                    I'm thinking somebody needs to send the cops 'round to your place. I'll agree that pedophilia, strictly speaking, is prepubescent. But ephebophilia isn't much better, in our current culture. It would be different if it the culture were still extremely traditional, and 12 and 13 year old girls were being married to a man that would provide for them. But when kids this young are used merely for sexual pleasure, it screws people up in ways that can wreak havoc for the rest of their lives. Give people a chance to grow up. Promiscuity is always damaging, but especially so in adolescence.
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                      • theantifeminist > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                        We live in a sexualized culture with easy and effective contraception, abortion on demand, a welfare state, acceptance or at least tolerance of female promiscuity and certainly sex before marriage - all the historical reasons for a high age of consent no longer exist.
                        If homosexuality is legal (and I believe it should be), then why should the age of consent be as high as 16 or 18 and ever more rigidly enforced?
                        Both the notion of 'statutory rape' and the idea that homosexuality is 'indecent' are derived from the very same attitudes of the Victorian era. Yet the 'liberal elite' promotes one as 'progressive' and the other as 'backward'.
                        The idea that the sexual act is of massive moral and emotional significance is a feminine idea that feminists exploit (at least when it comes to older men having sex with teenage girls). There is nothing masculine about calling for other men to be raped in prison so that the evolutionary sexual strategies of women are protected and promoted.
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                            Exploiters > theantifeminist a year ago
                            "If homosexuality is legal (and I believe it should be), then why should
                            the age of consent be as high as 16 or 18 and ever more rigidly
                            enforced?"
                            Because PARENTS don't want their kids to have sex. They want them to be focused on school and age appropriate activities.
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                                Alex > Exploiters a year ago
                                Age appropriate? You're denying thousands of years of human history to fit what feminists, the state, and the church have decided is age appropriate?
                                Cute. Turn in your man card at the door.
                                No seriously, turn it in. The ONLY difference today is we haven't got shotgun weddings because Janie or Timmy have birth control. Now you can argue about birth control, but arguing against a couple thousand years of recorded history just makes you similar to any other feminist, mangina, state, or church authoritarian.
                                Just because parents have been brainwashed by the state doesn't erase human biology.
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                              • Cui Pertinebit > theantifeminist a year ago
                                Pure bullshit.
                                First: read Aristotle, Plato, Juvenal, Marcus Aurelius and others - all Pagan, pre-Christian authors - and you'll see that healthy sexual mores are neither Christian nor "Victorian." People have condemned homosexuality for all time, and for good reasons that have nothing to do with Christianity or the "Victorian" era. That is the kind of blue-pill nonsense that liberals pushed so that they could advocate for their brave new world. Homosexuality should not be legal. By what moral system do you decide that it should? And why would this moral system not tell us that humping our dogs and 12-year olds and household plants are all fine ideas? People have known from the dawn of time, that when a person's sexual desire turns from what is natural to what is a dead-end, there is a psychological and societal dysfunction at work.
                                Second: all the reasons you gave for *not* needing an high age of consent, are reasons why we do need an high age of consent. You listed a few things, and we'll take them one by one.
                                1) "Sexualized culture." Most people agree that a sexualized culture is a bad thing. Our great grandparents managed not to have premarital sex; few people got knocked up before marriage in their days. There is no reason why people can't rise to this level, but now we raise our kids with the expectation that "they're going to do it anyway." This is stupidity.
                                2) "Easy and effective contraception." See 1). The biggest reason for the sexualized culture is contraception. I am always amazed at how few people manage to think about this issue, because it only takes a second to see the error. When the last Pope told people not to bring condoms to Africa because it made their problems worse, people were furious and incredulous. But then *liberal* health care workers came forward and admitted he was right. You see, people in Africa tended to engage in more sex, both because they thought the contraceptions would "save" them, and because, once they got used to being sexually active, they were willing to screw whether condoms were available that day or not. So, when people who were formerly abstinent start having more sex, even the low failure rate of contraceptives can't stop pregnancy and STDs from increasing. This is obvious, even from looking at our own culture. Here, "effective contraception" has produced a culture where teenage pregnancies and STDs are widespread (whereas in our great-grandparents' days this was not at all true). It should be clear that "widespread contraception" actually increases the things it is supposed to prevent.
                                3) "The welfare state." Just despicable of you, really. Are you saying that because we have a welfare state, who cares if the age of consent is low? The welfare will take care of their babies? Well I'll tell you what: I don't appreciate being robbed of my paycheck so that little whores can spit out babies they care nothing about, on the understanding that they don't need to worry about it and I'll pay for it. I say ship that slut off to a labor camp for ten years and let me keep the money that I earn to feed my wife, who stays with me and takes care of our children in an honest way, without robbing other people. Just despicable. The welfare state is exactly why whores should be sterilized and put into labor camps, where they will have to work to pay off the burden they impose on society.
                                4) "Tolerance of female promiscuity." This is really a "good" reason to lower the age of consent? Isn't the red pill life about realizing that women need to be put back on the leash? That their promiscuity is not acceptable? Look, even if some "game" types seem to think that we should be willing to sexually abuse the lost causes, surely that's no reason to take young girls who might have had a fighting chance, and turn them into the very thing we hate? A girl of 12, 13, 14, 15... she's confused. She lives in a culture that teaches her to be an awful human being. Her father may not be in her life at all, and if he is he's probably whipped by her mother. She is desperate for love. You can either say "hey, lemme bang that 14 year old 'cause the universe sucks right now," or you can say, "poor girl; maybe if we agree not to treat her as though we expect her to be a slut, she might grow up to be decent!" What do we want the red pill to be about? Is it about manipulating damaged women into servicing our johnsons? Or is it about confidence and acting as a man, using this confidence to put women in the place that is best for them and for us? If the latter, we should try not to go out of our way to train women to be worthless sluts at younger and younger ages, but rather, hope that we can put them back into a position of more permanent submission to our masculinity, in a mutually beneficial and helpful way.
                                So much for your reasons.
                                The real reason to *raise* the age of consent nowadays, is the same reason why we let kids stay on their parents' insurance until they are 26: they are emotional cripples with no sense of reality or responsibility. My great-grandmother was married at 15, and I have no problem with that, because she had her shit together and knew how to raise an excellent family. She was already an expert horse-rider, shot, cook and farmhand. Now, a 15 year old girl can barely drag her ass out of bed at 1 in the afternoon to show up at Starbuck's in her PJs. She is not ready, psychologically, for human intimacy. If we keep telling women that it's okay to act like this by getting in there as soon as she sprouts an hair, of course they're going to keep being awful human beings. And if we are creating these sluts by acting this way, then we are just as bad as them, and equally to blame. A man needs to stand up, protect the younger women from being turned into egregious cum dumpsters, and punish the ones who already are.
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                                • Ian B > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                  Regardless of the age thing, the assertion that "promsicuity is always damaging" is pure nutballery. Any particular sexual act may be good or bad, but if consensual the worst "harm" is being a bit upset or regretful. On the other hand, it is pretty harmful psychologically for people to be trapped for life in miserable marriages that are often effectively celibate; the pre-sexual revolution ideal.
                                  Sex is a positive act that makes people feel happy; evolution clearly programmed us to seek a lot of it as a means of being happy.
                                  People can only "grow up" by engaging in adult activities; retard them (as Progressives and some Conservatives seek to do) and they don't "grow up". There's no logic to the idea that somebody should be entirely shielded from sexuality (or anything else of an adult nature) until some magic age which is, currently, set higher (and getting ever higher) than at any point in human history.
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                                      Exploiters > Ian B a year ago
                                      "Any particular sexual act may be good or bad, but if consensual the
                                      worst "harm" is being a bit upset or regretful. On the other hand, it is
                                      pretty harmful psychologically for people to be trapped for life in
                                      miserable marriages that are often effectively celibate; the pre-sexual
                                      revolution ideal."
                                      Because those are our only two choices, right?
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                                          • Cui Pertinebit > Ian B a year ago
                                            This is pure idiocy.
                                            First: the idea that "consent is the sole criterion of the good," is a particularly blue-pill, weak-minded idea. I.e., thinking that "as long as people consent to do this, it can't really be bad," is the kind of thinking that *produced* the feminist movement and all the bullshit that flows from that. We now know that women simply are not capable of high-level thinking and that, in a society that coddles them like our present one, they are not capable of accountability, either. But they and we "consent" to this societal arrangement. Despite the consent, it is horrifically damaging to everyone involved. Men and women "consent" to get into domestic disputes. They consent to loveless marriages. They consent to shoot heroin together. What kind of dumb-ass thinks that something is basically harmless, simply because people "consent" to do it? People consent to do almost everything that destroys their lives. Promiscuity is inherently harmful, especially in aggregate. I will concede that it is more harmful to women than men. But it is harmful and "consent" does not erase the harm, any more than it would erase the harm from all the other damaging, consensual acts.
                                            Next, this warped idea people have about "pre-sexual revolution" marriage, is simply wrong. Of course, nobody reads history or historic literature anymore, so I guess expecting them to know anything is futile. But you don't have to read much literature before the 50s (when the sexual revolution really started, because that was when women "lost their jobs" in the home, so to speak), to see that there was not this widespread angst about unhappy relationships, that has been normative since that time. Even still, many studies have shown that married people in their 30s enjoy more sex than single people in their 30s. Many studies have also shown that people who are married in traditional marriages (i.e., marriages where the gender roles are fairly traditional) report being more satisfied with the quality of sex in their sex life, and with their sex life overall, than single people of any age. For some people - mostly men married to feminists - marriage is a sexless hell-hole. But the lie that traditional marriage, ipso facto, is like this, is a blue-pill piece of propaganda designed to promote the promiscuity that has produced the blue-pill society.
                                            Next, as to thinking that "sex is a positive act that makes people happy," I can only ask: why do people have this magic bubble about sex? People always feel the need to emphasize how natural and positive sex is, blah, blah blah. Look: "Enjoying a meal is a positive act that makes people happy." Great! Does that mean that there aren't plenty of people who gorge themselves on crappy food, get diabetes and die? That there aren't bulimic people who eat a meal and then throw it up? That there aren't people who eat to cover depression or boredom? Why is it that when we talk about sex, everyone raises the "forcefield of positive thinking" against any idea that people might use sex in disordered, damaged, irrational and harmful ways? It should be obvious to everyone, that they do. It would be more accurate to say that "married people in traditional gender roles, whose sexuality is ordered towards its natural consequence of family life, are engaged in a positive activity that makes them happy." It would also be accurate to say that "single people banging each other in essentially non-committed relationships, are engaging in narcissistic acts that promote short-term thrills at the expense of real happiness and health."
                                            Finally, it's simply sloppy thinking to say that people "grow up by doing adult things." The adult thing is to get married in a committed relationship and have kids. If you want to do that, I actually think 14 is a fine age. Narcissistically rubbing genitalia because it feels good, is precisely a childish thing to do. Plus, why don't you tell little Billy to get to work in the coal mines? He needs to grow up by doing adult things!
                                            What foolishness. Kids need to gradually take on increased levels of responsibility, until they rise to the level of adult responsibility. They don't need adult responsibilities put upon them at a young age. Why can nobody think clearly and logically anymore?
                                            This is why the blue-pill is so successful: even in a red-pill forum, men are defending the kinds of behaviour that have produced the epidemic of vacuous bitches without any male authority in their lives. Encouraging women to have promiscuous sex with people because this is an "adult thing" and is "not harmful," is precisely the feminist doctrine.
                                            It is the feminist doctrine! Do you deny it? How can you think of yourself as a red-pill man? The red pill is HARD TO SWALLOW. Continuing to tout the feminist doctrine of free sex for adults 'cause it's not harmful, is the blue-pill and it goes down nice (but it will come back up on you). The red pill, which is hard to swallow, says that women need to be faithful and submissive to the men in their lives.
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                                              • Ian B > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                                I'm sorry, I skipped most of that as tl;dr, not many sentences beyond the tragically ludicrous "we now know women aren't capable of high level thinking".
                                                You are just peddling the same stupidity as the Feminists. I don't think of myself as a "red pill man". I'm interested in reality, not some kind of tragic bunker mentality Guys Are Great movement that makes all the mistakes of feminism. You really have no clue what feminism is; its origins, its philosophy or anything else. It's rather sad.
                                                Enhjoy your "red pill".
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                                              • Gen > Senior Sherlock a year ago
                                                It's also a scare word used to push people's buttons.
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                                                • Cui Pertinebit > Gen a year ago
                                                  Look, just because some people irrationally shame men for things that are not an issue, doesn't mean that every attempt to shame people is of a similar quality. The author was pointing out the very well-documented, historical fact that homosexuality has historically been a predatory orientation that gravitates towards young men who are confused or only barely willing. In fact, a lot of male homosexuality is created by the experience of homosexual abuse in adolescence, which tends to really mess with a guy's head at that age. I've known an handful of homosexuals, but the two I got to know better than the others, turned out to be creeps that picked up boys leaving Jr. High at the end of the school day. One guy who was pals with a friend of mine, was 22; his two boyfriends were 14. I told the cops he was doing it, they told me unless I had hard evidence that he had done something, there was nothing they could do. BS.
                                                  Do my anecdotes make for anything? No, but those anecdotes plus child abuse statistics, plus all the depictions of homosexual activity through history, make it pretty clear: the gays like your young teenage sons. Historically, they have shown themselves to be far more ready to act on such temptations than straight people with greater self-control and sexual health.
                                                  I can agree that Turin is not the issue, and that he may well have been the kind of guy who would reject "queer identity" and all the other garbage we have nowadays - which is one and the same thing as the feminist/social marxist movement that red pill men should oppose. That's why his article wasn't about Turing, so much as about the pathological need that modern people feel to create gay and feminist and black and trans-queer-multi-culti heroes, no matter how questionable their actual moral character has become. And Turing was a recent example (just as, a couple years ago, one could have written about the movie on Harvey Milk, disgusting criminal and, incidentally, another homosexual and therefore hero).
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                                                      Exploiters > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                                      "Look, just because some people irrationally shame men for things that
                                                      are not an issue, doesn't mean that every attempt to shame people is of a
                                                      similar quality."
                                                      Agreed. Jimmy Savile trolling orphanages with the explicit purpose of taking advantage of vulnerable kids is not equal to Turing's case.
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                                                        • Ian B > Exploiters a year ago
                                                          There is no evidence that Savile ever did "troll orphanages". We now know that the initial flurry of allegations regarding Duncroft were fabricated; the "media star" Karin Ward is now being sued by Freddie Starr for her invented "Jimmy, Freddie and Gary Glitter at Television Centre" story.
                                                          The truth is unlikely ever to be known, but in all probability he never did any more than pinch a few bums of teenage girls, like just about every other bloke who mixed with dolly birds in that era. And while technically bum pinching is "sexual assault", in those days it was a mainstay of saucy comedy so hardly considered in the same hysterical manner as today.
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                                                          • Gen > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                                            Thanks for the thoughtful reply, i'll need to go back and have another read through, as well as your comment and see if I think any different on the matter.
                                                            I agree that heroes should be defined on their own merits, the actions they performed, and not as aspects of their identity. I would personally be quite upset if I was to be defined as a straight hero or white hero when those things are only facets of who I am. Why not just hero? Anyway, the honour is worth little in these times, a throwaway word we deem stupid children and fat sloths worthy of for finally addressing their own shortcomings.
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                                                                Kyle > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                                                "the gays like your teenage sons"
                                                                That's just a stereotype. That's like me saying because African Americans have a higher crime rate, and I know a few black criminals. Between history and your experience: blacks like to rob people.
                                                                I'm gay and I do not go for teenagers. I go for people around my age, and maybe a little bit older (just because the dating pool is significantly small).
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                                                                  • Cui Pertinebit > Kyle a year ago
                                                                    First, the homosexual infatuation with youth has been a ubiquitous part of all historic, gay cultures, from Japan to Greece to Rome to Persia. It is difficult to find a similar uniformity of mores amongst an ethnic group, for obvious reasons. But, to the extent that one can find something like a uniformity of mores amongst the "black culture" in the modern USA, I think people would be acting rationally to assume that your typical black youth is more likely to act in a criminal or dishonest manner when dealing with you. But yes, a white kid "acting black" (ghetto dress and mannerisms) is certainly more likely to rob you than a professional black man with excellent comportment. It's not about black skin, but about the popular black culture.
                                                                    Second, there's been a new "gay identity" emerging since the 70s, and especially the early 90s, which is far more "in-group" and neutered. This is middle to upper-middle class gay guys who are trying to actively adapt the "hobo" lifestyle (hobo= homosexual bourgeoisie). Blue collar gays, and closet cases, still tend to like 'em young. The guys I knew were pretty blue collar.
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                                                                        buttles > Cui Pertinebit a year ago
                                                                        If you can point to Ancient Greece as evidence that homosexuals tend to prefer their lovers young, then I can point to just about every other ancient society as evidence that *heterosexuals* prefer theirs young: most ancient societies preferred young lovers, whether boys or girls.
                                                                        The "homos == paedos" thing is a myth, and it doesn't even make sense: women are visually much closer to children than men. Why would someone who likes masculinity; hairy bodies, big muscles, deep voices, etc. choose a partner who has none of these qualities?
                                                                        It's much more likely that someone who is attracted to femininity - i.e. a heterosexual man - would, in the absence of other choices, prefer males at their most feminine, before puberty has made them masculine: Desperate heterosexual priests with no access to women or girls == likely to settle for younger boys. An androphile homosexual would be after the other priests, not the choir.
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                                                                          • Cui Pertinebit > buttles a year ago
                                                                            I didn't say homos were paedos. My comment tended more towards the indication that they are ephebophiles.
                                                                            Women have traditionally been married young because that is when they have the only attributes of theirs that interest men: beauty and fertility. That said, it still remained acceptable to make love to your wife after she was 20. With homosexuality, on the other hand, it was exclusively oriented towards youths, eunuchs (and sometimes slaves) for the simple fact that they were not considered men, and were therefore licit sexual conquests. The modern willingness to allow grown men to penetrate each other, is revelatory of a depth of debauchery, and an alienation from essential truths about gender, far in excess of any other historical epoch's failures.
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                                                                      • Efreet > Gen a year ago
                                                                        you're right about that. remember the hysteria (in some circles) when jerry seinfeld, while in his late 30s, dated an 18 year-old? ridiculous.
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                                                                          • Ricky Vaughn > Gen a year ago
                                                                            Right, because the Germans were just itching to turn Britain onto a human lampshade factory! I was nodding along with your response before the display of histrionics.
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                                                                            Bortimus a year ago
                                                                            The use of language in this article is rather disingenuous. Framing a 19 year old as a mentally incompetent young boy being preyed upon by an old man is trying to insinuate as pedophilia an act that the heterosexual version of which everyone on rooshv/rok regards as something perfectly acceptable and about which feminist disapproval is routinely griped. This article is poor quality compared to rok's usual fare.
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                                                                              • theantifeminist > Bortimus a year ago
                                                                                "The use of language in this article is rather disingenuous."
                                                                                It was intentionally so.
                                                                                "insinuate as pedophilia an act that the heterosexual version of which everyone on rooshv/rok regards as something perfectly acceptable"
                                                                                I'm trying to explain how the Turing case was seen at the time, and how the same liberal elite beatifying Turing now, are applying those same standards ever more harshly to heterosexuals, often from virtually the same period of history (and, as it happens, homosexuals who aren't as fashionable as Turing).
                                                                                And actually it's pretty well established that teenage boys are behind girls in terms of physical and sexual maturity, so it would not discriminate at all to have unequal ages of consent - especially as the modern justification for statutory rape laws are primarily the 'inequality in power' feminist arguments.
                                                                                Some of you appear to be missing the message of the article entirely. This isn't really intended as an attack on Turing himself, but rather on the hypocrisy of the 'liberal progressive' elite.
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                                                                                  Sam Spade a year ago
                                                                                  Too much government interference all around.
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                                                                                    • tom is a little bitch a year ago
                                                                                      Mind blown.
                                                                                      These historical articles are ingenious. I never knew he was a minor, and I've heard it retold by countless liberals.
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                                                                                        • Oscar a year ago
                                                                                          A deeper discussion about the origin of homosexuality is required. There are homosexuals born so, but others are the result of abuse at an early age. I remember with disgust, calling my puppy (mi cachorro), a minor by an adult with whom he had homosexual relations.
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                                                                                          Schopenbecq is the author of the blog The Antifeminist, interpreting feminism as a kind of trade union for low sexual market value women, growing stronger just as new technology and globalization lowers the average SMV of women.
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