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What advice would you give a redpiller if you knew they'd listen? (self.AskWomen)

tothemax2193 が 投稿

NOTE*: Had a thread just now, but I changed the title because I figured going more specific would make it more interesting. Sorry if you were typing something up when it got deleted.

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トップ新着論争中古い順Q&A

[–]EllaShue 167ポイント168ポイント  (34子コメント)

"Women are people. Not trophies, not demons, not objects of lust. Not receptacles for your dick or your rage or your confusion. Not lesser beings. Not pretty, sexy objects that exist for your pleasure. Not rewards. Not pets that you somehow want to fuck.

"Just...people.

"Stop hating half the world."

[–]♀placenta_jerky 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Amen.

[–]Wa_Da_Tah -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

As I guy Id just give the TL;DR stop being an asshole. But generally assholes don't listen to logic. Lol.

[–]♀♥sehrah 92ポイント93ポイント  (16子コメント)

Make more female friends.

I suspect that a lot of them had minimal interaction with women leading up to them taking "the red pill".

[–]notovertonight 22ポイント23ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree.

And they realize that being the NiceGuytm isn't working so they flip to the total opposite.

It would be hard to pretend to be something you're not.

[–]justice_warrior -5ポイント-4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Feeeeemale

[–]♀♥sehrah 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Uh, okay. Female is the correct term to use in the given phrase.

[–]notovertonight 78ポイント79ポイント  (51子コメント)

I don't get how RPers hate women so much - call them sluts, bitches, whores, talk about them riding the CC...yet their main obsession is how to get to fuck women. Why the hell would you want to fuck someone you hate? They hate how women have sex yet want to have sex with them.

(On that hand I don't get why RPWomen align themselves with TRP when their philosophies are totally different.)

I would tell a RPer this: You shouldn't be Mr. NiceGuytm but you shouldn't be a dick either. Just be a decent guy who treats a lady right and I'll be a nice woman who treats you well, cooks you home cooked meals and loves you!

[–]♀Sand_Dargon 14ポイント15ポイント  (24子コメント)

Can I get a synopsis of RPW and how it is different than TRP?

[–]notovertonight 34ポイント35ポイント  (12子コメント)

Sure. As far as my understanding goes, RPWomen believe in a natural order to relationships - that men are the "captain" of the relationship and that women are the "first mate." They both are different but important roles on a boat, but the first mate is led by the captain.

I believe that RPWomen are "old fashioned." Some of the women are more into it than others. Some allow their husbands to manage finances. Some are SAHMs. A lady wrote that she doesn't wear pants because her husband doesn't like them. Some are more progressive.

The SOs/husbands don't sound like RPers, so I don't get why they align themselves!

[–]madcowbomber 15ポイント16ポイント  (0子コメント)

That sounds a lot like a type of Christian paradigm (both in marriage and ministry) called complementarianism, as opposed to egalitarianism. Complementarians teach that God made men and women to be fundamentally different, but compatible beings. In this type of arrangement, men are the leaders of the household or of the ministry or organization; women may hold important or influential roles, and have lots of input, but men get the final say.

[–]♀Sand_Dargon 29ポイント30ポイント  (7子コメント)

Uhhhh....I prefer a more equal partnership where we can both compromise when we need to rather than giving into demands just because my husband is a penis carrier.

[–]notovertonight 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree.

I mean I think it's fine to let your husband do the finances if it works out. I think it's fine to respect your SOs opinion and not wear pants if he hates them and you're fine wearing skirts and dresses. But I don't think that unilaterally the man should be the leader. It should be different depending on the people

I don't hate RPWomen entirely. I can see how for some couples it would work - some couples being the operative word.

[–]♂Coidzor 11ポイント12ポイント  (5子コメント)

I think it might explain the insecurity if he has to carry his penis around with him rather than just having it, though.

[–]♂thecarebearcares 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

No-one said it was his penis that he was carrying.

[–]justice_warrior 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

No one said he wasn't carrying it though

[–]trampled_empire 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Classic Coidzor.

[–]♂Coidzor 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wakka wakka. :v

[–]♂LaoBa 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

RPW is all about an ideal, long term relationship with a specific male/female dynamic.

RP is not very much into actual relationships, it is more about scoring. They pay lip-service to the fact that you might be happy in a long term relationship but rant at the same time that this is a losing game for any alpha male.

[–]Modified_Hackware -3ポイント-2ポイント  (1子コメント)

It couldn't be that you've misinterpreted TRP though, it's just that RPW are right and anything on the other side of the see saw is wrong. It's right here in front of you why and how it exists, you have RPW advocating the system even if they're competing for their own team (Which is 100% fine) and men are still "Just wrong" because... Reasons.

[–]♂thatoneguy54 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well actually, the men are still "just wrong" because they refuse to view women as actual people. At least RPWomen doesn't do that.

[–]PrincessofPersuasia 12ポイント13ポイント  (8子コメント)

I'm subscribed to RPW and really enjoy it. That being said, I would never date the typical TRP man that posts in that sub. For me, a lot of the posters in TRP sound like jerks and the opposite of the "captain" that RPW look for.

[–]notovertonight 12ポイント13ポイント  (6子コメント)

That is what I don't get. RP and RPWomen values don't align!

Why not change their name to something like "old-fashioned women" or whatever?

[–]PrincessofPersuasia 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

Some of the values align, but from my observation most don't.

I've wondered about that, too. Or if there's a sub for women who like to appreciate "old-fashioned" practices and theories. The thing is that a lot of women in RPW aren't "old-fashioned" so I don't think it would accurately describe the group.

[–]♂Bonkzzilla 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

Someone should go and create a sub something like "Women who favor traditional gender roles", or similar. Because, from what (very) little I've read of it, that seems closer to RPW than anything RP-connected. I dunno, I am a guy, I'm probably missing nuances. My wife and I have a very traditional, "hetero-normative" marriage - I make most of the money, she does most of the housework, she cooks, I repair the cars and broken household stuff, etc. This has worked for us for 25 years now, but I know that if she ever tried participating on RPW, the RP connections would have her frothing at the mouth in ten minutes. Hell, I'm the same way with RP. I live a bunch of their philosophies (Self improvement, work out, own my own biz, etc) but I can't hack all the women-hate. I'm pretty fond of my lady, and think I'll keep her instead.

[–]girlwritesletter [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The RPW subreddit was created and is owned by the man who created the TRP subreddit, hence the name.

[–]♀Sy87 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The values may not align, but the leading-in framework and conclusions are the same. RPW take the basic RP truths and try to apply it in the best way for women. Things like hypergamy and smp are givens, and this is what we can do about it...

[–]♀Sin-D-lite 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

From what i have seen, RPW is just women against the radical feminism.
But still not that what RP is after.

Don't expect fully submissive women eager to serve their masters on RPW.
...I know its a bit confusing.

[–]♂gramsespektrum 12ポイント13ポイント  (11子コメント)

Why the hell would you want to fuck someone you hate?

Sexist/chauvinist men usually still like sex? Maybe they don't respect women but of course they still like to fuck. You don't need to like someone to screw them. All this sounds terrible, but it's just the answer to your question :)

[–]♂PM_ME_UR_JUMBONIUM 19ポイント20ポイント  (2子コメント)

Also when you see a woman's value as derived from her virginity, fucking her becomes an act of violence to tarnish her reputation and remove a piece of her value.

[–]mybowlofchips -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

Someone pointed out recently that Sansa Stark's rape was a reflection of GRRM's hatred of innocence and need to degrade it.

[–]bigtitch 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not GRRM - Sansa wasn't raped in the book.

[–]notovertonight 13ポイント14ポイント  (7子コメント)

You don't need to like someone to screw them.

I find that super depressing.

[–]♂gramsespektrum 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, I mean it's possible to have sex with someone you don't like or respect. I'm not saying that's what people should do of course, but OP was wondering why RedPillers want to get laid.

I must admit, I've had sex with people I either didn't like a lot or didn't know well enough to like. As long as it's consensual, I guess it's cool.

[–]♂issius 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

why? (serious question)

[–]♀alfie_ 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

you must be pretty sad and desperate to have sex with someone that you don't like

[–]traced_169 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not going to downvote you because you appear to be answering faithfully, but there are a myriad of reasons for why various people have sex. In some cases , having sex with someone of the "correct" sex validates their own sexuality and reinforces the idea that successful expenditure yields a prosperous and desirable sexual lifestyle.

[–]Jet20 -4ポイント-3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Not at all. I know it might be difficult, but you really need to think of it from a male perspective. Testosterone is a hell of a drug in regards to wanting sex. Sad and desperate is pure, unfounded value judgement.

[–]♀alfie_ 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm preeeetty sure that if I was a testosterone fueled male I'd still choose masturbation over having sex with someone that I don't like...you don't have to have sex when you're aroused. If, for some weird reason, the only available person to have sex with is someone that you don't like and you still make the active decision to have sex with them (keeping in mind that PIV sex is always a pregnancy risk) then I'd call that sad. And the desperation for sex was already there so calling it a desperate decision isn't unfounded.

Quick edit to clarify - I mean if you actively dislike this person which is completely different to not knowing someone well enough to make a judgement/feeling indifferent towards them/aren't sure how you feel about them etc.... Plus obviously this is my opinion and it isn't right or wrong and opinions change etc etc

[–]Fish_In_Net -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Angry hate sex.......try it

[–]copsgonnacop 21ポイント22ポイント  (5子コメント)

Just be a decent guy who treats a lady right and I'll be a nice woman who treats you well, cooks you home cooked meals and loves you!

Why would you expect them to believe this? Or why should they believe this?

Most guys don't go into seeking male/female relationships with Redpill philosophies. Most guys start out just being a decent guy and expecting women to react positively to that. If that had happened, there would have never been a reason to seek out alternative philosophies - redpill or otherwise.

[–]notovertonight 30ポイント31ポイント  (4子コメント)

I honestly believe that the guys who are RPers were not decent guys beforehand but rather had troubles because of their personalities and rather than fix that problem decided to latch onto a "belief" system.

[–]copsgonnacop 13ポイント14ポイント  (3子コメント)

rather than fix that problem

Isn't TRP mostly about changing oneself (i.e. "fixing the problem") to become something that women are attracted to?

[–]missingherdearly 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

From what I've read about TRP, it takes the idea of self improvement and fixing your mindset to an extreme. A lot of them have issues with putting women on a pedestal and treating like these almighty beings that they can hardly interact with. Instead of just teaching these guys to treat women like people, TRP takes it waaaaay past that and teaches them to treat women like shit. That's the problem with it though, it goes to the extreme. If it stopped somewhere in the middle then things would be a lot better.

[–]notovertonight 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's like a belief system that tells you what to do IMO. It's a belief that women deserve to be treated as sex objects - a warm vagina for him - and be treated with absolutely no respect. The more "plates" you have, the better. To get the women, you must "change" yourself.

[–]ChinmayT2 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Rpers do not hate anybody.

[–]notovertonight [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I could go into TRP and find several men who hate women and post quotes here.

[–]magicroot75 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Learning how to be OK with rejection is going to get you much farther with women than trying to explain and justify why you were rejected. This holds true even when you're an incredible guy.

[–]♀placenta_jerky 32ポイント33ポイント  (5子コメント)

I would ask them what "being alpha" really means. To me, when I hear the descriptions of Alphas and Omegas and Sigmas and Chad Thundercocks, etc I can't help but see the irony in their situations. They idealize and strive after the goal of being a Man going his own way, of being independent and masterful while casting off societal expectations, but really are conforming themselves to a rigid and unforgiving standard.

To go one's own way is not to swallow some pill or adhere oneself to a hierarchical heuristic. To go one's own way is not to impose some rigid structure on things that are organic. To go one's own way, above all, is not to be driven by hate or the need to succeed; that in itself is mutually exclusive. Think about it- if your drive is to succeed past others and measure yourself to others, that doesn't sound all that independent to me. I'd then encourage a TRPer to branch out and try interacting with people from all walks of life. Seriously, if I only kept company with girls my age or dudes my age, I'd become jaded quickly (even more so if it were completely via internet). The relationships I have with people across age/gender/race/SES divides have made me much more understanding of the humanity in each of us.

[–]Imsomniland 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

They idealize and strive after the goal of being a Man going his own way, of being independent and masterful while casting off societal expectations, but really are conforming themselves to a rigid and unforgiving standard.

Bringo.

[–]notovertonight 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Spot on.

[–]justice_warrior 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

They idealize and strive after the goal of being a Man going his own way

I think you may have two different segments conflated here.

Men Going Their Own Way or MGTOW is a movement where guys are just deciding not to get married.

The Red Pill guys are still interested in the opposite sex.

[–]♀placenta_jerky 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

RPers do like to appropriate MGTOW terms and concepts, though, and true MGTOWs still want to bang people, if not invest in an LTR.

[–]♀ladyintheatre 38ポイント39ポイント  (2子コメント)

Well if they'd listen to a woman they probably aren't a terper.

[–]rofosho 32ポイント33ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm sorry there was someone in your life who messed you up so bad that you now think like this. The world is so much better than what you think it is.

[–]♂cyanocobalamin 30ポイント31ポイント  (7子コメント)

  • Don't spend your energy blaming other people for your problems, whether or not they are responsible

  • Apply your time toward positive investments. Read, learn, workout, meet people, go places.

  • Find a good therapist to help you get going faster to where you want to be

[–]loreleidanes 9ポイント10ポイント  (2子コメント)

I love your second one. Interacting with a variety of people, considering different ideas, feeling better about your body, and gaining skills -- all crucial to liking yourself and being embraced by others. Resenting women for failing to find you attractive rather than just working to make yourself attractive seems so counterproductive.

[–]♂freebytes 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

The first point is part of the red pill philosophy. Men are expected to be responsible.

The second point is part of the red pill philosophy. Men are expected to constantly be improving themselves.

As for the third point, many men that post and read RP comments are using it for therapy.

Just like /r/AskWomen has a diverse set of viewpoints so does the red pill subreddit and not everyone considers it a pick-up group. Many of the ignorant comments seen there are from new RPers that lack a full understanding of the core points.

[–]cookiebootz 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

What are the core points and what distinguishes TRP philosophy from the generic self-improvement advice given above?

[–]♂Coidzor 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Male supremacy and the subjugation and distrust of women, mostly.

[–]♂cyanocobalamin 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

The first point is part of the red pill philosophy. Men are expected to be responsible.

The second point is part of the red pill philosophy. Men are expected to constantly be improving themselves.

It is pasted on their side bar, they give lip service to it, but they spend their time casting all women as one monolithic entity and then assigning all of their problems to one monolithic (imaginary) entity.

As for the third point, many men that post and read RP comments are using it for therapy.

In my opinion, they should be using therapy for therapy. Venting by rants, with the pretence that the rants are real makes more problems for themselves and others.

[–]skinnygirl86 14ポイント15ポイント  (2子コメント)

You guys need to calm the fuck down with dread game. Some guys take it too far to the point the girl doesn't want to deal with you anymore if she's not a mean girl or desensitized.

[–]♂freebytes 31ポイント32ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think that is part of the problem, though. The women who fall for the 'techniques' are the same women that red pill men chase. They are also the same women that help fit the stereotypes they have created. All women may not be like what they describe, but all women they chase probably are. Therefore, the system works because the subset of women on which it works confirms the bias.

[–]skinnygirl86 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

You're absolutely correct.

[–]♀Sleipnoir [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

If you just want to sleep around, redpill will probably work for you. But if you're doing this because you're lonely you need to know that you're likely not going to build a healthy long-term relationship this way.

Most of the guys I've met irl who were attracted to redpill were "nice guys" that couldn't get girlfriends and were frustrated about it. They see PUA techniques working and think they can get a fulfilling relationship that way but I don't think it will work out that way.

[–]findsomelight 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly I probably wouldn't try to reason with them. Their beliefs about women seem so ingrained. It's like a religion. They'd probably belittle and dismiss everything I tried to tell them. Men like that, I'd just stay away from.

[–]♀Kanwic 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Whatever you're thinking of doing, how would you feel if someone had done that to your mother or sister?"

[–]DOCTORxTEETH [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"The anger will go away eventually. Just keep working on yourself."

[–]♀fiestyandwild 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

"no thanks"

[–]♀Sunjammer0037 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Read up on the actual evolutionary biology/psychology. It would blow up all your "biotruths" to the wind.

[–]♀Alect0 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

I feel bad for them as I think that they have often been quite hurt by women in the past and have extended it to have a toxic attitude towards all women OR they are young, not had much contact with women and it's just bravado because really they're scared of women or don't know what they are doing.

For the former type I think they should get therapy and just maturing will cure the latter.

[–]♀atouchofyou [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Make yourself someone worth dating. Work out, eat better, see a doctor for health problems, practice your hobby passionately, read more about all kinds of things, volunteer or work for a cause you believe in, go to therapy to work on your problems, develop more empathy--whatever you want and need. But work most of all on being a person you would want to be around and date, and you will find dates without having to compromise yourself or other people.

[–]no-mad [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Consider being gay.

[–]GrandHighWitch123 6ポイント7ポイント  (3子コメント)

Talk with women.

Listen.

Take them seriously.

Step one is realizing they are human just like you.

[–]♀level20eevee 10ポイント11ポイント  (5子コメント)

Since there have been several posts there advocating to push past a woman's no ("LMR", so they say), I consider them to be rape advocates or supporters of rape advocates, so any advice that I would like to suggest would probably get me banned from posting here.

[–]undertheaurora [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Sorry but what does LMR stand for?

[–]♂karry9001 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Last Minute Resistance. IIRC, it's essentially the idea that if a women trys to back out right before sex, the guy needs to pressure her into going through with it, because she obviously wants it deep down. I don't think I have to explain why this is terrible.

[–]♀imaseacow 8ポイント9ポイント  (3子コメント)

Grow up, and start treating other human beings like fellow human beings. Be a kind, decent, interesting, and genuine person and you will find other good people to share your life with.

[–]AtTheEolian 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'd tell them they need to get into therapy immediately, but also work on recognizing women as full human beings with the same amount of agency that they have.

Empathy is one of our most powerful tools. Use it. Use it especially with people you don't like.

[–]blueXcat 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Look in yourself and do cleaning in your heart. Work on yourself and accept you are a human with differences that won't attract them all. but that's only by being yourself that you will find someone who fits.

If you want sex, just at least give respect

[–]CMPainterNotFound 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Get help."

[–]Reddituser814 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

You are way, way, way overthinking this.

[–]♀ShesGotSauce 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Consider the fact that men are responsible for the vast majority of murder, beatings, muggings, oppression, genocide, warfare, terrorism of each other and start having a conversation with each other about destroying each other less, if you really care about men's oppression and suffering.

You're fucking each other up on a much graver scale than we are.

[–]indomito 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Go to therapy. Find yourself some female friends. Get off reddit and try to live in the real world a little.

[–]worried19 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Would they listen? I'm not sure one would even be interested in talking to somebody like me in the first place. I probably wouldn't even be on their radar.

[–]♂RWDMARS 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

All it is is misogyny hidden behind a twisted form of logic.

I'd advise them that falling in love is great. Happiness is not just about getting a wife that is the most probable to raise your kids right. That's not what life is all about. They treat it like mathematics and everything is a statistic. Where do you win? What happened to being yourself and living life, instead of trying to be so 'Alpha', and destroying every part of them self that might have been sensitive. All I see is a plan to beat women, as if they're conspiring against us.

[–]♀sunshinecliffs 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

See a therapist and/or get some help instead of focusing on negativity and hate.

[–]♀imhereforthemeta [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

There are/have been millions of men who are ~~~beta~~~~~~~ who have enjoyed happy, healthy, amazing relationships.

If millions of men that you would consider to be failures are able to maintain a positive relationship with a woman without treating love and romance like war (redpilling), and these are men that you would consider in inferior, what does that make you exactly?

I'm sorry somebody was shitty to you at some point, but seriously fuck off.

sincerely, A girl who left an """alpha""" guy only to find the love of her life in the form of a self proclaimed non alpha dude who isn't afraid to express his emotions, considers himself a feminist, talks about his feelings, and gets sick at the thought of violence.

[–]BiznessCasual [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

You might want to leave that last bit about leaving an "alpha" out because they'll just go all "hurr, durr, you're just hopping off the cock carousel because you know you're approaching the wall and wanna lock down dat beta bux, because AWALT, amirite?" Those folks have a terrific affinity for only hearing what they want to hear.

[–]♀imhereforthemeta [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I'll have to add in that I am having the best and most frequent sex of my life then.

Wait...that's got to imply something too. WOMAN?!!?!? ENJOYING SEX?!!? Shit.

[–]BiznessCasual [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

"Hamster all you want, that'll all change when Chad Thundercock comes back into your life and gives you the real tingles."

[–]♂Oerath [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"Women don't hate you because they're all terrible, gold-digging, status obsessed, cheating whores; they hate you because you're a terrible, status obsessed, cheating asshole."

[–]iambecomedownvote [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Advice for what, exactly? The red pill is the study of sexual strategy - what works and what doesn't in regards to getting women to have sex with you. It's silly (but apparently common) to pretend that some men don't have more success with women than others. The red pill is trying to work that to your advantage; to figure out how to become one of those men. I think they (the red pill) get their causes and effects backwards - men become cocky and arrogant because they can easily get laid, but what they're looking for is success with women.

Most of the "advice" suggested in this thread is "stop wanting to be successful with women because wanting that makes you a bad person".

[–]Grammatical_Aneurysm [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Looks to me more like, "Stop acting like sex is the be all end all of women's worth," because that's kind of shitty.