全 33 件のコメント

[–]appletonoutcast 22ポイント23ポイント  (0子コメント)

Here's the problem with your argument.

If we, as a group, honestly want to take a stand as a platform for free speech and anti-censorship, that means you HAVE to stand up for the unsavory elements as well.

It's just an unfortunate reality for taking that particular stand. It's all or nothing, whether you like it or not. The second you start going "We're for freedom of speech, just not THIS freedom of speech", you betray the very ideal you stand for.

I think, more than anything, we need to argue for standard application of rule site-wide. Was FPH banned for it's contents? Then why are CoonTown, CuteFemaleCorpses, WatchPeopleDie, et. al. still around. Were they banned for vote brigaiding and harassment? Then why is SRS, SRD, and BestOf allowed to exist? From the beginning, it's always been this fight.

Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.

[–]theone899 14ポイント15ポイント  (5子コメント)

It's not just FPH, it was /r/NeoFag...

And then /r/NeoGafInAction

[–]Cataphract1014 -1ポイント0ポイント  (3子コメント)

Yea but no one is talking about those are they?

[–]theone899 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

What? Look at the front page of KIA, it has atleast 4k upvotes.

[–]sjwking 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...

This will answer to what is happening and why it is important.

[–]Zero132132 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

People are trying. Don't act like FPH isn't invading basically every board. The difference is primarily that KiA doesn't ban people unless they violate our rules, so we won't ban people for hopping in purely because they used to be an FPH poster.

In most subs, it's purely shitposting, but I guarantee you, FPH shit wouldn't be dominating the board if it was just KiA people. NeoFag and NeoGafInAction would be, because there was actually some overlap, and it's an unambiguous case of them banning a community unjustly, since it wasn't associated with harassment in any way.

Basically, we're being brigaded, but since we value free speech, we aren't going to ban the shit from being discussed here, even if it isn't what we want to focus on.

[–]Ferlion123 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Fatpeoplehate is not the hill. It's a soldier ON the hill.

The hill is hypocritical censorship. KiA has been well known for being anticensorship. One of the big reasons it's a "hate group" is because we condemn, but don't enforce or try to shut down opposite views seen as harmful or toxic.

I think it's safe to say the majority of us oppose their views. I think how they are operrating is meh, with them invading other boards.

I also think it, in theory, isn't much worse than coopting hashtags. This was a community that built itself on the ideas of the prime directive. It's also similar to pcmasterrace being banned back in the day.

We stand against removing speech on the grounds of people not liking it. We stand against hypocritical practices. We stand against unethical behavior in journalism. We stand against a lot of interlinked things.

FPH isn't the hill. They just fight on it.

[–]Moar_Entropy 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Even excusing the obvious fact that as best, KiA is mostly just talking about the issue, there aren't any memes rolling to the front page out of KiA. What would be the hill to die on? It's fairly obvious that the admins only need a bare pretense to ban a sub now, KiA has been on eggshells for a while for what other subs get away with. So wait until KiA goes away suddenly and our possible allies have already sailed for greener pastures? If not this hill then which?

[–]AFCSentinel 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Implying that all of the stuff going on has been our doing. Just a small hint: FPH had like 150.000 subscribers before Kung Pao's fatality.

[–]ThisIsFrigglishThe 0.0065% 13ポイント14ポイント  (1子コメント)

redditor for 32 minutes

Interesting.

[–]MyLittleFedora 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

That doesn't affect the points he made.

[–]A_killer_RabbiOh, it's just a harmless little rabbi, isn't it? 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

we already are supposedly a hate group tho at this point tho I think FPH just want to coop the GG idea (the fight against SJWs and corruption in the Gaming media) and use it to hopefully get what they want (the restoration of FPH) without contributing anything to the general discussion and I have a feeling once they do get what they want they will not even give two craps about Gamergate so in a way this seems to just be people who don't give a fuck about the original ideas

[–]badpandasinc 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

You can't kill what's already dead.

[–]Neo_Techni 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

its the same hill we've been on since the start

[–]kiwikku 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Nobody cares. It's the hypocrisy that matters, not the subreddit itself.

[–]its_never_lupus 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Dude if we cared what people think of us GG would have died months ago.

Virtually every left wing media outlet has taken part in a hate-filled disinformation campaign - the media has already lost it's shit so badly they could not step up the anti-GG rhetoric if they tried. And the media are not going to suddenly play nice if KiA lets reddit get away with this round of censorship.

The FPH thing is big now because it's happening, it's an ongoing event. Give it a few days to settle and see what the new normal is.

[–]Wolphoenix 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Hello totally not anti-GG 0 day account

[–]Dragofireheart [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

He just made the account whoever this troll is.

[–]A-bob-omb 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think it's more the neofag subreddit being banned that's pissed people off here.

[–]UberAndrew 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Anyone with common sense can see we have nothing to do with the shitfest going on right now, we're just reporting any happenings about it. There has been a bit of excess spam about it, but it usually gets removed.

And it's not like we're NOT going to talk about it just because we could be axed. We always faced that possibility, so it's better to go out showing the corruption of reddit rather than staying and pretending like nothing is happening.

Also, just about every major subreddit has posts about this, does that mean they're all hate subreddits? No, it's a big even so of course when it's relevant it's going to be talked about.

[–]vaoe 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's not really about FPH, it's more about it being complete bullshit.

[–]Wylanderuk 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why does this seem like a copy and paste?

[–]UWOTM8FUSJWS 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why are you telling us what we can and cannot be outraged about? We've been told many a time we're going to die, we're nothing, we'll have no impact, we're a hate group, you'll lose if you say this, your sub will be banned if you protest this. We don't care. We say what we want and we will continue to do so. Trying to tip toe around others or worrying about our perception is one that people always want us to do. You want us to curb our speech on this topic in case something happens. No.

Honestly, if you're a lurker as i usually am then you know the ethos of this sub. I do not particularly have to believe in say, a conservative views, to defend their right to express them to the death. Nor do I have to agree with FPH. You state it's fine to point out the hypocrisy and fine to point out the censorship but don't die on this hill? First, we're not dying the opposite in fact and secondly, we will defend the speech of whoever we choose. Not the type of fighters I'd want for free speech if we were to pick and choose battles based on whether we think we'll win them and how others may perceive us. I don't care if we win this battle, I will never go quietly into the night. We're on the turf of a group of people who like to silence people based on supposedly protecting their fragile minds from some mean words We're already fighting at a disadvantage, by your logic shouldn't we simply quit? Why bother, we'll get banned eventually. Go fight where we'll most likely win, right?

This particular case is one that shows the incredibly transparent lies and bias of the admins and mods. They claim to care about a safe space but ignore their pet subs who are allowed to roam and do as they like all over reddit unchecked. The arguments I've heard are that of 'but FPH is so loud, and they hit r/all so much' Fuck off, if you want to create a safe space you have to remove all the offending subs and SRS/SRD are two of the biggest who were ignored. There have been many calls for their removal due to breaking of the rules, far more rule breaking than that of FPH and If pointing this out forcefully means they ban KIA, then we'll have stayed true to the principles of GamerGate. They will pick and choose offending subs who go against their ideology, this was always the fear and they have proven that by their actions yesterday. If you're telling us to essentially be displeased but not so loudly as they pick each sub off that doesn't pass their purity test until it's our turn then I will have to give a loudly resounding NO! I

Anyway, I actually disagree that KIA is even doing much bar just pointing these things out. Look how many users there are here ffs, 14.5k. We normally have like 900-1.3k. These are people who are all pissed off and we are one of the few subs who are devoted to exposing these instances of hypocrisy, abuse of power, censorship while also being strongly anti-sjw.

oh and they'll be calling your speech hate speech soon enough. they already say KIA and GG is just a hate group, I don't really like FPH too much, but they're a counter balance to the silly fat acceptance and HAES movement. Logic, reason and medicine is ignored by these people so they choose public shaming. An utterly extreme movement (fat acceptance at every size) was met with an extreme reaction. What a surprise.

Oh and It's never popular speech that needs defending you monumental faggot.

Hugs, An anti-sjw.

[–]SpawnPointGuard 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is a mistep, if you choose to make the banning of FPH the hill that you're willing to die on you will lose. You will lose utterly and dramatically.

This sounds like something a villain would say right before losing the final battle.

GamerGate was built on the principle of anti-censorship. With all the talk of "ethics in games journalism", censorship is by far the bigger issue and the number 1 reason why GamerGate became a movement in the first place. We're currently going through the biggest abuse of censorship I've ever seen. This isn't even just /r/FatPeopleHate. They're nuking HUNDREDS of subreddits. /r/PaoIsKillingReddit and /r/Shitlords_United are gone, for instance. So what was their crime? "Harassment"? We've been seeing this "harassment" bullshit getting slowly warped over the past nine months to be a blank check to take any action against any undesirable opinion or, more importantly, any criticism towards them. Now we're seeing it's final form (hopefully). Criticizing public figures is officially considered harassment which is officially considered Bad Think. That should scare the fucking shit out of anyone who believes in a free Internet, discourse and open discussion. We all knew this was coming. We saw it happening. We saw this ideology gaining power, despite the majority opposing it.

Just remember, when people are banned for being assholes, no one is safe. We're all an asshole to somebody.

[–]the_nybbler [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The attacker chooses the battlefield. What do we gain by yielding it without a struggle?

[–]BasediCloud 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

You are not talking to us. Half your post you are speaking to the SJWs you fear so much that you tell them time and time again that you are not part of the evil evil people.

I hope you'll at some day realize why that is a gigantic problem.

[–]iribrise 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

So, knowing about the ZQ mod activities, you are saying that people shouldn't be outraged by shitty admin activities because it could make us look like a hate group to someone not actually paying attention, wherein we already look like a hate group to someone not actually paying attention BECAUSE of the ZQ thing.

I admit, I'm kind of confused. I understand to some extent the "PR" argument-- don't be an asshole if you want people to understand what you're trying to do. On the other hand, the mere fact someone might assume I hate fat people because I'm willing to defend their shitty right to be assholes without their community being nuked and subsequent, non-harassing communities being nuked.... doesn't really bother me.

Disagree but defend your right to say it, blah blah. I don't see the reason to abandon that principle because someone who doesn't care enough to look into the matter will come out with the wrong idea. They already have.

[–]anusmang 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are you dumb?

KiA is only a part of gamergate discussion, there are plenty of other places

gamergate will die on no hills because we are already dead

[–]NaClMeister 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree. I don't give a damn about FPH and can't wait for the deluge of posts about it to come to an end.

Nuking NeoFag is more troubling, however.

The difference? FPH is attacking the person whereas NeoFag is attacking the idea.

[–]Xapys 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Welp, guess it's damage control day for Reddit. We'll be getting a good dose of what others want us to be, similar to how Pao wants Reddit to be.

[–]Dragofireheart [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Claims that we chose a bad hill to die on.

Implies that we're gonna die.

I'm out of keks!

[–]Splutch [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

the hill that you're willing to die on

Can we stop using their fucking buzz phrases?

[–]verisimilitudesque 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's not fine to lose your collective shits because of it

Can you point to this, even though you've only been redditing for 30+ minutes?