Drug Use in Competitive Smash

KHDTX13 · 6時間前

I can't be the only one who finds this title hilarious

KJJBA · 6時間前

I don't think the competitive smash community has the resources to do drug tests. Even if it did I don't think it would be necessary. As far as I know there has never been confirmation of any player taking drugs to improve his skills in smash. Another issue I have would be what drugs should be banned and which ones shouldn't? Adderall for example has legitimate medical uses so should someone who needs to take it be unable to play smash? That seems absurd to me. How do we decide what drugs are performance enhancing?

TheSecondTier · 6時間前

It's impossible to enforce a ban, and unfeasible to screen for them (as much as we eSports, we ain't that eSports). But the fact is, they're not banned at the moment and there will ALWAYS be people willing to risk their health for an edge. I have no idea what could possibly be done about this, though. I don't use Adderall or any other drugs, so I have no personal experience with how it affects you, although I do know what it does. It's a pretty interesting situation and I guess we're going to have to see where it goes from here,

Swissyo · 6時間前

Sorry, but I think we might be years away from enforcing anything. It's not THAT big of a deal right now. Only rumors that are currently spreading seem to make it bigger than the problem really is.

Marthmario-mii · 6時間前

See with things like adderall, how do you distinguish those who are taking it to "b gud" and those that actually need to take it to focus?

InexplicableContent · 3時間前

The argument of banning drugs in esports is a parallel to the ban of drugs in sports. The reason drugs, in particular steroids, are banned in sports should be obvious. It would be virtually impossible to keep up in physical strength with someone who is using steroids unless you also used. This would lead to a literal arms race which would continuously lead to unhealthy body enhancements.

This same argument doesn't hold for esports. Strength is set by the game and cannot be modified. No drug can make you smarter, at best it can help you reach a state of clearer thinking. This can also be attained in ways without drugs, so there is no unfair advantage for the drug users. Therefore, there is no necessary ban.

bunnymeninc · 5時間前

I don't know about the rest of y'all, but if weed is banned you might as well retire me.

RelativeMinors · 6時間前

True pros beat them Addy scrubs

OtterAbsurdity · 6時間前

Much larger esports than Smash don't test for it yet, and they have far fewer participants per tournament and much higher stakes than Smash. If someone wants to take drugs to win at this game, they're going to do it. It's not remotely practical for this community to do anything about it, so we might as well just accept it and move on with our lives.

Edit --- for the sake for discussion, lets talk about how utterly ludicrous this would be to do:

Start with the assumption that the tests could be done cheaply enough for Smash's budget concerns ($10-20/person), which I seriously doubt. The sheer logistics of doing them are terrifying. The two possibilities are testing through drawn blood or piss. Taking blood isn't easy and can be dangerous if done improperly, you need to bring in a professional to do it. Hiring that professional to come out to your tournament isn't free either. Now put it in the context of smash: you can't use the most common blood draw site (the arm) because smashers won't put up with the possibility of it giving them sore arms, now you've got the cheapest professional money can buy working out of their comfort zone. If we go with piss, then there's the logistical nightmare of making sure people don't fake it. Now you're having smash tournaments where people are selling bags of clean piss to each other in the parking lot. God help you enforcing the legitimacy of those tests.

Jump those hurdles and now you've collected those samples: congratulations, you now have a bunch of fucking biohazards on site. Think about how many mediocre TOs we see at majors/national level -- do you really trust the likes of Alex Strife and MVG to handle biohazards properly? This is probably over the expertise of all the good TOs as well, do you think that Juggleguy knows jack shit about biohazards and medical testing in a sports context? I highly doubt it. This is grossly unworkable.

arcacia · 6時間前

What constitutes a performance enhancing drug? Where do you draw the line between an acceptable drug to take and an unacceptable one when it comes to competitive video games?

Even still, this whole discussion is pointless because it wouldn't be practical to enforce a ban.

Sapharodon · 6時間前

[deleted]

ChillinNetwork · 6時間前

There's this thing in pro sports called Over-conformity. It basically means going beyond what is considered safe/healthy/ethical to achieve results.

Considering how low the payouts are in Melee, why anyone is upset at a player potentially using is beyond me. The risk to your physiology is arguably not worth what little prize is in Melee, so really if a player wants to over-conform, don't be salty

ChedduhBob · 6時間前

It would be so easy to beat that. First of all, just about any doctor will write a prescription to vyvanse/adderall or whatever. It's crazy how easy it is to get.

Second, there is no way to prove it unless you pop one at the venue. Just go out to lunch and pop one on the way or something and you beat that.

Third, we can't drug test. Way too much time and money, and I don't even know if you can test for those pills easily.

Also, this is based on salty rumors.

Sogeki · 2時間前

I have ADHD and I take Ritalin to control impulses and help me focus. A tournament once banned me for "drug use." I'm fucikng 13.

hMJem · 2時間前

I'm not going to name names, but as early as 2008 when I was trying to become a top Brawl player, I was offered adderall at multiple tournaments. Just to go to a bathroom with a few people, pop some addys. I was told it would make me play better. I was 18 years old, easily could have been taken advantage of with that false knowledge.

Fortunately, I knew I wouldn't want to abuse adderall like that. I ended up being the best brawl player in the Pacific Northwest for a lot of the games lifespan. (Pretty sure I've had the longest streak of dominance in terms of being #1 as well overall through the games lifespan of 2008-2011 in the Pacific Northwest)

There aren't always going to be people who know better though. There are always those people who want to make gaming who they are or make it something going forward and would do anything to take it.

I'd say it's an unspoken job of older veterans like myself/others that if you see something shady or uncomfortable going on at a tourney, even if it's a local, if you think some younger person might be getting into a weird situation, talk to them about it. You might have 4+ years of life experience on this person. Make sure your scenes are a friendly place where if someones Dad was at a tourney, he isn't observing thinking drug talks or exchanges are happening.

Adderall has been apart of competitive gaming for a long time. It was rampant in Halo, it's been apart of Smash atleast since 2008 for what I know, wouldn't be surprised if there have been uses earlier than that in Smash. It's pretty easy to spot on someone whose on adderall if you've seen someone whose been on it before.

YOU DONT NEED ADDERALL TO WIN. If you are abusing it for your 15 minutes of fame in gaming, go for it I say. There is life after competitive gaming for all of us, if you want to hurt yourself long-term just for your 15 minutes of fame, enjoy. I was never salty about being 100% natural and playing vs people who were on adderall. I never considered it some unfair advantage. I believe in mind over matter, I think you can get to that level of focus without needing to hurt your body long-term abusing adderall.

You can't enforce it. It wouldn't be possible. Adderall has always been a "hush hush" type of thing in competitive gaming. Competitors know who is on it, but people don't put each other on blast. I like to think of it like sports leagues. You cant tell me that the NFL is clean. As big as they are in the physical sport they play, I'd say atleast 90% of them are taking PEDs. And the NFL doesn't want to punish that many people for it because it's just a known thing that happens. A hush hush type situation.

protomanfan25 · 5時間前

Has ANY other game in the FGC have to deal with this before? If we are the first, that's a bit of a curveball

45flight2 · 4時間前

I really can't imagine how anyone could ever give a shit about this.

pl28 · 6時間前

Is it time to start taking urine samples for drug tests at tournaments now? Kappa

someuniquename · 5時間前

I'm drunk and going to my first tournament. Does that count?

AlmightyStreub · 6時間前

This is stupid, taking adderall or vyvanse doesn't make you better at smash. It might make you more focused or more on your game but it won't make you better at the game. In sports like baseball steroids actually make you stronger so you can hit the ball farther, pretty much giving you an unfair advantage. All I'm saying is, if Player A is better than Player B but B takes adderall; if player A is playing well and up to his regular par he should be able to beat player B like usual.

Multishine · 5時間前

This will never be enforced in the near future and it's impossible to tell who is on it. Many players already use it and there's no way to get around that all you can do is keep playing the game.

TransatlanticFoe_ · 3時間前

I have a prescription so I need to take it even before tournaments.

MUGENDonkeyKong · 4時間前

Dr. Mario OP confirmed

-Dissent · 6時間前

This is stupid. I'm diagnosed with adult ADHD and thus I take it so I can focus on the game and not all the conversations around me. People can do this normally, I can't.

Better ban taking anything for headaches, you should be playing in your natural state!

TheGoldenSSTicket · 6時間前

Honestly, people are blowing this way out of proportion. Has anyone actually been proven to take any of these drugs? Right now it is here-say and finger pointing, but no one has actually been found guilty of taking them.

nellumotra · 5時間前

Honestly smash players should be allowed to be on any drug they want when they play I think we should just be seeking out the highest level of competition possible

-Tank- · 4時間前

Adderall and top level professional gaming go hand in hand. Welcome to eSports, smash players. Glad to see you guys finally made it.

Luckyray93 · 5時間前

This has tons of discussions as far as school and drug use as well as far as their concerned only people who will get caught taking the drug (like in class or on campus) are the ones they end up catching, if you had a kid who took a test on adderall and aced it theyre not gonna take his grade away because they found out half way through the semester he started taking adderall

My view point is the same if your gonna be taking performance enhancers to play melee you go for it, it will make some things unfair in terms of peer to peer but at the end of the day your just gonna have to accept it, its hard to ban something people can put in their body :/

futurecaillou · 4時間前

I do play a bit better when I'm high (weed, not adderall) than when I'm sober, but even then, I don't feel like it's a difference worth testing over. On top of that, there are downsides as well, especially for adderall (coming down at a tournament, feeling overly wired, too many jitters). Overall, it's just a mess of complications -- if I smoke weed daily, but show up sober, would I not be allowed to play because it'd be in my system still? What if I have a prescription to adderall? There are obvious loopholes and ways you "could" get around these, but you're just adding more money, time, and unnecessary planning.

ReverendAK · 3時間前

but can I still smoke an obscene amount of weed though? it makes me better at tech chases

TeddehBear · 3時間前

I think if you have a prescription and need something like Adderall or Vyvanse to focus, then there shouldn't be a problem.

ninjetron · 3時間前

Smash and beer kind go hand and hand around here.

-Ran · 2時間前

A ban must be enforceable. We do not have the means nor the ability to do so. Drug tests are not cheap and it would create a need to produce a paperwork chain that we as a community cannot manage. We'd have to have waivers at every major tournament that would be testing, and we'd also have to a trained specialist there to obtain the samples. Then we'd have to hold onto the money for the results to come back in, and given that we'd have no long term contract with a company, we'd be a low priority. We'd also be dealing with individuals from different states and even countries.

Oh, and that's not counting that many individuals in the community enjoy substances that are currently illegal in some states. I highly doubt that they would have to have documented proof in the hands of a TO that they utilize any form of drugs. I could already see the blackmail happening.

Fratfrat · 1時間前

So many misconceptions about drugs in this thread. Do some research guys.

SociallyAwkwardRyan · 4時間前

If we're going to worry about what a Smasher consumes, let's first worry about alcohol use at our tournaments, which affects many more people and if a lot more prevalent

cobrevolution · 1時間前

this is one of the most idiotic things this section has talked about. and that's saying something.

you can achieve focus without adderall or vyvanse or ritalin. taking these drugs does not mean you will become a better player.

there's a difference between taking testosterone and whatnot to increase strength, endurance, power, etc and taking something to get your head straight.

no amount of adderall is suddenly going to let you do your next level meleetactics waveland triple shine moonwalk to shielddrop uairs to make a whole twitch chat bust a collective nut.

how much is your reaction time going to increase with the help of these meds? far and away above the reasonable human limit and average player? come on. being able to press a button a few ms faster is not comparable to generating more fucking knockout power in a blow or jumping half a foot higher to throw down a jam.

d4b3ss · 5時間前

We talk about adderall. What about caffeine, or weed, or alcohol, or tobacco? All of those things can potentially "improve" performance. I don't think we as a community have the resources to test for this stuff. And honestly, I wouldn't care if the guy sitting next to me to play me took adderall just like I wouldn't care if the guy sitting next to me to take a test did.

This is a good read about this topic: https://www.reddit.com/r/SSBM/comments/2zofqm/would_adderall_be_considered_a_performance/

hasunet · 6時間前

Is this for real lol

spoonymoonchair · 2時間前

Don't worry about it.

FelixTheLeo · 4時間前

With all due respect, I don't give a shit if someone uses drugs to get better at a game and neither should anyone else.

6時間前

[deleted]

namiau · 4時間前

IS THERE A REPLAY OF THE FIGHT!? I heard it was fire!!

Martian_Media · 4時間前

It's definitely a gray area. It's pretty hard to know if people that have a prescription even need to have said prescription. I was diagnosed a few years back after multiple tests and whatnot, and now I'm starting to get worried that having to take my medication will hurt my standing in my scene. I don't think we need to pursue it very far.

DapperSandwich · 4時間前

It'd be interesting to see just how much of a benefit adderall or similar drugs have on players in higher levels of play. In fact, I'd like to see it tested to see the difference.

ImDravenUCrazy · 2時間前

Remember sometimes drug use can go the other way as far as doing well. (point in case Mango and alcohol.)

DempRP · 2時間前

It's a silly idea to ban it. There's no authority to prove if someone used PED's and the only way to is if someone stupidly admits they do it without a prescription. And that's doubtful to happen if everyone knows PED's are banned.

Although I do agree people using non-prescribed drugs purely for a video game competition is indeed a problem.

Funkin_donuts · 1時間前

If anyone takes adderall all of their achievements are gonna mean less and it's just gonna look bad. As long as it doesn't become commonplace (It might but I don't think it will) that's gonna happen and I'll be happy.

ScotTheDuck · 1時間前

If it's prescription with a good label and a doctor's name and phone number, it should be allowed.

krispness · 1時間前

If it's prescribed it's fone, that means they have a deficiency and the drug can only level the playing field. Otherwise I find the use of it to be disrespectful, I'm hesitant to call it cheating only because we will never get to a point were we can police the issue with regular drug tests; however if there is evidence of use Id have no problem with banning the player for an event or two.

zeketheplumbanned · 1時間前

spoiler alert in OP......

Pazda · 1時間前

Drug use is fair in Competitive Smash because anyone can do it.

Dafurgen · 55分前

But I have mad ADHD, what will happen if we ban them?

Smearglangelo · 52分前

Encourage players to avoid using drugs. Players should play to the best of their natural ability.

Captvito · 28分前

As long as meth is allowed, cuss how else am supposed to tech practicc for 3 straight days without eating or sleeping. kappa.

poopstixPS2 · 27分前

Can we just let West have his win? Geez. Now everyone is attributing it Adderall? Maybe he's just becoming a better player.

FlameCannon · 5時間前

I clicked on this, without any knowledge of this problem, expecting it to be all a joke and just filled with dank memes.

What I found is actually several people legitimately discussing this and potential ways to solve it.

I'll be honest, you surprised me r/smashbros.

AyylmaoBurnaway · 3時間前

Am I the only one who thinks this is entirely retarded 100%?

6時間前

[deleted]

xUser52x · 2時間前

What a joke. There is not enough money in Smash to take this even a bit seriously. We can't test, Adderall is a legit drug, and performance enhancing in Smash is very different from any other sport. There'd need to be science experiments to test affects, followed by drug tests, ect, ect. Smash, and pretty much every esport, is not there yet.

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