評価の高い 200 件のコメント全て表示する 462

[–]HisHaskness 59 ポイント60 ポイント  (57子コメント)

"Britain's not perfect, and we will never eradicate all human prejudice," he went on.

"But, we have reached a stage where the differences between men and women in our society are less reflective of overt discrimination, and more their common challenge of trying to find the right way to earn a decent quality of life for their family, whilst sparing some time to enjoy it.

"That means taking a consistent approach to equality, ditching outdated gender warfare and finding practical solutions to the challenges couples go through together."

Fairly hard to argue with.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (47子コメント)

"That means taking a consistent approach to equality, ditching outdated gender warfare and and finding practical solutions to the challenges couples go through together."

This is really all that feminism strives to do. The "gender warfare" comment is meaningless, no idea why he felt the need to put that in.

[–]popadom4u 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (10子コメント)

This is really all that feminism strives to do

There are many who dont.

They desire different standards in anything women do not fare well in

[–]Liability42 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (9子コメント)

Tumblr isn't the real world

[–]popadom4u 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (8子コメント)

see police, fire, army - really anything physical in the public sphere.

Political parties and soon company boards of directors

[–]Ivashkinpanem et circenses 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (32子コメント)

The problem is that the feminists who want equality are generally the people who realize that we are pretty close to having true equality and are busy doing things with their time.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (31子コメント)

Yeah, which makes it pretty ridiculous to make statements like "Feminists are obnoxious bigots", don't you think?

[–]Ivashkinpanem et circenses 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (12子コメント)

Not really, because the ones who make the most noise are the minority who range from "holding odd views" to "batshit insane". Look at the NUS for example. There are over 1M women taking part in some form of higher education right now, yet the ones we hear about are the small number of idiots at the NUS Women’s Conference demanding jazz hands and passing motions demanding that gay men stop acting like "black women". The ones busy getting an education and building future careers in a huge range of fields that even a generation ago would have been largely closed to women? We don't hear about them because they are busy doing shit.

[–]leredditaccounts 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Brilliant said, Ivashkin.

[–]debaser11 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not so brilliantly said, leredditaccounts.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (9子コメント)

We don't hear about them because people care more about a "Jazz hands" headline than the actual work of women's groups. People only got interested in the Green Party women's group when they had the temerity to propose a prison policy that didn't cover men.

There is a huge audience for examples of public feminism that are mental, because love having their biases confirmed. Most people just think feminism is about hating men.

[–]Ivashkinpanem et circenses 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (8子コメント)

And if we put aside the "why" for a moment, it's easy to understand why someone who is genuinely for equality is against "feminism". They don't see it as being related to an equal society.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (7子コメント)

The "why" is pretty important though. If the most people read about feminism is from Reddit, their attitude to it is obviously going to be twisted.

Most people arguing against feminism in this thread are arguing against the type of radical feminists that want men castrated. How is that a productive use of anyones time?

[–]Ivashkinpanem et circenses 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (4子コメント)

It is for understanding which views are held, not for understanding why those views are held. And the point is still that radical feminists will get more media coverage than boring women doing boring things like starting an IT services company or washing out of Army Ranger school.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

So whats your point? That public discourse on feminism is meaningless?

[–]Liability42 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

It's like arguing that atheists are evil because Stalin.

[–]AwsumoPrince Harry for next governor of the American colonies -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (17子コメント)

'many Feminist activists are obnoxious bigots' would be a more accurate statement

[–]NotSoBlue_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (16子コメント)

Pretty Orwellian how terms like "activist" and "social justice" have become pejorative.

[–]AwsumoPrince Harry for next governor of the American colonies 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (14子コメント)

If you let crazy people into your group and ignore the fact they are crazy, then you'll get a bad reputation.

[–]Liability42 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Said the redditor

[–]NotSoBlue_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (12子コメント)

Only from people who want to discredit the group as a whole.

[–]AwsumoPrince Harry for next governor of the American colonies 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (2子コメント)

No, such groups discredit themselves to everyone outside the group - if when you look at a group the noisiest people are clearly insane, and others in the group seem accepting of such insanity, then the group has discredited itself.

[–]NotSoBlue_ -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I just don't know how you can seriously criticise a moderate group of people because of an entirely unrelated group you don't like.

It would be like criticising UKIP for something EDL did.

[–]Projectmayhem666UKIP Defence Force 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (8子コメント)

Wait, let me save these comments, they're going to come in handy for the "They don't represent the views of Ukip"

[–]05banks -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Social justice has always been a meaningless term - marxist in origin and criticised since its inception.

[–]HisHaskness 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You're right. Take that bit out and if you can argue with it (from either side) then you are part of the problem.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I really don't think any arguments are about that. They're all about the crazies on either side.

[–]JamDuncConservative minus the religious and anti-gay crap! 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (15子コメント)

I think you guys should read up on Swedish Politics where one of the newer parties FI (Feminist Initiativ I think) just started getting votes and has seats on my local city council.

One of their 'policies' was for re-education camps for men, to teach them how to respect women.

Crazy, yet they got a lot of the vote in my district.....

[–]oliethefolieProsecco Socialist 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (6子コメント)

That's nuts.

[–]JamDuncConservative minus the religious and anti-gay crap! 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Indeed it is, yet their stickers and posters are all around. My GF (and her family) actually thinks they're crazy and doesn't understand how anyone can vote for them!

Edit: So it seems calling FI nuts is not allowed here. Why is this?

[–]oliethefolieProsecco Socialist 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The people who vote for them might also be nuts.

[–]EwanWhoseArmyWe're all Doomed 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Depends do they have PR in Sweden ?

Could be people taking the piss

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sweden is messed up. They do have a scary number of people that legitimately believe in fascism being okay if it promotes feminism.

[–]xu85 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Identity politics. A group of people tell them they are being held back because of an inherent characteristic of their identity. Could be race. Could be sexuality. Here it's sex. Humans don't like to apportion blame to themselves for anything, given the opportunity many will externalise it onto some "other", in the case of feminists "the patriarchy". Everybody needs an in-group and and out-group, human nature. If you erode nationalism and religion like we have done in the west, other things supplant them, step forward identity politics. The potential for FI is huge .. 50% of the electorate for a start, and a deeply embedded system of equality in Sweden. Now adherents have been re-educated to see society into oppressor/oppressed, and armed with this new mode of thinking, they have many causes they can fight for, and they need never stop until absolute equality is achieved. Equal pay is a big one. Childcare rights. Domestic abuse rights. These are all the things feminism started out with. Now they've been largely achieved, it's moved onto smaller issues like "the right to have a safe space in public", "not being stare-raped by men", "no to page 3", "not being approached by men in bars". People will always have some 'cause' to fight for, and it'll never cease until their impossible utopian dream of 100% is realised.

[–]popadom4u 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just the beginning

[–]Projectmayhem666UKIP Defence Force 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Refusal to be re-educated will have you sent to the gulags, comrade.

[–]niftykettlesPro Commonwealth, Pro UKIP 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Some of the stuff I read coming out of Sweden is just scary

[–]MimesAreShiteSpineless Social Democrat 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

One of their 'policies' was for re-education camps for men, to teach them how to respect women.

Source? I can't find one, and couldn't find the policy on their website.

[–]JamDuncConservative minus the religious and anti-gay crap! 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can't find it on their website now but they got a lot of grief for it here in Sweden last year. My Swedish is still quite poor but I remember chatting about it with my teachers in my Swedish class and my GF's family and friends all mentioned it on numerous occasions.

I'll keep looking but I'm on my phone and in the middle of the Swedish forests this weekend so my internet is a little slow, all I've found so far is:

http://www.avoiceformen.com/featured/there-is-also-good-news-coming-from-sweden/

and it's in the first or second paragraph.

[–]dank_may_may 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Sweden YES

[–]JamDuncConservative minus the religious and anti-gay crap! 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

?

[–]DeadOptimistDuring Britain's "brain drain," not a single politician left. 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (8子コメント)

Raab argues for a more meritocratic, and truly equal society in regards to sex.

I find I am hearing this type of thing more and more - in certain contexts. And it's really not something you can disagree with, as in doing so you are directly saying "I don't want things to be equal", and who can get away with saying that!?

But it still doesn't sit well with me. I guess because if we changed topics, from social issues to economic issues, the idea of "equality" almost necessarily requires some form of redistribution (to ensure the poor do not die on the streets) which in practice is not actually equal treatment. I would say redistribution in economic terms is similar to positive discrimination in social terms. Yet one is accepted but another is not (relatively).

I am reminded of this image, and the phrase "From each according to his ability, and to each according to his needs", and cannot help but think the same holds true in social issues still. That we cannot just say "it's all equal now" and forget about discrimination.

Of course, I realise what Rabb might be suggesting doesn't necessarily go against this. I am all in favour of equal maternity and paternity leave, and a truly fair court process. But I think discrimination is far more insidious than some believe, and comments like this, which paint all feminists with one brush, seem closer to a whitewash of the issues than actual discourse.

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Whilst SME employers will always discriminate against women of child bearing age or those who have young children (as they need to in order to survive), the reality is that women are generally favoured in terms of employment with applications often being particularly welcomed from under-represented groups.

[–]PinballBob 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Indeed a lot of the the discrimination present is now due to economics.

[–]IncompetentFoxSuch is politics; it's a painful business. 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

This comment being top of this thread in this subreddit gives me hope.

[–]DeadOptimistDuring Britain's "brain drain," not a single politician left. 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly, I tried hard to be diplomatic in that comment, because I realise it is a difficult topic. Both sides do have valid points, but often one side will latch onto their point and their "rightness" will blind them to the other side. You get no where doing that, so I tried to touch on the actually issue I wanted to bring up (equality vs justice) as opposed to the issue where it originated (feminism).

With that said, the attacks I've seen on feminism have been worrying. Not because they do not have something valid within them. I totally understand frustration at being told "feminism" is "equality" while also being told not to use male centred words like policeman. But rather because they paint the current world as "gender blind" (at best, sometimes they go full male oppression) and I just don't think that's the case. Stuff like this just seems ignorant of many facets of a whole school of thought, while also demonising it. It just makes me uneasy.

[–]popadom4u 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That is a gross oversimplification and the solution always seems to be giving wealthy and already privileged people more of a boost.

The notion that wealthy Indian doctors in london need help and lower standards whilst impoverished men in dead seaside towns are discriminate against is not equality.

What we end up with the ed and nicks camerons sopns taking the top spots as always then then their daughters getting quotaed in whilst the truly hard pressed and struggling white working class lad is kicked int he teeth for being the same gender and skin colour as cameron.

but they are not the same, which is the fundamental flaw in this binary system

[–]emmytee 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Given this mans clear far right persuasions, I don't believe his desire for "true equality" is sincere at all. Its just a derailing tactic.

[–]muthabuffer 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

"clear far right persuasions" don't suppose I could trouble you for some evidence? He is a centre right politician, I've never seen any evidence of him having "far right persuasions".

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Because his definition of "true equality" differs from yours?

[–]HalkRadical Centre 4.8,-5.1 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Back to the usual media interviews then.

So Minister, since nobody is watching this interview unless you say something controversial can I ask you the same question in 15 different ways until you give me a phrase that can be taken out of context and used in a news bulletin?

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

These strikes are wrong at a time when negotiations are still going on.

[–]SinghaleseTerrier3 33 ポイント34 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Hahahaha brilliant. Keep it coming please. Its about time the silent majority had a voice and the guardian world view was shit on.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Maybe he's been watching Sargon of Akkad. ;)

[–]dublinclontarf 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

AHAHAahaha, I've just started watching those, I was reading about gamergate and that got linked to.

[–]hey-up 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (2子コメント)

What he actually said was: "Can you imagine the outrage if such trite generalisations were made about women, or other minorities? Feminists are now amongst the most obnoxious bigots."

Isn't there a rule here about editorialising headlines?

[–]geoffry31Not a Guardian columnist 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Appears headline was copied verbatim from the article, so poster hasn't edited it, although they could have made it clearer if they'd noticed it was so misleading.

[–]hey-up 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sorry. You're right. Was a bit annoyed I wasted time on what I assumed was a quote-out-of-context / knee jerks from people who haven't read the article post!

[–]DefluousBistup 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (134子コメント)

This broad brush, generalisation, approach to feminists is utter crap and is painfully regressive. As a male economist who has specialised in feminist economics (as part of development economics) I'm pretty sure I don't think I fit in to the Obnoxious Bigots category. As a community we can continue with the circle jerk, create a few more acronyms to demonise feminism, or we could take the issues raised seriously and objectively. We really need to get away from generalisations, it doesn't help anyone.

Pick any group of people and you will find morons, it's nothing new and it's not impressive or progressive to refute them. The best thing to do is find the best arguments a group has and focus on those - engage with the arguments intelligently - and understand them before you start to disagree. The worst thing to do is to focus on a few idiots who's arguments you can easily dismiss - all that gets you is self-verification which soon leads to arrogance.

The core message of feminism, from an economist point of view (not moral) is expressed very well by this anecdote from Bill Gates (couldn't find the original I've used before, have limited time but this will do):

"Bill Gates recalls once being invited to speak in Saudi Arabia and finding himself facing a segregated audience. Four-fifths of the listeners were men, on the left. The remaining one-fifth were women, all covered in black cloaks and veils, on the right. A partition separated the two groups. Toward the end, in the question-and-answer session, a member of the audience noted that Saudi Arabia aimed to be one of the Top 10 countries in the world in technology by 2010 and asked if that was realistic. 'Well, if you’re not fully utilizing half the talent in the country,' Gates said, 'you’re not going to get too close to the Top 10.' The small group on the right erupted in wild cheering."

[–]Munchausen-By-Proxy 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Pick any group of people and you will find morons, it's nothing new and it's not impressive or progressive to refute them.

It's also not impressive or progressive to refuse to engage with criticism and instead write it off as "a few idiots", when it clearly is not.

NOW (who oppose shared parenting) are the single biggest feminist organization in the US. Some of the biggest names in academic feminism, like Michael Kimmel and Michael Flood, have histories that include saying "men are NOT the victims of what is meant by abuse", and infiltrating a fathers' rights group in order to send abusive emails from their accounts.

I'm told that if I think feminism sucks I just don't understand feminism and should take a women's studies course. But why give you 10k when I can just look at the behaviour of your students? From the UK to Canada it's feminist students fighting even the most benign of men's groups, in the most spiteful ways possible.

Not surprising when they're being taught by the same academics who collectively shun anyone who brings up male victims:

Suzanne received the brunt of the attacks - individuals wrote and called her university urging that she be denied tenure; calls were made and letters were written to government agencies urging that her grant funding be rescinded. All three of us became "non persons" among domestic violence advocates. Invitations to conferences dwindled and dried up. Advocacy literature and feminist writing would cite our research, but not attribute it to us. Librarians publicly stated they would not order or shelve our books.

Or female abusers:

When Michele Elliott – co-founder of the organisation Kidscape – published her book The Female Sexual Abuse Of Children: The Last Taboo in 1992, she was deluged by hate mail from feminists who saw it as an attempt to detract from the real problem: the abuse of power by men. If it was difficult for her to get the issue taken seriously, how much more of a challenge has it been for the victims?

But I'm sure it's just one or two bad eggs, right?

[–]The_Silver_Avenger 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Does no-one remember how big communism was in British universities in the past? Anyone? What do you think 'Citizen Smith' was based on? Students have always said really illogical things.

[–]Munchausen-By-Proxy 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is the feminist equivalent of "its just bantz mate". Yes students say stupid things, but we usually try to snap them out of it before they graduate. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think any professors at LSE were joining in those rugby songs.

[–]LAAT501legion 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Could you explain what feminist economics is and why should it have a different category from regular economics? I'm genuinely curious.

[–]DefluousBistup 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Simply it's applying economic methodology to gender issues. For example, I'm looking at the role of bargain power within household and its role in healthcare decision making. Economics is best thought of as a toolbox, again using my research as an example I use a lot of the bargaining 'tools' we have, Nash bargaining etc. The approach that I use moves away from the neoclassical way of treating households as a single production unit - which clearly has limited use and doesn't do well to explain the empirical facts we see.. Also making use of all the econometric tools we have for empirical analysis. Amartya Sen is a good one to check out if you're interested - 100 million missing women is a great start. Typed this out super fast, got a class to teach!

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Does feminist economics explain why women supposedly earn 75% or so of what men do but spend at rates of 300% of what men do?

[–]mcdowellag 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (96子コメント)

Here's a "utilization of talent" question for you. Look up "Shirtstorm". We saw a scientist cry because he could see his career die in flames just after what should have been a glorious triumph because he wore a shirt that crossed a feminist red line he didn't know was there. How many skilled people are we losing from PC-aware areas because, although they have the technical skills to do their job, the don't have the political skills to keep it?

[–]MimesAreShiteSpineless Social Democrat 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

The Shirtstorm thing was barely even a thing. It was a handful of articles and some people on Twitter. It's only been so long-lasting because people kept banging on about how unjust it was.

[–]gatorademebitches 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

evil twitter feminist here. I missed the initial outrage and only saw the backlash against the apparent outrage! also that guy said he was crying because he realised he did something wrong (in his opinion afterwards) not because of doxxing or anything anyway

[–]jthommoPragmatic Rawlsian -8.13 -4.62 -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (93子コメント)

Mate come on. There's no way he's going to lose his job because a bunch of people overreacted to something which he probably understands wasn't a wise thing or particularly progressive thing to do

[–]XordamondHigh Tory going back home to reunite the conservative family 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (92子コメント)

progressive

You know how South Park changed the word 'fag' to mean obnoxious arsehole Harley Davidson riders?

Something similar needs to be done with 'progressive'.

[–]blue_dicebut i'm here to tell you, everything gets worse forever 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You know how South Park changed the word 'fag' to mean obnoxious arsehole Harley Davidson riders?

It didn't though. No one uses it that way (apart from perhaps the odd edgy teen)

[–]nanonan 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (10子コメント)

I don't think anyone would dispute that Saudi Arabia has issues that feminism could help address. What are the best arguments economic feminism has regarding the western world where equality has been legislated?

[–]DefluousBistup 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (5子コメント)

A good example is the reason why we now pay child support to mothers not fathers.

[–]DefluousBistup -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

To think these problems are only of developing and emerging economies is pure ignorance. Go talk to your mum or your sister, see if their experience can enlighten you.

[–]dublinclontarf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've got a mum and TWO sisters, I've also got a wife and daughter, and I have to say they talk to me ALL the time about the daily oppression they are experiencing in... na nana I can't even complete this sentence in jest.

Modern feminism (as opposed to the classic kind which was looking for equality) is Social Marxism, racism and sexism dressed up as being "progressive".

[–]tim_ballk 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

How does "economic feminism" tie into this?

[–]thebluemonkeyI'm "English" what ever that means 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

This broad brush, generalisation, approach to "any topic" is utter crap and is painfully regressive.

Couldn't agree more.

I get it, people like to put groups into nice little boxes to make them easy to understand but just focusing on the loudest part and then thinking they're all that way is often wrong.

It's almost like complex things are more complex.

[–]Mike737 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (4子コメント)

who has specialised in feminist economics

???

What University granted that course a degree qualification?

[–]DefluousBistup -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

It was a specialism nested inside of a specialism in development economics as part of my MSc Economics course at Amsterdam VU and UVA. If you must know.

[–]tekeeler 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

If you must know.

Its a perfectly valid question.

Out of curiosity what does 'feminist economics' actually involve, how does it relate to Economics as a field?

[–]DefluousBistup [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Not the way it was asked it wasn't. I've already answered this question, have a look else where on the thread.

[–]Aspley_Heath 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (8子コメント)

The problem is, it isn't a few morons. /u/Munchausen-By-Proxy points out a few examples of this. I'll add another one, "Women against Rape" have basically campaigned for an end to prosecuting women who make false rape claims. They've even been allowed to speak in the house of commons.

I'll grant you feminism is necessary in most of the world but now that discrimination in the law has been abolished in the Anglosphere, women are permitted to do everything men are but now that these easy pickings have been achieved these western feminists are tipping the scales in their favour.

[–]DefluousBistup 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Pick something you beleive in, are there idiots and morons in that group of people who identify with that belief? It's always going to be case. Immigration for example, you may believe quite rationally that there's a case for quotas but you wouldnt want to be identified as one as the same as a biggot or a racists. In addition, if you think a law prevents sexism or unequal bargaining power between husbands and wives, or between boys and girls, you are mistaken. There is a place for feminism in developed countries. It's better to take it seriously and work together on the common ground, it's an awful idea to dismiss it because you've heard some lousy arguments.

[–]Aspley_Heath 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Pick something you beleive in, are there idiots and morons in that group of people who identify with that belief?

Of course but those guys in those movements are ignored or removed. Take for example those Kippers who've said racist stuff? Booted out of the party.

The western feminist movement indulges and nourishes these "idiots and morons" as you call them. I gave you the WAR example which want to allow women to lawfully make false rape accusations, that group with that viewpoint got a freaking voice in parliament for an afternoon.

In addition look over the pond, examine the Duluth model it is a system designed to combat domestic violence. It is feminist in origin and is now policy in most US states, it doesn't even acknowledge male victims of domestic violence. It believes: "[The Duluth Model] is based in feminist theory positing that "domestic violence is the result of patriarchal ideology in which men are encouraged and expected to control their partners""; do you think that type of thinking will help male victims? Or lesbian victims? Or gay victims? So here we have the "idiots and morons" directly influencing government policy, not belittled or ignored but taken very seriously.

[–]G_Morgan 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The problem is the fringe groups are too easily accepted. When you don't distance yourself from lunatics you'll end up being associated with them.

Particularly as a lot of feminists have been playing a silly game by using the nutters to shift the Overton window so they can occupy the middle ground. That kind of strategy can only work when you are confident you can't just be ignored completely. Right now feminism is storing long terms problems for itself by alienating an entire generation that strangely agrees with their broad aims but disagrees with them personally. All it takes is for that generation to come into majority with nothing else changing and you'll end up politically stonewalled for decades.

//edit - At the same time to an extent I believe women are less the priority than they were. The biggest rights issues facing society have been gay rights but there has obviously been huge break throughs there. I think control of your own life and ending it is the next big fight. Racism is obviously still a big issue.

Most of the remaining gender issues are mutual ones where there are privileges and counter privileges and need more thought than simply poking around the edges.

[–]dublinclontarf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

We don't have sex segregation in this country, women are equal so it doesn't apply.

[–]oliethefolieProsecco Socialist 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (3子コメント)

It's such a massive simplification of the issues surrounding feminism.

[–]Projectmayhem666UKIP Defence Force 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Doesn't address any of those issues or simplifies anything. He just points out what feminists are.

[–]dublinclontarf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

No it's not, modern feminism as a policy discriminate against white men and have a "social hierarchy" which everyone fits into and the power you have is based entirely on your race, sex and sexual identification.

It's the very definition of racist and sexist, but they re-define it to say that it's OK.

Try to argue with them and they'll shut you down by either mobbing you or going after your employment.

[–]RobCoxxy 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Our disability minister wants to scrap disability benefits and our Equality Minister voted against gay marriage. They're quite literally the wrong person for each position.

[–]Benjji22212Burkean -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I didn't know the minister of a department was required to hold a certain opinion towards it.

[–]tekeeler 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Generally you shouldn't have people's ideology conflicting with their job. Lockheed Martin wouldn't want to put a pacifist in charge.

[–]RobCoxxy 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Usually implies how much they care about helping the people their department affects. I mean the equality minister literally thinks homosexuals don't deserve equality. Defeats the point.

[–]teenyweenytempah-a bit, -a bit more 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Might not be the way to tackle this one.

However I'm not a fan of that whole Emma Watson feminism speech. Whenever anyone tells me I'm a feminist, I reply "yes but I'm more than that, I'm pro gender equality regardless of gender"

[–]dank_may_may 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (73子コメント)

Had they promised all this based shit before the election I'd have voted for them rather than UKIP.

Perhaps they've finally realised the general public are a lot more right wing than the Guardian reading vocal minority would have them believe?

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (67子コメント)

I have to say I'm more left wing and think the SJW, Feminist brigade are bad for everyone of any political persuasion. None of them are the least bit interested in working class people and simply seem to have co-opted 'Marxism' because it's militant and unpopular (for good reason), giving them another dimension of being 'victims'.

[–]sw_faultyCornwall 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (40子コメント)

They haven't co-opted Marxism. Moronic right-wingers call them Marxists because they haven't a clue.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (17子コメント)

I've heard plenty of SJW's calling themselves 'marxist' that girl from Goldsmiths Bahar Mustafa mentioned it in her recent speech. You see it a fair amount, if you follow follow a lot of SJW stuff.

Though I would admit TIA does have a more vocal 'right' community, I'm unusual in being a lefty and proud of it on that sub.

[–]altruisticnarcissist 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Bahar Mustafa is 27 and hasn't left university. Lives with her parents in a half million pound house in north London. Considers herself a proletariat. smh

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yep, I saw the Sargon vid on that earlier.

[–]dublinclontarf 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

He does seem to be building up quite a following.

[–]TophattingsonAnti-Populist 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Feminism has multiple branches. Marxist Feminism is one of them. The kind of feminism most people here would agree with is called "Liberal Feminism". It seems to be the most widespread belief set but many of it's potential supporters avoid the label entirely because of the term being poisoned by radicals.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Yeah, but I think 'Marxist' Feminism is a label these groups give themselves, and no on can control that really. I agree with the broad goals of egalitarianism, and think moderate feminists still have a part to play in ensuring all are equal. But groups like SCUM (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCUM_Manifesto), or the #killallmen twitter crowd have no place in any political discourse or group in 21st century Britain.

Of course, it's a shame that the word 'feminism' has become so toxic to other women. I try and use terms like 'radfem' or 'feminazi', to separate the SJW hate groups from the reasonable feminist groups when I discuss them elsewhere.

[–]Ed__Lib-Dem 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Liberal feminism more or less is egalitarian, their just working a particularly large part of the problem. They wouldn't favour authoritarian solutions.

It's verry much a case of the moderate majority being quieter than the loonies.

You do get some messier issues where nuance gets lost in the shit storm. Like the bechdal test, meant as a light heated observation on how poorly media represent women it's been turned into rigid dogma.

Basically it's saying typicaly a film should have at least two women in it who talk to each other about something that isn't men or babies.

Clearly this is only a rough thing piranha 3DD passes this test and alien fails it, but it's quite shocking how the vast majority of films fail this, even stuff that has no reason too.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Interesting stuff, thanks.

[–]haloraptor 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I've always found the Bechdel test extremely interesting. I remember reading an analysis by one woman writer of a show created and written by a team of women in which not a single episode passed the test. Even, like, the bits which reasonably could have. Can't remember who wrote it but I remember her picking out a bit where, basically, two of the characters were talking about the direction of their careers, studies etc. after they graduate. For all of like a second one of them mentioned off-hand wanting to do a PhD, then rapidly changed the topic to one on marriage and marrying well because of said PhD.

Like, a team of women wrote this, and not a single episode contained any instance of two women talking about something that isn't men or babies or marrying men to make babies. I can't even remember what show she was criticising! This is going to bother me now...

[–]Ed__Lib-Dem 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

IKR it's really quite alarming once you start to think about it, like we have used the strong arm of law to stop the blatant sexism(which is good work) but we clearly haven't gotten to the root of it yet.

[–]MimesAreShiteSpineless Social Democrat 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I try and use terms like 'radfem'

Thing is Radical Feminism is a genuine and well-established strand of feminism. People do seem to use it to mean bad/crazy/evil feminism a lot, though.

Personally I just go with 'dickheads'.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Um yes, yes it is. And just because something is established doesn't mean it should be respected or it's right. Radical Feminism started this whole 'patriarchy' bull shit, and all of Andrea Dworkins crap.

[–]TophattingsonAnti-Populist 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (5子コメント)

There is a certain element of Marxism that exerts influence upon their ideas. Basically, the idea that humanity is split into Oppressed classes and Oppressing classes. They aren't Marxist though, just slightly inspired.

[–]MimesAreShiteSpineless Social Democrat 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think modern mainstream feminism is more inspired by Radical Feminism (a movement which holds that Patriarchy is the primary form of oppression, and the cause of all others) than Marxist Feminism (which holds that economic and class oppression is the primary form of oppression, and the cause of all others). It seems likely that Radical Feminism was inspired somewhat by Marxian theory, though.

[–]Arathian 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

As someone else said, the vast majority of true SJWs either self-identify as Marxist or far-leftist of some form (anarchist, for example).

Just because they happen to be hypocritical upper-middle class idiots most of the time doesn't mean we characterize them wrong.

[–]sw_faultyCornwall 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

the vast majority of true SJWs either self-identify as Marxist or far-leftist of some form (anarchist, for example).

I see you qualified that statement with "true" so that even in the unlikely event someone performed a poll of "SJWs" you could discount it.

[–]Munchausen-By-Proxy 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (13子コメント)

There was something of an edit war on Wikipedia recently, where a group of editors decided that the Cultural Marxism page should be deleted, because it was a right-wing conspiracy theory.

The AfD nomination was put in by a user called RGloucester. Would you like to see one of his prior posts?

It's a strange sort of person who calls their own existence a conspiracy theory.

[–]RichieSMLondon - Liberal member of UKIP. (-2.25, -2.62) 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Had they promised all this based shit before the election I'd have voted for them rather than UKIP.

I'm pretty sure they nicked most of their ideas off UKIP TBH. If it wasn't for UKIP there would be no EU referendum and the Conservative guy on Question Time tonight even said that.

[–]Snake-Eye-Mitch -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Maybe they didn't promise this before the election was because the media would have tore them apart and they could've lost votes now they're in power they don't give a shit.

[–]dank_may_may -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Not just this though, keeping those terrorist girls out, outlawing the "human rights" act that kept foreign paedophiles, rapists and murderers in the country, appointing an anti-gay as minister for equalities, I've never had a government that wasn't shit before, I'm drinking lefty tears here.

[–]MindfulSpectre -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Is it so painful to you that gay people can be happy?

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (17子コメント)

I'm part of the anti-SJW / TIA crowd here. I totally agree that 'a lot' (not all) new wave social media feminists and tumbrinas are full of hate. Blaming men and white people for all of entire Worlds woes.

I think I finally met a Tory politician I like.

[–]JohnKimble111[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think I finally met a Tory politician I like.

Same here, though the problem is that he's very much a Tory rebel rather than the norm. I expect he'd be popular with the grass roots of the party, the problem is that those in charge are mostly nothing like him really.

The fact that they've got one really good MP doesn't really make the rest of them any less shitty and out of touch with reality (though it does help a little that he's got a position of at least some importance).

It's also noteworthy that Raab has barely mentioned gender issues in the 4 years that have passed since he made these comments. I guess the various attacks from Labour, the BBC and the left are quite effective at silencing people from speaking uncomfortable truths.

[–]Shiliband 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I think I finally met a Tory politician I like.

What about Daniel Hannan and Jacob Rees-Mogg?

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Nah, too Eurosceptic for me.

[–]Shiliband 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Fair enough, but you don't necessarily have to agree with someone to find them likeable, for example, I don't agree with Nicola Sturgeon or Dan Jarvis, but I still find them likeable.

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, but I guess neither bother me on any level and I do quite like Nicola Sturgeon. But if someone is a politician then I have to judge them on that too. A good deal of say George Osbournes policies I don't like, whilst I do like Dominic Raab.

[–]Kadavergehorsam 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (11子コメント)

I find the term sja odd. I am a champion for social justice. That sounds like a good thing surely. Anti-sjw sounds like someone is proud to be bigoted and hold down members of society who are treated unjustly.

[–]lazytoxer 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think it's meant to mock the way they see themselves. They aren't warriors, nor do they understand what justice looks like in a free society. They search for and incessantly clamour about negligible or nonsensical injustices to validate their own prejudices. They don't say anything worth saying.

It isn't supposed to equate them with real social justice.

[–]Kadavergehorsam 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's a shame. Social justice warrior is a great tagline

[–]terrymcginnisbeyond 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

You'd think it was a good thing. And generally Social Justice and ensuring that people are held up to the same standard regardless of gender or colour and we all have an opportunity to 'get on' in work and opportunity are good things.

But let's look at using the term 'Justice' within the term SJW, generally speaking this is about justice meted out by society through institutions such as the courts, but SJW's often try and dole out trial by media, and mob. Look at famous SJW Adria Richards and Donglegate. Two men made an innocent, though juvenile joke directed at each other at a conference, not directed at Adria Richards, who set out to destroy them based on their colour and gender.

What about the #tag crowd #KILLALLMEN, whilst most SJW's and Radfems say this is simply ending the 'patriarchy' (a word you can use interchangeably with Satan), It's still offensive to people and targets and divides people based on their gender, an affront to an egalitarian society, and something I would never even consider saying about any woman. And since the anti-gamergate crowd think you can become a rapist simply by playing GTA, then surely by that logic you can end up murdering people based on gender by using twitter.

Bahar Mustafa diversity officer for Goldsmiths University recently barred all white people or men from an event and actually mocked men and white people in the end, I don't think that helps anyone who is held down or raises anyone up.

I assure you, I may be anti-SJW, but I'm not about pushing a single person down, or holding another group back in favour of another group. I'm about raising everyone up to a better standard, so that BME have the same opportunity as white people, and women have the same opportunity as men. In Britain those goals have been very broadly met, the wage gap is myth (based on averages including hugely paid outliers), We have Muslim Peers, Gay politicians, millionaire women, yes there is work to be done on every group to ensure everyone succeeds still, but not at the levels SJW's think there is.

SJW's and radfems seem to want to switch places with men (well the Strawmen they've created), so they have all the 'privilege', and we know how well that works out don't we?

If you just keep an eye out and follow the anti-SJW stuff you'll see how much we're against bigotry and injustice, and how many SJW's have a 'white-mans-burden' / 'saviour' complex, and base their arguments on hate and authority. There are literally tonnes and tonnes of examples out there of hate by numerous SJW's and professional, patreon victims.

[–]Kadavergehorsam 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Thanks for taking the time to write that response out.

[–]dublinclontarf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (3子コメント)

SJW promote racism and sexism, no white men. Who are the bigots?

[–]Kadavergehorsam 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Genuine question but how does a sjw promote racism and sexism?

[–]05banks 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Social Justice promotes levelling the playing field by applying discriminatory practices such as enforced gender quotas in order to amplify voices of the "oppressed" and reverse "unequal power dynamics".

In practice, this results in positive discrimination, amongst other things, which is a sexist and racist practice.

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I am against 'social' justice in all its forms and for justice in all its forms. I'll leave you to make of that what you will.

[–]NotSoBlue_ -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What does that actually mean? Can you give examples of what you're actually against?

[–]archersongsPragmatic liberalism 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (32子コメント)

The carichatures of 'SJW' and tumblrisms are so far removed from the reality of what feminism is and what it seeks to address that it shows your ignorance to even bring it up. People ITT seem to spend so much time on reddit that they think they live in America. Straw man after straw man to reinforce the hivemind that "Dae le modern feminsim is about hating men?" "Dae tumblrinas are le attack helicopters?" "Dae le hambeast opression olympics hate white men?" I thought better of this sub...

[–]leredditaccounts 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (31子コメント)

Look in the real world. It's here in Britain. See the Protein World Advert controversy, for one example.

[–]archersongsPragmatic liberalism 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (30子コメント)

What about it specifically? Obviously I don't condone acts of vandalism (and i doubt the majority of feminists would) but I think portrayal of women in media and advertising is a wholly sensible thing to be considering.

[–]gregtylerAwry maths major 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

It feels like a lot of people in thread seem to have gained their only definition of "feminist" from places like reddit.

[–]XordamondHigh Tory going back home to reunite the conservative family 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Or politics. Or universities. Or the media. Or women they know. When notable female politicians are railing against Islam instead of the Sun I might change my mind.

[–]Meta-CognitionCaledonian Liberal 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

He isn't wrong. I mean, come on:

we have reached a stage where the differences between men and women in our society are less reflective of overt discrimination, and more their common challenge of trying to find the right way to earn a decent quality of life for their family, whilst sparing some time to enjoy it.

This is pretty much spot-on.

[–]ayy_machine 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (3子コメント)

He's not wrong

[–]jmabbzVote for the candidate you respect 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (2子コメント)

He should have been less absolute. 'many' or 'some' are acceptable prefixes for that sentence.

[–]tim_ballk 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm with you on that one.

[–]chrisawhitmore 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What he said was 'Feminists are now amongst the most obnoxious bigots.’

[–]EwanWhoseArmyWe're all Doomed 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Some feminists are pretty obnoxious bigots...

[–]archersongsPragmatic liberalism 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So are some; conservatives, liberals, social democrats, socialists, marxists, kippers, greens and labourites. Why tar a whole movement with the same brush?

[–]lawnswood 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Probably not a good generalisation for a Justice Minister to make.

[–]ProfessorZ00MI do not have the right not to do so 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (11子コメント)

I'm liking this new government more and more each day.

[–]HarryBlessKnappRight-Wing Liberal 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (10子コメント)

What's the ukip stance on feminism?

[–]JohnKimble111[S] -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (6子コメント)

They support shared parenting, which is something strongly opposed by most feminist groups.

Their only other good policy with any sort of gender link is to fund STEM university students, which will benefit more males than females (though perhaps not for long if the education system continues on its current feminised path).

[–]HarryBlessKnappRight-Wing Liberal 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

shared parenting... is something strongly opposed by most feminist groups.

This surprises me

[–]DevilishRogueLibertarian capitalist 8.12, -0.46 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Really? Most feminist campaign groups have been pretty open about their stance on the issue. Look at how they responded to Fathers4justice arguments that shared parenting should be the default legal presumption.

[–]HarryBlessKnappRight-Wing Liberal 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

if he's a half-decent, committed dad, it's a rare and stupid woman who'll let go of him, not only for the child's sake, but her own - think of all the free babysitting.

Doesn't sound especially against shared parenting

[–]tim_ballk 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's feminism, remember, not egalitarianism...

[–]JohnKimble111[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Some openly oppose it, others just try to sabotage the legislation and come up with random esxcuses why it shouldn't happen. The best known case is opposition to hared parenting by the National Organization of Women in the US (one of the biggest feminist organisations in the world):

https://nationalparentsorganization.org/blog/20980-as-it-was-and-ever-shall-be-now-opposes-equal-rights-for-fathers

http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/opposing-shared-parenting-the-feminist-track-record/

The good news is that exposes of the track record of such groups has led to them purging the proof of their opposition to equal parenting rights from their websites, so they do at least seem to be becoming ashamed of that fact they openly opposed shared parenting

[–]HarryBlessKnappRight-Wing Liberal 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So they don't oppose it any more?

[–]NotSoBlue_ 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (34子コメント)

Fucking hell, so much hate in this thread.

[–]whencanistopslightly green, but not very 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Middle of the night keyboard warriors broad brushing an entire group and spewing hatred? We've not seen that before.

[–]NotSoBlue_ -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

/u/JohnKimble111 always brings a bunch of middle of the night upvoters/commenters with him.

[–]meoxu8 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well he isn't wrong, in fact I would argue it is true for much of the Left. Just take a look at some of the bigoted 'feminist' hate groups on this site

[–]I_like_uk_a_little 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hear hear. About time we stood up against this hideous outdated ideology. It has just turned into a forum of sheer hatred.

It's not so much about rape culture as rape accusation culture.

[–]GreatBritishSenseTraditional Britain Group 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (25子コメント)

I gave up debating feminists ages ago. Debating them just gives credibility to their batshit insane views. Now I just troll them to make my valid points instead.

Some mangina was trying to get me to sign some stupid petition to "end violence against women" in the name of "equality". I had to explain to him that men are victims of violence far more often than women are, and that if women want equality we should be beating them more to make up for the inequality.

The look on his face was priceless.

The point I was making was valid though. Violence against women is not a problem when compared to violence against men and the drive to decrease violence against women without also decreasing the violence against men is deeply sexist. Violence by people against other people, irrespective of gender, is a problem. Feminists don't care when men are the victims of crime because they don't see men as people they can empathise with. We are like dogs to them.

The same can be said for the pay gap which doesn't actually exist. Or rape culture, which doesn't exist. A person does not have to verbally consent to sex for her to consent, most of the time sex happens because of micro-communications, that isn't rape. There's a big difference between a girl who is enjoying sex and a girl who is visibly distressed, so unless you are shit faced drunk or autistic then raping someone is fairly difficult to do by accident. Feminist drives to bring in "affirmative consent" laws is essentially persecution of men, but also harmful to women. It makes a legal and harmless act illegal for no good reason. Feminists are extremists and need to be ridiculed for holding such views.

[–]MimesAreShiteSpineless Social Democrat 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not surprised you don't like feminism, given that you want to do away with universal suffrage.

[–]NotSoBlue_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (23子コメント)

It makes a legal and harmless act illegal for no good reason.

What act is that?

[–]LtSlowOn the far centre 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

But that's what many, many people think, because the most vocal feminists ARE obnoxious bigots.

Most sensible women I know hate to call themselves a feminist nowadays because the tumblr crowd somehow made it mainstream and have done to feminism what Stalin did to communism.

[–]PuddleOfCrud 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Can we stop pretending it's only "tumblrinas" giving feminism a bad name?

In regards to Stalin, the backlash against the communists in Britain might not have been so bad if there weren't large numbers of them blithely defending him and his policies - there are parallels to be drawn here.

The "not all feminists..." problem is of the third wave's own making by desperately trying to co-opt anyone and everyone into feminism, including the hate-filled misandrists like Marcotte and Valenti that are currently giving feminism a bad name.

If the feminists can't maintain order within their own movement then how can they be trusted to "fix society" as they often claim they will?

[–]Liability42 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

For fuck's sake lads, Tumblrland isn't real life. Go outside and talk to girls.

[–]regenjimTry to be centre, but helplessly Left 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I mean there are degrees of feminism. I'm male, and a feminist. Mostly a feminist because of the recent surge of groping in clubs and cat calling on the street, grown from that daft LAD culture. I don't know how much institutional feminism there is because I never know what sources to rely on when people talk about it. This person probably has just read some fuckd shit on some authoritarian extreme feminist sites and assumed that every feminist is like that.

[–]Lethal_Papercut 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

So you decided to become a feminist because girls get groped and whistled at but not because there is actual discrimination against women in the world?..Since becoming a feminist have you taken the time to learn about feminist issues around the world or is groping and whistling still enough for you?

[–]regenjimTry to be centre, but helplessly Left 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You are why people generally dislike feminism. I'm a feminist full stop. Get a grip.