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Caution vs. Victim blaming (Tw: rape) (self.SRSDiscussion)

_flaminghomer_ が 投稿

There's a thread in srs at the moment making fun of this comment: "Everyone needs to "be careful." Every. Single. Person. Men need to "be careful" because they are the most likely to be physically assaulted or murdered. Women need to "be careful" because they are more vulnerable to being sexually assaulted and overpowered.Not a single human on this planet is absolved of the responsibility to make smart, safe choices for their own well-being. A mugger shouldn't mug, but you also shouldn't wear your diamond-crusted handbag through the most economically depressed parts of town without care. A rapist shouldn't rape, but you also shouldn't just let anyone bring you drinks. A burglar shouldn't burgle, but you also need to lock your doors at night.There will always be victims, but you can lessen the likelihood of being one by "being careful." What do you think is the responsibility of people in advising others to be careful? Is all advice twords caution victim blaming? Is there room for "be careful" in anti-rape advocacy (assuming the speaker acknowledges the responsibility for the crime is with the rapist and never the victim)? Thanks for your oppinions :)

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[–]meowmixxed 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (4子コメント)

TW for some fucked up real life rape scenarios below:

All advice towards caution is not victim-blaming. But there needs to be a way to frame risk-reduction in a way that does not perpetuate rape myths.

For example, dressing modestly does not reduce a woman's risk for sexual assault. So, flaunting your tits at a club is not risky behavior, like leaving a wallet on your carseat in 'bad neighborhood' is.

What is helpful? Letting people know who they can call for help. Having emergency phones/blue lights on campuses. Teaching self-defense and buying mace is not victim blaming. It's preparedness and it's the reality of life.

What really frustrated me when I worked as a victim advocate at Florida State was the emails from police following a sexual assault notification. There was always a list of crime-prevention tips and they were ALWAYS tailored to avoid what the victim did. If she was raped at a party, it would say to stay sober and never separate from your friend group. If she was raped because she got in a cab that wasn't a cab and the driver took her to a secluded area and raped her (true story) then it would say "only use trusted transportation sources." If I were that person who was assaulted and then I read that, I would sure as fuck feel victim-blamed.

[–]6ThreeSided9 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

For example, dressing modestly does not reduce a woman's risk for sexual assault. So, flaunting your tits at a club is not risky behavior, like leaving a wallet on your carseat in 'bad neighborhood' is.

This is new to me, what is the source for this claim?

[–]meowmixxed [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Rape is about power and control, not sex.

[–]6ThreeSided9 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Power is about getting what you want, regardless of what others try to do to stop you. If you want something more, then you're more likely to abuse your power to get it. Your argument is a valid one, but not a source to the above claim.

[–]meowmixxed [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I'm not totally sure if, in my example, seeing cleavage makes you want something more. However, I do understand where you're coming from so I'm making a larger effort to support this claim (PS this is all very heterocentric to meet the scenario I laid out). I'm also talking a lot about risk factors which, as I said above, can be helpful but can also get into the victim-blaming category. Many of these risk factors cannot be controlled and those at risk of victimization should not feel responsible for alleviating all risk of assault. It's not possible and ending sexual assault should be the main responsibility of possible offenders, not victims. /soapbox. So TW for possible victim-blaming and general descriptions of coercive tactics.

I mean, if we look at childhood sexual abuse and prison/military sexual abuse, clothing has little to no bearing on abuse (children are not showing off cleavage/body parts at home very often, prisoners/military women are dressed nearly identically), especially for repeat assaults. We also (almost) never see this discussed when we think about male sexual assault (whether committed by women or other genders).

In relationship abuse, a victim may be continuously sexually assaulted, so outfits would be rotating.

But let's go back to the club scenario - let's say we have a woman with a low cut top and a woman with a crew neck top on. Both have the same pants, body style, social standing/group, race, etc. The essential difference is cleavage vs. no/minimal cleavage in this example.

There is data that supports that "hypersexual" men are more likely to have 'coercive sex'.

Regardless of criminal status or age (juvenile or adult), males who sexually coerced age-appropriate females reported higher levels of sexual drive, frequency of sexual behavior, and sexual deviance on the MIDSA (2008) than noncoercive males. Hypersexuality covaries with a number of negative attributes, including components of negative affect like mood and anxiety disorders and increased substance abuse and impulse-related problems (e.g., LÂngstrˆm & Hansen, 2006). source

However, I don't know that we can accurately say that SEEING cleavage or any other sexualized body part would increase the sexual drive of an already hypersexualized man. It sounds as though from this and the MIDSA scale that was used, these men are preoccupied with sex whether in the presence of desired sexual partners/victims or not. However, it would be foolish to say that seeing boobs isn't going to make someone who is already thinking about sex think about it more. Yet again, would this man target someone JUST for having a low cut top, or look for other risk factors of sexual assault?

Extra TW: Disgusting explanations for/of rape

I did find a study on convicted rapists in Kenya. I don't have access to the article but found a blog post that summarized some of the findings. This may have a biased summarization, but here we go: This is what one of the convicted rapists said:

” She was attractive, sexy, beautiful, and seductive. On that day,she was in a miniskirt and the clothing was tight on the body. Her lipsticks were red ‘hot,’ and she was proud. I was stronger and more robust than her, so I overpowered her. I was drunk and did not know I was wronging her.” (emphasis mine)

In this instance, he had already found the woman to be attractive, sexy, beautiful, and seductive, and reflected the outfit she wore on that day, which could be construed as 'intentionally sexual' like our low-cut club woman. However, I think the "I was stronger than her and more robust" is the part that initiated the actual assault. However, this is just one sample and isn't really representative of rape as a whole, I just found it interesting. Another comment, that disproves my assertion:

The woman was wearing a transparent cloth, and immediately after she greeted me, my body got erected. I tried to seduce her, but she refused to abide by my views. My wife had left for her parents’ house the previous week, and since I was used to performing sex with her always I had a lot of sexual urge.”

So that motivation is a bit unclear, but the mention of her transparent cloth could be telling. It could also be unreliable information as it is coming from a convicted rapist who may be inundated with rape myths and/or continues to make excuses for his actions.

The majority of risk factors for rape involve increased vulnerability on the part of the victim - being alone, being a new student (in the case of campus sexual assault), being intoxicated, having trust in the rapist (partner, friend, acquaintance), gender/sexual minority, walking with headphones in, age, being an ethnic or racial minority, etc. So with all things being equal between our crew neck and low-cut neck line physically, I don't know who is at a higher risk. There are many sources that imply confidence can DECREASE the risk of sexual assault. Many risk-reduction websites suggest walking confidently and as if you are not confused, scared, alone, etc. I have not found any actual sources confirming this, but intuitively, we know vulnerability increases risk, so perhaps a lack of perceived vulnerability decreases risk (a stretch).

I found some articles about clothing choice and how that effects the wearer and others' opinions of her. This study posits that women who are dressed in formal skirts (vs jeans) were "most happy, successful, feminine, interesting, attractive, intelligent, and wanted as a friend." This article found that "Sexually unrestricted women, for example, showed greater shifts in preference for revealing clothing worn to the laboratory near ovulation" and posits this is in relationship to female-female competition. Men tend to be more attracted to (and can decipher) ovulating women. So maybe our club-goer was ovulating.

TL;DR: I went down a rabbit hole and came up with "well maybe showing cleavage can increase risk" but I'm not sure how that relates to sexual assault in a causal manner, and I still don't think this is the same as the "wallet on the dashboard" car break in scenario because potential rape victims have what rapists want whether it is on display or not. This is terrible wording but I'm trying to be blunt about it.

[–]lecih 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

An important part of meaning is context. And in many ways it's the context of comments like these that makes them most problematic. Quite often people will tell victims of rape after the fact that they should have been more careful but this has little to do with what the discussion ought to be about, which is how are they handling the experience of being assaulted? Do they need physical or mental medical attention? How will we handle the person who's committed the crime? These are the important questions to be asking when someone's been assaulted.

When someone forgoes these questions in favor of the much less relevant comment "there are things you could have done to reduce the chances of this" we can only wonder what the motivations of the person saying this are. It certainly doesn't help the victim because the assault has already occurred. Also, whatever the "rational basis" for these suggestions is (there may not even be one--in my admittedly scant reading about the psychology of rapists I have not found that they actually do care about how you are dressed for example) it's pretty cold-hearted to tell someone that they have partial blame for the occurrence of their own rape when there are a million other things you could be saying to them, such as the incredibly minimal show of compassion "are you okay?"

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree, but that wasnt really the question. No one should ask if victims should be cautioned after theyre raped, or told that they should have been more carful. Thats obviously victim blaming and people who do that should be hit with a bat.

On the other extreeme, however, are people who say that handing out pepper spray to women on college campuses undermines the efforts of womens groups on that campus to hold men responcible for not raping, instead of charging women with preventing rape.

What can be said, if anything, to advise, say, self deffense classes, that doesnt imply that people who dont take these classes are asking to be raped? What are the implications of the phrase "be careful out there" in a social climate where women are held responcible for being raped, and where men are imagined as unbridled rape machines who can't control their own actions? Is there a rout to cautioning potential victims to protect themselves that doesnt blame the recipient of that message should they refuse those precautianry measures (or those measure fail) and theyre later raped, or isnt there?

[–]srsdthrow 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (0子コメント)

My view of this is in regards to the long game, but there's plenty of other reasons to disagree with the theft/rape analogy.

If a person conspicuously waves around an expensive item, making it a target for theft, the issue is that the expensive item's existence would not have been known otherwise. If a criminal doesn't know the item exists, they can't desire to steal it, and unless other people are being conspicuous with their items that criminal will not commit a theft at all. Because the target of rape is an actual person, nothing short of flawlessly disguising every woman like a man would keep a rapist looking for a woman from raping someone. Women are everywhere. If one woman declines a drink to protect herself, there's nothing to stop the rapist from trying again with another woman. Even if every woman declines the drink, the rapist can try a different method to get what they want. The tactics used by many rapists mirror regular social interaction, and it's impossible for every victim to know how to protect themselves.

Some scenarios:

  • A man is raped by his girlfriend. Had he never made her his girlfriend, she wouldn't have had the capacity to rape him specifically, but he trusted her. Is the solution to tell men not to have girlfriends?

  • A woman is raped by a man she meets at a bar; she consents to some sexual activity, but he forces her to do more than she is comfortable with. Is the solution to tell women to avoid casual sex?

Many people think anti-rape education is ineffective because rapists are self-aware and willingly choose to commit rape. However, in both these cases, perhaps the rape wouldn't have happened if the rapists were educated about proper consent. This particularly applies in the second case: men are taught that women will resist them at first in order to not appear a "slut", but will give in if they are convincing enough. Maybe this man didn't think he was committing rape. Maybe the woman in the first scenario had the common belief that men always want sex, and didn't believe him when he said "no." These are cultural factors we can change and make people more aware of through anti-rape education, but most importantly we can't get rid of them by telling people to protect themselves. If the boyfriend in the first case is able to stop his girlfriend from raping him, she still hasn't learned anything about consent and could do it to her next partner. If the woman in the second scenario rejects the man, he can find another woman at the bar.

In terms of stranger rape, I agree that all people should be vigilant when out and about, and it's not a bad idea to carry pepper spray and/or know self-defense (especially if you are a smaller/weaker person.) However, most rapes aren't stranger rapes, and anti-rape activism can't really do much about someone who so blatantly disregards another person's autonomy that they forcibly abduct someone and make them do sexual acts. Furthermore, even if a victim in a stranger rape is prepared to protect themselves, they could still be raped - a victim shouldn't be blamed for fearing further violence (like being killed) if they resist. Even if every woman carried pepper spray, for example, they may not be able to use it in time.

Finally, victim-blaming doesn't make sense because of the power element of rape as a crime. Old women, who are not traditionally sexually appealing, have been raped in home invasions (i.e. not walking down a dark street at night or otherwise "putting themselves in harm's way.) Even if you "do everything right", you can still be raped.

While I don't think we should discourage people from protecting themselves from street crime, self-defense is not an important aspect of anti-rape activism because it doesn't address the actual problem. Telling one woman to "be careful" may stop her from being raped, but it won't stop the same rapist from attacking another woman. The theft analogy doesn't work because people are the targets of rape, not property, and simply existing can make you a target. Fighting rape culture by encouraging appropriate norms of consent will make it so the only rapists are those who deliberately wish to violate others, not those who simply don't understand consent or don't believe they are causing harm.

[–]idknickyp 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Can we stop comparing rape to theft? I think a lot of it is hard because at the end of the day, all of the comparisons to theft, are just extremely objectifying, and kind of pointless. In the case of theft, you can get away with not bringing a "diamond encrusted purse" but as a woman, you can't just not bring your body. Rape happens everywhere and in a huge variety of situations, no one can possibly prepare themselves for every possibility, and even preparing for a few puts a huge damper on freedom, and takes time. From everything I've read you are most likely to be assaulted by someone you know, and the most common "date rape" drug is just plain alcohol. So maybe we need to teach women tools to get out of situations, to warn other women about problem men, and ask men to stop enabling their friends by ignoring problems.

edit: sorry if that didn't necessarily explicitly answer the question, I guess those were just my first thoughts on it.

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think your comment did a great job of answering the question.thanks for sharing.

[–]idknickyp 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

of course! I think it's just hard because I'm not sure what most of us picture when we hear rape (ugly old guy with a knife to the throat of a young hottie in a dark dirty ally) is what's always really happening.

[–]chupamillama [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Is there a better comparison to be made wrt rape?

Even the word rape elicits a very strong response from people. Discussions can be more substantive if it's not talked about directly.

[–]kissedbyfire9 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think the problem with telling women "precautions" is that:

  • (as previously mentioned) "stranger danger" is the vast minority of rape cases so it's displacing the fact that you're more likely to be raped by a current boyfriend, friend, etc. so it's kind of hard to tell women "hey, never let your guard down around anyone you trust ever! never let them get you a beer or come over to study or walk you to your car, etc.",

    • the conditions for people's rape are so wide and varied and aren't necessarily causing one's rape. Being in a park isn't necessary for rape, neither is dressing provocatively, being drunk, walking home alone, studying with a class mate in their dorm room. These things are as causal as wearing flip flops, carrying a purse, stopping to get frozen yogurt before. Just because they are contexts in a rape doesn't mean avoiding them will save you from rape. The only common element in every case that ties victims of rape together is a rapist. You can't predict that person and women can't avoid the thousands of contexts where rapes happen.
    • The difference between "avoiding getting robbed" and "avoiding getting raped" is also context too. It's basically saying, there are bad people out there and you have to protect yourself against those bad apples. We can't change people who are malicious just cause. We can't just teach people who are going to steal not to steal because they're bad people, just the same way we can't teach rapists not to rape because they're just bad people. The narrative around this is all wrong. First of all "going to a bad neighbourhood" means going to an area of poverty, where unemployment, lack of opportunities, and poverty are all high. These issues are systemic. In my mind, you can't teach a person who is poor not to steal because that's not their problem. Systemic inequality is the problem. However, you can "protect" yourself from the actions of desperate people by just doing simple things like locking your doors and windows. And I guess not being an asshole and flaunting wealth in a poor area ( though that's still definitely not a guarantee that you'll get mugged). When comparing this to rape, it's not like rapists are being systematically deprived of basic necessities and therefore need to resort to desperate actions in order to have some basic income. Rapist mentalities come from our general rape culture that our society has: teaching entitlement to women's bodies, objectifying women, pornifying violence, toxic masculinity, teaching men that a struggle is sexy and not really a struggle, etc. This is why we say we have to teach rapists not to rape. Because a lot of men don't even think what they are doing is wrong let alone rape. So that comes with education. Obviously there will still be a handful of bad apples, just like people who steal (some just do it because they like crime). But we're not teaching robbers not to steal because the vast majority of them are doing it because systematic inequality is a huge huge problem and therefore teaching them "not to steal" won't do anything, whereas our mentality around rape is taught and thus the vast majority of people who rape should be untaught the mentalities that lead to it. (sorry for weird formatting, I honestly have no idea how to make it normal lol)

[–]rmc 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (3子コメント)

*(I'm a cis man, thus is just some thoughts, but I might be wrong) *

Many people make the "flaunting expensive goods in a high crime area" analogy, but there's one place their analogy breaks down which shows how people treat them differently.

Imagine you flaunt expensive goods and get mugged, or leave your car in a crime hot spot. Now, your friends, cops and family might say that you should be careful, what did you expect etc. However they don't think that you gave away your car. Despite all the "what did you expect" everyone admits that a crime, that a theft, took place. If the thief were to try to register themselves as the new owner of the car, they wouldn't be able to.

However, with rape, people (incl the courts) seem to view it as if no crime was committed, that if you dress revealing in a club that took have consented to sex, and hence it isn't rape.

[–]Dhamballa 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

While I get your analogy, just from a criminal Justice/due process/innocent until proven guilty angle we can't really ignore the fact that a woman is infinitely more likely to consent to sexual acts than I am to give my wallet, phone, and watch to someone. Circumstantial evidence is way more important in rape prosecution than in any other crime.

Personally, I wish we could focus less on personal choices and more on collective choices. I'd like to work with other feminists to do something about some of the cultural choices that make rape easier (ie getting blackout drunk thrice a week as a lifestyle).

[–]Willetscat 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

There is also a narrative that somehow rape victims "deserve it" based on behavior, while such a standard is rarely applied to victims of other crimes.

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And this, I think, is what we should be looking for ways to avoid. I think the theft/rape analogy is useful only insofaras it illistrates how the victims of crimes dont deserve to have been victimized, regardless of what their actions were before they were accosted. The anaolgy is problematic in that it is easily over extended and misinterpreted, but it does propose that we may be able to take steps to deffend ourselves against attacks and that isnt untrue. My question is about whether advacting steps twords self defence can ever not emply that the victim is responcible for preventing their rape. If you set up a self deffence class and market it to women, does it contribute to the belief firmly rooted in rape culture, that its the responcibility of the victim to deffend themselves, and if they dont that their rape is their fault?

[–]Fulcro 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Caution and prevention discussions are only appropriate BEFORE and assault, I feel like it becomes victim blaming after the fact. It's also completely pointless and insulting.

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Totally agreed.

[–]woodenbiplane 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (11子コメント)

Rape is not like theft. Using the handbag analogy objectifies the woman's sexuality as if it is an object.

Women who dress provocatively are not statistically more likely to be raped. Men who rape frequently target women who actually dress more conservatively, as they tend to target women who are seen as dominate-able.

Rape is not about acquiring sex. Rape is about power. Rapists rape to dominate, not to get off. Rape is not about sex.

I used to think like you, and then I asked the same question you asked here a long time ago. See this thread for far far far more and better info: http://www.reddit.com/r/SRSDiscussion/comments/p4r87/how_is_this_thing_different_from_that_thing/

[–]praxulus 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Rape is not like theft. Using the handbag analogy objectifies the woman's sexuality as if it is an object.

I can see how, in certain contexts, making comparisons between rape and theft can be harmful. I don't buy that argument that they can't be compared at all though, e.g. they're both things I wouldn't want happening to me (or anyone else for that matter). I'm not saying rape is theft, or that rape is as bad as theft, just that they have an attribute in common.

There are still plenty of people who think of rape as if it were the theft of a "woman's virtue" or some shit like that, and I completely agree that that's a terrible attitude to take. That's not the kind of attitude being espoused in the comment OP quoted though. That person was just putting rape and theft into the category of "bad things," is that wrong too?

[–]idknickyp 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I think that the problem is this is a very frequently used analogy, and is often used as a way to tell women that they need to be careful, however, in the theft example, it is easy to just not carry an expensive handbag, but women just can't leave home without their vaginas so they don't get raped, and I think that is where it breaks down. that and the analogy is still encouraging people to view womens bodies as analogous to property. this mentality plays into rape culture, the more humanized someone is, the harder it is to objectify them, but if you are saying their possession of a body, is the same as possession of a coach purse, what are you saying about their humanity?

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I dont think thats the intention of the anaolgy. I definitely agree that there are some objectification problems with it, and wouldnt it be easier to find an analogy without those problems, but the point of the comparison isnt that women should leave their vaginas and purses at home, but rather that the world is an unsafe place because of some factors that can be accounted for, and that as people aware of those dangers, we might take steps toward accounting for them (like taking self defence classes, or carrying pepper spray or a tazer, in the case of rape, or not carrying valuables openly in the case of theft). I think a bigger problem than either of these though, that was brought up in another comment, was that the dangers we're encouraging women to account for with these cautions are actually less common factors in rape. A really effective caution would have to include not going places with men who you trust, even public, and not being around male family members (which would of course be absurd).

[–]woodenbiplane 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, that.

[–]grapesandmilk 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Can't they do it for both reasons?

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

No. Rape is always about power and violence.

[–]idknickyp 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't know. I think there are times where people just do not truly know what consent is. I think this might be especially apparent in cases of rape within relationships, if one partner wants sex, them coercing, manipulating or otherwise forcing them into it is not necessarily about being in power, but may just be about getting what they want when they want it. which, yes, does have to do about power, but I'm not sure that it is unadulterated power.

I think it is also dangerous to say, RAPE IS ONLY ABOUT POWER, because that makes it easier for people to say, "hey, what I did was only a little bad, like sure I forced her, but it was just because I was really horny and I know she's a slut and would do it, not because I wanted to have power over her, so it wasn't about power, it wasn't rape" or "ehhh, I mean everyone there was drinking, like yeah she didn't really know what was happening, but like I wasn't trying to hurt her, so like it's not about violence, so it's not rape"

[–]grapesandmilk 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

How can someone know all the reasons if they haven't done it themselves?

[–]speed0spank [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It's been studied?

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

First of all, you dont know how I think because my post didnt express an opinion. I submitted a topic for discussion and asked some guiding questions. Please dont automaticly assume the poster disagrees with you when they ask aquestion about something youve come to a conclusion about.

Second, you didnt really answer the question at all. No one here would ever ask if women should dress more conservatively to avoid rape. What I was asking was if more effective precautionary measures could be taken, without implying the fault of victims who didnt take them, or who took them but who were also raped.

If youd like to discuss the topic, we can do that, or if you want to keep talking down to people, I guess you can do that too.

[–]woodenbiplane -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think you've missed what I was trying to say, and completely misread my tone. Have a look at that thread.

[–]gepeg-libre 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

While this attitude is usually taken too far, for example by comparing theft of a diamond handbag to getting raped, I think there are some precautions that people can take to avoid putting themselves in potentially dangerous situations. The thing is, I think many women already habitually take these precautions because they live in a world where it's necessary and it's drilled into them. Examples are like arranging a safe-call with a friend if you're going home with a stranger or something.

I struggled a lot with this when I got sober. I'm a queer guy and a recovering alcoholic and I was raped when I was younger after a guy brought me home and fed me liquor (which I happily guzzled down) until I passed out, and then he fucked me. When I got sober I had to think about the consequences of all my actions, and even something as seemingly obviously not my fault as getting raped had to be analyzed. If I wasn't pitifully addicted to alcohol, I imagine that I would not have allowed myself to drink to the point of passing out in the house of a stranger who I didn't want to have sex with who'd expressed a lot of interest in having sex with me.

I'm not sure where I'm going with that thought but maybe it's relevant. It's still not my fault that it happened, but one of the pillars of my sobriety is the knowledge that I will never, ever be in a situation again where I'm unable to defend myself. Does that make sense? That also goes for all the dozens of times I had the shit kicked out of me when I was blackout drunk. There are things you can't control and things you can. Like, I might get hit by a bus tomorrow and there's nothing I can do about that, but today I know I'm not going to hit a bus tomorrow myself.

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thank you for sharing and congratulations on getting sober. This really illustrates the tension between acknowledging that what happened isnt your fault, and knowing that in the future acting differently may protect you from its happening again.

[–]maridoatrevido 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Tell a Cishet white male Christian Republican, "don't invest all your money with one of your church elders who promises a 10% per month return on investment " and nobody bats an eye.

[–]speed0spank [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

What?

[–]_flaminghomer_[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Lol yeah, what's your point?