331
332

TIFU wearing a HATRED video game t-shirt at a hospital. (self.tifu)

BjarneBiceps が 投稿

並べ替え:
ベスト
トップ新着論争中古い順q&a
あなたは単独のコメントのスレッドを見ています。

残りのコメントをみる →

[–]CSKarasu 51 ポイント52 ポイント  (50子コメント)

Everything about this post is terrible, but /u/TheDeadlySinner has pretty much summed it up.

Also, the removal of Hatred from the Steam store wasn't censorship. Valve is a private company, but one of many digital distribution services, if Hatred was not reinstated the game could still be made and distributed in other ways.

Personally, I won't be buying Hatred. The developers are linked to extremist far right hate groups.

[–]Krono5_8666V8 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (0子コメント)

People getting angry about steam potentially removing the game has less to do with them removing hatred and more to do with them removing hatred while keeping equally (or more) offensive games, or just horrible games in general. the fact that there is 0 quality control is one thing, but to selectively enforce a policy for removing games is bullshit.

[–]manielos 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Can you elaborate about those right wing hate groups connection? I've never heard about it to be frank

[–]CSKarasu 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

But members of the Hatred team ascribe to not one, but several political groups that could be considered controversial. They even go so far as to mark their attendance at events which they sponsor.

The fact that several members of the Hatred development team openly like multiple extreme right groups on Facebook shows, to Pankowski at least, that they are supportive of these groups’ ideals.

Source

[–]houndric 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thanks for the link, very interesting read.

Not totally related but a point I'd like to bring up regardless - isn't it a little messed up that someone can have their career crushed from controversial Facebook likes? Isn't that the exact kind of thing most of us on the internet fight against? I want to believe that our personal beliefs are private, but I also can't blame people for the outrage over the developers.

I'm in the game industry as well and I've been seeing a lot of male developers getting flak for their stance on people like Brianna Wu, or Zoe Quinn. While most of us don't care, it's really all about a few passionate individuals. The industry is so tightly knit that things like that can really effect your chances of being successful. It's kind of scary.

[–]Eladriol 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

they 'like' some far-right facebook groups. They claim they do so for research about what these groups think rather than liking them. Given there's literally no other evidence then I'm inclined to say that they don't have links to far right groups

[–]OrbitalSolutionsLtd 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Are you sure about that extremist thing ? Sauce ?

[–]CSKarasu -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Linked below.

[–]5171984 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Removal?

[–]truh 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It got removed but Gaben himself made sure that the game was put back into the store.

edit: source: http://www.maximumpc.com/gabe_newell_vetoes_valves_decision_remove_hatred_steam_greenlight_2014

[–]CSKarasu 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yes. It was removed and then reinstated. Source

[–]5171984 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh, I see - so this was a little while ago. Now that you mention it, I vaguely remember hearing about it. So weird how I instantly forgot about the game until this post. Thanks for the link.

[–]ZordonFreemanI 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

As much as I can't be arsed for it, the Hatred dev Hate Group thing got debunked pretty quickly.

[–]CSKarasu -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It wasn't debunked, at all. People just glazed over it. Where is your article debunking this? I'm the only one in this entire comment thread who posted a relevant and related link to an article backing up what I said. You guys have posted NOTHING. It's like arguing with brainless zombies.

[–]PDK01 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Censorship doesn't have to come from a government. The 1st amendment guarantee against censorship applies only to the government.

[–]A0G 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (22子コメント)

You state as fact what you've heard as rumor.

[–]CSKarasu -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (21子コメント)

You mean the far right links? It was documented in an article I believe was on Polygon? Devs wearing far right shirts, devs following the groups on facebook, and personal comments.

Some of these groups are known to assault and harass non-Polish. The groups backgrounds were verified by a professor.

[–]MisakaHatesReddit 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (13子コメント)

Cause we all know polygon are known for their amazing journalistic abilities. LOL

[–]JackalKing 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I believe was on Polygon

Because polygon is the bastion of journalist integrity, am I right? If I had a nickle for every time polygon wrote an article on something blatantly false I would be richer than Bill Gates.

I'll remind you that this is the same website hired Ben Kuchera as their editor, the man who published articles claiming Brad Wardell, CEO of Stardock, sexually harassed a former employee. This same article included blatant lies about the guy, and lead to him getting death threats. ZERO investigating was done on the article(or really any article done by Ben Kuchera). The man's son was bullied at school and people posted directions to his house because of the shitty journalism of Ben Kuchera. Of course it was later proven that none of the allegations were true, that the person accusing him was a disgruntled employee who destroyed company assets and was fired. A man's life was nearly ruined and his family was targeted because people like Ben Kuchera publish rumors and false allegations all the fucking time.

Never take anything polygon says at face value, because they are a shitty website that put zero effort into actually investigating anything they write.

[–]CSKarasu -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Google ad hominem.

[–]JackalKing 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Ah yes, the patented "Ill just accuse them of a logical fallacy and not address anything." defense.

Its not ad hominem because the character of the person is DIRECTLY related to the argument. If the website hires a person who has a history of publishing lies about people, then that calls into question everything else they have published. This is how trust works. This is how journalistic integrity works. The reliability of the source is paramount when establishing your argument. When citing sources for a paper, there is a reason a college professor will tell you wikipedia isn't a credible source. You claim these people are part of hate groups because polygon said so, and polygon is known to be shit at investigative journalism. They aren't a credible source of information.

But please, feel free to completely ignore the fact that your source is one of the most unreliable websites on the internet when it comes to facts. Cite more logical fallacies if it makes you feel better. It doesn't change the fact that you are literally saying "Polygon said so, so it must be true." Come back with a more credible source if you want anyone to believe the shit you are flinging.

[–]CSKarasu -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I've backed up my points and yet you have presented nothing but your personal bias against the website. Show me evidence that these points are unsubstantiated, the journalists have substantiated theirs, respond and substantiate yours.

[–]HASHTAGLIKEAGIRL 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

If he responded with a link to fox news you'd be doing the exact same thing

hypocrite

[–]CSKarasu -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not really. Last Fox News link I saw on here was in /r/gaming where the anchor was debating against a religious activist that there were no links between games and violence. The point was even backed up with the relevant research including a graph of crime level dropping against rise in videogame consumption. Kindly get over yourself.

[–]JackalKing 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Very well. I'll even use your own standard, Polygon.

Statements from the mouth of the developer himself.

Further, Polygon's original source for their "proof" that the devs were neo-nazis was "Fuck NO Video Games", a tumblr blog. Part of their "evidence" was that one of the devs is a tattoo designer and his designs included ancient germanic and slavic symbols that, while they are sometimes associated with neo-nazi groups, are also just as often associated simply with the culture of the fucking region. The entire blog post read as an extremely American-centric ramble that completely ignored the complexities of political and cultural movements of the region.

Their most damning evidence for them being neo-nazis is that they liked a far-right group on facebook, which the developer themselves explain in the linked article.

So just to recap. Polygon's "source" for the devs being neo-nazis wasn't some professor, it was a blogger devoted to finding controversy where there is none. The blogger in question is completely ignorant of Polish culture and politics. The developers themselves explain why they liked the facebook page.

This is literally a non-issue. They are not linked to a neo-nazi group. Its just a bunch of perpetually offended people looking for reasons to be offended, and they are being encouraged by a website that wil literally publish anything that will get them clicks, with zero accountability, standards, or ethics.

[–]Cyspha -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (8子コメント)

No, everything about THIS post is terrible. It is filled with misinformation. First of all, the removal of the game from steam was a mistake, Gabe Newell himself apologised for that. It is now up on Steam again and kind /u/5171984 even provided a link.

Second, there is no reason to believe nor is there any proof that the developers are extremists. They are just a bunch of talented people trying to develop a controversial game. And this controversy is their PR. And it works.

If you don't like the game, that is fine. But please do not intentionally misinform your readers.

Edit: corrected auto-correct

Edit:

Newell's Apology: https://m.facebook.com/destructivecreationsteam/photos/a.367406143426716.1073741828.311540585679939/387264774774186/?type=1&permPage=1

[–]Combocore 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Private companies can censor too, and Steam's crazy monopoly makes their censorship kinda significant.

[–]Eladriol -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Valve is THE digital distribution service. Not being allowed on valve is effectively killing any game that does not have a major publisher behind it. Preventing a product from having a viable route to market is effectively the same as censorship, it's like saying google removing links to a website isn't censorship because teeeechnically other search engines exist-except for even worse because steam has a higher market share than google in their respective markets

The developers aren't linked to far right people, just some butthurt people over the victory of freedom of speach read too much into the facebook profile of one of the devleopers

[–]mjd188 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Not being allowed on valve is effectively killing any game that does not have a major publisher behind it, preventing a product from having a viable route to market is effectively the same as censorship" No, no it is not. Valve/steam have every right to decide what products they sell in their store. "Censorship" is just what everyone calls it when they disagree.