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[–]one_finger_salute 458 ポイント459 ポイント  (174子コメント)

This is not a fair comparison. You can not separate black-face from its historical context. Black-face and minstrel shows were designed to represent incredibly racist and offensive stereotypes. They represent a time in American history where it was common place to blatantly portray black people as inferior. They reinforced cultural beliefs that are extremely destructive and offensive.

I would say that black people playing white people is more a satire of this sort of blatant racism. It may still play off stereotypes and be in bad taste but it is not at all equivalent to black-face.

White people were never systematically subjugated and abused in America. They are not subjected to discrimination and bigotry. Black-face is a reminder of an incredibly horrible time in history. When people use black-face it is at best in bad taste and at worst a flagrant display of racism.

Edit* As many people have pointed out, I was incorrect when I said "White people were never systematically subjugated or abused in America." I agree that many groups of white immigrants were indeed persecuted and discriminated against. Please read my other posts on this thread to see where I have elaborated on this.

[–]Vhyce 190 ポイント191 ポイント  (70子コメント)

White people were never systematically subjugated and abused in America.

Besides the Irish.. to a staggering degree..

[–]Fearlessleader85 138 ポイント139 ポイント  (8子コメント)

They weren't white back then.

[–]TeamSawyer 102 ポイント103 ポイント  (7子コメント)

This.

The concept of being "white" has always been an exclusionary designation in the US. Italians, for example, were once not considered "white"

[–]SaltFrog 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (5子コメント)

And they're still not! God damned whops with their delicious food and beautiful shoes and absolutely stunning suits >:i

[–]MrShotson 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I know it phonetically sounds like whop, but it was actually spelled Wop. Wikipedia says it's a bastardization of guappo, meaning thug, but my grandparents insist that it was also short for WithOut Papers, inferring that those dirty Italians were all illegal immigrants.

[–]SaltFrog 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

TIL, thank you!

[–]radicalradicalrad 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Hey hey, don't be racist. Some of them are dagos.

[–]jrgolden42 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You think you're pretty smart, don't you Trebek? What with your dago moustache and your greasy hair?

[–]radicalradicalrad 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's "The PEN is Mightier."

[–]MyKettleIsNotBlack -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The Italians brought pizza with them. =/ I vote Italy into the White Club, but I only get a non-voting Jewish Honorary White membership so someone else has to do it.

Edit: Clearly people still hate Italians. Explains the downvotes.

[–]WhatWeOnlyFantasize[S] 74 ポイント75 ポイント  (21子コメント)

And Italians, and Eastern Europeans and basically everyone not in the green area...

[–]PlainclothesmanBaley 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (5子コメント)

How does Japan fit into this map?

[–]onlyupvoteswhendrunk 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (1子コメント)

They are robots.

[–]NterceptR 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Giant transforming robots

[–]NoMouseville 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (0子コメント)

the whitest asians

[–]mankind_is_beautiful 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

For most of human history they didn't mix with other peoples, so there wasn't an opportunity for oppression? My best guess.

[–]Zonel 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Nah they had opportunity, they just discriminated against each other based on class and profession. Burakumin

[–]opydoopy 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You included scotland, the scottish were also treated like shit.

[–]untipoquenojuega 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And the Polish and Baltic.

[–]monsieur_noirs 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Jesus, Catholics are not white!

[–]teh_beast 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Sounds like this product is for you! https://youtu.be/xdyin6uipy4

[–]Nomsonfacekcool 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (1子コメント)

He's saying that the Irish and Italians were discriminated, and they were, a lot. Not that they're currently in the same amount of discrimination today.

[–]lipidsly 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And it led to a 1/3rd decrease of the population of ireland. Talk about diaspora

[–]whoaaa_man -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is a very funny video.

[–]KurtInAintEasy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ap-tSd5aulM

[–]Lingerfickin -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Where are italians now? Offices?

[–]hippykiller303 -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Go fuck yourself you racist peice of trash. You are a waste of life.

[–]TheFreeYankee 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You're obviously not familiar with American history.

[–]hippykiller303 -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, I am. But this post just makes it seem like black face and the movie white girls are on the same level. This gives justification to racists one way or the other. And you would understand that if you weren't a fucking idiot.

[–]legitimategrapes 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Whoosh

[–]one_finger_salute 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (14子コメント)

This is very true. White immigrant populations were discriminated against and you could easily argue that immigrant populations (regardless of race) are still discriminated against to this day.

It is not my intent to trivialize the unfair treatment of any group but I would still argue that the discrimination of the Irish in America does not hold a candle to the institution of slavery, Jim Crow laws and persistent systemic racism towards African Americans that still exists in society.

[–]AntiChr1st 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Eh, well, that's if you ignore the fact that the Irish where slaves in America for a while, which has some fascinating horrors like the bit where Irish girls would be "bred" with black slaves because the mulatto slaves where considered more valuable.

Jesus fuck, I'm not even American and I know that much...

[–]lipidsly 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And the slavery was just because the British couldn't think of a better way to kill them all while trying to make some money off them. Conditions on all slave ships sucked balls but it was a fairly common occurrence for irish slave ships to execute prisoners because they were board, sometimes dumping large segments of the slaves in the middle of the atlantic because: Fuck'emtm

[–]TedTheGreek_Atheos -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

The Irish were indentured servants who could pay off their debts and be free. A privilege African slaves didn't have.

http://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/Indentured_Servants_in_Colonial_Virginia

[–]AntiChr1st 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That is a truth with modifications. The majority were people who were sold, that much is certain. Most for a time only, and as such not as damning as it was for a black slave, but the work was no less harsh and many years working such before being released in a foreign country didn't exactly leave you in the best of positions. It also ignores the suffering of the female irish "indendured servants", I highly doubt being captured, sold, raped and used as breeding stock was any more fun because the technical term for your situation was indentured servitude.

[–]sadfatlonely 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Indentured servitude still wasn't cool. I mean, yes, it was better than being an African slave, but it was pretty shit.

[–]ReallyNot_Clever 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The original point wasn't who had it better, it was to prove that a white demographic WAS discriminated against at one point. "No Irish need apply" basically guaranteed after paying your indentured contract you would not be hired anywhere and would be poor and starve. Even with that bullshit the Irish toughed it out and worked where they could to better the country with hard work instead of crying like a bunch of pussies with a race card. Down vote me if you like but its history. My grandfather came from Ireland well after slavery. Never owned slaves and had nothing to do with it but since my skin is white I am grouped in with slave owners and the horrors they committed.

[–]TheFreeYankee 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, maybe there was a possibility for them to become free, and there were a fair bit that did manage to get to that point. HOWEVER, they were still property of their masters under law and were subject to beatings, loss of food privileges, death, etc., and the debt-holders could extend their required time of service for the smallest infractions. Miss a little in the corner after mucking out the stables? That's an extra year for you.

Yeah, they could become free, if they survive long enough. Even then, many former IS would find themselves in a very similar situation to freed slaves: no land, no money, and no place to go, resulting in their having to become sharecroppers on their former masters' land (basically the same situation by a different name.) So yeah, indentured servitude was better than full out slavery, but only ever so slightly.

[–]Lingerfickin -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Thank you! Yeah, are Irish in marginalized neighborhoods today? This conversation is staggering. I can't believe someone has the gall to say that 'white face' has some sort of social import. Are you offended white people? Did that hurt your job prospecting because everyone decided to minimize your merits and stereotype you? Aww, I'm sorry...

[–]thursday_13 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think most people understand that they are not equal in terms of historical discussion. There is no such thing as whiteface in the same breath as blackface. It is a completely different thing.

But the real question is, why are we afraid of satire? If a comedian Paints his face black for the purpose of satire, that isn't doing blackface. Blackface was purposefully derogatory, racist, and hurtful. It's very murky the idea, but we as a society have to get past the idea that white people are safe for satire, but black people are not. No body was oppressed when robert downy jr painted his face black for Tropic Thunder. We should use context to judge, not appearance.

Humor heals wounds. I think the more receptive we are to allowing context to dictate our response the faster our society can move forward. (Full disclosure, you won't catch me dead wearing black face paint)

[–]Lingerfickin 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Personally, I hated that blackface was reintroduced with that. I haven't seen the movie. White people are able to find jobs. There's a big difference. We're not talking about white people at risk of being taken down by the power structure these days. Period. They're supported by it. By support, I mean the collective laughter. If everyone laughs in unison at 'whiteface,' it doesn't make white women less employable. When blackface occurs, it not only is a direct communication of inhumanity and degredation, it does have a wider impact. When that impact can be said and shown to happen with white people (or other people) it's time to bring that to a close. Alternately, if it's wrong to be making this movie in the first place (which I'm open to considering, even) then maybe we should consider how we're openly considering and talking about black people ON A REGULAR FUCKIN BASIS. Not to get cross with you, but I'm heated about the situation and its overbearing inequality.

[–]sadfatlonely 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think the point people are making is about the single line in the comment above claiming that white people have never been subjected to bigotry in America. Not implying that any group of whites had it as bad as black people, or that white face and black face are socially and historically equal.

[–]Lingerfickin 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I respect that point. But as long as we're mentioning blackface and the movie white chicks as a means for making the point of discrimination in entertainment media moot, I'm going to do that for the point of discrimination in late 19th century turn of the industrial revolution USA.

[–]zombiecheesus 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (4子コメント)

White people were commonly enslaved by Africans during the height of the trans Atlantic slave trade.

The more you know, the more shitty things look.

[–]mr_noisy_tush -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well TIL

[–]Cilicia 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Africans" is a technicality. The Barbary coast is in the Mediterranean, and the people who inhabit the region are Semitic people, iirc.

[–]Lingerfickin 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's a good point. Is that still happening?

[–]dont_call_me_shirlee 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Except the Irish got overt it.

[–]ok_ill_shut_up 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Because they were accepted into the white group. I don't know if that'll work out with the blacks, lol.

[–]thursday_13 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They Americanized more so than anything else.

It wasn't the color of their skin. Look at Chinese Americans, they have done exceedingly well in this country. Integration is the key. Jim Crow laws did more harm than slavery ever could. Simply because it prevented integration.

[–]silverrabbit 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Black people have a harder time hiding their blackness than Irish folks do. It's the same reason some Latinos can pass...

[–]yakityyakblah 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Number of times I have seen anyone bring up Irish discrimination on Reddit as anything other than a response to people bringing up black racism: 0

[–]thursday_13 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well, it's kind of the auto response to someone saying "no one white was ever a slave". It's kind of hard not to bring it up.

[–]yakityyakblah 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Right, but my point is, nobody seems to give a fuck about it outside of minimizing black slavery. It's never, "we should also be sorry about the things we did to the Irish", it's "why can't black people get over it like the Irish did".

[–]GodOfAllAtheists 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And the Italians...

[–]TheRegalNinja -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

They seem to be referring to american history specifically

[–]Rommel79 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The Irish were the first slaves in America.

[–]Lingerfickin -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And did they get past that?

[–]bosrox -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

lol are you comparing being irish to slavery "to a staggering degree"?

[–]Rommel79 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Considering that Irish people were slaves, yes.

[–]sourwurms -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

muh irish

Get over your potato famine

I can't believe you compared the history of black people in america to the fucking irish.

[–]RoseyOneOne 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (3子コメント)

While Dutch people dressed as 'Zwarte Pete' are in black face, it isn't quite the same as the legacy of what that was in the US and evolved from a different historical context. I'm not saying it's any better, but I think they do it as a tradition that has a racist implication that many might not immediately think of. It's crazy, but kids grow up with it and in a different way than what that is in the US.

[–]turminater 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's part of a yearly tradition were children get presents and sweets and adults and the media bicker over racism. It's always such fun.

[–]one_finger_salute 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Thank you for making me aware of 'Zwarte Pete'. I did not know the context of the OP's picture or the history of Zwarte Pete. This topic is incredibly complex and I made the mistake of making assumptions and jumping to conclusions.

[–]WhatWeOnlyFantasize[S] 38 ポイント39 ポイント  (10子コメント)

Except Zwarte Piet has nothing to do with American minstrel shows.

[–]higherbrow 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It kind of does. As van Muiswinkel points out, it's mostly a racist holdover from another era. And the questions people are posing regarding it are markedly similar to questions people pose about blackface in general, with the key difference being that the Piets are a specific cultural character.

It's not far off of Uncle Remus, or the ridiculous farce of TinTin in the Congo.

[–]one_finger_salute 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (5子コメント)

I admit that I was ignorant of Zwarte Piet. I immediately, and incorrectly assumed that this picture of was american in origin. As I said above, context is important and I was not aware of the context of this picture.

[–]one_finger_salute 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I find it interesting that the most downvoted comment I made in this thread is when I admitted I didn't know something and was wrong.

[–]Flufflebuns 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Came here to say this! Listen to David Sedaris' explanation on St. Niklaus' 6-8 black "friends".

[–]Lurky-McLurksalot 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Six to eight did you say?!"

[–]thesilent30 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Everything has to be seen through the lens of American culture, this is reddit, yo!

[–]FoxyGrampa 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Hmmm almost. black face is seen as being "bad taste" because back in the day, if you were black you couldn't act in a play. In order to portray any black person, a white person would need to be painted black.

So, really, it's a reminder of a time when white people openly saw black people as inferior in that they would rather paint a white person black than allow a black person on stage.

[–]one_finger_salute -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Good point. It reminds me of how Hattie McDaniel, from Gone With the Wind, wasn't aloud to attend the premier of the movie or attend the Oscars because of segregation.

[–]RomeoTango 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Thank you for saying this. It's infantile and naive to say the racial problems some minority whites experienced is in any way equitable to the way blacks were, and still are treated is so erroneous that it boggles that mind. It's like people forgot all of American history when they make that argument.

[–]underthingy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The picture on the left has nothing to do with america......

[–]shonnycastle -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Pretty sure OP posted this with an American audience in mind...

[–]Rockyrambo -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's a horrendous argument

[–]Lingerfickin -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Glad you said what you said

[–]Corbo1985 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (23子コメント)

The fact that you say that White people have never been systematically subjugated discredits anything you have to say due to the fact you no basic understanding in history.

  • From Middle English, from Old French sclave, from Medieval Latin sclāvus (“slave”), from Sclāvus (“Slav”), because Slavs were often forced into slavery in the Middle Ages.

The whole root of the english word for slave comes from the fact the slavs were so often enslaved.

*The Irish slave trade began when James II sold 30,000 Irish prisoners as slaves to the New World. His Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies.

By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat (70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves at this time).

From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and over 300,000 were sold as slaves.

Ireland's population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one single decade.

There are ridiculous on the amounts of times this happened all over europe. Hell even muslims enslaved christians in mass.

Pick up a gd history book.

[–]Jay_the_gustus 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

There is an amazing amount of ahistoricism in this comment. What's more, the photo OP posted was of Europeans in their homeland of Europe. The relevancy of the north american paradigm is passing at best. Taking hyper specific offense to cultural practices such as you have done here when encountering other traditions is obvious madness. I am glad this thread is against you.

[–]one_finger_salute 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

OP is posting this picture to a predominantly North American audience. I do not think it is unreasonable to think that it would be widely taken from a North American Perspective.

I doubt very much that most of the people on here know that the picture is of Zwarte Piet and I highly doubt that OP was trying to make a statement about Zwarte Piet. Rather, OP was likely making a statement about a perceived double standard in North America surounding black-face.

OP is still making a moral comparison between the practice of black-face and the movie "White Chicks" even if the original picture is of Zwarte Piet which is of European origin.

I do not think it is "madness" to challenge images and opinions like this that disregard decade of history and systemic racism.

I do take offence to black-face and I do not think it is "madness" to do so.

*edit for formatting

[–]unique616 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You can not separate black-face from its historical context.

Every country has its own history. In the US, it might be offensive to wear black-face, but the people in this picture are a from a foreign country. The never enslaved black people. They aren't making fun of them. It's just how they've always celebrated Christmas. Santa Clause's companion, Black Peter, is black because he's a muslim from Spain.

[–]one_finger_salute 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree. But as I stated in another part of this thread...

OP is posting this picture to a predominantly North American audience. I do not think it is unreasonable to think that it would be widely taken from a North American Perspective. I doubt very much that most of the people on here know that the picture is of Zwarte Piet and I highly doubt that OP was trying to make a statement about Zwarte Piet. Rather, OP was likely making a statement about a perceived double standard in North America surounding black-face. OP is still making a moral comparison between the practice of black-face and the movie "White Chicks" even if the original picture is of Zwarte Piet which is of European origin.

[–]555nick 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

But, but... white people subjugated other white people & Asians & Native Americans too, and black people in Africa subjugated other black people so that white people subjugated black people can't be brought up!

/s

[–]DarthZarth -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Hey dude, ever notice that this was comedy and not politics? There is several reddits for politics. Go to those

[–]one_finger_salute 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I wasn't the one who posted a picture of black-face with a overtly political statement about racism in r/funny.

[–]jvgkaty44 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

For the hundredth time you can't have double standards and expect to have equality. It will never work. You can't have "revenge" and expect white people to be OK with it and not have feelings of anger. You can't embarrass or emasculate a group of people to make things right. This is not how humans work. When will get this thru your thick skulls.

[–]hazie 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Mm yeah technically they weren't doing blackface though. This is blackface. In the picture they're not trying to make black people look like buffoons, they're just putting makeup on to actually look like black people.

Furthermore, this is not in America, but the Netherlands. They're dressing up as the traditional Dutch Christmas character "Black Peter". Whether or not you find this racist, it has absolutely nothing to do with America. It's absurd to say that this is racist because it "represent[s] a time in American history".

[–]msirelyt 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think that White Chicks was going for black face satire. I'd bet it was not even considered possibly offensive by the directors. I think that most people don't find it offensive because white face doesn't have a horrible history. You are right that black face is a reminder of some awful shit. With that said, in order for there to be complete equality among races people need to live by the same rules. The moment you prohibit one race from doing something, while simultaneously allowing another, you perpetuate a disconnection between the races. At some point we're going to have to remove it from being such a horrible atrocity. Hell, every year at Thanksgiving we celebrate with feasts while our children dress up as the race that their ancestors demolished, so I don't think that we have problems with the morality of it.

[–]TheNotSoGrimReaper -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (7子コメント)

It's weird that you assume no Anglo cultures have ever been subjected to horrific racism and stereotyping...

What's not weird though, is that you aren't replying to the people who have historically accurate counter points.

I forgot it only racist if it's white people making fun of blacks.

People like you are keeping discrimination alive and strong, congrats!

[–]Laxperte 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

In this case, the zwarte piet's face got black because he climbs in the chimneys for Santa...

[–]Poemi -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

I would say that black people playing white people is...in bad taste

When people use black-face it is at best in bad taste

So, in your own words, it's entirely possible that they're both equally (in)offensive?

[–]one_finger_salute 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I would say that context is incredibly important. Could there be situation where a black person portraying a white character is more offensive than a white person in black-face? Sure.

For example, I personally would find a black person playing a blatantly Jewish stereotype for the purposes of belittling the Jewish people more offensive than an ignorant white person using black-face for a Halloween costume, assuming that the Halloween costume was not intended to be racist.

As I said above, context is important and OP was not taking the historical context of black-face into account.

*Edit for formatting

[–]Poemi 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Sure, context is important. But in your first comment above, you did what most people who take your position do: while acknowledging the hypothetical possibility of good intentions on both sides, you assumed the best of the hypothetical black actor ("it's more of a satire"), and the worst of the hypothetical white actor ("a flagrant display of racism")...based on their race.

See the problem with that?

[–]one_finger_salute -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You conveniently left out the first part of what I said where I stated "it is at best in bad taste". I did not mean to assume the best intentions of the black actor. I was trying to make the point that the historical context of a black person playing a white character is very different than a white person putting on black face.

I personally believe that, regardless of the intentions of a white person who puts on black-face, it is always in bad taste because of its historical context. I do not believe the same is necessarily true for black people playing white characters. It has nothing to do with their intentions and everything to do with the historical context.

I am in no way saying that a black people playing a white character should get a free pass from criticism. They too can easily fall back on old and dangerous racial stereotypes. I would also say that men playing women can also be offensive by playing off of sexist and misogynistic stereotypes.

It is difficult to talk about these subjects (especially in this format) without generalizing to some degree and I admit I did this in my previous posts and I thank you for challenging me on these generalizations. As always the truth resists simplicity.

[–]mattwb72 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

For me the fact that you're making fun of/putting down someone's race and their stereotypes holds more weight in the offensive category than if there is a history of putting them down.

Or we could all just chill the fuck out and not get so offended by stupid shit and focus on more important things in life.

[–]Clarkson23 -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Irish and Italians sure had it easy when they came to America. /s

[–]thebloodofthematador 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They didn't then, but they do now. People love stereotypes of Italians and the Irish anymore. Look how every asshole in America acts on St. Patrick's Day. It's irritating and stupid, but nobody's going to, say, not hire someone with an Irish last name because of it. Black people still have their lives affected (and sometimes taken from them) because of racial stereotyping.

[–]legitimategrapes -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Holy shit you have net upvotes. Did the mouthbreathers who upvoted this shitpost actually learn something and appreciate it?

[–]spaghetti_taco -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

So it's just satire and white people can never be discriminated against because they owned slaves 150 years ago. And I don't have any right to be offended because "its just satire" and my grandparents grandparents owned slaves?

Naah.

[–]one_finger_salute -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Once again I wish people would actually read my comments before putting words in my mouth. I clearly stated:

I am in no way saying that black people playing a white character should get a free pass from criticism. They too can easily fall back on old and dangerous racial stereotypes

[–]spaghetti_taco 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

That is nowhere in the post I replied to. Maybe read your own post?

[–]one_finger_salute 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Please notice that I used the word "comments". This is plural meaning I was referring to all my posts on this thread, not just the specific one you were responding to.

I agree that it was unrealistic for me to assume that you read all of my comments on this thread which is why I quoted my response to someone who made a very similar point as you.

It is just frustrating that people are making the same points over and over without taking the time read what has already been said.

[–]spaghetti_taco -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Please notice that the word "comments" is ambiguous and there can be multiple comments in a single post.

I made my post before you replied. Should I just wait for you to give me the all clear to read all of your posts before I reply? Why not move that additional note to your first comment to avoid the problem?

[–]one_finger_salute 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I apologize. I should have been more clear and I should responded to you based on the specific post you were commenting on rather than another post I made in this thread. You are right. It is unfair/unrealistic of me to to expect people to read an entire thread before responding.

[–]DoxBox -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Black face is racist.. in most contexts.

[–]miawallacescoke -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Someone's way too offended, douche

[–]ForgotmyPWasalways -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You can not separate black-face from its historical context.

...You can if you're not American. But most of reddit and its ethnocentric American userbase doesn't seem to grasp or even want to hear about the fact that there's a whole world outside of your country with different histories, cultures and people.

[–]one_finger_salute 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

As always, the truth resists simplicity. I admit that I oversimplified my argument to make it fit a North American perspective. Once you go deeper and start looking at the historical context in other countries, it gets really difficult.

[–]_-_-O -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm assuming that you want to be equal. I want to be equal. I wasn't black in the 20s, I wasn't Jewish in the 40s, I wasn't Catholic when Kennedy was elected. I've never been Armenian and I've never said Mao. what can i do, what can we do, to make everything equal? Because I feel that i've already done my part and that is not giving a shit

[–]earthmurder -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Blacks enslaved whites first, bitch.

[–]DJboomshanka -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Even worse, the black face pictures are if a ditch Christmas character who is Santa's slave, and black

[–]rhymes_with_chicken -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

ya...besides, blondes are too stupid to stand up for themselves.

[–]Zippo16 -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The people dressed in black aren't even american. They're Nordic or Swiss or something. It has to due with the "anti-Claus" or something