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This sub continues to disappoint... (self.Israel)

tayaravakninDirty American が 投稿

It has, at this point, been overrun with people downvoting anything remotely right-wing. Reddiquette, anyone? No?

Apparently any kind of defense of Israel is now taboo. Unless you argue that Israel is deliberately killing civilians, headed for apartheid, literally Hitler, etc. you're gonna be downvoted. The problem I have isn't so much with that: I don't care about the karma. What bothers me is that this indicates a wider trend, that people in the sub today are just willing to downvote rather than engage with anyone they disagree with, and try to push their posts down the page so no one else does either. I sure as heck won't go to that similarly poor /r/Israel2, where engagement is met with disdain. It's gotten me so frustrated posting here that I respond with anger or disdain.

What to do? It's almost not worth posting anymore. What's the point if no one is willing to talk, or discuss, without just downvoting? Seen a lot of new names, a lot more sarcasm and rudeness, and it's starting to get way more annoying. We should be discussing, not downvoting people who have different but legitimate opinions, just as left-wing opinions are legitimate.

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[–]ShadowxWarrior 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm an equal opportunity downvoter.

I saw that you (/u/tayaravaknin) were downvoted for no reason in some threads, I think that you just got someone so mad that he follows you around and downvotes every comment you make (probably with multiple accounts). Don't take it to heart.

[–]DementedWatchmaker 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (13子コメント)

Funny because recently, my downvoted comments in this sub are the ones presenting left wing arguments.

I think the election caused tempers to be running high, and a lot of tribalism in the threads :/

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree with what you said, and also probably people who wouldn't normally be in the sub but are coming to try to make after election drama

[–]TheMossad 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (10子コメント)

The left wing in America, because of the recent media explosion over Bibi coming to speak, has begun to think of Israel as a completely right wing state. The media has decided to make it a Republican vs Democrat issue, because that's all the Americans can comprehend living under a 2 party system, they don't know anything about the multiple parties of Israel, nor do they care to learn about them. MSNBC covered the elections nonstop, bringing in people who knew NOTHING about Israeli politics to just condemn Bibi all day. At Fox News, you could see the childish glee on the pundits faces when Bibi won, and Jon Stewart used this to show how Bibi has become the new darling of the republican party.

Another unfortunate fact is that many people think that Zionism = Right Wing Ultra-religious Settlers. So when they see someone supporting the "Zionist Union", they automatically downvote it out of ignorance.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

The left wing in America, because of the recent media explosion over Bibi coming to speak, has begun to think of Israel as a completely right wing state.

While your overall point is true, the problem is that Bibi and the Right have been playing the exact same message, but on their side. So you have right-wing voters who think Leftism is treachery here, and left-wing voters abroad who think Zionism is Rightism. It's to the point where, well, why wouldn't they? That's what the Israeli government keeps saying!

And then, let's talk about the violence last summer. Since when do we all keep mum about Jews attacking Jews?

[–]TheMossad 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

I think that regardless of if you are liberal or conservative, you should condemn and distrust Iran ,when every friday they yell "Death to America, Death to the UK, Death to Israel." Both Liberals and conservatives should condemn Hamas and BLAME Hamas for the recent wars in Gaza. But since Bibi = rightwing, and in the eyes of the American left, rightwing = wrong; that translates to Israel being wrong about everything it does as long as Bibi is PM. However I would argue that the Americans who promote this narrative are MUCH more damaging to Israeli-US relations than Bibi himself. They play on dividing the people, and I don't believe that either side really cares about Israel, they just need to take the Pro/Anti-Iran stance as their parties command them too, and Israel is the one who is getting blamed for the divisiveness, when it is really the US media, and the fact that congress has been harshly divided over every Policy Obama has proposed, the Iran deal just being the latest. The democratic party, the party that I unfortunately voted for, has turned against Israel as long as Bibi is PM, and the US media is playing it out like a soap opera.

About the Jew on Jew violence, if we are being honest with ourselves, we have to admit that there are still those in the right who are Kahanists and view the Jews that don't agree with their near-fascist views as traitors. We simply need to keep condemning them like we did when Kahane was rising in popularity.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I think that if you are liberal or conservative, you should condemn and mistrust Iran when every friday they yell "Death to America, Death to the UK, Death to Israel." Both Liberals and conservatives should condemn Hamas and BLAME Hamas for the recent wars in Gaza.

No. Conservatives should be siding with Hamas and Iran, who are, after all, regimes of religious rule and hierarchical values. The fact that they can't see how similar they are is but an aspect of their general insanity.

But since Bibi = rightwing, and in the eyes of the American left, rightwing = wrong

Admittedly, you should try looking at the American Right if you want to understand why they've generalized like that. Inside the USA, "right-wing = flagrantly evil" is actually a pretty accurate generalization!

And no, I don't mean conflicts over "teh gays" or "SJWs" or any other internet-politics issues. I mean simply: the Republican Party, which currently has the exclusive claim to be the American Right, has become a combination of rentier capitalists trying to extract as much wealth and power from society for themselves as they can, and religious dominionists, and just plain creepy people who value hierarchy for its own sake rather than for the sake of order.

I don't believe that either side really cares about Israel, they just need to take the Pro/Anti-Iran stance as their parties command them too, and Israel is the one who is getting blamed for the divisiveness

This was true until Bibi turned it into a partisan matter. Like, if Bibi didn't want this to be a partisan matter, he shouldn't have been spending his term in office openly registering himself as a Republican, and alleging that only Republicans can truly be Zionists.

Sure, Bibi seems to actually believe this shit he's spouting, or at least he keeps consistent about it if it is cynical, but he should also have been able to predict the negative consequences for Israel's relations with other countries. Problem is, he's so flagrantly delusional that he really believes he might as well alienate everyone except American Republicans, because American Republicans and similar (ie: Modi in India, who is a neoliberal right-wing religious dominionist in the Republican mode) are the only foreign non-antisemites who aren't shilling for Arab interests on the entire planet.

the fact that congress has been harshly divided over every Policy Obama has proposed, the Iran deal just being the latest. The democratic party, the party that I unfortunately voted for, has turned against Israel as long as Bibi is PM, and the US media is playing it out like a soap opera.

Yes, but the thing is, if you're clever, when you see a shitstorm, you stay the fuck out of it.

About the Jew on Jew violence, if we are being honest with ourselves, we have to admit that there are still those in the right who are Kahanists and view the Jews that don't agree with their near-fascist views as traitors. We simply need to keep condemning them like we did when Kahane was rising in popularity.

We need to admit that Yachad is a neo-Kahanist party and ban them, and that Bayit Yehudi contains no small fraction of Kahanists, and that even Likud has a sprinkling of them. We need to actually confront the neo-Kahanism that's been fucking festering in our society for years now.

[–]TheMossad 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I think you're being very unfair in your characterization of the Republican party. The Evangelical Christian side of it that you claim to be similar to Iran and Hamas is 1/5th of their party at most, and while they have their fair share of loonies, they're far from Iran or Hamas, even the crazy religious ones like Ted Cruz or Mike Huckabee are nowhere close to the Ayatollah and his dictatorship.

I think we can both agree that Bibi coming to speak to congress was tactless and damaging to the relations of Israel and the US. But when it comes to this Iran deal, Obama is completely wrong. Speaking out against Iran should be something the US should be interested in REGARDLESS of Israel. Iran is committed to de-stabilizing the entire middle east, from Bahrain to Yemen they are trying to make the gulf states their client states. It was IRAN who's Shia militias were killing US soldiers during the US occupation of Iraq. When the Free Syrian army was closing in on Damascus, it was IRAN's Hezbollah that joined the fight and killed them by the thousands, crushing what was left of the secular resistance and turing it into what they and ISIS/Al-Queda wanted, a Sunni vs Shia war. It's IRAN that turned a forward leaning Lebanon into a bitter and divided government that is near collapse at any moment. The very fact that he's trying to put forth the idea that Iran can be negotiated with is absolutely insane. Anyone should see that Iran is slowly and methodically trying to acquire a nuclear weapon, and unfortunately, this makes the Republicans right about this issue, even if they're too dumb to know why they are right and are only supporting it to seem 'tough on terror'. We can agree Bibi made a real mess of things, but Obama's pipe-dream of a legacy where he repaired relations between the US and Iran will in reality be far more damaging to the stability not just Israel, but the whole Middle East, than that Bibi coming to give a speech at the request of the Republicans.

I don't personally believe in banning political parties, it's very unliberal (is that a word?) to try to suppress a political opinion, no matter how wrong it is (as long as it is non-violent of course). I'm pretty sure whats left of the Kahanists are going with Yahad and Baruch Marzel and his group, I don't think there are many Kahanists in Bayit Yehudi or Likud at all. Again, I think you are being much too harsh in your view of the right, both in Israel and America. That being said, Israelis are generally afraid to admit that this ideology isn't dead, and we should be more vocal about confronting it.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Iran is committed to de-stabilizing the entire middle east, from Bahrain to Yemen they are trying to make the gulf states their client states.

No, they're just rivals to Saudi Arabia, who the Americans are allied with. Daesh is trying, and succeeding, to destabilize the region.

I don't personally believe in banning political parties, it's very unliberal (is that a word?) to try to suppress a political opinion, no matter how wrong it is (as long as it is non-violent of course).

Kahanists are violent.

[–]TheMossad 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, they're just rivals to Saudi Arabia, who the Americans are allied with.

Really? All you say is "No"??? I'm sorry, but you're just completely wrong about this. They have used the uprising in Syria and the destabilization of Iraq to attempt to create a Shia power base extending from Tehran all the way to Beirut. Just because Daesh is trying to destabilize the region as well doesn't mean Iran isn't. Daesh is EXACTLY the sort of enemy Iran wants and needed to make themselves look like the legitimate defenders of Shia Islam.

You don't need to remind me that Saudi Arabia are US 'allies', but perhaps you need a refresher on the countries like Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Yemen, and Bahrain where Iran is currently fighting and destabilizing/taking over the governments there.

[–]pitmotתל אביב / יהודה / לוס אנג'לס -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Left and Right don't translate from Israel to the US.

Also, most Americans do not know that Bibi and Romney in the past worked together in Boston. So rather than look like support of an old friend, Obama did his best to play victim (which he is a master of doing), and makes a narrative that conveniently fits Obama's Islamo-phile agenda.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Also, most Americans do not know that Bibi and Romney in the past worked together in Boston.

If they didn't know before, most Democrats know by now. That's why they're so fucking angry.

So rather than look like support of an old friend, Obama did his best to play victim (which he is a master of doing),

Sorry, when does Obama play victim? Have I just missed this?

makes a narrative that conveniently fits Obama's Islamo-phile agenda.

While he's certainly more Islamo-tolerant than previous American Presidents (ie: Southern and Evangelical Christian jackasses), I can't see calling him Islamophilic. But hey, I've not been soaking my brain in Republican propaganda magazines devoted to finding everything anyone associated with him does that could seem Islamophilic.

[–]pitmotתל אביב / יהודה / לוס אנג'לס 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The media makes a "self-fulfilling prophecy" by constantly trying to make some sort of backlash or drama between Bibi and the US.

It is entertainment for them. It is the content the brings in viewers easier than real thinking about real issues.

[–]Get_Low 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've had to correct so many people who think the Zionist Union is the "party of the right." I facepalm every time.

[–]ofekme 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

yea i wrote some stuff talking about the left and how some stuff they dont get (imo) and i got upvoted form what i saw.
it sucks but even in my faimly my mom and bother are upset because of the election results i think we are all a bit satly about some things that happen doing that time.
it will slowly go away as time passes by.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 36 ポイント37 ポイント  (19子コメント)

You're not being downvoted for being right-wing. You're being downvoted for conflating yemanut with Zionism. That problem is so fucking intolerably common in today's Israeli political and media landscape that the Left fucking ran as "the Zionist Camp" and you still got people saying, "I can't vote for the Zionist Camp because they don't know anything about Zionism!"

So yes, it's fucking frustrating. I'm not downvoting you, and I approved this thread despite its being reported, but it's really fucking frustrating from our end that everyone assumes we're fucking traitors if we don't vote for the Right.

[–]123456789-0 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Curious: why did you decide not to get rid of this thread?

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Because even if I totally disagree with his politics, and feel that butthurt about downvoting is pretty dumb, he's still not actually breaking any rules.

[–]StevefromRetail5 star general in the JIDF 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The fact that it got reported at all should say something about the user base that lurks in the background here. It's not your fault, I don't think there's any way to combat it. I've had a few people now follow me from different subs and harass me here, though. It's just an endless stream of neckbeards.

[–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (10子コメント)

I have never said the Zionist Camp was anti-Zionist. Why am I being downvoted? I have never argued the left is traitorous. I have argued that I don't agree with what it believes is best, but why would I be downvoted in particular? Many others have too, for perfectly legitimate disagreements.

I appreciate you allowing the thread and your civility. I respect you and our disagreements. This is not a point to be made about you, but about those who are precisely unlike you.

[–]okpbroהצפון 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

we're well past zionism. we built this country on zionism. it's done, for the most part.

now we're in a survivalism phase. THEY makin' everyone fight against one another within ourselves. scaring us, as if we're unsafe like in 2000.

you can say the ZU campaign was aggressive and anti-right, but look what caused it. look at how left wingers were percieved during the last operation in ghaza. right wing hate towards left wingers went out of line constantly. violence on the internet and in left peaceful protests.

you can say some of ZUs members have opinions you don't agree on. but they're as zionist as anyone else. the right doesn't own the flag or zionism, even doe that's how they're advertising themselves and it's what they're injecting their voters with. "not voting right is voting against the flag" bullshit.

even when the country was in it's first footsteps, people had a lot of different opinions. no one was called a traitor.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

why would I be downvoted in particular?

I have not the slightest idea.

[–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

And that's the problem. I think we can agree there.

[–]TheMossad 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

^ This post used to be -3, just so people know how true his claims really were, not even his original post, this small post right above, where him and the mod agree. Downvote brigades are a very real thing here.

[–]MikeSethSAGE OF ALL FIELDS 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I approved this thread despite its being reported

I can't be the only one who sees a problem with the fact people would report a thread like this.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well nothing tells us who reported a thread. So we can't do anything about that.

[–]leo_trotzky 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

it's really fucking frustrating from our end that everyone assumes we're fucking traitors if we don't vote for the Right.

Equally is frustrating that people needed to open /r/Israel2 because you were banning people that you do not politically agree .

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (1子コメント)

There are lots of yemanim on /r/Israel. Like you, for instance. Your tinfoil hat is showing.

[–]leo_trotzky 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I am center right, not yemani. Still you should not have banned Zionist redditors while the haters are roaming free on this subreddit..

[–]Neil_young_freak 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You think you can't engage online? Try living here!

[–]anti_humanضرب الحبيب زبيب 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not sure but I upvote every comment of yours that I read...don't mind the downvotes, it's really meaningless. For every 10 upvotes/downvotes you get, there are at least ~50 people on this sub, and many more on bigger subs, that actually read your comment and were influenced by it.

[–]yuksare 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The last week was a blatant anti-Israel week on /r/worldnews, and probably on the other political subs as well, thanks to Israel elections. So I think that this sub, /r/Israel, was simply brigaded by Israel haters from other subreddits. They will get bored soon.

[–]ShutupPussy 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's not an r/israel problem. It's a reddit problem. This is sort of the culture on the site and that's how it operates. Reading, debating, discussing requires thought and effort and simply downvoting upon first skim is just simpler and usually more instantly gratifying.

Maybe try to keep threads as specific as possible to weed out those who don't care to debate by making them seem too technical or boring.

[–]Yehuda1318החלל החיצון -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

תכלס צריך להגיב רק בעיברית.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

...עברית

[–]baflaגבעת חלפון 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think we should go back to change the sub. I feel nothing constructive can come out of discussing Israeli politics on the Internet. Just the rehashing of tired arguments. There should simply be a FAQ for people with questions and content should focus on politics only if it is something actually new. We need more stuff like Friday music. Hell, even stale memes are better than another opinion piece.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Upvote for excellent flair!

[–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (21子コメント)

They're just taking their anger at Bibi's win against us, no biggie.

In all seriousness though I know what you mean, the last time a person made a thread like this it was flooded with insensitive comments from the left and the mod shut the thread down. We will be downvoted, the majority of the people who come to this subreddit are against anything right or from religious people and that's just the reality of it.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (20子コメント)

The "us vs them" attitude being used by you/politicians/almost everyone in this country is what will break us, not the politics or the politicians.

[–]StevefromRetail5 star general in the JIDF 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I don't get it. It's not like her view is unfounded. I can think of several user accounts off the top of my head that come here to just downvote everything and talk about how Israel is the most evil country on earth.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

If you have an example of when one of those people posts and doesn't get a bunch of downvotes, I would love to see it.

[–]StevefromRetail5 star general in the JIDF -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

They do get a bunch of downvotes when they post. My point is that I think the issue that the OP noticed is actually those people just hanging around in the background and downvoting everything, possibly with multiple accounts.

Not to say it's just them -- I think there's multiple strains of people (the anti-Israel arguers, the stormfronters, the left wing non-Jews who are interested in Israel, etc). I can think of examples of each one, but the main ones I'm referring are the second and sometimes the first.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Except OP said those are the people that don't get downvoted.

[–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (8子コメント)

I agree with you, but that's just the reality of it. No point of being naive - at least people should be given respect and a chance to speak rather than being downvoted to oblivion for their choice/opinion. That's the whole point of the thread...

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Unless you're banned from the sub everyone has a chance to speak. I agree with the OP and admire the effort to get people to stop downvoting what they don't agree with, but it should start with them. Saying

Unless you argue that Israel is deliberately killing civilians, headed for apartheid, literally Hitler, etc. you're gonna be downvoted.

Is probably going to get you downvoted, because it makes the discussion less productive. I admire their effort and idk if there's a better way to change people's behavior but saying that isn't going to make them change. Going to your original post this has been a problem since before people were "taking their anger at Bibi's win" against you

[–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Unless you're banned from the sub everyone has a chance to speak.

Yeah...so based on this comment I really don't think you understand what OP's point even was. And the anger against Bibi comment was a joke, clearly when I said after "In all seriousness though".

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Didn't get the joke, sorry. I do understand what their point was I just don't think this post is helping, especially worded the way it is.

[–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I really don't see how there is anything worded badly in this. OP is expressing legitimate concerns that quite a few of us are noticing in relations to this sub, and the fact that people don't want to post on here because of it (which I've been in that place too) is sad and should be discouraged.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

How about what I quoted? People who say those things are always downvoted to nothing... So it's an exaggeration and not helpful

[–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I agree with that quote and it's not an exaggeration, maybe it is to you. You don't find it to be productive then you're not understanding OP's frustration at the way people are upvoting/downvoting here.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Could be. I know in some subs the downvote button is hidden. I wonder if that's a possibility here/how it would go over in /r/Israel.

[–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't know that anyone was going to change. If I used hyperbole out of frustration, I'm sorry. It's irrelevant to the overall point however.

[–]ofekme 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

the funny thing when war times comes no one is left or right (some extreme from both sides)

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What's funny about that? Really though, what's the connection?

[–]Yehuda1318החלל החיצון -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

איזה בולשיט.

על איזה סירטון כתבת "צודק" לפני כמה ימים? עזבי את התגובה של המחנה שלך, איך את אישית הגבת כשהעם אמר את דברו?

קישטי את עצמך תחילה.

[–]Green_Apeפלצנית 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

מה צודק

ההודעה האחרונה שלו - לכו להצביע

אני לא ככ מבינה מה הבעיה שלך... אנשים שמצביעים? אולי יש לך בעיה איתי

[–]Tallis-man 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (32子コメント)

Unless you argue that Israel is deliberately killing civilians, headed for apartheid, literally Hitler, etc. you're gonna be downvoted

You don't help yourself by exaggerating. Take a look at the recent UN thread, for example, currently on +170 and the fourth-most-upvoted thread of the month.

There's a whole bunch of very highly-upvoted comments riffing off how absurd the UN is, suggesting that it's saying Israel should be more like Saudi Arabia, joking about how people will blame Bibi as for everything else, etc.

At the other end of the spectrum there's /u/zozoped on -2, which is higher than when last I looked, with a post pointing out that the Ynet article posted is basically drivel, that none of the previous commenters have bothered to make the minimal effort required to seek out the report for themselves, and with a decent summary of the historical reasons why the UN produces such a report annually.

Frankly, I just don't believe that this subreddit downvotes 'anything remotely right-wing'.

[–]heyyoudvd 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (15子コメント)

The fact that this post sits at the top of the thread proves OP's point.

For those unfamiliar with him, Tallis-man is a pro-Hamas, anti-Israel nutjob who spends countless hours on this board with the express purpose of shitting all over Israel. He has even gone on record defending Hamas's right to kidnap Israelis.

That's the kind of shit user who has been upvoted to the top of this thread. It just goes to so how many sick-minded Israel-hating bigots come to spread their filth on this board.

[–]HouseFareye 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yeah. The fact that a Hamas apologist has the most upvotes here shows what this sub is devolving into.

You can see the way the op is being castigated and belittled as being a whiner and having a "victim complex" despite that his post was completely reasonable.

People don't want to look in the mirror or do any self examination to see if they are being fair. It's always the "other side" that is at fault.

[–]Tallis-man -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

People don't want to look in the mirror or do any self examination to see if they are being fair.

I find this especially ironic, since you've taken /u/heyyoudvd at his word that I am a 'Hamas apologist'... with the evidence apparently being a summary of IHL saying that the taking of combatant hostages was not illegal as he had claimed.

Frankly I think you owe yourself some 'self-examination', to see if you're 'being fair'.

[–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Actually, you were pretty flagrantly apologizing for Hamas's use of hostages and claiming that, despite all visible evidence, they weren't doing it for bargaining.

[–]HouseFareye 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I wasn't taking it at his own word. I read this sub all the time. I think his characterization of your opinions is accurate. Anyone can look through your history and decide for themselves though.

[–][削除されました]  (8子コメント)

[deleted]

    [–]heyyoudvd 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (7子コメント)

    First of all, you're not going to drag me back into that debate. Others can click it and read for themselves what kind of terrorist apologist garbage you posted.

    Secondly, playing this Chomsky-esque game where you place more value on politeness than on actual morality - is not going to work. You're commenting on how I've conveyed the message; I'm commenting on the actual substance of your views and posts. Going on about "petty name-calling" and "childish grudges" and "attacks" and so on won't change the fact that the actual substance you post is despicable.

    You can dress it up all you like and pretend all day that you're acting in a mature fashion, but at the end of the day, you spew bile. I've had enough lengthy discussions with you to know that you are a terrorist apologist who continually goes to bat for organizations like Hamas. You never miss an opportunity to shit all over Israel, defend anything and everything that the Palestinian leadership does, and whenever you're caught defending Hamas, you resort to the transparent excuse that you're not making moral judgments but are merely stating the facts.

    You're a perfect example of everything that's wrong with British intellectualism. You can't defend your morally abhorrent views, so you focus on the tact (or lack thereof) of those who call you out on them.

    [–][削除されました]  (6子コメント)

    [deleted]

      [–]heyyoudvd -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (5子コメント)

      If you'll notice, my initial post wasn't addressed to you. It was a reply to your post, but it was addressed to the thread, as a whole. The topic of this thread is the prevalence of anti-Israel sentiment on an Israel board. An anti-Israel bigot had the most highly upvoted post in the thread, so I pointed to that fact to show that OP's point was correct. You can drone on about personal attacks all you want, but you are part of the problem here, so that fact needed to be highlighted.

      [–]Tallis-man 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      If my post didn't contain any 'anti-Israel sentiment' then its upvote tally is, and was, irrelevant.

      You've yet to actually address the matter for all that you drone on about 'actual substance'.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (3子コメント)

      You really should have reported him long ago.

      [–]heyyoudvd 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      The thing with people like him is that he comes across sounding reasonable at first. He writes long, coherent, intelligent-sounding arguments that seem pretty convincing to those who don't know any better. It's only once you delve deep into a particular debate that you start to realize what he is. It's only once you start to challenge him and get deep into a discussion that you realize that his views are founded on anti-Israel bigotry.

      With people who come here and shout "Fuck Israel" or "Israel is a racist, apartheid state that commits genocide!" you can pick them out easily for their bullshit. But people like Tallis-man are far more frightening because he's much less obvious and much more well spoken. Those are the kinds of people that we need to watch out for.

      [–]iranianshill 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (15子コメント)

      You don't help yourself by exaggerating. Take a look at the recent UN thread, for example, currently on +170 and the fourth-most-upvoted thread of the month.

      He was obviously engaging in a little rhetoric there, no need to take it literally and the UN thread is a fucking terrible example to counter the point he is making because (1) there's literally no debate to be had on that matter and (2) it's not a topic that really involves any left/right opinions.

      On a side note, the post from /u/zozoped was a shit rebuttal. He simply explained why those reports are produced, he didn't address the fact that Israel was the only nation singled out at the UN for violations against women. Literally the only useful part of his post was how he pointed out that Ynet wrongfully said "Palestinian abuses are not noted at all".

      Even then he's grasping at straws; the word "Hamas" does not appear in the report and the PA is only praised for steps it has taken. The only party ACTUALLY named and blamed is... Israel. It talks a lot about the hardships of Palestinian women but ultimately traces all of the causes back to (1) The recent conflict (2) occupation and settlements (3) closure of Gaza, blaming Israel for these things.

      [–]Tallis-man -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (14子コメント)

      You still haven't read the report, have you?

      The claim

      the word "Hamas" does not appear in the report

      is pretty unambiguous. It's also false. The word appears four times. 'Israel' appears 11 times, mostly in the summary of recent developments at the beginning and in footnotes.

      The only party ACTUALLY named and blamed is... Israel.

      No party is 'blamed'. Just read the report before commenting on it. You'll be doing us all a favour.

      As for /u/zozoped's rebuttal, it added something to the discussion: namely, that the UN has been obliged since 1985 to produce an annual report on the situation of Palestinian women, and that the 'singling out of Israel', such as it was, wasn't due to institutional anti-Semitism at the UN. He also pointed out various inaccuracies in the article which other posters hadn't noticed, let alone commented on. As such, it shouldn't have been downvoted.

      If /u/tayaravaknin's point that the downvoting on this subreddit was political and heavily biased in favour of the left and against the right was correct, then he wouldn't have been downvoted. So I think it's a pretty solid counterexample.

      [–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (13子コメント)

      1) Some exceptions don't prove the rule. That this got so many upvotes shows at least that people feel that way, even if not fully agreeing or even if it's not objectively true all the time.

      2) The fact that the UN only has to report on Israel is the definition of institutional bias, when so many other countries do worse to their own women.

      [–]heyyoudvd 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

      2) The fact that the UN only has to report on Israel is the definition of institutional bias, when so many other countries do worse to their own women.

      I found that point of his particularly funny. He tried dismissing allegations that the UN has an immense bias against Israel - by pointing out that the UN only releases reports pertaining to Israel. That is the most self-defeating argument I've ever heard.

      Tallis-man and zozoped seem too intelligent to not see the ridiculousness of that argument, so the only conclusion to draw is that they're being deliberately deceptive for the specific purpose of demonizing the country.

      [–]Tallis-man -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

      For starters the report is about Palestinian women. It isn't a report 'pertaining to Israel' save tangentially, and even then it mentions Israel sparingly (read it!).

      And secondly, my point here and elsewhere is that there are valid reasons for the UN to report on Palestinian women which have nothing to do with any purported UN bias. That is, that the Palestinian situation -- of UN-provided refugee camps as well as other services, in the absence of a state -- is so unique that it is hardly surprising that the UN produces reports about Palestinian women uniquely as well.

      I have no interest in 'demonising' Israel. I know you think differently, though it seems pretty clear that if I were intelligent, which you generously say I am, and wanted to spend my time demonising Israel, I wouldn't do it on the /r/Israel subreddit. I honestly believe that a lot of the ill will towards the UN swilling around this subreddit is based on misunderstandings which originate from a biased media. The Ynet article is an example of that, full of lies and half-truths. I'd honestly be very surprised if people objected to this report half so vehemently after reading it.

      [–]heyyoudvd 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      See, that's a Get Out Of Jail Free card that you can use for anything. Saying that the Palestinians are "unique", therefore they're treated in a unique fashion by the UN, therefore the primary party that they're in conflict with (Israel) gets uniquely criticized - is such a lame excuse.

      Sure, there are plenty of unique qualities about the Palestinians' circumstances, but there are plenty of unique qualities about the circumstances of countless different peoples around the world. And none of them get the kind of attention that the Palestinians do. The fact that the Palestinians even have their own refugee agency that is completely separate from the one that deals with all other refugees on Earth (UNRWA vs UNHCR) and provides cash and benefits that no one else in the world receives - really shows you just how ridiculous the UN is with regards to the Palestinians.

      This whole "they're unique" argument just doesn't fly because objectively speaking, there are so many groups on Earth that are so much more oppressed, have so far fewer rights, such lower living standards, much less sovereignty, and far more problems with their neighbors - than the people of Gaza and the West Bank do. In other words, the UN should be giving a hell of a lot more priority to a hell of a lot more groups than it does to the Palestinians. But it doesn't. It singles out the Palestinians for sympathy in perpetuity, and it attacks Israel more than anyone else on Earth - by far. That's why any attempt to justify this women's report is absurd. The fact that no one else receives such a report, but the Palestinians do (and it attacks Israel, of course), shows just how ridiculous the whole thing is.

      Finally, for you to even imply that the UN doesn't have a radical anti-Israel bias is insane and you know it. This is especially true of the Human Rights Council. I hope you're not going to try to defend that sham of an organization. I don't think even you could find a way to justify their lynch mob behaviour.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      For starters the report is about Palestinian women. It isn't a report 'pertaining to Israel' save tangentially, and even then it mentions Israel sparingly (read it!).

      Oh fuck right off.

      That is, that the Palestinian situation -- of UN-provided refugee camps as well as other services, in the absence of a state -- is so unique that it is hardly surprising that the UN produces reports about Palestinian women uniquely as well.

      Hahahaha no.

      [–]Tallis-man -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (6子コメント)

      You clearly haven't read the report either. It isn't a report 'on Israel'. The report is entitled Situation of and assistance to Palestinian women, and the UN is required to produce it annually as a result of the 1985 Nairobi Convention (at least according to /u/zozoped, I haven't checked). This was imposed upon the UN by member states; hence, the UN isn't 'institutionally biased'.

      The reason that Palestinian women are given their own report is presumably partly that they don't have a state that can report on the condition of women, and partly that the UN has a significant role in the region. If you read the report it's actually pretty good at treading an impartial line.

      As for (1), I agree that my example doesn't disprove your pattern, but it was simply the first that sprang to mind; I have seen little evidence of your posited anti-right-wing bias. As for the upvotes, I think a lot of people are irritated at the voting patterns in this subreddit, even if they disagree with your idea that they generally tend to work against the right. My own posts have ranged from -35 to +~20, without there really being much of a pattern, and I imagine I'd be described as 'left-leaning'.

      I think on the whole that a lot of people downvote credible arguments they dislike to avoid engaging with them, but I don't think such behaviour is confined to any single political wing.

      [–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (5子コメント)

      This was imposed upon the UN by member states; hence, the UN isn't 'institutionally biased'.

      This is caused by institutional problems.

      The reason that Palestinian women are given their own report is presumably partly that they don't have a state that can report on the condition of women, and partly that the UN has a significant role in the region. If you read the report it's actually pretty good at treading an impartial line.

      Let's be perfectly honest, if the problem was that a report couldn't be had then many, many other countries would need them. I'd encourage you to find the basis for the report, then talk about it. As far as I'm aware, they're required to write up reports every year on this (which is an institutional problem, the UN being undemocratic and biased is part of its structural deficiencies in my opinion, though they can't be easily remedied in any way I can think of), and the fact that only Palestinian women are singled out as requiring a report of their own is pretty...fishy, to put it lightly.

      I think on the whole that a lot of people downvote credible arguments they dislike to avoid engaging with them, but I don't think such behaviour is confined to any single political wing.

      It's my opinion, and my observation. The fact that many seem to agree is at least indicative of the feeling being fairly widespread.

      [–]Tallis-man -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (4子コメント)

      The fact that many seem to agree is at least indicative of the feeling being fairly widespread.

      I upvoted this post, because I think voting behaviour in this subreddit deserves discussion, but I disagree with your opinion on the political pattern of this behaviour. I suspect there are others! So I wouldn't assume that all your up-voters agree with everything you've written.

      Let's be perfectly honest, if the problem was that a report couldn't be had then many, many other countries would need them.

      Well perhaps, but also being perfectly honest the advantage of writing a report on Palestine is that there's no government for it to embarrass; a government which would almost certainly obstruct an impartial and free-ranging investigation at every turn.

      [–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

      I upvoted this post, because I think voting behaviour in this subreddit deserves discussion, but I disagree with your opinion on the political pattern of this behaviour. I suspect there are others! So I wouldn't assume that all your up-voters agree with everything you've written.

      I was more talking about the comments, but that's fine.

      Well perhaps, but also being perfectly honest the advantage of writing a report on Palestine is that there's no government for it to embarrass; a government which would almost certainly obstruct an impartial and free-ranging investigation at every turn.

      So, an institutional problem related to UN power to accurately report by having UN members accede to its authority, leading to inherent bias and a problem in reporting, since the Palestinian Authority is one of those repressive governments that will restrict access to an "impartial and free-ranging investigation" as you put it.

      [–]Tallis-man -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      You still seem to be assuming that the purpose of this report is to embarrass Israel. Read it! If that is its purpose, it's doing a dismal job.

      There is obviously a degree of 'pro-Palestinian' bias in the UN, because it is responsible for various aspects of Palestinian life which would otherwise be the purview of a Palestinian state. Obviously it cannot remain silent when Israeli munitions hit a UN school or a UN peacekeepers' military base, although in normal circumstances these would be another nation's school and another nation's military base and the UN involvement wouldn't be so direct. If my grammatical pedantry didn't prevent it, I would call this 'pro-palestinian' bias: in support of the rights of the people, not any political identity claiming to represent them. But from what I have seen this does not translate into an 'anti-Israel' bias. You, and many others on this board, disagree; fine, but I don't think this report can be used as evidence in your favour.

      [–]tayaravakninDirty American[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      You still seem to be assuming that the purpose of this report is to embarrass Israel. Read it! If that is its purpose, it's doing a dismal job.

      I disagree.

      As at September 2014, some 1.8 million Palestinians in the Gaza Strip remained effectively isolated from the rest of the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, by the continuing closure by Israel.

      No mention of Egypt's closure, of course. Much of the report focuses on Israeli-Palestinian clashes, which are not the report's mission. Read the recommendations section: it recommends plenty that Israel must do, but never once mentions anything the State of Palestine must do, despite having influence/power over many areas. It only lauds the State of Palestine for its actions, mentioning little else. Did you miss that?

      Not only has media picked up on it as doing so, and poorly so, the UN continued its anti-Israel streak. It's well-understood.

      [–]discographyA 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (12子コメント)

      Define:"legitimate opinion"?

      [–]BattlerBaster 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      Read your comment again and realize what you just said.

      [–]discographyA -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Deep inapplicable thoughts you got there big guy.

      [–]Rehald(Texas) חו"ל -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (9子コメント)

      Typical Reddit Leftist, "anything that is against my narrative is wrong fundie republican fiction"

      [–]discographyA 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      Typical presumptive ass that has no idea what my beliefs are but that won't stop them from projecting.

      [–]juden-shikker 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Typical presumptive ass that has no idea what my beliefs

      Oh I think we might

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (6子コメント)

      Getting really tired of your shit. Play nice and learn the first thing or two about Israel rather than fucking Texas, or there will be repercussions.

      [–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      What kind of a mod are you, honestly? There are so many comments that are condescending and worse than Rehald's but you chose to target him and attack where he's from, that's just ridiculous and petty.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      The kind of mod who keeps quiet when shadowbanning an obnoxious user, after getting called a dirty kike the last time.

      [–]Rehald(Texas) חו"ל 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

      /r/Israel is the new /r/Texas everyone, ugh.

      " Play nice and learn the first thing or two about Israel rather than fucking Texas"

      • I actually try to be nice, but when someone spits at your ideology and calls you out as either supporting ignorants or racists it can get hard. Don't expect someone to respond with a smile after he was given the middle finger.

      • Freedom of expression is the backbone of a democratic system, regardless of whether someone voted Meretz or Shas, they should be given an equal voice in every platform and social circle. Do I approve of Meretz? Not at all, but I have never ever suggested that they should be silenced. We are all Israelis in the end and thinking such thoughts is a childish process. I do however call out on people who think that censorship somehow makes their argument the correct one.

      • You are implying that I don't know nothing about my country, which is vile and insulting. You are making an assumption that just because of my politics I know less about Israel than someone of your political views. I'll tell you this: I also was born in Israel, I also speak Hebrew, I also am going to serve in the IDF after college even though I can try and avoid it. Just because the great State of Texas can influence me, doesn't mean I am less of an Israeli than you, or any other user in this sub is.

      • Also, why "fucking Texas"? Why hate on the Lone star state? I remember that other ex-pats brandish their places of residence yet it seems you only have a problem with the place I have called a second home. "Don't generalize or judge", Isn't that something many people from the left say all the time?

      Please understand my viewpoint in this, many Right wingers are felt like they are being singled out and blamed for all the country's problems almost daily.(Sounds familiar)?

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      Also, why "fucking Texas"? Why hate on the Lone star state?

      Because you talk more like an American than an Israeli. You talk about civil marriage meaning the state forces churches to marry gays. This is not even how the issue is framed in Israel. So yeah, you talk like a Texan, you get taken for a Texan, and treated like a Texan.

      [–]Rehald(Texas) חו"ל 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      I was talking about how that could be a future issue in Israeli politics. Obviously the debate for gay marriage is not in focus due to other problems. Also it ain't my fault that you interpret my messages in a certain way. Just because I text "ya'll" doesn't mean I am a less of an Israeli than you (When it comes to my knowledge).

      Also, many /r/worldpolitics brigadiers come here and defend Hamas anyways regardless of whether they are EVEN ISRAELI or not. Would they get the same level of flak?

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Also, many /r/worldpolitics brigadiers come here and defend Hamas anyways regardless of whether they are EVEN ISRAELI or not. Would they get the same level of flak?

      Yes, yes they do.

      [–]Lord_KhamulRachel "Roadkill" Corrie 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (13子コメント)

      Keep in mind the downvoters here are not Israeli and are anti Israelis. every post in this sub political or not is targeted by voting brigades.

      The mods should disable the downvote option here or make downvotes available only to subscribers.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel[M] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      The mods should disable the downvote option here or make downvotes available only to subscribers.

      Actually, let me go investigate the latter.

      [–]123456789-0 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Might as well get rid of the up vote while you're at it. Otherwise you'll just start getting complaints about how certain comments are getting too many up votes & others too few.

      [–]anti_humanضرب الحبيب زبيب 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I just subscribed now, never subscribe to anything because I view reddit...differently. In any case it's meaningless, anyone can subscribe. The best way would have been if Reddit let certain small subs have non-anonymous upvotes/downvotes, since the majority of downvotes and upvotes don't contribute anything to any discussion.

      [–]justjacobmusic 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I'm pretty sure there are users and/or bots out there downvoting any submissions to this sub. I've posted stuff here in the past that wasn't remotely political but was still substantive that got downvoted initially down to nothing, then gradually upvoted again to a couple positive points above 1. I've never had a thread really blow up on this sub.

      It might be the case that there are people out there going even further to downvote right-wing content, but it may also be the case that this content is just being downvoted as much as anything else. (At least initially.)

      [–]zenyara 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Looking for signs of intelligent life on Reddit? How's that working for you?

      [–]DueyDerp 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      You're not alone. /r/australia is exactly the same. Also, nearly every post is politically related.

      [–]saargrinfulltime Zionist Shill 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I dunno,i typically get upvoted for pro Israel conments..
      Ever on /worldnews

      [–]iranianshill 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      It'll get better once the anti-Netanyahu hysteria starts to die down.

      [–]chabanais -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      Reddit is filled with mindless Leftists who celebrate diversity by downvoting everything.

      [–]Tallis-man -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I laughed, but I think it'd be a better joke if you replaced 'diversity' with 'equality'

      [–]OuiNon -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

      [–]zbengo -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (14子コメント)

      Agreed, this is one of the reasons you cant really stay on this subreddit for too long.

      First of all, our mods are biased and don't control the trollers on the subreddit. not to mention there are few individuals here with many alt accounts who downvote brigade anything that considered to be pro Israel or favoring Bibi and the right.

      This subreddit is pretty accurate reflections of the life in Israel, the media is completely biased and out of touch of the Israeli reality, kinda like the mods and the Anti Israel haters who lurk this subreddit. Wish we could vote for a some new mods who will balance the atmosphere in this subreddit. Until then, there is no real point of participating in this subreddit.

      [–]discographyA 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (10子コメント)

      A right winger with a persecution complex and belief in a media conspiracy. Don't see those too often!

      [–]HouseFareye 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (8子コメント)

      This comment is a case in point about what he's talking about.

      You're just name calling and people are upvoting you for it.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      He's name-calling, but it's pretty damned accurate to how the Right ran its campaign.

      [–]discographyA -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (6子コメント)

      If someone is going to behave like a total cliche they shouldn't be surprised if someone laughs at them for it. The right wing of countries like the US and Israel consistently control almost all the power structures and positions of privilege (media included) and whine like they're Jesus being nailed to a cross. Sorry, that level of obtuseness and purposeful ignorance deserves all the mockery it gets.

      [–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

      The right wing of countries like the US and Israel consistently control almost all the power structures and positions of privilege (media included)

      A left winger with a persecution complex and belief in a media conspiracy. Don't see those too often!

      See? It goes both ways, so have a seat.

      [–]discographyA 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      I see you made no sense, but not whatever point you think you had.

      [–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      .....dafuq.jpg

      Can you please form a grammatically correct sentence? I have no idea what you're trying to say. Actually, don't even bother responding. Probably not worth my time anyways.

      [–]eaturbrainzsmolan alive in israel, smolan making album of israel 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Well, I don't know about media, but the Right certainly has a substantial majority in the Knesset. So he's correct about that one.

      [–]HouseFareye 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      What was actually the point of your original comment? I am actually curious. You didn't present any evidence. You didn't make an actual argument. It was all just ad hominem insult. All snark, all smirk, all smarm, but nothing else.

      [–]discographyA 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      The point was obvious as the comment I was replying to was nothing but a long screed on how persecuted he is on the right and the media not aligning with his views. If you don't see that it's because you willfully do not want to see it or are illiterate.

      [–]merchant_of_death -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Right wingers whine about their own situation and how they think they're treated. Leftists whine about treatment of others. Its in his nature.

      [–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      Until then, there is no real point of participating in this subreddit.

      I've said this so many times on here that it's sad, but you shouldn't let the downvotes or the attitude in this sub get to you. It is frustrating but there needs to be different people on here - that's the whole point of interacting on reddit! :]

      [–]Yehuda1318החלל החיצון 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      במהלך השבת חשבתי על פשוט ללכת לסבים אחרים. יש פה יותר מדי שנאה כלפנו, ואפילו ישראלים מהצד השני של המפה בשרשרת תגובות כאן "כאילו" לא מבינים מה מפריע לנו.

      [–]Moroccan_princessירושלים של זהב 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      כי הם חרות, לא צריכים להתייחס אליהם כמו שהם לא מתייחסים אלינו- אבל לא צריכים ליברוח מכאן כי זה בדיוק מה הם רוצים! :]

      [–]harediharediharedim -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Also the mods remove anything posted from what they deem to be 'right-wing' source.

      We can't post here from the most popular media in the US (Fox), or the most popular media in Israel (Israel Today)

      [–]Agnos 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Do not let 'downvote/upvote' influence your discussions, present your arguments and be happy if read and responded. This kind of shit happens in most subreddits anyway (from my experience). In a smaller sub like this one it is not important anyway as even if a comment is buried under threshold, it does not take long to scroll and read. Anyway, each downvote you get means someone read your message :)

      [–]richjew 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      This sub has been overrun by foreigners looking in on Israel. It's just Netanyahu is the anti-christ and blah blah Palestinians.

      [–]Rain_When_I_Die 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      It's not just this subreddit, it is all of reddit. Reddit is dominated by the young, typically naive, leftist SJW demographic and they think their collective view on here is a reflection of the collective view of society but it's not. They also think because they are doing some BA in humanities or philosophy that they are suddenly more educated than others. People tend to smarten up after they leave college, have to find a job and gain some life experience outside of their hipster campus environment.

      [–]anti_humanضرب الحبيب زبيب [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

      The timeless quote falsely attributed to Winston Churchill is always one of my favorites:

      "If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain."