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[–]PancakeZombie 169 ポイント170 ポイント  (143子コメント)

Wait. So if the animal didn't suffer, it's cool for vegans to eat it?

Edit: guys, calm your tits. You realize this is /r/shittyaskscience, right?

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 64 ポイント65 ポイント  (105子コメント)

No. Take wool for example, in theory you could take it harmlessly. But to get wool, you have to breed sheep, castrate them, and they often eat the sheep, and big retailers have some cruel shearing practices.

But some vegans would be cool with it if it were, say a pet that needed to be shaved anyways, or like a moulting rabbit (there's angora bunnies)

They would not be ok with milk because to get milk you have to breed, and often the babies are killed, even in the most humane farm.

Some are ok with eggs if they're, say, rescue hens. But they're not ok if they will be eaten or were ordered from a hatchery, because hatcheries sell meat chicks, and kill/sell old chickens

[–]xcalibur866 210 ポイント211 ポイント  (75子コメント)

Call me weak willed, but damn veganism sounds like a giant waste of energy, time, and effort.

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? 62 ポイント63 ポイント  (53子コメント)

It's not a waste if it's something that makes you happier with yourself.

[–]xcalibur866 47 ポイント48 ポイント  (19子コメント)

That's exactly what I'm saying. Doing this wouldn't make me happy, so it's hard for me to see exactly how it could make anyone happy. But to each their own.

[–]Thepunk28 36 ポイント37 ポイント  (18子コメント)

so it's hard for me to see exactly how it could make anyone happy.

It's probably hard for a vegan to see how meat from animals in bad living conditions makes you happy. If that helps put it in perspective.

[–]Dentarthurdent42 33 ポイント34 ポイント  (15子コメント)

I'm pretty sure most vegans once ate and enjoyed meat, so they probably understand the joys of bacon and know that most people are unaware of just how poorly most of the animals are treated.

[–]sqrrl101neuroseismologist 37 ポイント38 ポイント  (6子コメント)

A lot of vegans I've spoken with say they never really enjoyed bacon, which I find interesting. Assuming my anecdata is generalisable to the larger population, it suggests to me several possibilities:

  • It's easier to become and stay vegan if one doesn't particularly like bacon in the first place, as most people who do like bacon would find it too hard.

  • Many vegans lie to themselves about how fucking amazing bacon is, in order to make their dietary choice easier to maintain.

  • A vegan diet selectively impairs memory for the taste of certain foods. I would postulate an as-yet unidentified factor present in bacon that improves mnemonic function.

  • Empathy for animals and dislike of bacon are both dependent on an unknown variable, possibly the function of a specific brain region or receptor protein.

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I have been vegan for 2.5 years. I used to absolutely love bacon. I'd put bacon on anything and eat it as often as I could. The reason I became vegan had nothing to do with not liking the flavor of meat, but how it is obtained and what it did to the health of my body and my environment.

Bacon has a heavy umami, salty, smoky taste with a firm and crispy yet slightly chewy texture. This can be achieved with shiitake or king oyster mushrooms, coconut, eggplant, etc. The texture and flavors are easily replicated and the fact that no sentient being had to be exploited in any way makes it taste that much better to me.

[–]apatite 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Bacon has a heavy umami, salty, smoky taste with a firm and crispy yet slightly chewy texture.

Fuck. Now I want some bacon.

[–]Kriegbuzzaxe77 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I eat meat, but hate bacon, and any other meats that come from pigs or cows. So I am more of a Fish and Poultry eating kinda-omnivore. Especially since there are several vegetables I also won't eat. (Such as Spinach. YUK!)

[–]meteotrio 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not everyone that eats meat likes bacon.

[–]DrTad 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

fuck that was funny :D

[–]bangwhimper 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not a vegan, but a vegetarian who tries to eat vegan whenever possible. For me, I used to love bacon and meat in general, and for the first few years of vegetarianism, I missed them terribly -- but I couldn't reconcile the pleasure of eating them with the pain that animals went through in the farming process, which is what kept me going.

I found that, about two years in, I started to lose all desire for meat. Now, at 8 years in, I actually get sick when I smell meat cooking, and the thought repulses me. I think it's just the body adjusting, you know?

[–]11War 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (4子コメント)

A lot of people get grossed out by eating something that was once alive, feels, etc.

[–]yourlycantbsrs 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

More people should be grossed out by eating something that directly caused unnecessary suffering, don't you think?

[–]Username_IV 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Fuck, i'd eat people if it were legal. Seems like a waste to let all that perfectly good meat rot in box.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Talk about diseases...

[–]jumb1 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's going to be interesting when lab-made meat becomes a real thing, produced in bulk.

[–]D0wnb0at -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I have lots of muslim friends, that is the only thing I cant understand about their religion... no bacon

[–]BoneHead777 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

A friend of mine was raised muslim. She gets asked about the pork thing a lot, since she sticks to it. Her answer is usually a variation of "You don't miss what you've never known"

[–]Veloci-Tractor 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

they also come to understand that joy is a falsehood

[–]ZSlender -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Because it's salty and mmm

[–]Zazomazo101 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

But bacon

[–]kuilin 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So, don't do it if it doesn't make you happy.

Doesn't that apply to everything? Can I say I'm a vegan because I'm happy with eating meat?

[–]MarionQ 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Yeah that's true. For example eating meat makes me happy so I eat it everyday

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Then keep doing it man. Whatever makes you happy.

[–]yourlycantbsrs 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (3子コメント)

What if kicking children makes them happy? Should they keep doing it?

[–]ChaoticMidget 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

This is needlessly antagonistic. If anything, the kicking children thing is closer to eating meat than being vegan is.

[–]EauEwe 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

How is this needlessly antagonistic? Pargmegarg's entire reasoning was that it was okay because it makes you happy.

[–]ilikeeatingbrains"Ouch!" "Quiet vagina, I'm masturbating." 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And those fookin' kids could use a good fong in the arse

[–]ifyourheadexplodes -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (23子コメント)

Cutting out a chunk of your brain might make you happier than a clam, but I'm not going to ever find out

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (22子コメント)

Okay. But that's not exactly analogous. Not eating meat won't lobotomize you.

[–]ifyourheadexplodes 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (21子コメント)

It also means broad statements like "if it makes you feel better, it's good" are illogical and often wrong

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (20子コメント)

I was more getting at if something is harmless to yourself and others and makes you happy, then why not do it?

[–]yourlycantbsrs 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (14子コメント)

Eating meat harms animals.

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (13子コメント)

Animals aren't people. It's not the same thing. Not valuing an animal's life is on a whole different playing field than not valuing a human's life. I personally won't eat animals because I disagree with it but it's someone's personal choice to either eat meat or not.

[–]ifyourheadexplodes -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (4子コメント)

And I was saying that doesn't play out well logically in all scenarios

[–]pargmegargWhat is this thing? Is this an email? -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

What scenarios does it not play out in?

[–]Username_IV -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Plus, all the satisfaction you get from constantly telling everyone you know you're a vegan. I wonder what would happen if we put a vegan, and a person on paleo, in the same room? Who would talk the other person to death first?

[–]SepDot 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (6子コメント)

My ex was vegan. Huge pain in the ass.

[–]ilikeeatingbrains"Ouch!" "Quiet vagina, I'm masturbating." 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Do all vegans have huge cocks?

[–]SepDot 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I see what you did there! ;)

[–]kuilin 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Ahh, the old Reddit switcharoo

[–]ilikeeatingbrains"Ouch!" "Quiet vagina, I'm masturbating." -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

You can say that again

[–]funkensteinberg -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That again.

PS: hmb, I'm going in...

[–]benjimann91 -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hold my cock, I'm going in!

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why?

[–]CIDC -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (11子コメント)

It seems like a waste of time an energy, but it's the same as anything, if enough people change, people will notice. Tear drops in the sea :)

[–]mayorbryjames 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (10子コメント)

Hey I'm making a McDonald's run, you want anything?

[–]landon0605 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Their meat barely qualifies as an animal product though.

[–]mayorbryjames 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (6子コメント)

So vegans eat there? Fuckin hipsters.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Not even their fries are vegan

[–]mayorbryjames -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (4子コメント)

"How can you tell if someone's vegan?"

"They'll fucking tell you"

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

How can you tell if some idiot is going to post this exact "joke" whenever the word vegan is mentioned?

Don't worry, it gets said every fucking time.

[–]CIDC -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Vegi deli wrap large meal with a Fanta safe x

[–]mayorbryjames 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You got it. I'll get a receipt so you can pay me back.

[–]plainOldFool 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I've researched the egg bit and there are some vegans who are opposed to any use of eggs as it seems hens will eat the unfertilized eggs. I don't know if that is true, but I found it fascinating.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yes hens will eat their eggs. The Vegans I know with chickens don't eat the eggs

[–]YouPickMyNameSchrödinger's dog 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

"Let's feed out chickens less and make them eat their own periods instead. It's the humane thing to do."

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

That's not what they do. Even free feeding (food out all the time) they'll still eat their eggs. Chickens love eggs

And they're ovulations, not periods

[–]YouPickMyNameSchrödinger's dog 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm just kidding, I know nothing about chickens.

[–]irishchris1991Post-Scientific Methodgynist 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

How many vegans with pet chickens do you know?

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

1 in person. The rest are on /r/vegan

And I've met a few at BYC

[–]Smells0fChipotle 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

So Vegans are against beating the meat?

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not anymore than someone against Spanking a monkey

[–]Jeux_d_Oh 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (9子コメント)

This makes me think of a question I often ask to vegetarians: Imagine, a cow that has an accident with one of its legs (broken for example), and it has to be amputated: would/could you eat that leg-meat? Until now, every single one replied that they would not eat the meat, for a whole host of reasons...

[–]RazecewInverse Particle Analyst 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Assuming this is a pet cow who will benefit from the operation, and eating it poses no health risks, there's no logical reason not to eat it. Same for human amputations as well. Evolutionarily, we avoid cannibalism due to same-species disease risks, but with modern medicine that could be screened for. If you can stomach that hardwired disgust, why not celebrate a friend's traumatic leg injury with a little BBQ?

Similarly, note that the breeding of animals for our own pleasure and not for the welfare of animals highlights some logical inconsistencies. If we follow the standard premise that we are justified in hurting/eating animals due to our perceived superiority of intelligence, why eat pigs? Scientifically, fully developed pigs are shown to be roughly as intelligent as a human three-year-old. In castrating, tail-docking, and occasionally accidentally boiling or disembowelling pigs alive, we then must logically find no issue with making tasty torture meals of the mentally handicapped, young children, and really anyone you deem less intelligent than you. Or, perhaps we should treat/eat/not eat creatures according to their capacity to suffer, not their capacity to think or resemble humanity.

[–]Jeux_d_Oh 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, avoiding cannibalism is not specific for humankind, most animals do not eat their own kind. We already don't eat (or reject the idea of eating) the more intelligent animals: dolphins, elephants, monkeys, whales, etc. Your notion of eating animals that suffer the least seems noble, but that means that you're ethically allowed to kill animals just because they don't suffer as much; that's quite the punishment... It could also mean that people that are somehow not able to suffer very much (because of a defect in their sensory nervous system for example), they could be more 'eligible' to be eaten... idk, it's a very difficult dilemma.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Well I eat meat and I wouldnt eat it either

A lot wouldn't even eat synthetic meat just because it becomes gross after a whilw

[–]Jeux_d_Oh 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Well that was often their response, they would not eat it because 'meat tastes gross'. Which makes me wonder their true motives from time to time... Because you DO throw something away that is perfectly edible, with no (intentional) suffering for the animal who lost the leg; the animal lost it anyway! Out of curiosity: why would you not eat it?

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Because to amputate it they'd have to get medication, and unless it was amputated immediately it could have infection and crap in it

It's not really wasteful, Most people don't eat amputations

[–]Jeux_d_Oh -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Well, you're right in giving these practical reasons, but even asked just theoretically (so no infections/medications etc. in the meat) they would not eat it. But how is it then not wasteful? If you're eating a chickenwing or meat from a cow's leg, you're essentially eating an amputation too...

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Idk. Just seems icky. Lol, I know I'm mature.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I mean, if this were to really happen, I could eat it. It just seems wrong.

But we don't amputate cows legs anyways, we kill them

[–]Jeux_d_Oh 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

There you are, posing these practical problems again ;) The whole question/dilemma is mostly theoretical, of course.

[–]meanderlingsciencer 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Why is castrating sheep bad but neutering dogs good?

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sheep are castrated by either putting a rubber band around their scrotum, or cut open without painkillers

We generally don't neuter dogs like that

[–]Dentarthurdent42 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (5子コメント)

They would not be ok with milk because to get milk you have to breed, and often the babies are killed, even in the most humane farm.

So... are vegans anti-PETA?

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

PETA is anti-pet ownership. They operate 0 animal shelters. They do not and have never claimed to save the lives of cats and dogs, except by reducing the disease and overpopulation spread by these animals. It is certainly an extreme stance but not a hypocritical one.

There's no real data of course, but IME vegans are probably 25/75 pro-/anti-PETA.

[–]irishchris1991Post-Scientific Methodgynist 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Most vegans support PETA's objectives. Some do not support their tactics.

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

This is definitely an accurate statement. The average vegan response to PETA is probably something along the lines of "well they can be assholes, but those assholes are getting shit done."

[–]meanderlingsciencer 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What shit are they getting done? All I've seen of PETA is making weird naked commercials, handing out flyers (which are killing trees! won't someone think of the trees), and taking up all the parking spaces outside my work because they're protesting.

[–]CochinBrahmaLover -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Some are. The most reasonable ones I've ever met are.

Only the crazies support peta ime

/r/vegan has a lot of peta supporters interestingly, first people I ever met. They usually justify the killing with 'yeah but they usually get the maimed / tortured animals that are beyond saving'. But a lot of vegans like that peta gets shit done, even if they're crazy. But some flat out hate peta

[–]ucvgabe -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yknow the animal is already dead when you buy it, right? You not buying a pack of ham off of a shelf isn't going to save that pig, it's already slaughtered...

[–]CochinBrahmaLover 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

But not buying it means not giving money to them so theyll kill more...

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (30子コメント)

not necessarily "suffer." A vast number of vegans are against the idea of taking advantage of animals. Does milking a cow or eating an unfertilized egg do harm to the animals? no. But you're taking advantage of them and they have no real way of consenting or defending so vegans who prescribe to that mindset view it as morally wrong.

[–]justin_timeforcake 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (29子コメント)

In the case of milk and eggs, it goes beyond "taking advantage" of animals. When egg-laying hens are bred, half the chicks are male (thus non-productive). Those male chicks are ground up alive or left to die in dumpsters. The females go to live in cramped, dirty conditions. They've been selectively bred to produce an unnatural amount of eggs, which depletes their bodies of needed nutrients, so generally they have poor health. They have their beaks cut off without anesthesia. They are usually put through periods of starvation to cause 'forced moulting'...something about this makes them produce more eggs. Then they are killed at a small fraction of their lifespan when their production begins to slow down.

Similar case for milk; cows have to be impregnated to produce milk, so when they give birth, their calves are taken away immediately. Usually they become veal, or if the calf is female, becomes a dairy cow like her mother. Cows go through back-to-back lactation cycles for a few years, and then get killed when their milk production slows down. Again, they are bred (and given hormones in some cases) to produce way more milk than what is healthy for their bodies to give, and are often kept in bad and stressful conditions.

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (25子コメント)

I think my mind always goes to "free range" when thinking about eggs. I've been getting those for so long I almost forget the reason why I do. It's disgusting. Humans suck.

[–]justin_timeforcake 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (21子コメント)

It's great of you to be making conscious choices to reduce suffering, but unfortunately most of what I described above happens to "free-range" chickens as well. The only difference is that they are kept in big sheds with hundreds of other chickens, with barely enough space to move, instead of being kept in tiny cages with no space to move.

A lot of the ways that humans treat animals that we use for food (and clothing, and entertainment) really do suck. But the positive way of looking at it is that it's not really that hard to at least stop contributing towards it, and more and more people are doing exactly that.

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (20子コメント)

Goddammit so what eggs should I buy? Sometimes I get from local farmers but it gets expensive

[–]Ganoes-Stabro_Paran 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't know about you, but I buy them in Sicily at one cent apiece and transfer them to Malta secretly at four and a half cents apiece in order to get the price of eggs up to seven cents when people come to Malta looking for them.

[–]Kriegbuzzaxe77 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Eggs from local farmers are the way to go.

[–]justin_timeforcake -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (17子コメント)

Do you really need to eat eggs? Tofu scramble is amazing, you can easily replace eggs in baking with flax seeds or a whole list of other things, and there are wonderful egg-free mayos on the market.

[–]Kriegbuzzaxe77 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

You cannot make cake or cookies without eggs, neither one works without eggs. Just get ones from local farmers that you know properly take care of their chickens.

[–]justin_timeforcake -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I make cake and cookies without eggs all the time. Sorry, but you're just wrong.

And what does "properly take care of their chickens" even mean? Did you read several comments up where I gave a list of reasons why vegans don't eat eggs? Those things still apply to even the smallest commercial egg producers.

[–]Kriegbuzzaxe77 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (5子コメント)

No they don't, not to the ones I buy eggs from. They do not kill or otherwise mistreat male chickens, they actually DO let them be free range and they do not have any cages or fences either. Where I live (in Northern Indiana), most farms are small, family farms that actually treat their animals as ethically and humanely as possible, they are not the factory farms that do all the stuff vegans oppose to.

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (8子コメント)

Why must everything delicious be either unhealthy or amoral?

[–]RazecewInverse Particle Analyst 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you want to earn money, a really easy way is to mug someone and then force them to empty their bank account for you. Similarly, getting things your body needs is as easy as eating another body. Sometimes the easy way isn't the right way.

Animal products are almost hard to cook badly - they come pre-loaded with have a good mixture of what a body needs. Everything that's not from an animal has what a body needs, but you have to mix it yourself, i.e. know how to cook, or find someone who can. Cooking of any type involves knowing, intuitively or otherwise, how to mix the right type and amount of fat/protein/carbs etc. that your body craves. That said, I'm not the best chef and don't think I can personally cook any vegan food that could outmatch a really good steak but trust me, if you ever check out a restaurant such as Blossom in NYC, you'll know I'm not exaggerating when I say that any food can be ungodly good.

Protip: try cooking things in canned coconut milk.

[–]justin_timeforcake 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Depends what you mean by unhealthy, but I can think of a lot of foods that are delicious and at least don't cause animal suffering:

  • guacamole

  • hummus

  • peanut butter & frozen banana smoothies

  • veg thai curry

  • veg sushi

  • tempeh bacon, coconut bacon

  • curry-coconut butternut squash soup

  • pesto

  • sundried tomatoes

  • portobello mushroom burgers

  • apple crumble

...I could go on and on. Basically apart from "hunk of meat" meals like steak and porkchops, pretty much any dish can be made vegan. Whether or not it's delicious just depends on how well you can follow a recipe.

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Oh well yeah, there are many delicious and healthy things out there (i love most of what you listed. The ones i don't love I merely have yet to try). i guess I was just thinking broadly and talking about meat and most desserts lol

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

"Free range" is a bullshit marketing term, all it means is that the chickens aren't strictly kept in their own tiny cage for their entire lives. These chickens are "free-range". They are not happy or healthy.

The chickens are still born in, and will die in prison. But free-range chickens get to share their sentences in one giant, cold, dark, bare concrete prison instead of a slightly different cold, dark, bare prison with tiny cells.

[–]theathenian11the shittyscience guy 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Dammit all to hell

[–]HARSHING_MY_MELLOW 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The bright side is that eggs are completely unnecessary to having a varied and healthy diet!

[–]Gradual_Bro -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Why is that most vegans will do just about anything to make a sure a fucking chicken doesn't suffer while ignoring the masses of suffering and starving children across the world?

[–]justin_timeforcake 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

ignoring the masses of suffering and starving children across the world?

What is your evidence that being vegan prevents people from caring about starving children across the world?

Since 30% of all crops grown on this planet go to feed livestock animals, if everyone stopped eating animal products, then there would be a lot more food to go around to feed starving people. Do you know that part of your taxes go towards subsidizing the animal agriculture industry? Wouldn't that money be better spent making sure everyone had nutritious food to eat?

And as far as doing "just about anything to make sure a fucking chicken doesn't suffer", you just don't eat them. It's not a huge effort.

[–]SinaShahnizadeh 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Because every human on earth could be supported if it wasn't for the meat industry. A lot more land, water, and food goes into the meat you eat than you think.

[–]GigathuluThe sum of some of some of the sum. 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

There are those that would eat road kill, but I am not one of them. I'm ok with being meat free, and that seems like a lot of trouble just to counteract the health benefits you get from a vegan diet.

[–]Vamaranthus 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

My grandma had a pet cow that she said would push her towards the milking area every day, because she wanted to be milked so badly. Does this mean my grandma was in possession of vegan cows milk?

[–]Green_Shirt 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, they don't eat animal products because animals can't consent.

Breastfeeding does not have this problem.

[–]polysyllabist 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

It's often about consent. A sheep can't consent to it's wool taken, nor a bee to it's honey. And meat is right out because things capable of consent tend not to consent to their murder. Go fig right?

And while a cow can't consent to her milk being taken, a human mother can, and in the context of her child, unsurprisingly will ellect to do so.

[–]justin_timeforcake 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You're right, but it's about a lot more than just consent. All of those things come from industries that cause immeasurable suffering to animals. And most of them are not necessary to human health, and vegan alternatives exist.

[–]GoogunkWill science 4 food -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Cows love getting milked. You should be able to earn some vegan credits for milking cows and reducing their suffering. There is a grading rubric in the appendices of "The Rules of Being Vegan" that goes into more depth.