全ての 16 コメント

[–]qghgg 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (3子コメント)

There are already image posts going around gg boards calling for it; something along the lines of a "fight false flags with false flags".

The sad fact is that even if they did get genuine threats, it's unlikely to get proper coverage - the media doesn't take threats against women very seriously; it's taken months of relentless threats against Anita and Zoe to get media attention.

There's also difficulty from a reporters point-of-view because gamergate is a movement that's about being decentralised, anonymous, and anti-media. That makes it really hard for media to engage with them.

GGFeminist was recently approached by a reporter about the harassment she received from someone at the same campus as her - she kept her anonymity, declined to do an interview, and instead provided the journalist with a letter describing the incident and, frankly, minimising the harm that it caused. There's not a lot that a journalist can do with a story like that. I have no doubt that what happened to GGFeminist was real, and I think it has potential to be a really good story - but I can't see what a journalist could do with what she gave. It's also not a story that suits gamergate's narrative - the story is about on-campus harassment of women; not about how SJW-based journalism is ruining games forever. GGfeminist was unwilling or felt unable to even do a print interview, which is totally her decision and no-one should fault her for that. And she kept her anonymity, which no-one can fault her for, given the situation.

But compare that with Brianna Wu, who's an amazing interview subject - passionate and smart; Anita Sarkeesian who's calm, eloquent, and clean-cut; and Zoe Quinn, who's basically the most interesting person in tech (cyborg who builds robots in her spare time). It's not even about the levels of abuse, it's about who's a better interview subject. Journalism is still a business.

Gamergate has a lot of real problems with how they deal with the media - this is even aside from their general horribleness of the movement. Fredrick Brennan getting told off for being rude in the last moments of the HuffPo panel was cringeworthy; media sources can't do interviews with people hiding behind pseudonyms like "KingofPol" and "mundanematt"; you can't interview Jordan Owen and Davis Aurini - five minutes of research will turn up that one's been linked to white nationalism and the other talked about Anita Sarkeesian's genitals in a previous interview (and has over sixty hours of ranting about her).

These are the prominent voices in gamergate, none of them are women. I suppose other voices could come out of the woodwork - like that all-women panel on Huffpo that I didn't watch yet - but the problem there is that they aren't notable voices as far as the media is concerned.

The other problem with this horrible idea of harassing women in gamergate, is that it's still harassing women - it's not changing the focus of the narrative on to "corruption" or "SJWs"; the focus is still on misogyny in the gaming world.

TL/DR: There have been signs that this is planned, it's an incredibly awful idea to harass anyone and will do no good for anyone.

God I rant about this a lot. I can't imagine the trauma of having this thrown at you every day.

[–]PinwheelsAndUnicorns[S] 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well I hope I'm just being cynical, but do have to agree with you that it would be a terrible idea for them to do so, as the media narrative would (rightly) focus on misogyny.

[–]qghgg 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree, I hope we are just being cynical when we think it could happen; I'm just in a mood where I think there are no depths that people can sink to when they want to be cruel - I follow Zoe Quinn's twitter (mostly because she's hilarious and inspirational) and it was pretty heartbreaking earlier today - tweets about feeling happy after watching a documentary about puppets only to find horrible messages attacking her body. For some reason that really disturbs me.

I'm watching a Twilight Zone episode as I type this, which starred only Agnes Moorhead as an old woman fighting robots; great episode which has a woman character at the centre without anything sexual, condescending or sexist in it. It was made over fifty years ago, we're meant to advance as time goes on, not go backwards to a time where women are attacked for anything they do. Imagine Agnes Moorhead being attacked for daring to think she could star in 25 minutes of prime-time without a man.

[–]RollinAndTumblinLiterally What 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They seem to forget that these threats didn't came out of thin air. It wasn't like they just magically started up a few weeks ago. First, gaming culture has always had a well documented problem with women and second, Anita and Zoe have been getting threats since the day they became "famous". It's just gotten worse in the last two months. The media isn't stupid. They have known these things for quite some time now.

[–]AgeMarkusDARPA Petman 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (4子コメント)

I personally think their next move is trying to draw in people by claiming that they don't harass anyone and that they're great people, citing the recent Anita happenings and the recent charity drive as proof. I've already seen it start to happen. :/

[–]Goondor 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I've been in many of the channels, public and private over the last week and there's a lot of discussion and even infighting regarding where to go next. Some people really are pushing for abandoning the tag, others are suggesting fake doxxing or fake death-threats, though to be fair the majority then immediately tells that person to fuck off because they don't want to ruin the "message."

The best thing though was the discussion around Georgina asking if she could open a patreon where for every $100 raised she would write a GG article (there's also a thread in KIA to be fair, there's no secrecy around it) . The reception was really weird.

[–]Zagrobelny 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The best thing though was the discussion around Georgina asking if she could open a patreon where for every $100 raised she would write a GG article

Wouldn't that be a violation of journalistic ethics? You know, the thing that GG is supposedly concerned about.

[–]MRAGoAway_ 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Who is Georgina?

[–]Missepus 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I have been approached a few times the last days by people who deliberately are not aggressive. They offer to talk, they rebuff other GG'ers who are too aggressive, they are funny and patient, engaging in the kind of conversations I am used to having with, you know, all the other types of gamers I like to hang out with. I am not sure what this means - that the moderates are coming out of the woodwork, or that they have started a "clean up gamergate" campaign.

[–]suberb_lobster☭☭Cultural Marxist☭☭ 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think that is the purpose of #notyourshield. To use those people as a shield.

[–]PinwheelsAndUnicorns[S] 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, I've thought the same thing. And what better way to do so then to start sending threats their way as well? Again, I recognize how cynical it is to think this way, but the whole "movement" has shown me depths of cynicism i didn't even know existed.

[–]IrbyTremor☣sᴏᴄɪᴀʟ ᴊᴜsᴛɪᴄᴇ ᴊᴀʙʙᴇʀᴡᴏᴄᴋʏ☣ 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Probably an escalation of threats and harm. They're already freaking out. Not looking forward to what they might do in desperation.

[–]Eidlon 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think if they do false flag (it hurt to type that) themselves, we'll see a factionalization.

I was looking at KiA and 8chan last night and it's already there (hell, maybe it's been there for weeks, I haven't been looking prior to this week)

There are voices actively shouting down bad behavior, and drawing reasonable ethical conclusions. They're getting upvotes.

If there's a schism, though, I don't see either side willing to give up the label #GamerGate. They'll both continue to use it, and come up with an insulting name for the opposition. Both sides will become known by their nickname (or the nickname they give, could go either way) and the whole thing will be mostly forgotten in time.

The people involved will harden their stances for a few years, and twenty years from now we'll see retrospective discussion that bears bafflelingly little resemblance to what actually happened, or what anyone wants to pretend happened.

[–]DocSubAnime Egg 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Abandoning #GamerGate is the best possible move for them at this point. This is already such a complicated story for mainstream news audiences, so news outlets probably won't follow up (or even notice) if the movement changes its name. That's a double-edged sword, of course, because they thrive on attention, but the negative press is entirely focused on #GamerGate.

[–]Racecarlock 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I hope not, I know a really nice woman on twitter who is a gamergate supporter who denounces harassment. This would be the last thing she deserves. Even if she is a gater.

[–]redpilledredditor⚔Social Justice Warrior⚔ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They should fuck eachother in the ass