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War Machine -- Attempts Suicide in Jail (tmz.com)

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[–]HongManChoiThe Techno Goliath 114 ポイント115 ポイント  (109子コメント)

Surprised at all the support War Machine is getting here. He's a piece of shit human being. He's done nothing to prove otherwise. Some people are beyond help. War Machine is one of them. Fuck this guy.

[–]Phil_T_McNasty 231 ポイント232 ポイント  (43子コメント)

It's never wrong to feel or show empathy.

It's not as if anybody's life would be improved by him killing himself, it's just sad. It's really fucking sad, this whole thing.

[–]allyboy101 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

"It's never wrong to feel or show empathy. "

This is very very true. The guy clearly has shit wrong with him... he has had a shitty shitty life and people with their perfect (in relation to his) upbringings are quick to pass judgement.

Life is hard, and for some it is harder than others. He deserves to be in jail as he needs to change, this is clear, however saying he deserves to be dead is terrible. Anyone can change, they just need to be shown how.

[–]Minimalanimalism 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (33子コメント)

It's only sad for the victim. Assholes like this guy are the ones that put us all at risk in the world. People who feel they have the right to do shit none of us would ever do because they so fucking "alpha".

I'm glad he tried and failed to take the easy way out instead of taking responsibility for what he did. I expected nothing less from a guy like him.

[–]Antonio_Stark 59 ポイント60 ポイント  (29子コメント)

You don't think he hates constantly walking around with a chip on his shoulder, filled with hate and anger, getting set off by every little thing? His mind must be a living hell. Don't you think he wishes that he could be a happy normal guy like the rest of us?

I feel bad for him because we're not all born angry and hateful. We're raised to be that way. He had a shit upbringing and never learned how to cope/deal with his issues.

The result: He's beaten a woman within an inch of her life and is a threat to society.

I don't know if he's beyond redemption but I feel bad for him because long before he was a nut job he was a little kid that was abused and/or neglected by his parents. That little kid grew into a hateful, angry man.

[–]Minimalanimalism -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (20子コメント)

You could make that argument for any horrible person that has ever lived. Every single human is a product of their upbringing. Now imagine some guy beats your mother or sister within an inch of their life... Then there are forums of people talking about how much the asshole is "suffering" because of how cool it sounds to act sympathetic. It's weird white knight bullshit and I don't get it.

Edit: I'll add that your statement is very similar to that of a battered housewife. "He's not a bad person, it's just he's had some hard times, we should show sympathy because the woman beater is clearly suffering"

[–]Analog265 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Thats not what he's saying.

All he's saying is that having empathy for all people isn't such a bad thing and it isn't tantamount to condoning what he's done. The world would be a much better place if we were all a bit more empathetic.

[–]Minimalanimalism -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (4子コメント)

I'm completely empathetic to the victim. Something a lot of people here seem to lack while discussing how much war machine is "suffering" right now. He almost killed her! She is suffering. He is merely being held accountable and being a pussy about it.

[–]Antonio_Stark 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Dude, I don't think that you're comprehending that we all think that War Machine should be punished and still feel sorry for him at the same time. It's like you're a calculator and we're trying to divide by zero.

-We feel bad for the victim.

-We think that War Machine should be punished.

-We also feel bad for War Machine for the abuse/neglect that has occurred in his life to make him this way.

You can want to see somebody punished and still feel bad for that person.

[–]Minimalanimalism -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Got it. I agree with all three points and I think you agree with mine since you edited your original comment about how much war machine is suffering right now.

[–]hurf_mcdurf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You don't have to feel bad for War Machine. If you compartmentalize your morality (for the sake of intellectual sterility) to the point where you do not feel disdain for those who flagrantly, knowingly cross lines which are impermissible to cross then why pretend to care in the first place? Morality isn't about calculating the percentage of empathy a person deserves, the purpose is to prevent these things from happening and without the shame and disdain laid upon those who trample on the rules there's really no point to the moral code in the first place. There is such a thing as punishment/retribution outside the legal punishment called for by his crimes, these things have always existed and they're completely necessary. Moral relativism is completely empty intellectually and yet you get the vast majority of those who consider themselves thoughtful people rallying behind it. It completely ignores the game theory of life as an organism in this universe, the evolved systems which got us to where we are in the first place.

[–]Analog265 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Dude, all of us have empathy for Christy Mack. The point is that on some level, you should be able to empathise with everyone, that includes the people who have done bad things.

I laughed at the top comment as hard as anyone, but seriously celebrating peoples suffering doesn't make for a healthy society.

[–]resykle 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I don't think anyone is defending what he did. He comitted a terrible crime and he is now being punished for it. But is it really so wrong to try and understand what was going on with him? I don't think most people wake up with the intention to do something terrible. Maybe by just briefly trying to understand what was going on in this man's head we can prevent these crimes in the future.

If being empathetic is "cool" then I don't see that as a bad thing

[–]LotsOfButtons 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The whole 'fuck this guy' is just an emotional response, people tend to be more comfortable dismissing people as irredeemable than trying to understand them.

[–]Antonio_Stark 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (9子コメント)

It's easier to see life in black and white because then you don't have to think as much but life is seldom that simple.

People are complicated creatures.

[–]qwerty622 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (8子コメント)

yup. we don't know what kind of chemical makeup resides in his brain. what anger and despair and helplessness feel like to him. my guess is all of these emotions are magnified much much more than what passes as "normal" for regular people.

bottom line though, there need to be repercussions to actions like this otherwise we cannot have a working society. but it is not wrong to try to understand him, and to have empathy for him.

calling him a "monster" is the easy way out. we understand nothing about him by saying this, and are not better equipped to prevent this type of behavior from people in the future.

[–]Razzahx 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's because you expect everything to be black and white. However the way the mind works is definitely not black and white. There isn't a person here condoning what he did. Its good to reflect on what caused a person to become the way they are so that you can prevent such a thing from happening to those around you. Its similar to how no one is born a racist. You are molded by your upbringing to be one.

[–]MikeCharlieUniform 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

While you are correct that we are the result of the experiences we have - that our brains are programmed by things that happen to us - it is also true that our brains are reprogrammable. Neural plasticity is a real thing.

[–]Magnum256 -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (6子コメント)

You sound like you're just trying to play the devils advocate and it's kind of pathetic. You could make the same exact argument for people like Hitler but try selling that to the Holocaust survivors and their relatives.

Do I necessarily think War Machine should be dead? No. However he should probably be incarcerated for the remainder of his life since he seems to have no self-control whatsoever and each time you give a man like him "one more chance" you're just putting innocent people at risk. He beat that woman to within an inch of her life, he has jumped random pedestrians with his gangbanger buddies, I mean the guy is a mess and beyond hope. He has failed at being a decent human beign.

[–]wix001 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

He isn't purporting he deserves a second chance, or is in any way a good person.

[–]Mr_asdfghjkl 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

he has jumped random pedestrians with his gangbanger buddies, I mean the guy is a mess and beyond hope. He has failed at being a decent human beign.

Since when? He wasn't part of Ian McCall's group back in the day, was he?

[–]t_minus_lego -4 ポイント-3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

He's been convicted? Isn't this fucking America? He's an innocent man right now as he hasn't been proven guilty. We have the story of a woman scorned, on Twitter no less.

How about we let the court decide before we judge him, lose all empathy and mentally convict him as a piece of shit who deserves life in prison.

I mean honestly, what the fuck.

[–]hurf_mcdurf 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Your thoughts aren't bound by the law, you're free to presume whatever you want and you're actually much more free than the court system to factor whichever evidence you please into your moral evaluation of a situation. The law is not the end-all of morality,

[–]briguy42 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

We're just the public, his fate will be sealed by a jury. Why are you upset about people passing judgement?

but a woman scorned via twitter? being tortured and nearly beaten to death is not being scourned.

Has he been convicted yet? No. He'll have his day in court, but unless you're implying he was framed for the whole ordeal I don't know what you're talking about. He's already been arrested and convicted twice of violent crimes.

[–]JeremyPSkinner 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree with this. We live in a system of fair trial and innocent until proven guilty. Is he a good guy? Probably not.

But no doubt the potential that Mack has mental issues of her own, to stay with a man who beats her and other decisions she may have made.

Until a concluded trial, he shouldn't be treated as guilty.

Atop of this, I don't wish he dies. Whether by execution or suicide. For the very reason that execution was removed in most states and Western countries in the first place: We don't have all the evidence and may not for many, many years.

[–]Flowirbridge 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Maybe I'm a sick fuck, but I feel like him killing himself and ridding the rest of the world of this monster like him is a responsible action to take.

If only he was successful... too bad he didn't do it at like 3am instead of 9:30 -_-

[–]hobo_law 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Too bad he didn't do it before he showed up at Christy Mack's house.

[–]eloquentnemesis 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe Christie Mack's.

[–]Magnum256 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

It's not as if anybody's life would be improved by him killing himself

You mean other than the women he repeatedly beats the shit out of? Or the guys he jumps with his gangbangers in front of Chuck-E-Cheese? Nah you're right, no ones life would be better with him out of the picture.

[–]deanacus 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (2子コメント)

What possible gain does she get from him being dead? She doesn't get justice in the legal sense, she doesn't get to face her abuser, nada. Sure she gets to know he's dead, but that doesn't necessarily improve her life any.

[–]Billz09 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

And how does facing her accuser improve her life?

Here's a possible scenario: WM gets a light sentence by reason of insanity. He's committed and released 2-3 years later. Down the road he regresses, goes on a bender, and goes after Christy one more time. Only this time, he kills her.

[–]MikeCharlieUniform 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Freedom.

[–]hurf_mcdurf 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

You can empathize for someone without wishing any good on them.

[–]Huegod -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

No tax payer money spent on trial or housing for jail. I think everyone is improved if he killed himself.

[–]Qwiggalo -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's one life out of billions, why do some people think every life is valuable? It's just ignorant, some people deserve to die and need to die.

[–]PFunk224 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

What he did was absolutely reprehensible, but you have to separate the act from the person (somewhat). I'm not saying he shouldn't be punished to the fullest extent of the law for what he did, or that he should be forgiven for it, but we should be hoping that it isn't the case that he's just a shitty person who doesn't care about killing someone. We should be hoping that there's a major chemical imbalance in his brain that can be corrected.

If it were you in his shoes, you'd likely be praying that there's something somebody could do to change the way you think and see the world.

[–]0909a -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well his neurology is shaped by his childhood and to change that is really really really fucking hard. The development years can cause all sorts of imbalances.

[–]hulking_menace 49 ポイント50 ポイント  (37子コメント)

Show me the most vile, evil piece of shit in the world and I'll find you a thousand people on reddit who are sympathetic.

[–]CryHav0c 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (12子コメント)

I think that's a good thing. Because the minute you start drawing lines in the sand about whether or not it's okay to feel sorry for someone, it becomes a calling card to wish for someone's demise because they have differing political views or maybe act a little too brashly.

Look at Mike Tyson. That dude has been down a dark road, but he turned his life around has probably made a lot of people better for it.

[–]Qwiggalo -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Why can't the line be drawn at someone attempting/succeeding to kill an innocent person's life?

Innocence being defined by someone who didn't kill/plan to kill someone else.

[–]hurf_mcdurf -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Because these people never want to draw a line. It's intellectually satisfying to them to subdivide any discussion ad-infinitum until the morality that they are discussing is pixelated beyond recognition or utility.

[–]spinemangler 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (7子コメント)

I don't know man. Hitler was a pretty good guy, he just had a bad childhood.

[–]altiuscitiusfortius 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (0子コメント)

He loved animals. He was a vegetarian who loved his dog and brought in animal cruelty laws that the germans still use today. Also he considered an arbitrary group of humans to be worth less then all other humans or animals even and he tried to exterminate them. But hey, pobodys nerfect.

[–]hulking_menace 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (2子コメント)

He was just trying to solve social problems and economic issues in Germany. Sure, he didn't go about it in the best way, but you can't blame a guy for trying, right ?

[–]huxception 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I mean he painted, he had an artistic side, he had a family. That shows he can't have been "evil", just misguided right?

[–]benjohnstonsf 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

He just lost his temper like any of us would if we came home one night and found the jews in bed with another man.

[–]gargolito 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Eva Braun loved him because he used to make her laugh.

[–]krabbby 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (3子コメント)

All Im saying is that Hitler had some good ideas.

[–]Snow_Pro 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Actually, Hitler did nothing wrong.

[–]HaunterGatherer 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So I took this 20th century German history course in the summer.... Apparently Hitler was a huge slacker who just let a bunch of different groups work on overlapping areas and then eventually picked the plan that was working out best. He slept in past noon every day, went for a walk, ate supper, then watched movies all night. I guess people had to get his interest by talking about something he liked, and then corner him to get a decision.

[–]Berimbozo 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

John mulaney?

[–]jgj09 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Reddit:

War Machine is just misunderstood

Mother Teresa? Piece of shit

[–]minotaur2011 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Do you know reddit isn't just one person?

[–]virak_john 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Although it seems things are turning around a bit as of late, for a while you'd have seen less empathy for Jon Jones in this subreddit.

[–]2cone -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Mother Teresa

she was a piece of shit though and arguably has hurt thousands upon thousands of people.

War Machine

basically beat up a conniving reptile

[–]hurf_mcdurf 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

basically beat up a conniving reptile

Elaborate?

[–]SystemBreakers 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Empathetic.

[–]hulking_menace -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

No.

[–]jkure2 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Yes. Being able to empathize with someone =/= sympathizing with them. Learn the difference.

[–]Berimbozo -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't really believe in free will so I find it helps me be pretty sympathetic to people

[–]tranypanda 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

So, would you be an advocate of just killing off these so called "beyond help" people?

[–]SheenLantern -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Says the one living in Israel...

[–]Qwiggalo -2 ポイント-1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, killing people is expensive. Just lock them up.

[–]hitmanrva10 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (14子コメント)

It's not exactly support for the guy, but a sort of understanding that although he is a piece of shit, the guy obviously needs help. He obviously has been through a lot in his life ( clear from TUF) and is not the most psychologically stable person. People like him need help.

Not everyone grew up the same way. Some people grew up in tough neighborhoods, without much support or love from others. It's easy to just say he is a piece of shit without realizing that he is a product of the environment he grew up in, much of which he had no control over.

[–]RasAlTimmeh 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (3子コメント)

You have a point but only to a certain extent. EVERYONE is a product of their environment. That kind of thinking is only ok for kids who commit crimes who are not yet aware of the world and their choices. Adults, despite their shitty upbringing, have to face the music for the shitty choices they make. Whether they are the byproduct of a shit family life or not. Many many pedophiles and sex criminals have been through childhood trauma and injury and that has resulted in their illness and fucked up situation. But pedophiles will always be treated like scum if they diddle children, even if the reason they do it is because they were abused as a child themselves. They commit a heinous act, they are responsible as adults. If someone has a problem or a psychological tendency and look for treatment before they make bad choices, then no one should judge, it's not their fault. But this fucker warmachine is long past the point of empathy and sympathy from society. He's banned from living among us. sorry

[–]HongManChoiThe Techno Goliath 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

I don't care what environment a person grew up in. When a guy beats someone almost to death not out of self defense (if she hadn't gotten away I believe he would have killed her) and try to rape them they do not deserve sympathy. They are broken as a human being.

[–]hellrunner 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (3子コメント)

sympathy for a broken human is not the same thing as support for his actions. it's incredibly myopic to go "oh he's just a piece of shit" and let that be the end of it. Solves nothing.

[–]hulking_menace 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Putting him in prison solves a lot of things, actually.

Kinda hard for him to beat up his girlfriend from in there.

[–]BumAccount 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just to help clarify, it was not advocated that he not go to prison, the sentiment wished was more that things went better to a point in which none if this would have occurred.

I think mostly people are considering what would go into making someone like War Machine who he has been and are wishing everything was different. You can look at this as unwarranted sympathy for War Machine, or you can see it as people wanting the best for Christy, numerous other people he's harmed, as well as himself.

[–]Pringles_Can_Man 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I gotta agree with you....

People have choices they make in life, good and bad, we all do. Choosing the bad because it's "what you know" is a poor excuse. Start applying the logic of "it was his environment" towards Timothy McVeigh, the unabomber, Columbine shooters, Stalin, etc, you start to see a pattern of yah this person's life was fucked up, but they took it to the next level with their own actions.

[–]hitmanrva10 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes he is broken as a human being. He was broken since he saw his parents do drugs and witnessed his father die of an overdose. Plus much much more. How was your upbringing?

[–]0909a -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

People like him are not born like that, they are created by their environment. You get rid of the environment you get rid of people like him. Baby's are not born murderers

[–]hulking_menace -5 ポイント-4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yeah! And that girl was just asking to have her face caved in, right?

I mean, sure, they'd broken up. But she had another guy over. She should have known that she was his property. Her hanging out with another guy was basically begging for him to break her face and attack with her with a knife, right?

It's not War Machine's fault that she did that. He just responded like anybody else would. He's not an adult with control over his actions.

You fucking moron.

[–]BurntOfferings 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Harsh bro.

[–]Crazy_man99 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

He is no doubt a piece of shit but that doesnt mean we shouldnt be trying to figure how we can help him. His brain might just be all fucked up and imbalanced from all the repeated blows to the head from his mma career. Add some steroids and recreational drugs into the picture... Its a chemical mess in his head.

[–]Pilx 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Lots of assumptions in there. He had a troubled childhood with an abusive mom and step dad, he also witnessed his Dad die in front of him. Combine that with untreated mental illness(es) and you've got a recipe for disaster - but hey they're just my assumptions.

That being said, he did have the chance to turn his life around. I mean he wasn't exactly slumming it and had already done time behind bars for assault... so there's some point where he has to take responsibility for his own actions, even if those actions may be as simple as seeking help (therapy etc.) for any anger management and other emotional illnesses he may have had.

[–]Crazy_man99 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah I would think hes a little too far gone to take any responsibility for his recent actions. Im wondering if he had some friends close by that would try to keep him in check.

[–]Mr_NeCr0 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

He is obviously not beyond help. The guy just tried to commit suicide. He realizes he has done so much wrong that he doesn't feel he deserves to live. That is repent and it's at least worth trying to build back from.

[–]Captcha_Imagination 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Support? 98% of /r/mma wants him dead. And at least half of the 2% are trolls.

[–]TheRadBomber -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm with ya man fuck this guy and fuck the naive people that say he needs help cause he had a bad childhood or whatever they want to claim. A lot of people had fucked up childhoods so that's not an excuse. Why should we value the life and well being of this fucking scum who didn't value Christy Macks'. And also on a semi-related rant fuck anyone who says she deserved cause she was a slut Porn Star.