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Angry rant about naked ladies (self.TwoXChromosomes)

peachesandmolybdenum が 投稿

Dear everyone on TwoX,

I am SO MAD right now. Currently, on barstool sports (and most likely somewhere near the top here on Reddit) there is an entire thread of hacked naked photos of celebrity women. I found out about this thread because my boyfriend looked at it.

I would like to make clear that I'm not PARTICULARLY angry with him (though I am a little), but the entire thread fills me with rage. I am fully okay with him or any male looking at porn. I get it - I'm okay with him watching the filthiest of things, as long as it's CONSENSUAL.

My big problem with this is that these ladies (actresses, atheletes, and models) had NO SAY over whether their pictures wound up online. Girls who post themselves to /r/gonewild know what they're getting themselves into - they are choosing to be naked online for the world to see. These private photos were not shared on purpose.

I'm angry that whoever hacked these photos felt they had the right to do so. They thought that because they could, it was permisable to violate the privacy of these women. I feel like every instance of hacking like this is a HUGE violation of women's rights.

Not much else to say, just wanted to share my outrage that something like this is considered okay by many (certainly not all) men.

To the men who saw no problem with this: how would you feel if it was your girlfriend, sister, or mother's photos?

Edit Clarification: these photos were hacked from cell phone text messages

Edit #2 There have been lots of people commenting about male nudes and a double standard. I do not think that leaked male nudes are acceptable either! Simply for the purposes of this discussion I focused on the recent leaked lady nudes. And no, beyond pics 1-3 that bf showed me, I have not looked.

Edit #3 My boyfriend and I are fine! It was a brief discussion in which I talked about the issue of consent and he agreed to just look at pictures or videos posted consensually.

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[–]Galactic 203 ポイント204 ポイント  (51子コメント)

I'm angry that whoever hacked these photos felt they had the right to do so.

They don't think they have the right to do it. They know it's wrong. They know what they're doing is illegal, just like the thief who robs your house knows it's illegal. They just don't care, they do it just because they CAN. That, or they are motivated by greed. Monetary greed or internet fame/infamy greed.

[–]FrostyGoingHisOwnWay 85 ポイント86 ポイント  (15子コメント)

Just FYI they posted a bitcoin address and have been taking a significant number of donations, which is why the images were leaked out slowly to encourage more people to donate.

[–]Galactic 35 ポイント36 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Bitcoin, eh? I gotta say, as disgusting as their actions are, the hacker or hackers who orchestrated this whole thing are being pretty cunning about all this. If they just sold these pics to TMZ or whatever it would be much easier to track them down.

Hope they get caught anyway. As titillating (no pun intended) as those pictures may be to me and many others, they weren't intended for public consumption, and considering my staunch stance on an individual's right to privacy I'd be a hypocrite of the highest order if I were to side with the hacker.

[–]gzagenius86 [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

Yeah because posting your photos to the cloud really shows a firm commitment to protecting your shit.

[–]aspmaster 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Bitcoin, eh? I gotta say, as disgusting as their actions are, the hacker or hackers who orchestrated this whole thing are being pretty cunning about all this. If they just sold these pics to TMZ or whatever it would be much easier to track them down.

Well... Not necessarily. Untraceable, illegal transactions have kind of been A Thing long, long before Bitcoin ever entered the scene.

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      [–]dcm628 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      This is the only point I wanted to make.

      I would be shocked if the hacker felt they had a right to these pictures. This was a for profit endeavor by a thief.

      [–]lookatmyfangs 75 ポイント76 ポイント  (23子コメント)

      I'm gong to break this up into points because of the various issues.
      1. Hacking is a crime. Period. Breaking into anyone's privacy is reprehensible and is deserving of jail time. Nothing more needs to be said about this fact. These people need to be brought to justice. Those supporting the hackers through BitCoin are accountable too for they are an accessory to this blatant assault.
      2. Looking at the pictures is human curiosity. The response each individual feels after viewing these pictures is the issue. Many(men and women) would look at these pictures with curiosity and then be disgusted at the blatant invasion of privacy. Heck, I looked at a photo after my girlfriend brought it to my attention and I felt absolutely depressed. Those who feel nothing but pleasure at this are messed in the head. They are watching a crime occuring. These so called "people"(animals really) stand by and actively support(a good number) as strong women and role models for all get their private life ripped apart by the same society that they work to entertain.
      3. Here is the big issue. The internet and sharing. The problem with sharing anything private is that after you hit that "Send" or "Save" button, you have no idea who can view it and/or copy it. Our phones, tablets and laptops are wonderful devices, but it really has come to that point where everything is connected. The concept of online privacy is just that, a concept.
      4. To those saying "stop pretending you don't like a nude Jennifer Lawrence": Are you mental? Who wouldn't like a nude Jennifer Lawrence. I would have zero problems with this if the celebrities in question had taken these photos with the purpose of sharing them with the world and then shared it themselves. What you're effectively saying is that their private life, belongs to you just because she is a celebrity/attractive/a woman, basically anything you consider as lesser to you. This is not white-knighting, this is basic human rights that are being violated.

      I don't comment often, but I do speak my mind at certain times. Down-vote me, up-vote me, I don't care. These are my two cents.

      edit: My grammar is deplorable. I fixed as much as I could.

      [–]notimeforname 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (15子コメント)

      Those who feel nothing but pleasure at this are messed in the head

      Pretty sure being aroused by a naked photo doesn't make you messed up in the head. Even if you don't feel guilt for it.

      I really don't know why so many people try to pin this on everyone who saw the photos or shared them. Its like people still don't get how the internet works. People share things, people want to talk about things. The only blame is on the scumbag who leaked them.

      [–]Psykechan [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

      I'm an Information Security person which is why this story interests me. Please don't get the idea that I support these actions as I certainly do not. This is just my attempt at civil discussion.

      1. Hacking is not necessarily a crime. Even when it is a crime, how it's prosecuted depends on where it occurred. If this was indeed an inside job by someone working at Apple, it may not even fall under criminal trespass.

      2. We are hardwired to be curious and we are also hardwired to think about sex. Saying that it's acceptable to do something as long as we feel bad about it later is silly. We human beings can forgo our baser instincts and choose to not look at the pictures.

      3. Yes this is a big issue but maybe not what you might think. Everyone has a responsibility to understand who has access to their online data. This is something so important that it should be taught in elementary school. Also, all privacy is just a concept, but just because it's only a concept doesn't mean it shouldn't be protected!

      4. See my response to #3. It's an invasion of privacy; it doesn't matter if it's online or not.

      [–]HwoThumb 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      There's some sort of glitch. It's only letting me upvote this once.

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          [–]immunoinformatician 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          A bad day for decency, a good day for computer security.

          This will remind even the least tech-savvy person that computers are ridiculously unsafe and broken.

          This was bound to happen and it will happen again unless we change our priorities when in comes to software design.

          And to be honest I'm glad it was a hack with media attention where nobody got physically harmed, the only other things I can think of that would get this much publicity is a disabled power grid, nuclear meltdown, derailed trains or scrambled air-traffic.

          [–]cyrano111 38 ポイント39 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          Showing my age, I feel forced to share a quote from Dick Cavett, some time in the early 70s, in relation to topless photos of Jackie Onassis taken of her on her yacht with a telephoto lens: "if she wants me to see her naked she knows where to find me".

          [–]WorkGameSleep 312 ポイント313 ポイント  (39子コメント)

          Guy here. I am going to copy a comment I made on one of the posts that made it to the top of /r/all earlier today.

          I'm all for a good celebrity nude, but only if they actually wanted to share it with the world. This is just an invasion of privacy and is just wrong. If other redditors want to fap to this then that's their business. But I've got some serious moral objections to what just happened.

          These women just lost any semblance of their already limited privacy. These pictures and videos were intimate and personal. This was not something the public was meant to see and this is absolutely not ok. I feel awful for all of them. Today was not a good day for Reddit.

          [–]Beerphysics 70 ポイント71 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          I agree with you.

          When I saw those threads pop-up, my heart sank. No one deserve to have their privacy and intimacy put there for everyone to see and scrutinize. They must feel so violated right now.

          And let's not play the victim-blaming game. Everyone deserve privacy.

          [–]Sibbour 145 ポイント146 ポイント  (18子コメント)

          This is exactly how I feel as a male. I can't fap to the photos....I just keep thinking about how violated and/or exposed Jennifer Lawrence and the other celebrities feel right now.

          [–]JustaGangsta 46 ポイント47 ポイント  (8子コメント)

          Also a guy. Also agree this is abhorrent. But what I really don't get is why anyone would fap even if they weren't leaked against their will. The Internet is filled with far more fappable pics. I don't get the appeal for this at all. It's an extreme invasion of privacy, and the photos aren't even that great. Why do people want these? Only thing I can figure is because they're not supposed to have them.

          [–]dcm628 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          I don't think it's because people know they aren't supposed to have them.

          This is an extension of celebrity culture (specifically American celebrity culture).

          Women being shown nude and sexualized is a huge deal here. Decapitate a person and the movie is still OK for kids but don't dare show a nipple. Actresses primary are sexual by holding back and teasing in their roles. When an actress does a nude scene it's a huge decision for their career.

          Look at Kirsten Dunst in all this. Her privacy was violated just as much as Jennifer Lawrences. There is maybe one percent of Lawrences attention going to Dunst. Her "best" nude is almost identical to a frame from one of her films so nobody cares. Jennifer Lawrences sexuality matters a lot to her career. She is absolutely not sexualized in the Hunger Games because that isn't what the story is about. Her sexuality in Silver Linings Playbook matters a lot to her character in the opposite fashion.

          None of that is in any way a justification for violating any of these people's privacy. I just think that the phenomenon is far more interesting culturally than any individual offense.

          [–]zhidecitta 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          The fact they're naughty is probably correct for a lot of the people you see talking about it on reddit like it's a goldmine. As an alternative though, there's the whole mindset of a fan to keep in mind. Someone who's a big fan might have a crush developed from movies and TV appearances that makes a more elaborate or detailed fantasy for them than you get from a plumber in a porno. It'd be pretty twisted though to so clearly violate someone you're a fan of by going for the pics, but parasocial relationships can be pretty twisted.

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            [–]lilianegypt 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

            All I can think of is Jennifer Lawrence sitting in a room somewhere, crying. It's what I would do. Many of these women are probably feeling pretty horrified and humiliated right now. My heart aches for them.

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              [–]addtothebeauty 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (3子コメント)

              If other redditors want to fap to this then that's their business then they should be ostracized for being morally devoid.

              Today was not a good day for Reddit.

              Agreed.

              [–]smartstuff14 [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

              I think you have far too positive an image of the online community to begin with.

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                [–]yetanotherhero 195 ポイント196 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                The general public tends to feel like we own our celebrities, and a disappointingly large number of men feel entitled to access to women's bodies. Leaked celeb nude pics are most often of women celebrities, so it's kind of where these two distasteful attitudes meet.

                [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 41 ポイント42 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                I know, it just makes me angry. And as someone else said, yes, I was aware of this before today. But still. There are so many women out there who CHOOSE to post their images online, what gives anyone the right to violate those who don't choose to do so? I want to be the big sister to all these men (and women) and just smack them upside the head. I wish they knew better.

                [–]yetanotherhero 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                They very likely do- they just do it anyway. I'm ashamed to say when I heard of this I got all the way to a Google search bar before I stopped myself. I find Jennifer Lawrence hugely attractive, and combined with availability, anonymity, and a certain cultural space that makes this kind of thing seem like not a big deal...well as I said, I found myself at that search bar.

                What stopped me was my own hypocrisy- I'm always willing to tell people I think it's disgusting the way we treat celebrities, and to speak out on feminist issues. I genuinely knew it was wrong, but there I was at that search bar. The anonymity of the internet can be a dangerous thing for personal morals.

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                    [–]dellie44 498 ポイント499 ポイント  (173子コメント)

                    I am absolutely disgusted, horrified, and ashamed.

                    And it wasn't just the creepy "the fappening is here", "this is the best day ever" comments. It's the fact that people are blaming these women for taking nudes in the first place! People are using it as an example of why you shouldn't take nude pics, as if we should guard everything we do from now on because hey, some creepy perv might hack us! This isn't the "dude shared private pic meant for him". This is illegal, disgusting, and deserves jail time. This guy went into celebrities' iClouds with no regard for anyone but himself and his dick.

                    Futhermore, this is insane victim-blaming. God forbid women share sexual pictures of themselves with a sexual partner, because that's slutty and they deserve to get those photos leaked!

                    I was so disturbed by this incident that I was brought to tears. This entitlement to women's naked bodies is misogynistic and I'm sick of it.

                    [–]doubleunicorn 212 ポイント213 ポイント  (37子コメント)

                    The victim-blaming is absolutely what i found the most shocking. I made the mistake of reading some of the comments on those posts, just to see if anyone in the more mainstream subreddits found the release of these photos as horrible as I did. Along with some of the "best day ever!" comments that you mentioned, there were quite a few people saying she shouldn't have taken the photos, and was basically asking for it by doing so. She didn't do anything wrong. Anyone, whether a public figure or not, should have the right to privacy. This went way beyond basic human decency.

                    It's events like this that really make me hate the world we live in right now. Covert assholes can hide behind their computers and do horrible things to innocent people with no repercussions -- and even gain support (just look at the upvotes!).

                    [–]lord_julius_ 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    The person that accessed someone else's data for personal gain deserves most of the blame. The people paying for these pictures deserve the rest.

                    We shouldn't blame these celebrities for what happened to them, but we shouldn't ignore the lessons that are to be learned from this.

                    My guess is that the "hack" employed to access these pictures was little more than someone taking advantage of the fact that people use weak passwords, use the same passwords on multiple sites, and the answers to their password reset questions are things that can be guessed or found on wikipedia.

                    It's unfortunate that people have to take measures to protect ourselves from shitty people doing shitty things, but that's how it is.

                    [–]amtal-rule 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (19子コメント)

                    The blame isn't with the victims, it's with the cloud services.

                    The victims had no privacy, just files stored on other people's machines.

                    [–]twice_mistaken 50 ポイント51 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                    The only blame lies with the leaker. People don't seem to realize just how many points of vulnerability exist on your basic information infrastructure, ranging from digital to non digital.

                    People should start realizing that putting anything online should be more akin to doing something in public (possibly in a secluded area, or not) rather than in the privacy of their own home. Your "space" online is basically a glass house with curtains- curtains which open from the outside of your house, though they might be a bit heavy, so the average person probably won't bother lifting it if you're also an average person; but as a celebrity, the contents of your glass house is (or seems to be) way more interesting and enticing, so more people will be willing to put in the effort to see. This doesn't justify their actions, but this IS a danger everyone online should be aware of.

                    [–]xmenvsstreetfighter [非表示スコア]  (1子コメント)

                    The tech side of this is very confusing to me. My main question is if iCloud storage is intended to only be accessible by the owner of the account, why wasn't the data encrypted on Apple's servers?

                    Hacker News seems to think it might have been this exploit: https://github.com/hackappcom/ibrute but that doesn't make sense to me either. How would someone get their hands on hundreds of celebrity's personal email addresses? And how would Apple not notice the billions of requests it would have taken?

                    [–]chrisrazor 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                    Your first sentence isn't congruent with the rest of your comment, which is essentially blaming people for using these services and expecting privacy.

                    [–]Suttreee 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                    She's not blaming anyone, she is telling people to realize that internet privacy is an illusion and that people need to be careful. That still doesn't distract from the fact that the only person who did anything morally wrong is the leaker.

                    [–]lnslnslns 37 ポイント38 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                    From a technical standpoint, Apple's cloud services are probably not at fault here (but we don't know that for sure). Unless it was someone with significant knowledge and inside access to iCloud, then its significantly easier to guess someone's password in most cases (especially so if you know that person personally). Or convince them to install an modified app on their phone. The weak point in any half-decent security system is almost always the user with the key being conned into giving it up, or giving up enough information to guess it.

                    I'm not trying to victim blame here, as everyone should be able to store stuff on reliable cloud services securely. However, what's secure for you and I is not secure for high profile celebrities. Its unfortunate, but they should to take the same attitude towards data storage as they do to physical securitt - hire a professional to manage it (as many of them do with bodyguards).

                    Its depressing, and it shouldn't be, but the rest of us need to realize that in quite often, data you do not have complete physical control over is data that is now at a high risk of becoming public.

                    IMO, something like this was inevitable. Banks deal with monetary theft from stolen online banking passwords daily. Everyone has friends who have Facebook accounts that were "hacked". Large, seemingly trustworthy companies routinely fail security tests and leak customer information (see: Sony, Adobe, etc...). Hell, even the NSA, that bastion of internet theft and secrecy has leaks. Stealing celeb nudes makes for big news, but is not unexpected to anyone who knows much about computer security.

                    In addition, we need to realize that there is a separation of victim blaming and lessons that can be learned for prevention. Hopefully this will be a wake up call to a lot of people.

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                        [–]Caulk_Warship 38 ポイント39 ポイント  (36子コメント)

                        This guy went into celebrities' iClouds with no regard for anyone but himself and his dick.

                        I hate to tell you, but apparently he's made over 100,000 USD in things like bitcoin donations.

                        I love to tell you that he will probably be found and prosecuted. He severely broke the law, and against powerful people. These women don't just have their own swing but they have plenty of allies in Hollywood and such that will hunt down the person who did this. People are acting like he's using bitcoin so he won't be caught, but they don't realize the US government has the resources to get this guy. They just need to put the effort into it. And I imagine they will.

                        Let me also add /u/dellie44 that I really appreciated your post, you put it in a good perspective.

                        EDIT: Let me also add that even if he is convicted on criminal charges, the lawyers of these celebrities will probably find a way to sue him for his finances. And I assume he will be caught.

                        [–]JustAProudGamer 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                        As an IT guy as well. I can tell you its very unlikely that he gets caught.

                        Unlike others previous-leakers, he was extremely meticulous, he never contacted any media magazine, nor anybody at all.

                        He was/and is behind 9 proxies, also very likely TOR, using a bootable live-OS. Leaving no trace of what his real IP is, nor what he did, nor either leaving trace on his computer (he must have encrypted the pictures on a USB-Stick with impossible-to-break encryption (this is easy). Also he connects with PUBLIC wi-fies or from unprotected wi-fis of households. There is proof of this. If you saw his leaks, he often says "I am changing location, coming in 1h". This is why the leaks come in waves, and not all together. Theyve been dropping for 1-2 days now.

                        He changes locations from public/unsecured wi-fi to unsecured wi-fi. Together with proxies and tor. From a computer bought in cash, with a spoofed MAC address. (I know this sounds fictional, but I can assure you this is how these guys operate).

                        Even if the entire NSA worked to find him, it would be impossible (done right).

                        All these "pedophiles" you see caught even using TOR was because they did not use an updated version of the browser, and they did not deactivate javascript (they were noobs, basically). The heads of most of the pedo sites in tor have never been caught and theyve been sought for decades (I'm on mobile but ill show later).

                        This guy is no noob.

                        The only way he could get caught is by following the trail of money. Bitcoin transactions are public, people know his wallet (and can see what he has/got), however they don't show a real name. He can get caught in only one way:

                        1. He chooses to EXCHANGE his bitcoins to dollars - then he will deal with real-life bank accounts and real names. This is the only scenario in which he can get caught.

                        However, it's also avoidable by selling his bitcoins for CASH.

                        Also, he could choose to not exchange the bitcoins for dollars and use them as normal currency (hell, today you can buy anything with bitcoins, even a Tesla car).

                        So, sadly to you, and to many of us, it's very unlikely that he gets caught.

                        [–]adnfadnfdnf 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                        One thing you overlook: bitcoins can be "mixed", exchanged with coins with different ID numbers. Once mixing occurs, the coins are broken up and distributed to people who have no knowledge of the original origins. The block-chain can't record this, because instead of the coins being "spent", they are just swapped with each other on the mixing server. Even though bitcoins themselves can be tracked, because of mixing, you can't prove that each person in the block-chain is the same person.

                        There's a far worse aspect to this story though. We don't know what exploit he used, it seems to be related to iCloud services. Apple hasn't released a statement yet (it is still the weekend), but the real danger in this situation is that, if there is a real exploit on iCloud, and more hackers learn about the exploit, and then normal people will be targeted.

                        My general conclusion: don't trust laws to protect you, try cryptography instead.

                        [–]NightGod 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        We don't know what exploit he used, it seems to be related to iCloud services. Apple hasn't released a statement yet (it is still the weekend)

                        My money is on social engineering over the course of years and he finally decided to cash in.

                        [–]Caulk_Warship 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                        A few people have replied like this, and I'm sad to hear this. But I'm glad you told me.

                        Anyway, it is possible for criminals to mess up, and this guy might be lacking in his skills of being a criminal. That seems to happen to hackers, though if this guy doesn't cause any further commotion in his actions then it sounds like he probably will not provide any more evidence. He did say he would release more in the future though, but I don't know how that could be detected.

                        Thanks for correcting me, even if it is saddening.

                        I will say one thing, and that's that the government has the resources to combat anonymity, even if they have to invent the technologies to do so.

                        [–]JustAProudGamer 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                        Very happy to help.

                        He has released many new ones during the last few minutes (as I said he waits/changes location).

                        ALL the biggest hackers have been caught because of slip ups, ALL OF THEM.

                        The leader of LulzSec (The most famous hacking group, and anonymous), was sought by the FBI for years, years! And he got caught because he logged ONCE, yes, ONCE in years he forgot to cover his IP and logged on his account with his real IP. This was one or two years ago.

                        The second most prominent. Ross Ulbritch, the "creator" of the SilkRoad (first drug market online on TOR).

                        He was caught because years ago, when he was creating the site, he posted ONE post on a forum with his IP asking for help with how to code the website. This is how they got him.

                        Tor hasn't been broken, and if you see the Snowden leaks you'll see how even the NSA recognizes they can't deanonimize tor. The only way to catch this guys is through slip ups.

                        It all depends on how safely the guy does it..

                        The FBI will look back (check the IP logs of all the accounts of these girls, look for which IP's he connected with to steal the pictures - they'll also follow the trail of money).

                        The best way to catch him is to involve the FBI now and conduct an operation by inserting malware in the website he publishes the pictures in, hoping to infect his computer (this is how many pedos are caught). But again, if he is careful and disables javascript and others...

                        Anyway, as you can see, it's VERY complex.

                        Let's just hope they catch him.

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                          [–]NightGod 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          It's amazing how many people don't get this. I pointed out similar things back when there were some major SWATing incidents and how unlikely it was that the person would be caught if they were even slightly net security savvy and people jumped down my throat saying how wrong I was. Honestly, if the dude is going to get caught, it's almost certainly going to be because he opens his mouth and brags about it.

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                            [–]grimoiregirl 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                            Fastest way to catch him would probably be for the female celebrities to offer a reward of bitcoin to whoever manages to find him. Someone out there besides the US government has a way to track him down. There are people on the internet who live for that kind of shit.

                            [–]Anon271 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (19子コメント)

                            As a network engineer and Web developer of over 10 years, this guy will not get caught. And the government is not going to dedicate any amount of useful resources to catching him. In fact if they were smart they would offer him a job. Don't get me wrong I think this is as sick as the next person but let's be realistic here.

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                              [–]Jingledonkey 70 ポイント71 ポイント  (35子コメント)

                              I know what you're saying.... but I'm even afraid to take a nude snapchat and cover my junk with a drawn picture because when you put anything on a computer or phone you just don't know who has access to it.

                              I don't agree with hacking anybodies phone or computer but if you're a celebrity you have got to have the brains to know that people are out there after you.

                              [–]dellie44 55 ポイント56 ポイント  (21子コメント)

                              It's an unfortunate reality that no one is safe to share private messages, pictures, etc.

                              The victim-blaming that bothers me is the idea that these women deserve shame, regret, and embarrassment. We all know how to be as safe as possible with our privacy, especially in this day and age. But the fact that the hacker had to go into iCloud (and even retrieve supposedly deleted pictures) to get the pics says to me that celebrities do know. It's just that there is no way to anticipate a hack this major and this violating.

                              I don't disagree with the reality of needing to be safe, both online and offline. I'm just incredibly disappointed in the extreme measures we all have to take in protecting our privacy, and I wish it were different.

                              [–]iKickComputers 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                              But the fact that the hacker had to go into iCloud (and even retrieve supposedly deleted pictures) to get the pics says to me that celebrities do know. It's just that there is no way to anticipate a hack this major and this violating.

                              Dude. What? Your shit ain't safe in iCloud. The naivety... You should know better, what with all the NSA revelations. Everybody should. Nothing you put on your OS without very special care is completely safe. Do not store sensitive data on cloud based services, phones, or anything unless you accept the possibility that data will be taken. You do not have the privacy you think you do.

                              Also, I'm not really seeing any victim blaming suggesting that Jennifer Lawrence or Kate Upton or anybody deserves to feel shame, regret, and embarassment. They shouldn't. It's just nude pics. In modern society, for most people, it's whatever. If they're really regretting this, they should feel fairly stupid and naive, but not really anything else. I haven't seen anybody suggesting they should be feeling any other way. Everybody is pretty sympathetic as far as I've seen.

                              [–]appropriate-username 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                              It's just that there is no way to anticipate a hack this major

                              extreme measures

                              It takes five seconds to winzip a picture, and there are mobile winzip equivalents.

                              edit: but with Apple's stellar reputation in the infosec crowd, I can understand why this would seem to be coming out of left field. I, for one, am moving all my pictures to facebook right now.

                              [–]twice_mistaken 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                              I really can't tell if you're serious about Facebook...

                              [–]zhidecitta 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                              but with Apple's stellar reputation in the infosec crowd, I can understand why this would seem to be coming out of left field.

                              Not sure if serious? They're actually horrific with their information security, and always have been. They didn't get viruses because they were too niche to be a target (and are only up to 15% market share). They're trailing behind the industry in terms of actual computer security and defense with no signs of changing.

                              [–]lychnomancy 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                              Worse, they convinced their entire audience that they're immune to viruses and other issues as a selling point, convincing their customers not to take any precautions of their own.

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                                  [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                  So you're going to fairly extreme lengths (in this day and age) to conceal your privacy. I can't blame you, I won't share any kind of picture of myself either. However, I don't think that just because they are celebrities they should be so constricted. If a normal person can text or snapchat a pic of their boobs to their S/O, a celebrity should be able to too. And ALL parties shouldn't have to fear that some jackass online is going to hack their phone account and share it online.

                                  [–]Spider-Plant 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                  Nobody deserves things like this to happen to them.

                                  But everyone knows that things like this DO happen, and while for most people the risk is very small, for celebrities it really is a much bigger risk.

                                  It has happened before, it will happen again, and I'm not going to feel bad for the people it happens to.

                                  The thing is the more high-profile you are, the greater the reward is for those who manage to get this stuff from you. Being celebrities, they already know this.

                                  That's not to say it's right, or cool, or anything like that. But it can happen to anyone, and is way more likely to happen to celebrities, and they (and anyone else, really) need to be aware of what they are getting themselves into and what steps they can take to avoid this stuff happening.

                                  [–]twice_mistaken 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                  A normal person would have the same technical risk (i.e. the amount of technical skill and effort would be about the same on average to "hack") when texting/snapchatting/storing information online as a celebrity, but the mere fact that someone is a celebrity will mean that there will be more people willing to put in special effort to target them. All parties should not fear privacy breaches online, but all parties should be very wary. It's an unfortunate reality that the Internet is now possibly more open than the offline world.

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                                      [–]Moronthislater 35 ポイント36 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                      "The people sharing these images are perpetuating an ongoing assault. The people gleefully looking at them are witnessing and enjoying an ongoing assault."

                                      "This is not a 'scandal' - It’s a crime, and we should be discussing it as such."

                                      Both from

                                      http://m.dailylife.com.au/news-and-views/dl-opinion/this-is-why-you-shouldnt-click-on-the-naked-photos-of-jennifer-lawrence-20140901-3eo6s.html?rand=1409540229974

                                      [–]TheIcelander 78 ポイント79 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                      It's the fact that people are blaming these women for taking nudes in the first place

                                      "If you didn't want them leaked you shouldn't have taken them!"

                                      "What do you mean you won't send me nudes?!?"

                                      The idiocy of these pubescent twats knows no bounds.

                                      [–]AnISTJ 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                      It actually isn't completely ridiculous to say "if you didn't want the chance of them being leaked, you probably shouldn't take the risk of sending them over the internet".

                                      Why is it idiotic to take precautions in life? Take for example murder. We all know this is wrong and will always be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. I live in a society where I know this is true and I feel mostly safe about my life. However, I do take reasonable precautions. I won't walk down some shady alley in the middle of the night with no one around and start flashing money and expensive electronics/jewelry. I avoid shady parts of town, especially at night. I don't leave expensive stuff in my car in plain sight because that is just an invitation for someone to break into it.

                                      Same common sense applies to the internet. All this bullshit about "the cloud being secure" and "you have privacy" is nonsense. There is ALWAYS a way to breach privacy, there is always a way someone can look at your stuff, there is always an exception to every rule. Nothing is 100% secure, NOTHING. You want true privacy? Don't use facebook, don't put your name on stuff, don't put sensitive information on the cloud. You can expect a "reasonable" amount of privacy, but complete privacy? Hah, we don't live in that world.

                                      Life isn't COMPLETELY out of control where you have NO fault. There are certain things you can do to help/protect yourself. Be smart about your life and don't expect the world to follow your code of morals and ethics.

                                      And finally, given that there have been leaks in the past, wouldn't celebrities smarten up and not take nudes of themselves and post it in the cloud/text it to other people?

                                      Did they have it coming? No, but god damn I can't believe they didn't smarten up about this. Besides, they have tons of money they could have just hired a computer expert to keep their shit safe.

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                                        [–]BuenoOrNoBueno 29 ポイント30 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                                        The NSA hacks your communication every day and Snowden already said that the staffers pass around private pics they like to each other at work. Every person, every day, for years.

                                        [–]foreignergrl 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                        I'm just happy to announce that I have posted thousands of pictures of my cats online. The thought of someone boringly going over those pics every day for years brings me nothing but a strange sense of vengeance and satisfaction.

                                        [–]DorianC0C0C0 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                        I had a friend in college who was paranoid before it was as fashionable (he has only ever communicated via encrypted emails, even personal ones, as an example)

                                        When I asked him why he encrypted everything, he said: "Imagine if 90% of the time, all you're emailing are photos of kittens. But 10% of the time it's something important. You encrypt it all, so that if anyone bothers to go through your stuff, they have no idea what's important and what isn't. Whereas if you only encrypt the 10% that's important, all you've done is told them precisely where to look."

                                        And so [hisname]'s Kitten Theorem of Privacy was born.

                                        You may consider yourself an early adopter of the Kitten Theorem, if you'd like. :)

                                        [–]Porcuppied 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                        Heh, that made me chuckle. You keep doing the good work /u/foreignergrl!

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                                          [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 39 ポイント40 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                          And we should not be okay with that! This is an issue of women's privacy AND your own digital privacy. This is an issue for everyone.

                                          [–]NichtAbsolute 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                          You've clarified a bit here, but in your original post you said:

                                          I feel like every instance of hacking like this is a HUGE violation of women's rights.

                                          To which you've now added:

                                          This is an issue of women's privacy AND your own digital privacy.

                                          And I have to say, I think you're tilting "hacking" toward women just a little too much. You're generalizing to an extreme in your original post! Digital systems and encryption are gender-neutral; privacy more-so.

                                          Furthermore, if every instance of hacking was a "HUGE violation of women's rights," (as you originally state in your opening post) then how do you feel about the people who hack into large corporations to steal trade secrets? China hacks into US servers, steals weapon designs, and suddenly it's a women's rights issue?

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                                              [–]tattt2 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                              as if we should guard everything we do from now on because hey, some creepy perv might hack us!

                                              Duh you should. I prune my gmail and encrypt my sensitive files. Whats wrong with you

                                              [–]addtothebeauty 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                              Totally agree. We need to expect - demand - more decency from people. "But men like porn!" doesn't excuse disgusting violations of privacy. It is their behavior, and everyone who chose to participate in furthering that violations by viewing it - that's YOU, OP's bf and every supportive commenter - that is despicable and deserving of public shame.

                                              [–]enharet 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                              You don't think you're overstating it just a bit? People don't need to guard everything they do, but maybe they should stop and think just a minute before uploading something they wouldn't want others to see to some nebulous "cloud" service. How is that different from being careful where you use your credit card because you know financial information isn't always secure? Yeah, the leaker is an asshole and a criminal, and the victims are not slutty and didn't deserve this, but acting like there was no way these women didn't know this was a possibility is ridiculous. In an effort to never blame the victim (which is admirable), we're infantilizing the victim.

                                              This isn't the same as saying women shouldn't wear short skirts to prevent rape. This is the same as saying people should think twice before they click. Over 100 young women made the mistake millions of people make everyday - they assumed that any form of digital storage is secure despite all previous evidence to the contrary. When Target was breached, were you horrified, disgusted and ashamed? Were you offended that your credit card company offered you a replacement? Do you refuse to change your passwords on the grounds that people just shouldn't have to have passwords because everyone should just be good and honest?

                                              Fuck all 46,000 subscribers to the fappening, and everyone else getting off on this violation of these womens privacy. But don't act like the idea that an adult should take reasonable precautions in their life is morally offensive.

                                              [–]ReportingAProblem 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                              It's not victim blaming, it's security pragmatism.

                                              Nothing you share with others is secure. Always expect shared content to be out of your hands and beyond your control.

                                              Don't want others to know your secrets? Don't share them. Don't want others to see your nude selfies? Don't take them. Even if the receiving party is totally trustworthy, shit gets hacked, software lies and says content is deleted when it's sitting in a backup somewhere.

                                              Sucks for them, but that's reality. The celebs who didn't take such photos will never have such photos leaked. That's all there is to it.

                                              [–]V526 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                              This isn't victim blaming, its target hardening.

                                              Make it harder for them to get to you.

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                                              [deleted]

                                                [–]twice_mistaken 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                What happened was a gross breach of privacy, but let's not get carried away with the rape label. All you're doing is cheapening the word.

                                                [–]exemplary_butthole 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                Actually, he hacked for money, not to wank it.

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                                                  [–]mewfor 83 ポイント84 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                  I am bummed out that the people in the pictures are basically being punished for being sexual.

                                                  [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                  Such a good point. So much victim shaming!

                                                  "You shared a risque photo with your SO? Well, now it's public property! That's what you get for being a celebrity!" So terrible.

                                                  [–]Arnox 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                  "You shared a risque photo with your SO? Well, now it's public property! That's what you get for being a celebrity!" So terrible.

                                                  Has anyone actually said this anywhere, ever?

                                                  You put quotes around it as if people genuinely have this sentiment.

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                                                    [–]BRDtheist 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                    It's ridiculous because one minute these fuckwits are moaning that women are not sexual enough, don't want sex, only tease men and never "put out", yada yada yada, but then the next minute they punish women for being sexual thereby ensuring that they're reluctant to ever do something like that again. It's ridiculous and pathetic.

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                                                      [–]silentkit 97 ポイント98 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                      "Privacy is more important than anything, even National Security! Oh, cool, someone hacked a famous woman's private photos! Let's all gather 'round and jerk it to these non-consensually publicized images together!"

                                                      Infuriating and disgusting.

                                                      [–]hammertimebustamove 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                      Pretty much posted this to facebook with similar wording, and the first comment is some troll saying "A bunch of guys came, so that's all that matters." Which sadly, is probably true for them. I'm sure many dudes are going to bed satisfied and feeling triumphant. Meanwhile I imagine these celebrities are having some of the worst nights of their lives.

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                                                        [–]lockedge 71 ポイント72 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                                                        I remember when people started realizing how to grab photos from private photobucket accounts, and there were hordes of pictures of women opened to the internet, linked to their facebook accounts, etc. It was a disgusting mess.

                                                        And I remember a friend of mine trying to defend it, saying crap like "Don't put anything online unless you're okay with everyone seeing it", and "There's like a voyeur feel to it, it's just a kink, it's not wrong."

                                                        Freaking absurd. If I went up to my friend's window and took photos of his longtime girlfriend while she was changing, or while walking naked to her dresser after a shower, and posted those photos online, that would be a huge breach of privacy, and he agreed. And eventually understood my point. The internet is not secure. neither are windows. Doesn't change the notion that the privacy we hold to can be torn away from us, and that it's not our fault if it is. Nothing is perfectly secure.

                                                        So leaked photos, of celebrities of random people, is just disgusting. Same category as upskirt photos, child porn photos, etc. in my eyes, because it's all non-consensual.

                                                        [–]monoxide0184 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                        It's non-consensual and terrible it happened. Feelings go out to the people affected. And this isn't ok; if whoever did this is ever caught, he'll get jail time and quite a bit of it given the money involved.

                                                        But I have to agree with your friend. Just don't store stuff like this online in the first place. Just don't do it. It's far too easy to break past passwords, especially when the target is a public person whose life is more or less open to the public 24/7. "Security questions" and other security measures rely on certain information or other accounts being private and this works fine for 99% of people. From everything I've read, this wasn't a wide-scale breach of some cloud service, it was targeted at specific users. The easiest way to avoid an embarrassing breach of privacy is to avoid the situation in the first place.

                                                        If you really want to do this sort of thing, get a film camera (yes, they still exist!) and store them in a box somewhere. For all the hassle, paper is still infinitely more secure than anything digital. Or if that's too much trouble, store them on your PC locally.

                                                        To borrow your analogy, the onus isn't on you to not take photos through your friends window (that's already illegal), the onus is on your friend to draw the curtains. Or catch you in the act so that police can be called etc.

                                                        Edit: To be clear, I'm not attempting to lay blame anywhere, but the reality of the world is that people suck and crime happens every day. Privacy is a very personal thing and privacy online is virtually non-existent despite best efforts by a lot of people to the contrary (myself included). Security breaches and identify theft happen every day, even to the most prepared people. Extremely sensitive/personal things like photographs of your naked body probably shouldn't be injected into that environment. It's extremely convenient for us, but an increase in convenience usually comes with a decrease in security every time.

                                                        [–]BRDtheist 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                        But the celebrities did "draw the curtains" - they had passwords and stuff. It's more comparable to the friend drawing the curtains and not realising that there was a tiny gap, and then the peeping tom coming up to that gap and taking photographs through it. Or using an open window to push the curtains aside. The friend shouldn't be expected to have to staple their fucking curtains together just because some shitbag wants to get his rocks off.

                                                        [–]drrilll 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                        This is such a valid point being entirely overlooked. Storing nudes on the internet, or even sending them by text is like taking all your valuables and storing them in your front yard. Your front yard is your property, and no one should violate that. And of course if someone takes them it is wrong, it is stealing, and it is a crime. But bottom line is you were asking for trouble when you decided to store your valuables somewhere so open.

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                                                          [–]thr0wawizzay 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                          As someone who's had photos of them put online on some creepy website people used to "trade" girls, I completely agree. The whole thing is kind of sad, actually.

                                                          [–]cunctatrix 33 ポイント34 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                          Yeah, this whole thing is really fucked up. And, yes, the sort of people who would hack and spread these images make even a fervent atheist like me pray for a hell just so they can get what they deserve. But you know what? This could also be a turning point. Maybe - just maybe - after all these people's nudes are leaked, after we are all, as a society, forced to collectively acknowledge that so many of our idols and role models take and share nudes of themselves, maybe we'll realize that someone having nudes online really isn't such a big deal. And it really doesn't say anything about who they are as a person, their morality, or their worth. Maybe, when some asshole ex-boyfriend posts a girl's nudes online, it won't be something that'll get her fired, or draw the ire of friends and family and her community. Maybe it won't be a big fucking deal at all - and wouldn't that be better for us all, in a way?

                                                          (I'll dare to dream, at least... and, of course, I want to make clear again I'm not trying to excuse or justify these actions at all; these people should be condemned and punished severely. But I also think our culture and the judgments against women who are victims of these actions can - and should - change.)

                                                          [–]TimeSovereign 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                          Well, that's one way it could go, I was kinda hoping for one step further, let's not blame the victims or judge them and while we are at it, let's just stop this whole trying to hurt women by hacking and posting private pictures of them in the first place.

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                                                            [–]HollaDude 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                            Me too, I just felt sick when I saw those threads. It's so disgusting.

                                                            [–]-halcyon 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                            Feeling sick when I read Reddit comments has become a common theme.

                                                            In the early days of Reddit, I came here to escape the bullshit commentary I experience in the real world.

                                                            As Reddit has grown in size, I increasingly find myself seeking commentary OUTSIDE the internet/Reddit.

                                                            It just makes me so god damn sad and horrified that so many people are so messed up... it seems like most people have a really shitty set of ethics....

                                                            [–]doubleunicorn 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                            Or they believe that their ethics are only applicable IRL. Once you're an anonymous pair of hands typing on a keyboard, anything goes... like there are no consequences.

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                                                              [–]buffalo-jones 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                              i dont think anybody's privacy should be violated. man or woman.

                                                              [–]Poptartica 50 ポイント51 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                              The whole time I'm reading the comments that were overjoyed at the violation of these peoples' privacy, all I could think was http://i.imgur.com/hsRexee.png

                                                              (edited for better wording!)

                                                              [–]9pmbedtime 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                              I don't feel good about it either. Their comments are way too excited. They are calling it the fappening, like it's Christmas.

                                                              [–]Poptartica 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                              Yeah, people should realize that aside from all of the very obvious "that's wrong" stuff, these sorts of things happening and being approved of by so many people are a huge reason why a lot of women are extremely hesitant to be sexually open with partners in this way/sense (or even with men who aren't 'partners'). It kind of ruins it for everyone in the future, and it's really dumb that people lack the foresight to see that. I mean yeah, there are of course people who are not comfortable being open that way to begin with. But stuff like this sure as hell makes the people who might have been... really cautious and probably unlikely to do it anymore.

                                                              [–]allisonrocks 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                              This is exactly the case, even if me and my SO are together forever and he never shares the pictures they could still get put out there and very negatively effect my life. I told him right when I saw the first thread this morning, "This is why I don't send nudes."

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                                                                  [–]Sunkat 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                  I am mad too. I have had people say to me that because these women live in the public eye they should have "been more careful" or "they were asking for it". I am loathed to live in a world where any woman must limit her freedom in fear of persecution by others! Why we are told not to walk alone at night. Told not to dress promiscuously. Why we are told not to take photos of our self; as an expression of our own sexuality with out fear of others exposing us.

                                                                  [–]JasonDavidWongPargin 136 ポイント137 ポイント  (60子コメント)

                                                                  I just want to point out that the fact that the photos were leaked against their will is precisely what these guys find arousing. If you had any lingering doubts about our society's unhealthy attitude toward women, here's a perfect example.

                                                                  If Jennifer Lawrence or any of these other actresses had just gone topless in some indie movie, you'd barely hear a peep - the whole reason this has exploded across Twitter and every single message board on the internet is because they find the violation aspect thrilling.

                                                                  The thing is, if any of those guys were caught, say, climbing into a tree to peep into these women's windows, they'd A) be prosecuted and B) ostracized as a creep. "What kind of a weirdo spies on girls against their will?" But the internet has turned it mainstream, made it acceptable. The fact that many of the photos are unflattering makes it even better, in their eyes - it proves they're supposed to be secret/private.

                                                                  You hear men talk about having sex with a woman in terms of winning or conquering (their "conquests") and I guess that's part of it. By stealing the photos and exposing them to the public, the creeps "won", and that's what turns them on.

                                                                  [–]whey_ 48 ポイント49 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                  I think you are spot on and it can be further expanded on by looking at how reddit and the internet at large is jumping on Jennifer Lawrence the most, rather than the other celebrities.

                                                                  JL has the reputation of being down to earth and someone who doesn't do nude scenes in movies or bring a lot of drama to herself like other celebrities do. Even Seth McFarland made a joke in front of millions about how she's the only one who hasn't showed her boobs on screen or in an accidental twitter leak. She's always shown as goofy, fun loving, klutzy girl-next-door type.

                                                                  Basically, she's the pure, sweet girl reddit and others fantasize about, compared to the other celebrities that leaked. Not saying the other celebrities are bad or anything like that, but they aren't viewed the same way JL is. The fact that she's also a reputable actress who has been climbing the ladder of success only adds to the level of damage these photos (and possibly videos) will do to her career compared to the others.

                                                                  So when you add all these factors up, it's not surprising that Jennifer Lawrence is the prime target. These fuckers find it thrilling that their little pure girl-next-door starlet is actually a "dirty girl" (read: normal human being) and they're all gleeful that they're getting the chance to help reveal it to the world and punish her for it.

                                                                  It's absolutely disgusting.

                                                                  [–]kikat 39 ポイント40 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                  I can not stand how people in the mega threads are mentioning that we should stop re-leaking this photos and all I'm hearing is "stop being such a white knight." If I needed any confirmation that there is definitely a chauvinistic misogynistic vibe that permeates Reddit then I have it.

                                                                  [–]PrincessGary 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                  Actually, the Jennifer Lawrence subreddit has deleted all the pictures, threads, and has threatened to ban anyone who reuploads them, I can't say the same for any others, as I've not looked.

                                                                  [–]DorianC0C0C0 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                  Really? That's actually wonderful.

                                                                  [–]whey_ 46 ポイント47 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                  reddit has always been a misogynistic shithole that likes to pretend it isn't. The only difference between reddit and 4chan is that 4chan doesn't try to hide it and reddit has better spelling and grammar.

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                                                                      [–]Vita_non_Victus 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                      If Jennifer Lawrence or any of these other actresses had just gone topless in some indie movie, you'd barely hear a peep

                                                                      The buzz around Scarlett Johansson's nude scene in 'Under the Skin' proves you wrong.

                                                                      [–]snaredonk 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                      Exactly, he has no idea what he is saying. Same when Miley posed topless it was everywhere

                                                                      [–]johnyann 60 ポイント61 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                      Seriously. There are more attractive women posting to /r/gonewild daily.

                                                                      I was talking to a friend about the whole insanity, and his argument was that people are just excited about boobs.

                                                                      Thats horseshit. You know how many boobs there are on the internet? That were posted with 100% consent? Millions. Maybe billions of boobs.

                                                                      [–]gamercer 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                      I just want to point out that the fact that the photos were leaked against their will is precisely what these guys find arousing.

                                                                      I don't know that that is true. If Kate or Jennifer posted a week ago saying that on Sunday they would willingly post nudes on the internet, I would expect at least as much of a frenzy.

                                                                      I think this excitement actually comes from the fact that nude images of these people hasn't actually been public yet. Neither of these people show and reveal everything within their professions.

                                                                      [–]deep_charlie 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (22子コメント)

                                                                      the fact that the photos were leaked against their will is precisely what these guys find arousing

                                                                      Not me. I just like looking at naked ladies. Especially ones I've admired for a long time.

                                                                      If Jennifer Lawrence or any of these other actresses had just gone topless in some indie movie, you'd barely hear a peep

                                                                      Wow. Not true. As soon as someone had capped a screener copy, it'd be all over the place and a big deal.

                                                                      I totally get that I'll downvoted til my shadow glows but I'm being honest.

                                                                      edit: downvotes away, fair enough :)

                                                                      [–]MayansLied 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                      /r/watchitfortheplot is a perfect example of people wanting to see celebrities naked in their movies.

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                                                                          [–]Zorkeldschorken 52 ポイント53 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                                                                          This happens every day. The only difference is that it's happening to celebrities.

                                                                          EVERY DAY, someone posts someone else's nudes to a message board.

                                                                          There are whole archives of nude selfies that were never intended to be shared.

                                                                          Relationships break up, and the ex posts the pictures. The intended recipient shares the pictures with his friends even though he promised not to. A "friend" borrows the recipient's (or the subject's) phone, looks through the pictures without permission, and sends themselves copies, which they then share. The phone gets lost, and the person that finds it looks through them and posts the pictures. Or any number of other reasons that I can't think of right now.

                                                                          But like I said, the only difference is that it happened to celebrities this time. And this isn't even the first time it's happened to celebrities.

                                                                          I know it sounds like I'm blaming the victim. I'm not. The person who does this kind of thing is an asshole, whether it's to a celebrity or to anyone else. But the only way to not get your nudes released is to not take them in the first place, or to immediately copy them off the phone and onto something more secure. This has happened so many many times that this should be obvious by now. But nobody thinks that it can happen to them, celebrity or not.

                                                                          [–]Lawtonfogle 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                          There are whole archives of nude selfies that were never intended to be shared.

                                                                          And it should be a sex crime.

                                                                          Sharing nudes of someone who hasn't consented should be a sex crime the same way sharing child porn is a sex crime. In both cases, they lack consent (the child because they are too young to consent, the adult because they did not consent) and thus sharing this material should be viewed as a sexual violation of the victim and thus a sex crime.

                                                                          [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                          Absolutely you are correct. I know this happens all the time. I've read the articles about the poor girls whose accounts are hacked. It's terrible when it happens to a 14 year old, a college girlfriend, or a random hookup. It's terrible when it happens to ANYONE. That doesn't mean I'm going to let the constant stream of inappropriate photos dull my anger at the violations of privacy that are rampant all over the internet.

                                                                          [–]Zorkeldschorken 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                          I know. I think we're saying the same thing. But phones are not secure. They're wonderful gadgets, and are changing things in ways we can't begin to imagine, but we're still learning.

                                                                          I have a 13-year-old daughter. She like to go online and play games and stuff.

                                                                          My wife and I have already repeatedly told her that if anyone online ever asks her for a picture, to just say no.

                                                                          One guy a few months back didn't like that. He kept pestering her about it. So she blocked him. ON HER OWN. She only told us about it afterward. I was so proud of her.

                                                                          [–]Svataben 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                          Excellent parenting and excellent kid!

                                                                          I have a friend who did her PhD on kid's safety on the Internet, and she found that, if a child got enough adult attention from home and was generally well guided, they'd not likely get in trouble on-line. I'm guessing your daughter is just such a kid. :)

                                                                          [–]chestyheaven 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                          This actually brought tears to my eyes. You should be extremely proud as a parent. I'm just now leaving my teenage years and I wish my parents had an adult conversation with me about nudity and respect. You're doing a fantastic job and your daughter is definitely on the right track.

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                                                                              [–]foreignergrl 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                              Girls who post themselves to r/gonewild[1] know what they're getting themselves into - they are choosing to be naked online for the world to see.

                                                                              Not always. There are no guarantee that they took those pics for that purpose, there are no guarantees that the redditors posting their pics are the girls in the pictures, there is no way to confirm whether or not those girls are adults (some sure as hell don't look like adults), and finally there is no way of knowing whether or not they have been coerced or pressured to take and post them.

                                                                              [–]BlackCaaaaat 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                              That is a really good point. Disturbing.

                                                                              [–]Jemhao 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                              Surprised this point isn't further up. While yes, there are professionals who work in the porn industry, it's so important to remember that there's non-consensual porn, and that porn and sex trafficking are linked.

                                                                              A blanket statement that "Porn is okay" can be just as ignorant, even if the intentions are good, as someone thinking it's okay to look at leaked nude photos.

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                                                                                [–]sentinel32 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                As a man, let me just say - reddit admins issuing shadowbans and deletions for talking about Zoe Quinn, but allowing this? I nominate the admins for hypocrites of the year.

                                                                                [–]appropriate-username 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                I think people looking at celebrities' nudes is less damaging to them than death and rape threats from hundreds of people (and people looking at her nudes) are to zoe but that might be just me.

                                                                                [–]sentinel32 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                                I'm not talking about threats. Those obviously should be grounds for bans and deletions.

                                                                                I'm talking about people being shadowbanned by admins simply for making top-level comments in threads, with absolutely no threats or attacks or personal information at all.

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                                                                                  [–]Vita_non_Victus 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                  Weren't those for doxing and brigading?

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                                                                                    [–]Bravely_Default 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                    As an avid reader of Barstool Sports I came here ready for man bashing but in actuality I complete agree with you. Its not even a gender thing its a privacy thing, no one would like their dirty laundry aired out in the public, its an invasion of privacy and whoever did it should be punished.

                                                                                    [–]Heavy_In_Your_Arms 34 ポイント35 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                    This made me upset too. My boyfriend asked me if I wanted to see Jennifer Lawrence nude and, out of curiosity, I said yes. After I saw the pictures and said that they didn't look like they were professionally taken, he told me that celebrities had been hacked and all their nudes were out online. I felt sick and guilty for having looked at Jennifer Lawrence.

                                                                                    I immediately said we shouldn't be looking. I thought it was wrong to look at peoples' bodies without them having released the pictures themselves, but it never really registered as an issue of consent until I read what OP wrote. I realize now that the lack of consent is what initially upset me.

                                                                                    I wish I could write a letter or something to these people who have been violated and tell them that they have support...but they would probably just feel really awkward knowing that the sender of the letter saw them naked. Also, how do you even know where to send such letters?

                                                                                    Ugh. Bottom line is that people are awful and the hackers need to be brought to justice.

                                                                                    EDIT: I didn't get an obscene amount of upvotes, but I wanted to say that I'm genuinely surprised I was met with a positive experience after posting that I did, albeit unwittingly, look at non-consentual nudes. I felt really vulnerable posting this experience because I feared I'd be looked down on in some way. I really appreciate the objective stance this community takes. You gals (and I suppose the odd y chromosome) surprise me in the best way every day. Way to go!

                                                                                    [–]TheAbsurdityOfItAll 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                    As a man myself, I totally agree. I've enjoyed a vast collection of porn over the years. Love porn. But these pics, because of their nature, don't do anything for me. Like those unwitting "up skirt" images taken in public. Just fucking gross.

                                                                                    [–]Subrosian_Smithy 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                    What the fuck did I miss now?

                                                                                    Someone let out a bunch of naked celeb photos? And people think it's cool?

                                                                                    I don't know how I feel about the people fapping to this but I do have absolutely no sympathy for the people sharing it.

                                                                                    [–]AnInternetName 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                    I'm a dude who stumbled upon this thread via r/all. I think it's really shitty - the whole thing is a massive invasion of privacy. Celebs are people too and I don't buy the whole "fair game" argument. This shit ain't right.

                                                                                    [–]leo_99 35 ポイント36 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                                                                    I'm so upset with this. Reddit thinks "people deserve their privacy", except women, because I'm guessing to them women don't count as people. It's bullshit, and my heart goes out to JLaw, Kate Upton, Victoria Justice, and anyone else who got their pics leaked. Fuck whoever did this. It's disgusting.

                                                                                    [–]alanitoo 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                    Most people are avid readers of celebrity tabloids, blogs, etc. This has nothing to do with the fact that JLAW and others are women and everything to do with the fact that these women are famous.

                                                                                    I mean was Anthony Weiner's penis picture not splashed on top of every tabloid for weeks? Why? because he was a well known politician.

                                                                                    When it comes to celebrities there is always a morbid fascination about their everyday lives. If someone had leaked naked pictures of Chris Pratt, Jon Hamm, Brad Pitt etc, these would've still hit r/all and everyone would be talking about it.

                                                                                    [–]Yosafbrige 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                    Actually; I had the same thought about Chris Pratt and I still doubt his picture would have exploded like Jennifer Lawrence has despite his current Reddit god status.

                                                                                    It would be talked about sure. There would likely be one post about it that would barely hit the front page.

                                                                                    It IS because this is a famous WOMEN that this took over the Reddit front page for the entire day.

                                                                                    Sure; most of that is because Reddit is comprised of primarily straight men who don't like seeing another dude naked. But also it's because women don't seem to get as much titillation out of seeing a straight on naked man. A lot of women's "hot guys" pictures are of the men's faces or a man wearing nice clothing (or forearms exposed shots) or nice abs at the most. Compared to guys who focus heavily on the "exposed" aspect of a women's body.

                                                                                    I'm not making any giant judgements here, 'cause I'm not sure HOW I feel exactly at this point (I looked at Jennifer Lawrence's pictures too, but I didn't see anything particularly exciting about them and felt extremely bad doing it). But I doubt HEAVILY that leaked male pictures would cause this sort of uproar no matter WHO it was.

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                                                                                      [–]Gnome__Chomsky 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                      Can we not go from "Hey, nude pictures of hot actresses!" to "Reddit doesn't think women count as people", please?

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                                                                                        [–]Gyrro 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        To the men who saw no problem with this: how would you feel if it was your girlfriend, sister, or mother's photos?

                                                                                        I don't really visit this sub so I feel I should really just step back and let you subscribers discuss this, but I just wanted to comment upon the above sentence quickly. Before I do I want to note that I am in no way advocating the release of these photos nor am I blaming anyone for the problems celebrities face, I just wanted to touch upon one thing.

                                                                                        The problem with celebrities is that they are treated as a higher social class, and as such are detached from the rest of society in a way. Due to this, I think other people think it's okay to share these photos because they don't see celebrities as people; they're just the things we see on screen. They're almost imaginary due to their detached relationship with the rest of society.

                                                                                        The obsession people have with the private lives of celebrities and the invasion of such things stretches far beyond the realms of nakedness though - much of it relates to glossy magazines targeted mainly at women that expose the tiniest flaws of celebrities while they're sunbathing or out with their kids. Don't get me wrong here - I'm not saying it's any of your fault, just pointing out that both genders are at fault here. We as a society need to stop putting celebrities on this pedestal and treat them as people. It's unhealthy for everyone.

                                                                                        [–]Whipped_Grave [非表示スコア]  (1子コメント)

                                                                                        How is this different from paparazzi pics? The subject of the photo doesnt consent?

                                                                                        I agree that the way these photos were found was completely illegal and does seriously violate the right to privacy. But on the cover of every gossip mag, that are sold primarily to females, is filled with non-consensual photos.

                                                                                        [–]SenseiT [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        In your post you surmised that the person who stole and posted the photos thought he/she had a right to do so. In my experience, people do shitty things because they want to, not because the feel entitled. I suggest the poster knows it is wrong and a violation and just does not give a crap.

                                                                                        [–]meegs9 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        This story has been posted in various places across the internet - and on all of the pages I have seen, there are various people saying that the women deserve it, that they were so stupid for trusting 'the cloud', that they need to shoulder some blame for daring to be sexually active in a moment that they thought was private and secure. It is utterly disgusting, and I cannot believe that we live in a world where a woman is blamed when her private property it stolen.

                                                                                        [–]amoebaamoeba 49 ポイント50 ポイント  (57子コメント)

                                                                                        I'm angry I had to come to TwoXChromosomes just to see a thread that starts from the POV that maybe we shouldn't steal and share photos of women without their consent.

                                                                                        That this is okay to the majority of redditors is mind-boggling. I hope this doesn't sound like hyperbole but I can't shake the feeling that many posters are exhibiting behaviours similar to those of actual rapists. Specifically the power dynamic element - ideas that these women "owe" us their naked bodies, that they "tease" us in movies by being sexy, that they're public property. And the round after round of cyber-high fiving over the fact that they know these photos were released against their will.

                                                                                        Relishing the idea of seeing the nudes of someone who doesn't want you to see them, despite already having access to plenty of other photos from consenting (often paid) women? Sounds pretty fucking familiar to me.

                                                                                        [–]alanitoo 62 ポイント63 ポイント  (31子コメント)

                                                                                        You know how to desentisize people from the brutal crime that is rape? By fucking throwing it around every single time in any case that isn't specifically rape.

                                                                                        No the guys jerking off to nude pictures of Jennifer Lawrence aren't rapists. Not even close. If Jennifer Lawrence and all those actresses had decided to have a big nude photo shoot today, do you seriously think all these guys on Reddit would be turned off? Nope. It was consensual you guys, total boner kill. Fuck no. It would've still hit r/all and everyone would still be talking about it.

                                                                                        Is it a horrible violation of privacy? Of course. But did you really expect for someone to say, 'Here are naked pictures of the hottest women in the industry' and the majority of people to simply choose to ignore it? Heck, I'm a straight girl and I looked at them out of simple curiosity. This reminds me of Seth Rogen's line in 'Zack and Miri make a Porno' where he says he would watch a leaked porno of Rosie o Donnell even though he doesn't find her attractive simply because she's famous'.

                                                                                        TL;DR: These men are not rapists anymore than someone who reads about a horrible murder news story is a potential murderer. So seriously stop throwing around that word because it just demeans and offends women who have actually been raped.

                                                                                        [–]amoebaamoeba 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (22子コメント)

                                                                                        I never said it was rape. I said the justifications that people are giving for why it's okay to look at these photos are often surprisingly similar to those given by rapists. Learn to read.

                                                                                        Edit: direct quotes from various threads - "They play a game of sexual denial. They arouse us a dozen times and never offer resolution. It's only fair that this happen."

                                                                                        "If they didn't want this to happen, they shouldn't have taken these photos"

                                                                                        (In response to Mary Elizabeth Winstead's tweet) "Yep, I AM 'feeling pretty great' now'!"

                                                                                        "I want to look at Jennifer Lawrence's tits and neither she nor god is going to stop me"

                                                                                        "Remember to download and store the pics in case the celebs try to delete them!"

                                                                                        [–]alanitoo 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (21子コメント)

                                                                                        You're cherry picking comments. I can do that as well. Two of the most heavy upvoted posts on Reddit talked about Reddit's hypocrisy regarding the NSA and celeb nudes.

                                                                                        Let's address your points.

                                                                                        • The idea that these women owe us their naked bodies: That applies to every single fucking celebrity. How many times has Mel Gibson, Alec Baldwin, Tom Cruise gotten into trouble or sued magazines who delved into their private lives? It's what comes with being a celebrity. It's not because they are women.

                                                                                        • Round of high fiving because these pictures were released against their will: Wut. I was in these threads. The only high fives were at the fact that you were seeing these attractive celebritites naked. That's it. No one was circle jerking over the fact that it was non consensual. In fact if you had visited these threads you would see that's where the uncomfortable comments were about. 'Like yea these pictures are hot...but the guy who released this is a jerk'.

                                                                                        • Relishing the idea of seeing the nudes of someone who doesn't want you to see them instead of looking at consenting women. Let's see. If you had given Redditors two choices. a) You can see this picture of this unknown hot woman but the pictures were released by her vindictive ex. or b) Jennifer Lawrance has released this nude picture. You can only see one. Which one do you seriously think MOST guys would pick??

                                                                                        TL;DR Men are clicking on these pictures because the women are hot and famous. That is all. Stop trying to make rape analogies that simply don't apply here.

                                                                                        [–]badlucklincoln2 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        Gonna be honest, I think voyeurism is a fetish for many guys and girls, the idea of spying on someone intimately without their knowledge or consent turns some people (men and women) on.

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                                                                                            [–]sleepydruid 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            Totally agree. I ended up just searching for this thread on TwoX. Really sucks.

                                                                                            [–]chinese_drugs 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            I know this person attacked you for this comment, but I just want to say I agree with you. The word "rape culture" is thrown around a lot, but I think this crime (along with the subsequent blaming of the women for having taken the photos in the first place) is a good example of what rape culture is. I don't think you're "throwing around" the word rape by alluding to a greater cultural context that excuses rape and pointing out how this incident fits into that context.

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                                                                                              [–]ryeoldfashioned 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                              Its interesting that reactions to this leak seem to be different than all the prior leaks. Over the past 5 years there has been an unending parade of celebrity nude picture leaks, all of which were invasions of privacy (Scarlett Johanson, etc).

                                                                                              There seems to be a lot more pushback and anger this time. Not that I disagree, I just wonder what makes this time different.

                                                                                              [–]Yosafbrige 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              I think the difference is just how ubiquitous this leak was.

                                                                                              It literally has taken over Reddit and Twitter for the entire day. These pictures are being passed around all over the Internet.

                                                                                              There WAS pushback for the Scarlett Johanssen pictures too (I was there, I remember), but it was more contained than this. It was just a few threads, not the ENTIRE front page of Reddit and the top trending news for hours on all websites that count that sort of thing.

                                                                                              [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              I actually don't know for sure what the big difference is, but I do know that other leaks have not shown up on my radar like this has.

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                                                                                                [–]PM_ME_YOUR_DICK_PIXX 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                Yea, was just talking with a guy on the thread who claims that all women take nude selfies for attention and validation. When I brought up the fact that some people take them for their SOs and have trust in their partner not to share the pictures, he argued that it was still for attention and validation. So apparently women don't get off from sexting with their partner... What sexless, sexualized objects we are.

                                                                                                [–]sparklesia 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                I've been on Reddit continuously since 10pm (it's past 5am now) following the "fappening." I can't sleep, I feel sick.

                                                                                                I've read through thousands of comments in various subs but they're all the same. Men bragging about how much they've fapped, how they only loved Jennifer Lawrence because they wanted to see her naked, how she's now a "slut like any other trashy girl on the Internet" because she committed the grievous crime of taking personal nudes.

                                                                                                There are a few people who speak out about the invasion of privacy, but they're inevitably shot down as either being "white knights" who are "missing their balls" or feminist lesbians.

                                                                                                I can't stop myself from reading the literal circlejerk that's going on right now. It's the volume of the misogynistic comments that bothers me. There are thousands of individuals on Reddit who think and feel this way strongly enough to comment on these threads. I would understand glancing at the leaked photos to satisfy curiosity (I'm guilty of that hypocrisy myself), but crudely objectifying women and insulting those who feel uncomfortable fapping to nonconsensually released photos??

                                                                                                I don't know how to feel, how to make sense of all this. I feel utterly disenchanted with the community here on Reddit. Is it just the demographic here, or is this how many men think? I never noticed this level of rampant hatred, immaturity and objectification in the past... was I just oblivious?

                                                                                                I don't know why I'm so strongly affected by this. I usually ignore celebrity gossip and have no issues with porn and wanting to fap. Maybe it's because I've sent nudes to SOs myself, and I know how vulnerable and exposed it makes you feel. I don't even know why I'm posting this, but I feel I have to, I need to know there are other people who are as sickened by all the comments as I am.

                                                                                                [–]3inchesOfFun 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                For every person who is okay with these photos, I am wondering how they would react if they had naked photos of themselves posted to their facebook pages?

                                                                                                [–]Trenchie_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                This is my stance exactly, both philosophically, in terms of feminist ideals, and in sexual interest.

                                                                                                The feminist reasons in terms of consent are fairly obvious, but the sexual interest is also related, as the fact that someone wants me to see them naked is more, well, arousing honestly, than the nudity itself.

                                                                                                I don't doubt that others are different, but I do wonder how common this aspect of arousal is.

                                                                                                [–]thatsnotgneiss 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                It looks like imgur is taking them down almost as fast as folks are getting them up.

                                                                                                [–]Polyneophite 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                Until Jennifer Lawrence shows up at my house and says she wants to take her clothes off I am not interested. Would I be interested then? Damn right I would.

                                                                                                Now? In illegally acquired hacked photos without consent? Not even a little interested, in fact I am anti-interested.

                                                                                                [–]dolfjewolfje [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                I wish people would learn the difference between porn stars and music/movie stars :/

                                                                                                [–]Jammmbo [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                I just had a somewhat heated discussion with my workmates about this.... they are all men. Luckily one of them did agree with me on how degrading it was to the women involved. However having to explain to the other ones how degrading it was and victim blaming is horrible, was quite hard to do. I wish I could get my point across without getting upset sometimes.

                                                                                                [–]theshawnna [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                The violation of privacy is shocking, the nudity is not. Can't we all just get used to everyone having a body already?

                                                                                                [–]TheGoldenMouth [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                yes thats terrible, where can i see this?

                                                                                                [–]Qender 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                                I thought it was odd that all the hacked photos were women. Obviously male celebrities photos would also be valuable or of "voyeuristic interest." I think it says something about how society feels entitled to view women's bodies, as if a clothed women is a riddle that has to be answered with nudity or else leave one perpetually wondering. Whereas male privacy is respected.

                                                                                                [–]froderick 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (37子コメント)

                                                                                                Out of curiosity, if naked photos of, say... Hugh Jackman, Ryan Gosling, or Channing Tatum were leaked and women online were doing the same things, would you have the exact same complaints?

                                                                                                If so, then good. That's consistency right there. I know a couple of women who've expressed your view, yet when I propose the above hypothetical, they say "Oh well that wouldn't be as bad".

                                                                                                [–]carolinablue199 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                I would still have a problem with it if the pictures were stolen. Neither you nor I are entitled to viewing anyone's body, celebrity or not, male or female. It's a sick violation of their privacy, essentially a virtual peeping.

                                                                                                [–]froderick 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                                I agree with you, however lets be honest... if nudes of the aforementioned male celebrities were leaked, would you see as much outrage on this subreddit?

                                                                                                [–]carolinablue199 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                I would hope so. I can't think of a situation in the past to sort of formulate a hypothesis. So many of the leaked pictures over of years (that I've heard of/made headlines) were of women. Erin Andrews being filmed secretly in her hotel. The Dirty posting nudes of women sent in by their scorned exes. Vanessa Hudgens leaked pics (which Disney blamed her for). Kate Middleton being spied on with a telephoto lens while sunbathing on a private beach. This is a long standing trend of trying to catch women in naked for self gratification. We're tired of it, we are angry and frankly I think we are a little bit scared of how quickly it can happen to any woman...

                                                                                                Can you recall an instance of a male celebrity having nude pics leaked? Or sites where male nudes are sent in by women to humiliate them?

                                                                                                I am saying it's still wrong, but I do believe the outrage is also based on the history and frequency of attacks on women's privacy: it's also combined with common unwanted comments on our bodies (sometimes daily) in public.

                                                                                                [–]Muttbag 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                Prince Harry in Vegas, Colin Farrell

                                                                                                [–]WizardofStaz [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                Why are you trying so hard for this? "Let's be honest, aren't you REALLY a hypocrite? Aren't women REALLY hypocrites?"

                                                                                                [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                                I would, actually. Just because it's a man I've admired on screen does not give me a right to his body. Conversely, were such a photo to be released consensually, that would be a different story.

                                                                                                [–]ef_you_see_potassium 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                I would

                                                                                                so interestingly as part of those pictures Kate Upton's boyfriend, Justin Verlander, was shown nude presumably without consent as well and no one is making any noise regarding the matter.

                                                                                                [–]froderick 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                I agree with you 100%, I just know people who are a bit hypocritical on the subject. However you can almost bet that if said photos would leak, you wouldn't see near as much condemnation on TwoX than you would on these current leaks.

                                                                                                [–]birdswillbebirds 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                                                                Tumblr and other predominantly-female sites were ecstatic when nudes were leaked of Dylan Sprouse. In fact, Tumblr was the site responsible for spreading his nudes. Where was the outrage then?

                                                                                                [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                                                                                I do not know who that is. And I would hope that there was someone out there like me who was advocating for his privacy!

                                                                                                [–]birdswillbebirds 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                                I'm sure there was, but there wasn't nearly as much outrage as we've witnessed today. The fact that you haven't even heard about his leaks proves my point.

                                                                                                I didn't know who Dylan Sprouse was, either, so I googled him. He was one of the twins on the Disney show 'The Suite Life of Zack and Cody.'

                                                                                                [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                                                I don't know that show either. I am sure there exists a double standard. That does not eliminate the need for a conversation regarding bodily privacy for both genders.

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                                                                                                  [–]lilianegypt 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  It would still be a despicable invasion of privacy. Male or female, if someone's photos are leaked without their consent, then no thank you. It makes me sick to my stomach. There's nothing sexy about lack of consent and peeping toms.

                                                                                                  [–]sockstream 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  This. And also, consider what you would've done at different stages of your life. I imagine there's a lot of immaturity going on, and the majority of early teens would laugh and giggle about all of this.

                                                                                                  It's the kind of question you should really answer for yourself. Already others have decided to respond with the high ground opinion, and if that's the truth for them then that's fantastic. But think long and hard for yourself.

                                                                                                  That said, it's all wrong, of course. Even knowing context beforehand, my curiosity got me to click through to two of the pictures. A lot of people mention disgust here, whereas I think it's more embarrassment, like you just walked in on someone finishing up a shower. The disgust comes after, when you start thinking about what this does to these women, what horrible shitheads did the leaking, and how many people are seeing the pictures.

                                                                                                  [–]grimoiregirl 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  If nudes of a celebrity I find hugely attractive were posted online without their consent, then yes, I'd be tempted, but no, I wouldn't look.

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                                                                                                    [–]NHDruj 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    Reddit has an odd relationship with the concept of "privacy".

                                                                                                    [–]Lawtonfogle 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                    My big problem with this is that these ladies (actresses, atheletes, and models) had NO SAY over whether their pictures wound up online.

                                                                                                    Put simply, these photos being used as sexual material by others was never consented to. Isn't the lack of consent what makes child porn bad? Why are these photos so different? The only real difference I see here is that the average man would find the subject of these hacked photos attractive, and thus much of society turns a blind eye to it. But while that explains it, that does NOT justify it.

                                                                                                    [–]sumanane 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    I learned about them as I was browsing /r/bitcoin, and boy was I disgusted and enraged with the comments on the thread.

                                                                                                    [–]Venicedreaming 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    I want to live in a world that sexual pictures of women will no longer make headlines

                                                                                                    [–]mandano 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    While it's wrong to steal and distribute pictures etc etc, I don't really think it's a big deal to have your naked pictures out there with or without consent. Everyone knows what naked people look like, and you go out to the beach or the club nearly naked... And it doesn't take a rocket scientist to imagine what you look like naked. people will masturbate about you without actual nude pictures...

                                                                                                    While a picture of you that is released without consent violates your privacy, it does not violate your person, because a picture of you is not you, so people viewing it or masturbating to it will never be known to you or harm you. Plus, these days, it's so common for nudes to be around that it likely wouldn't damage most careers if it were found out by the wrong person.

                                                                                                    [–]PSTTSE 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                                    Oh boy I'm going to get shit on so hard for saying this, I'm very sorry in advance. You can turn off iCloud photostream universally across all devices by logging out of your iCloud account or disabling it entirely. If you have famous boobs and you think some hacker scum would want to get at your private photos, there are steps you can take to protect yourself. Not saying this isn't unfortunate for all the women involved, privacy should always be respected.

                                                                                                    [–]Turgidbee 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                    Who would shit on you for saying that? That's sensible advice.

                                                                                                    [–]JackfromAllstate 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    I didn't know you could do this. Probably lots of people don't, or I'm just computer-retarded. Interesting.

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                                                                                                      [–]TheBeginningEnd 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      I'm angry that whoever hacked these photos felt they had the right to do so. They thought that because they could, it was permisable to violate the privacy of these women. I feel like every instance of hacking like this is a HUGE violation of women's anyone's rights.

                                                                                                      FTFY.

                                                                                                      [–]toomany_geese 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                      Honestly, I'm glad that celebrities were involved because they have the assets and means to sue this guy's ass off for all he's worth.

                                                                                                      Shit like this happens to normal women every day, but they pretty much have no course of retaliation or means of protecting themselves. Remember that one guy who hacked and leaked photos of a woman's medical photos after she had surgery for breast cancer? Disgusting.

                                                                                                      [–]-Sai- 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                      I'm angry that whoever hacked these photos felt they had the right to do so. They thought that because they could, it was permisable to violate the privacy of these women.

                                                                                                      Because women's bodies are public property. But don't forget, we don't need feminism anymore and it's teh badz!

                                                                                                      [–]peachesandmolybdenum[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      Right? I don't need feminism because all the strong women before me fixed everything!!!

                                                                                                      [–]Mf_mays 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                      i disagree with the statement that it's a violation of women's rights. privacy isn't a woman's right, it's every human's right. and that you said that many men think it's okay. a small margin thinks it is, not many. just looking at it does not affirm the assumption that because you look at it means it's okay. other than that good post.

                                                                                                      [–]y_x_n 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      It's pitiful that some people have absolutely NO DISREGARD for others, doesn't matter if they're celebrities or fucking strangers on the internet.

                                                                                                      Men can be real pigs and I've lost some faith in humanity now. The amount of attention and interest that these leaks have caused is just ridiculous and shameful.

                                                                                                      [–]Lamadian 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                      Imagine if everyone got this upset with regards to the NSA basically hacking ALL of our phones, looking at our pictures, and passing them around amongst themselves. Which they do.

                                                                                                      [–]ChadwickHenryWard 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                      Reddit is disgusting.

                                                                                                      [–]hhggekt 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                      There are disgusting people everywhere, but the overall reaction of the entire thread can be broken down to three major opinions:

                                                                                                      • Don't trust overly sensitive data to any data services unless they are physical, in your possession, and encrypted.
                                                                                                      • The person(s) responsible should be held accountable, and all companies partaking in the release of these photos should be heavily prosecuted/fined.
                                                                                                      • You shouldn't take photos that you don't want someone else to see.

                                                                                                      I marked the third opinion because I completely disagree. The argument of nude selfies can go on ad infinitum, but in the end the justification need only lie with the parties involved. This was a gross breach of privacy and like in all things, victim blaming solves nothing.

                                                                                                      It's still to be determined who is at fault but if anything this situation should at least teach everyone the first opinion is particularly valid: Don't trust overly sensitive data to any data services unless they are physical, in your possession, and encrypted.

                                                                                                      [–]ramot1 [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      I don't post very much, but I am going to. I will not even look at those pictures for the same reasons that OP and many others object to them. It is certainly not a red-letter day for reddit , but at least a few of us will be able to hold our heads up, and our standards too.

                                                                                                      [–]industriallatheman [非表示スコア]  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                      I love how on reddit guys will:

                                                                                                      • Constantly pester women to post pictures of their boobs... for science!
                                                                                                      • Complain about the NSA's outrageous violation of our privacy.

                                                                                                      And then when a woman who send someone nude photos and whose privacy was violated... straight to how dumb she was for taking the pictures in the first place.

                                                                                                      [–]BonoLightier [非表示スコア]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      Violating the privacy of women, or their rights in the matter, is considered to be sexual assault.

                                                                                                      [–]spagoogly 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      consent is cool, guys. It's the same as my bf staring at a lady in the street-just because she has a nice ass doesn't mean you get to stare at it. The same way, just because you're an attractive celebrity doesn't mean we get to sae you naked without your permission or knowledge.

                                                                                                      [–]InducedLobotomy 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      Personally, this is exactly why my wife is smart enough to keep her clothes on in front of a camera. The internet and computers is no place for someone's nude body. Unless you're totally are okay with the understanding that someone could acquire said photos without consent or knowledge, ladies, guys, keep your nudes off electronic devices.

                                                                                                      [–]fsy123 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      It's common sense, if people don't want their nude photos shown to the public, don't upload them online or to a server. Or don't take nude photos at all. People WILL find a way to access those photos and WILL want to share those pics with the whole world. You gotta think a little man.

                                                                                                      Stick to polaroids, where truly no one except only you can see the picture.

                                                                                                      Tl:dr dont be an idiot and take nudes and post them on the internet. Hackers are here.

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