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I'm not too comfortable with selective abortion (self.SRSDiscussion)

submitted by komnene

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[–]komnene[S] [score hidden]

How about you don't try to police what someone else does with their body for any reason?

How about I put one of the most basic values of society above a tiny (no screening for certain non-illness causing genetic markers) restriction? Everyone of us being created by random (through fertilization of the egg by a random sperm cell) kind of makes us on an equal footing despite all the differences in genetics and circumstances. Clones or genetically engineered people takes all of that away from us. I don't want to force upon anyone the feeling of being created significantly differently from other people, I don't want to live in a society in which one part of the population is obviously deemed as inferior and less worthy of life to the other.

I don't want to live in a society in which we artificially create an elite population. How can you all be so blind towards what that might bring?

I just feel like my value > your value.

[–]NSASkypeDate [score hidden]

I don't want to live in a society in which one part of the population is obviously deemed as inferior and less worthy of life to the other.

This is the problem. Not bodily autonomy.

Everyone of us being created by random (through fertilization of the egg by a random sperm cell) kind of makes us on an equal footing despite all the differences in genetics and circumstances.

This is laughable. I am laughing.

EDIT: Like most privileges, the ones your afraid of here are going to be available to only the moneyed, and that is a far greater cause of inequality than the scientific progress you're afraid of.

[–]komnene[S] [score hidden]

EDIT: Like most privileges, the ones your afraid of here are going to be available to only the moneyed, and that is a far greater cause of inequality than the scientific progress you're afraid of.

Why, even? Because they can do things the poor can't? Boo hoo. Is this the only reason? Not the elite society-within-society that is artifically created? Even if everyone can do the selective abortion, at the end the children that come through selective abortion will eventually form the elite and easily oppress the children that were created without selective abortion (more like eugenics). "Oh haha, you don't have blonde hair? Why didn't you get aborted?"

[–]NSASkypeDate [score hidden]

Because they can do things the poor can't? Boo hoo.

I am having trouble understanding anything you just said, but this line is making me question your place here.

[–]komnene[S] [score hidden]

It is an issue, but a really irrelevant compared to the one that I am arguing against here. Society functions with rich people doing things poor people can't. Seriously I wonder what this is about rich people and not rich people if the genetically engineered and non-engineered people will create new, way worse classes easily. I wonder if society can function if:

  • People aren't entirely responsible for their life-story anymore (Oh I am like this because my parents made me this way through genetic engineering) - it is an attack on independence

  • That people that have characteristics that are aborted normally know that they are deemed less worthy of life by society

  • That we put certain people in a "making" condition and other people into a "made" position, even if what I am talking about is free for all, it will create new classes of unoptimized and optimized persons; allowing people to fiddle with your genetics takes independence off of you and transfers it to the one who decided on which genetics are good and which bad

[–]NSASkypeDate [score hidden]

Oh I am like this because my parents made me this way through genetic engineering

People already do that with their upbringing.

That people that have characteristics that are aborted normally

Why are you convinced that this is going to happen? Abortion is still a traumatic experience, and right now we're talking about screening, not engineering. People aren't going to go "well Honey, let's hit the painful and damaging reset button on you because of this minor problem."

it will create new classes of unoptimized and optimized persons

I don't see any way that we as a species can muster the resources to do what you're talking about, or that we could achieve the economic equality it would require while still making the scientific progress (we are really nowhere near this point) needed for it.

In a world where women's reproductive rights are so severely restricted, especially where I live, you are challenging bodily autonomy by nitpicking over the ethics of a science fiction universe.

[–]komnene[S] [score hidden]

Challenging bodily autonomy on screening of genetical characteristics unrelated to illnesses, something that isn't done yet anyway, but might be in the future. That's all. A woman can still do everything except screen for this particular thing. (Although I am clearly against genetic engineering as well, but not the topic of this thread) Also this is pretty similar to genetical engineering already anyway - it's about optimization of the human genome.

This whole thread is specifically about the hypothetical scenario I am talking about and might be possible in the future.

[–]NSASkypeDate [score hidden]

Also this is pretty similar to genetical engineering already anyway - it's about optimization of the human genome.

They're similar only in that they share motives that you are ascribing to them. You have a persistent problem in thinking that people someday potentially having the freedom to maybe do something that could create an oppressive culture is the problem, and not the attitudes which cause oppression.

You're an asshole, and I'm going to breakfast.

[–]komnene[S] [score hidden]

We are a lot closer to that society than you think. Shopping for genetic characteristics might become a reality in 20-30 years. This is my take on how to deal with it.

So you are an asshole for diverting attention from real problems women have with body autonomy in current society? This is a discussion board, not a public TV debate.