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[AMA Request] The Reddit Admins (self.IAmA)

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[–]xman813 148 ポイント149 ポイント

Have they lived down the (?|?) yet?

[–]buffalobuffalobuffa 97 ポイント98 ポイント

Hopefully not.

[–]FAWMartin 22 ポイント23 ポイント

Shit, I can't tell whether or not that's a popular opinion.

[–]mrdude817 10 ポイント11 ポイント

Well it has positive karma, so it must be, right?

Shit, I don't know either.

[–]beernerd 21 ポイント22 ポイント

Since that issue affects less than 1% of users, and they recently implemented compromises for the legitimate complaints, I'm pretty sure they've moved on.

Edit: Downvotes won't change the facts. Sorry.

Edit 2: Those of you asking for sources should take a look at this page. Here's the short version: 113 million unique visitors, of which less than 3 million logged in meaning that roughly 2.6% of active users could potentially have RES installed.

[–]nicko378 93 ポイント94 ポイント

Les than 1% uses RES? That seems hard to believe

[–]aveman101 33 ポイント34 ポイント

Only 10% of page visitors have an account, and only 10% of account holders contribute at all (comments, post submissions, votes, etc). That's where the 1% comes from.

However, I believe you can still use RES without holding an account (let alone contributing), so that figure might be too low as a percentage of RES users.

[–]DirkPortly 17 ポイント18 ポイント

you can also contribute without using RES. So I'd say the number is actually probably high.

[–]stubborn_d0nkey 10 ポイント11 ポイント

How many users primarily use mobile devices?

[–]Mammies 42 ポイント43 ポイント

🙋

[–]cantgrowneckbeardAMA 8 ポイント9 ポイント

Make that✌️of us.

[–]LordofShit 8 ポイント9 ポイント

Me 🕒

[–]nomahcnatut 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Me clock❓

[–]LordofShit 4 ポイント5 ポイント

Look at the time on the clock.

[–]THE_OBEAST 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Number 🕓 reporting in.

[–]NichoNico 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Definitely helps that I'm using the Chromoji extension for Chrome, or else I would have no clue what your sentence meant.

[–]nakedatkeyboard -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

I call bullshit on these 2, I don't know how to do that fancy crap on mobile.

[–]LordofShit 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Hit the globe next to the space bar.

[–]darkshaddow42 0 ポイント1 ポイント

thatsthejoke.jpg

[–]image_linker_bot -1 ポイント0 ポイント

thatsthejoke.jpg

Feedback welcome at /r/image_linker_bot

[–]Troggie42 0 ポイント1 ポイント

My app has RES features built in so it fucked me up too, although instead of (?|?) It shows (100|0) for scores as if there are just a lot of upvotes and no downs. It's Reddit News for android of anyone's curious.

[–]pnt510 0 ポイント1 ポイント

There are also people who use mobile or don't bother installing RES so the number is even lower.

[–]LordofShit 2 ポイント3 ポイント

It's not like those groups are mutually exclusive. I use both.

[–]Jaksuhn 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Only 10% of page visitors have an account

Are they 'users' though if they don't have an account ? I would have thought they would just be viewers, users implies (at least I thought) they have an account.

[–]aveman101 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Semantics.

You shouldn't write off 90% of your visitors just because they don't have an account, and therefore aren't technically "users."

[–]EdgarAllanNope -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Yeah, but no one gives a fuck about lurkers.

[–]THE_OBEAST 0 ポイント1 ポイント

True.

[–]snegtul 5 ポイント6 ポイント

TIL: I am the 1%.

AAAAAAAAH!

[–]Roboticide 15 ポイント16 ポイント

Reddit is much larger than most realize. And RES much smaller.

It was a very vocal minority that disliked the change, but given that Reddit Admins have access to all the hard data, it was still a better change.

[–]A_CHEERFUL_GUY 5 ポイント6 ポイント

I'm an active user who doesn't use RES because I can't download it at work.

[–]ImAnAlbatross 0 ポイント1 ポイント

An admin from reddit did an ama like a week ago

[–]THE_OBEAST 1 ポイント2 ポイント

How is that related to him not being able to download RES at work?

[–]Roboticide -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

Okay.... So... what's your point...?

You might be a cheerful guy, but you're also still a statistically insignificant one.

[–]RsonW 1 ポイント2 ポイント

You think a statistically insignificant number of people don't use RES?

[–]cywydd -1 ポイント0 ポイント

His point is that he is an active user who doesn't use RES because he can't download it at work.

[–]DiabolicallyRandom 0 ポイント1 ポイント

And most of the apps on phones did the same thing as RES.

[–]Mordaxx 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I never understood "the change"? What happened except the (?|?)? What's better and what's new?

[–]Luretch 2 ポイント3 ポイント

I had no idea what RES meant, everyone seemed to assume everyone else knew what it was and I know that's not the case!

[–]andnowmyteaiscold 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I was once in a class with a girl in college who, after spending 3 years in a psychology program, hadn't heard of Pavlov or his experiments with dogs (a fundamental experimental of classical conditioning that is mentioned in virtually every psychology class and is fairly well known and understood by the general public.)

I didn't really know what to say and be careful about what I said as to not make her feel stupid.

Had I been a more blunt person I would have said exactly what I was thinking, which was:

"Well, you obviously haven't been paying attention."

[–]beernerd 4 ポイント5 ポイント

Over 65 million unique visitors every month. Even with millions of downloads, RES users are a niche group.

[–]EdgarAllanNope 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Not really. Most are lurkers and don't participate. They don't matter.

[–]beernerd -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Of course they matter. You think your opinion matters more just because you made an account? Should my opinion matter more than yours because I have more karma? Or because I buy reddit gold?

1 user is 1 user. Only 10% of users actually make account. And only 1% actively participates. You are suggesting that we should give all of the power to the 1%.

[–]bulletcurtain 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Well he has a point. People who don't vote or submit content don't affect the site in any way. In that sense they're totally inconsequential, because they don't add to or modify the reddit experience in any way. I guess their main impact is to introduce new people to reddit, who might in turn create an account and contribute.

[–]beernerd -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

All lurkers are just participants waiting to jump in. I lurked for at least a year before creating my first account. reddit is the frontpage of the internet, and on the internet all users are created equal.

[–]nodle 24 ポイント25 ポイント

What? I'm the 1%? I feel so...privileged.

[–]curlbaumann 15 ポイント16 ポイント

Occupy reddit

[–]Crisiss 12 ポイント13 ポイント

check your reddit privelage, shitlord

[–]LordofShit 1 ポイント2 ポイント

I will forever be the one percent.

[–]AdventuresOfSeal 11 ポイント12 ポイント

What compromises do you speak of?

[–]krackers 27 ポイント28 ポイント

The one where your controversial comments are blessed by jesus

[–]Iggyhopper 0 ポイント1 ポイント

amen

[–]DaedalusMinion 8 ポイント9 ポイント

The controversial sign you can enable in the preferences which let you know if a certain comment is getting Upvoted and downvoted a lot.

[–]Buckwheat469 10 ポイント11 ポイント

It's a very poor excuse for a compromise TBH. They should have worked on different ideas to keep the downvote count, make it accurate, and prevent bots by other (more intelligent) means.

[–]DaedalusMinion -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

and prevent bots by other (more intelligent) means.

Easier said than done. Plus the scores we were seeing were fuzzed anyway so no big deal.

[–]Buckwheat469 4 ポイント5 ポイント

All other means haven't been explored, so fuzzing the scores in the first place and removing the downvotes now were unnecessary until all possibilities had been exhausted. As a developer, you never mess with the data.

I never claimed that it was an easy problem, but many websites have created methods that reduce bots effectively which Reddit has not put in place.

[–]cywydd 3 ポイント4 ポイント

As someone who is not aware of these solutions, I ask for you to list them.

[–]Buckwheat469 2 ポイント3 ポイント

  • Email verification
  • Challenge response from email verification
  • Heuristic comment, upvote/downvote counts, submission rate scanning to identify possible bot accounts
  • Disabling of stale accounts, requiring manual email verification on login (prevents bots created with temporary mail solutions)
  • No creating accounts with temporary email services (black-list of email providers such as GuerrillaMail).
  • Identification of upvote/downvote times to determine if there's enough variability in the vote rates. Humans don't process upvotes in millisecond time but bots/scripts do. Humans also add variability by evaluating comments, which may add several seconds to a series of upvotes/downvotes.
  • Bot identification by mods and users (flag as possible bot for further review).

There may be other ideas that I don't have the time to consider right now. Please feel free to offer other ideas which may seem appropriate and which wouldn't hinder current users to a great extent.

[–]cywydd 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Reddit already does email verification, and it heavily restricts posting based on a lack of verification. I don't know about votes, however.

Reddit also already crunches the vote and post numbers, along with account identity information, as part of bot detection. I don't know all of the methods they use, but they clearly have access to all of the data and they claim to shadowban and vote-fuzz many accounts based on it.

I actually can't think of anything else. I suppose this is why I'm not a developer.

[–]DaedalusMinion -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Email verification

Goes against reddit's policy of anonymity. At present you can just sign-up without needing anything, though it would be good as an optional feature.

Heuristic comment, upvote/downvote counts, submission rate scanning to identify possible bot accounts

This is absurd. In order to satisfy a bunch of butt-hurt redditors, you wish for them to implement something like this?

Disabling of stale accounts, requiring manual email verification on login (prevents bots created with temporary mail solutions)

See 1.

No creating accounts with temporary email services (block-list of email providers such as GuerrillaMail).

Can be easily bypassed by dedicated bots.

Identification of upvote/downvote times to determine if there's enough variability in the vote rates. Humans don't process upvotes in millisecond time but bots/scripts do. Humans also add variability by evaluating comments, which may add several seconds to a series of upvotes/downvotes.

Can be bypassed with random upvoting/downvoting.

Bot identification by mods and users

Weak method, reddit already sucks at this. See the whole reportthespammers and /r/spam fiasco.

Basically you've come up with 2 things, email verification (which reddit has confirmed they are working on, but not for bot verification, rather for two factor authentication.) and magical detection of bot.

IMO people are grasping at straws about this whole situation.

[–]DaedalusMinion -1 ポイント0 ポイント

As a developer, you never mess with the data.

As a developer, you can do anything you want with your website/program. Reddit's methods of dealing with spam are largely secret and if they ever come up with a better method, they will implement them because it benefits them more than the end user.

You can also probably direct technical questions to the admins who work on this through their contact page. They reply on the regular.

[–]beernerd 2 ポイント3 ポイント

They added new features like contest mode. It was in the most recent blog post.

[–]Doctor_McKay 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Contest mode has been around for a while and that's hardly comparable.

[–]beernerd -1 ポイント0 ポイント

The complaint was that some subs run contests or surveys where they only count the upvotes so they used RES (despite the fact that those numbers were fuzzed). The response was the contest mode, which does the same thing but better because the numbers are real.

[–]gsfgf 3 ポイント4 ポイント

they recently implemented compromises for the legitimate complaints

I'm still yet to see a post with a "controversial" flag

[–]EdgarAllanNope 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Have you enabled it?

[–]i_lost_my_password[🍰] 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Downvotes won't change facts, but your facts are wrong.

[–]nakedatkeyboard -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

If I wanted your opinion I would give it to you.

[–]ThatDarnSteve 1 ポイント2 ポイント

In regards to your edit: I know. Have them anyway...

[–]roland0fgilead -1 ポイント0 ポイント

It doesn't make his point any less valid.

[–]beernerd -1 ポイント0 ポイント

At least you bothered to comment.

[–]SCX-Kill 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Any source on that 1% number ?

[–]beernerd 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I can't find a source for the number of RES downloads, but if you check the reddit blog you can find some reason statistics as far as users.

[–]vaellu 1 ポイント2 ポイント

And opinions don't make the facts.

[–]beernerd -1 ポイント0 ポイント

  1. 113+ million unique visitors last month Source.

  2. Almost 3 million of them logged in.

  3. Even if every single logged in user has RES it would still account for less than 3% of the total number of reddit users.

These are the facts. It's time you accepted them and moved on.

Edit: And before you start suggesting that users who don't log in don't matter, please read this comment.

[–]MissedHerPink 0 ポイント1 ポイント

That assumes that there's no crossover between the 113 million "unique" visitors and the 3 million logged in. For example, I'll go on Reddit at school or at a friends house without logging in sometimes. That would be a total of 3 visitors, when it's really just one.

Plus, 3 million people is A LOT of people. Registered users are more invested in the website so it's definitely a good thing to try and make them happy.

[–]j1mmyava1on 3 ポイント4 ポイント

sorry can you explain what you mean by (?|?) . I didn't get it

[–]tyrroi 17 ポイント18 ポイント

In RES you used to be able too see how many upvotes and down votes a post or comment had, admins changed this so now all it says is (?|?)

[–]AssuredlyAThrowAway 5 ポイント6 ポイント

You also used to be able to see upvotes and downvotes on submissions without res, this is also now removed.

[–]duckvimes_ 4 ポイント5 ポイント

For what it's worth--somebody put together an extension that'll show you upvotes and downvotes based on the new percentage, which is supposedly more accurate than the old version. I'll see if I can find it...

Edit: Got it!

I should add that it's not perfect, since a 50% post could either be 5|5 or 500|500, but it's better than nothing.

[–]helen73 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Please do. I would be very interested in that. It annoys the fuck out of me to not be able to see the voting!

[–]duckvimes_ 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Finally found it: http://www.reddit.com/r/RedditUpvoteDisplay/comments/28pyqd/how_to_get/

(it was posted somewhere else when I found it, but this has all of the links)

[–]helen73 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Cheers for the link mate!

[–]okayfineyeah 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Thanks for that. Now, if we could just have it for the comments also...

[–]duckvimes_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント

That'd be nice, but it's unfortunately not possible due to what the admins did.

[–]okayfineyeah -1 ポイント0 ポイント

A girl can dream

[–]AssuredlyAThrowAway -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Yea I think green_flash did; I suppose that solves one of the problems.

[–]duckvimes_ 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Found the link--see my other comment.

[–]AssuredlyAThrowAway 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Thanks.

[–]duckvimes_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント

It looks like he put together a Greasemonkey script, but there was somebody who actually put together full extensions for pretty much every browser. Can't find it though.

[–]probably2high 0 ポイント1 ポイント

And replaced it with a much better representation of the voting.

[–]Ptolemy48 4 ポイント5 ポイント

"better"

[–]endsandskins 2 ポイント3 ポイント

They didn't replace anything, they just don't show downvotes anymore.

[–]xman813 -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

Its an RES thing. Reddit Admins broke something that used to show you how many upvotes and downvotes a post got, like this (10|2).

Now all that shows up in RES where the upvote/downvote tally was is this (?|?)

People went ape shit...pitchforks were grabbed, ya know, a typical day on reddit.