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For the Reddit mobile users (imgur.com)

submitted by Timhook22

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[–]sertman 67 ポイント68 ポイント

Lets say a post has 200 upvotes. Before, you could see whether it was 250/50 upvote/downvote, making it a widely popular opinion, or whether it was 1000/800, meaning that it's quite controversial and there are people with emotional attachments to each side of the argument. Seeing the upvote/downvote counters was crucial to assessing Reddit's reaction to a particular comment, which is then helpful when it comes to figuring out what the consensus is on any particular topic. You might say to yourself that it doesn't matter, but I've found a pretty strong correlation in my experience between how a community deals with an issue that it has and the number of upvotes/downvotes given for any particular comment on the issue.

For example, in the NFL subreddit there's a controversial topic at hand, the U.S patent office throwing away the Redskins trademark for being offensive to Native Americans. Now, this comment was made, and currently has 300 upvotes. But what does that mean? I happen to know that before UV/DV counters was disabled, it had about 1100 upvotes and 800 downvotes. That means it's a highly controversial post that many, many people felt strongly enough about to break reddiquette and downvote it. That's useful information to know. Now, should that post be made today, we have no idea how controversial that post is, and how strongly people feel about the issue. That's an important dimension of reddit for me that is now gone for what seems like no reason at all.

Hope that helps.

[–]coldolivesat3am 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Yes it does. That was a perfect explanation. Cheers very much.

[–]iGotDatDainbramage 11 ポイント12 ポイント

You know the previous upvote/down vote counts weren't accurate right? The only number that was accurate was the total vote count

[–]sertman 9 ポイント10 ポイント

The exact numbers don't matter, what does matter is a rough approximation of how many people cared enough to vote.

[–]lost_my_pw_again 6 ポイント7 ポイント

But it wasn't a rough approximation. It was utter BS. Just look at the threads. The like % jumped to 95%+ on a whole lot of them.

What you gauged as "whew my comment is actually controversial and not just some circlejerk" was actually an opinion similar to the unpopular opinion puffin.

[–]JD5 0 ポイント1 ポイント

That only applied to the score of a post, not to the comments. The comments never jump by more than a couple of votes. They were more than accurate enough to be useful.

[–]sertman 2 ポイント3 ポイント

You're going to need to substantiate that claim that it's "utter bs" somehow, just seems like your own personal speculation

[–]jdbyrnes1 3 ポイント4 ポイント

That was actually explicitly stated by an Admin in the post explaining why Reddit was changing the system.

The "false negativity" effect from fake downvotes is especially exaggerated on very popular posts. It's been observed by quite a few people that every post near the top of the frontpage or /r/all seems to drift towards showing "55% like it" due to the vote-fuzzing, which gives the false impression of reddit being an extremely negative site. As part of hiding the specific up/down numbers, we've also decided to start showing much more accurate percentages here, and at the time of me writing this, the top post on the front page has gone from showing "57% like it" to "96% like it", which is much closer to reality.

Full post here:

http://www.reddit.com/r/announcements/comments/28hjga/reddit_changes_individual_updown_vote_counts_no/

[–]sertman 7 ポイント8 ポイント

Link karma and comment karma are treated differently - I've seen plenty of 1000+ karma comments with a 90% upvote/downvote ratio. What people are the most upset about are the comment karma totals being taken away, not the link/selfpost karma totals.

[–]jdbyrnes1 2 ポイント3 ポイント

I was not aware that vote fudging was different for each.

The original argument doesn't seem to hold up if that's the case.

[–]ToastyFlake 0 ポイント1 ポイント

The more votes the more fudge, generally. What reddit should have done is fix the votes to be accurate, not eliminate a feature that many people liked. Using the argument that we made the old system fake so it's ok to do away with it altogether is ridiculous.

[–]WorkoutProblems 3 ポイント4 ポイント

That's link karma... he's talking about comment karma

[–]MiatasAreForGirls 0 ポイント1 ポイント

It was a really rough approximation. For all we know it was 315 up, 15 down.

[–]sertman 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Generally, vote fudging only happens after a lot of people vote on it. If a comment reaches the point where the votes start getting fudged, then we know that lots of people had a strong reaction either way to the content of the comment, which is what I'm looking for. Knowing whether a comment with 10 points has been voted on by a few people or a lot of people is really telling as to what people think about it.

[–]AliKat3 1 ポイント2 ポイント

The vote fuzzing definitely made the counts on the front page pretty much useless, but I think where people actually care about it is on smaller subs, new posts, and comments, where it will now be difficult to tell how many people have voted on something. People want to know if their comment with 5 points was just upvoted by 5 people or if 20 people upvoted and 15 people downvoted. I'm not exactly up in arms about this - it doesn't make or break reddit for me, but it was kind of entertaining to see, so I sort of wish there was some kind of middle ground where maybe you could see votes up until the point of fuzzing, or it would say a post has >50 or >100 votes, or something like that.

EDIT: Typo

[–]OneMulatto 0 ポイント1 ポイント

So everyone based their reply on the opinions of others?

[–]sertman 0 ポイント1 ポイント

No more than they would as long as they can see what the sum total of upvotes/downvotes is, which they can.

[–]wipeyournose 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I would recommend that you put down the computer and go outside for a few weeks. You have lose sense of what really matters in the world. Imaginary numbers attached to an uninformed comment on a stupid ass website made by fellow basement dwellers like you is not something you need to worry about.

Get a fucking life

[–]mrspeacockwasaman 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Wait there was a time when we could see how many up/down votes a comment got? I thought you could only ever see how many points a comment got.

[–]karmapopsicle 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Reddit Enhancement Suite, along with many mobile reddit apps, were able to grab the fuzzed up/downvote numbers through the reddit API.

The key thing here though is that the numbers were always fuzzed - they were never accurate representations of actual voting patterns.

[–]mrspeacockwasaman 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Ah, gotcha. Thanks!

[–]cdnpatriot -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

It sounds like people need a vote counter to validate their way of thinking. How about judging a post on the content it self and forming one's own opinion rather than relying on numbers.

[–]sertman 1 ポイント2 ポイント

That argument could conceivably be applied to the removal of comment karma altogether, though. It's not really applicable to wanting to know whether or not people feel strongly about a comment or whether nobody cared or nobody saw it.

[–]cdnpatriot -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Isn't that the point? I don't pay attention to karma so that may be why I don't care about the changes. What does it matter if it's popular, igonred or controversial unless you're looking for self validation on your own opinion on the content of the post.

The points are already useless since it's pretty much an "I agree/I disagree" button anyways. Whatever validation people are getting is skewed by Reddit's demographic.

[–]sertman 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I don't think anything I can say at this point is going to convince you to leave your narrow opinion that this is all about some need for validation, lol. I think it's interesting to know what the "hot-button" issues on reddit are, and what issues are truly controversial ones. We don't have that anymore, and that's sad to me.

[–]cdnpatriot -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Yep, I don't think so either :). To each thier own I guess.

[–]ANGRY_TWAT -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

Who cares? That's such a stupid and irrelevant thing to care about. The admins will not change anything back because they know the whiny children on reddit will forget about the whole thing within a couple weeks.