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TV4[S4E7] "Only your sister" (wavesheep.deviantart.com)

submitted by SuffocatingNostalgiaHouse Baelish

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[–]ajkkjjk52Maesters of the Citadel -7 ポイント-6 ポイント

WHY DID THEY CHANGE THE LINE??!?

[–]Elcactus 20 ポイント21 ポイント

Because he doesn't refer to her as "Cat" as much in the show, and people might not have gotten it immediately.

[–]redditkilledmydoge 12 ポイント13 ポイント

Fuck those people

[–]subarash 8 ポイント9 ポイント

Yeah, fuck people who don't want to memorize the nicknames of 150 different characters to be able to enjoy a tv show.

[–]JeffVanGundyGolden Company 4 ポイント5 ポイント

She was a main character for the first two and a half seasons, for fuck's sake! It's not as if they'd be expecting viewers to remember Gendry or Illyrio or even Hot Pie... she was popping up in damn near every episode!

[–]THREE_EDGY_FIVE_ME 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Yes but it was very rare that anyone referred to her as Cat.

In fact, I don't recall a single instance on the TV show where she was called Cat.

[–]redditkilledmydoge 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Yeah, you should do what normal humans can do and use context, memorization and/or make connections to be able to understand nicknames.

Who else would Baelish mean by Cat? If you don't know who Catelynn is then you don't know Peter's back story and he might as well just be kissing underage girls and pushing ladies into cliffs for no reason and why watch game of thrones if you don't care about the story...?

[–]RC_5213House Baratheon of Dragonstone 8 ポイント9 ポイント

BECAUSE KELLY C HAS DRAGONS, MKAY?

[–]redditkilledmydoge -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

Smoke westeros errday

[–]nullv 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Please explain to me why "only your sister" ruins the show while "only Cat" is okay. If the book said "only your sister" and the show said "only Cat" would you be just as outraged?

The two lines mean the exact same thing, nothing was lost in translation when being adapted. Given the context of the show's pacing, I personally think "only your sister" is the better of the two lines.

[–]Adlanth 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Lysa spent an entire scene referring to 'Cat' not so long ago.

[–]Elcactus 1 ポイント2 ポイント

But is it something people would internalize? I watch almost every episode more than once and I even forgot she said it until now.

[–]WalterEagle 3 ポイント4 ポイント

All it takes is to have him call her "Cat" again earlier in the episode. Or say "Only Catelyn".

[–]Elcactus 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Hence the "as much" line. She is referred to as Cat before, but it's not done in a way that makes people remember it well, and as such might lead to a moment of confusion before people figure it out, which would kill the moment.

[–]roterghostHouse Martell 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Even if the line was "Only Catelyn," book-readers would still be losing their minds. It has nothing to do with meaning. It's just bad because it's different.

[–]Killgraft 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Only catelyn would be a much cooler line than "your sister", it fits better with the "only one" lines, still is like the original, and gives more information for people unfamiliar with the nickname cat.

No one said anything much when they changed "Jamie Lannister sends his regards" to "the Lannisters send their regards " because it's still bad ass and very similar to the original. "your sister" is just too generic and simple of a line to be as memorable as "only cat".

Might as well change the regards line to "the king says hello".

[–]Dent18 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I'm pretty sure he did.

[–]ajkkjjk52Maesters of the Citadel 1 ポイント2 ポイント

I know that rationally, but it's one of my favorite moments from the books and it just makes me sad to have it adulterated in any way.

[–]Elcactus 5 ポイント6 ポイント

I more than agree it sounds much less awesome, but they did have a solid reason for doing it that way. The show isn't meant to be a love letter to the book readers, it's for everyone.

[–]Reinhart3Stannis Baratheon 1 ポイント2 ポイント

He does call her Cat though. Ned does too, and she refers to herself as Cat when she's talking about her father. Also it's mentioned that he loves Catelyn at least 6 times. And it's fairly obvious that they are sisters. He even referred to her as Cat in that episode.

[–]Elcactus 1 ポイント2 ポイント

"As much" != "Not at all". It's also mostly done in passing, and a good chunk of people might not have picked up on it, at least to the degree where they would realize it before thinking about it so much that that impact of the line is lost.

[–]Dent18 -1 ポイント0 ポイント

So?

Fuck them.

Any word there other than "you" would have the same effect. Why not make it Cat?

[–]Elcactus 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Because he was specifically referring to her, the goal is to say "I only every loved your sister", but in a way that would be easier to pick up on if you didn't already know what LF refers to her as.

[–]CaptnYossarianThe Iron Bank Will Have Its Due 0 ポイント1 ポイント

It's still spoonfeeding the show watchers. I like it when a show treats me like an adult with a memory, and it'd have been a moment of "Cat? who... wait! does he mean Catelyn?! Her sister? the manipulating bastard!" for show watchers, just like it was for book readers.

That's not to say the circumstances in the show don't demand some catering to the viewers given you don't see internal monologues, but a little bit of credit is often rewarded with higher engagement.

[–]MinorSeventh94House Connington -4 ポイント-3 ポイント

I don't see why the showrunners have to cater to the viewers who aren't invested enough in the show to understand such an easy reference.

[–]Elcactus 2 ポイント3 ポイント

And by "not invested in the show" you mean "either already had it spoiled or didn't pick up on the significance of a seemingly insignificant nickname from a while earlier"?

[–]Reinhart3Stannis Baratheon 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Are you honestly telling me that if he said, "I've only loved one women. Only one." You wouldn't know it was Catelyn? It's been mentioned over and over again in the series by Littlefinger, Catelyn, Ned, Sansa, Lysa. It was mentioned once or twice in that episode. He said to Sansa, "You look so much prettier than your mother ever did. I could have been your father", as well as talking about poisoning Joffrey for what happened to Catelyn less than 5 minutes before the scene.

[–]MinorSeventh94House Connington 1 ポイント2 ポイント

Actually, I think arguing about whether or not the audience would understand the reference is pointless. It's (sort of) understandable that the writers thought the viewers would forget who Catelyn was. That doesn't mean their decision to change the line was the correct artistic choice. They can cater to that 95% of the audience all they want, but doing so can detract from the quality of the show.

[–]Elcactus -1 ポイント0 ポイント

Everyone knew who he was going to be referring to, but "Cat" is not presented in a particularly memorable name for Catelyn. No doubt people would figure it out, but the delay would lessen the impact of the moment.

[–]Reinhart3Stannis Baratheon 2 ポイント3 ポイント

but "Cat" is not presented in a particularly memorable name for Catelyn.

She is called Cat all the time. Anyone who pays even a little bit of attention to almost ANY Littlefinger scene would know that he loves Catelyn. It was referenced twice about 3-4 minutes prior to the scene. When he says "I've only loved one women", if you don't know he's talking about Catelyn then I don't even know what to say.

[–]Elcactus 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Of course everyone knew he meant her, the point is the second of confusion among those who don't know he thinks of her as "Cat". "Cat" is mentioned prior to the scene, but not in a particularly memorable way, and most of the scenes in which it is mentioned dont make it memorable because the emphasis is on something else. You might figure out what he means after a second of two if you didnt know about it beforehand or, but the impact would be lessened if you have to spend time thinking about it.

[–]Reinhart3Stannis Baratheon 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I understand what you're saying, but I disagree with you. I think that when he says, "I have only loved one women" the VAST majority of viewers would instantly think, "He's talking about Catelyn" so when he says "Only Cat" it would instantly click. I think that you're underestimating viewers ability to remember character relations.

he point is the second of confusion among those who don't know he thinks of her as "Cat".

I don't think there would be a second of confusion. I have an extremely hard time seeing more than a small handful of people hearing, "I've only loved one women. Only Cat" and thinking, "Cat? Oh, he means Catelyn" In Season 1 or 2 I could understand it, and even maybe in Season 3. By the seventh episode of Season 4 we have seen way too much of Littlefinger talking about Catelyn for anyone besides the people who can only name 6 characters to get confused.

[–]subarash 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Because that's 95% of the audience?

[–]MinorSeventh94House Connington 1 ポイント2 ポイント

95% of the audience won't be able to remember a character who died at the end of last season?

[–]GrubFisherLet It Be Written 3 ポイント4 ポイント

They remember her, they just don't remember her name. She's "the red-haired girl's mom and Ned's wife"

[–]MinorSeventh94House Connington -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

You know what? Then they wouldn't get the reference. If they cared, they would find out on the internet or from a friend who did, then they'd tune in next week to watch the sexy Spanish guy fight the big, scary muscle-y guy.

[–]subarash 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Not her childhood nickname. Problem?

[–]MultidisciplinarySand 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Makes no difference in the punch, and clearly tells the audience who he means.

[–]ManWhoKilledHitler 3 ポイント4 ポイント

For all we know they might have tried both versions and decided that the aired one just worked better. Not everything that works well on paper translates well to the screen.

[–]BSRussell 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I don't lose sleep over it like some people, but "your sister" definitely doesn't sound as good. Just sounds awkward. When people are talking about a third party they both know intimately they tend to use their name. It just sounded forced to me.

But oh well, it's the shoving that's important.

[–]MultidisciplinarySand 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Sounds fine/as good to me, but that kind of thing is very subjective.