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[–]Hairlesswalkingchimp 259 ポイント260 ポイント

I'm gonna get real with you reddit, no matter how pissed this makes you it doesn't change the fact that he would not have had this absurd success if he was a white kid.

[–]sars911 6 ポイント7 ポイント

Or Asian

[–]DonTago 102 ポイント103 ポイント

Don't you realize that white children of this boy's generation have to atone for the sins of their ancestors by giving him greater access to opportunities and education for the display of equal merit? /s

[–]DolphinLundgren 53 ポイント54 ポイント

Yes, the descendants of white sharecroppers, Irish and Italian immigrants, and German serfs have to atone for the evils perpetuated by the Portuguese and British in Ghana by giving up their positions in elite schools in the United States.

[–]pfitz6 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Very well put.

[–]foxh8er -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

Nobody gave up a seat. The adcomms liked what they saw.

[–]Hairlesswalkingchimp 17 ポイント18 ポイント

Since this is reddit I literally can't tell if your serious or not.

[–]DonTago 19 ポイント20 ポイント

That is the funny part, that some SJW might actually argue that point in complete and utter earnestness. I just shake my head.

[–]sadmoviedave -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

what's the purpose of affirmative action, then?

[–]DownvoteDaemon 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Think about it this way. In America white people are 63 percent of the population(73 percent if you include white Hispanics like those from spain). Institutionalized and systematic racism doesn't happen because white people hate other groups...let me explain. Being a part of the majority comes with many benefits.

The concept of homogeneity dictates that humans are more likely to be friends with, mate with and unconsciously give favoritism to those with similar traits. It is the reason most white people prefer to date white people. It is not because they are racist but because they prefer those similar to them. It could be similar in race or socio-economic background. There are white people who would rather only hire whites because of racism but they are probably a smaller group than the ones who do it unconsciously. White people run most institutions by virtue of being the majority.

Affirmative action is not perfect but it tries to correct for this bias. There is no perfect way to fight institutionalized racism. If black people were 63 percent and white people were 13 percent you better believe there would be something to protect the white people. It is supposed to give a minority a chance against a white person of equal credentials. Does it hurt a few white people? Sure and it's not perfect.

[–]oldtimepewpew 5 ポイント6 ポイント

I'm white and my ancestors were more likely to be living and working in shit rather than dishing it out it out. They weren't doing it in America either.

[–]OnefortheMonkey [score hidden]

You do understand its not done as an apology, right? I'm not saying you have to agree with the process, I don't know if I do. But I just want to make sure you realize that it had nothing to do with white guilt

[–]foxh8er 26 ポイント27 ポイント

You can't say that for certain without seeing all of his academic credentials.

[–]jonesrr 24 ポイント25 ポイント

If he had anything worth HYPS admission it'd be mentioned in the article. I remember at commencement at MIT (this was 10 years ago) when I was there, they mentioned a plethora of students and their accomplishments for the incoming class. These included things like, founding huge charitable organizations, being a violinist for the Vienna symphony orchestra, working on research into nanorod delivery of medicine, bioimplantation research, etc.

I don't remember them all, but yeah, those would be mentioned in the article, and that's what it took then to get into MIT.

[–]foxh8er 10 ポイント11 ポイント

Well, what did you do to get into MIT? Or were you mentioned in the commencement speech? I'm just curious here.

I'm not going to say that his background didn't play a part at all, but lets be honest here - it wasn't everything.

[–]jonesrr 42 ポイント43 ポイント

I did something pretty incredible at 17, was all over the national and local news for the charity I founded, and had a 1570 SAT and 35 ACT. Again this was 10 years ago. I won't mention the specific thing I did, but we raised almost $2 million and wound up meeting with state officials and got new legislation passed for environmental protection.

The Governor came to our work site twice for photo ops.

[–]foxh8er 17 ポイント18 ポイント

Well that's...impressive.

Makes me want to shoot myself, but okay.

[–]jonesrr 12 ポイント13 ポイント

I didn't get into Harvard, just so you know (I'm white). It worked out for the best though, since I wound up in engineering.

[–]soyeahiknow 2 ポイント3 ポイント

In my option, MIT is way better than HYPS. 15-30% of the incoming class spots are reserved for legacies. MIT is all merit.

[–]foxh8er 2 ポイント3 ポイント

My intention for the longest time was MIT.

Oh well, maybe grad school.

[–]jonesrr 6 ポイント7 ポイント

MIT is absolutely fantastic, if you get the opportunity I'd do it. I went there for grad school as well on a research assistantship.

The social scene isn't the best, but the access you have is outstanding. I had the easiest time in the world getting a job with my background in undergrad and the career fairs on campus. I had something like 25 job offers when I was done with my masters (and a lot of internships and co-ops of course). This was in the height of the crisis as well.

[–]foxh8er 1 ポイント2 ポイント

I'm looking at a Course 6 PhD (Nuclear and Materials Science isn't my thing). Of course, the acceptance rate for non-MIT undergrads is also allegedly 5%, so, well, state school it is.

[–]notreddingit 1 ポイント2 ポイント

How important is your high school grade average in all of this? Is there a big difference between say a 93 average vs a 98? Or does it not matter as much since high school grading is so subjective?

[–]vngbusa 0 ポイント1 ポイント

I remember reading a great NYtimes article a few years back, entitled "The kids that don't get into Harvard."- kids with amazing accomplishments, but simply edged out by the sheer competitiveness of the process. Scary stuff. I commonly remark that one has to cure AIDS to get into Harvard nowadays, but I guess I'm only half-joking...

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/29/nyregion/nyregionspecial2/29Rparenting.html?ref=michaelwinerip&_r=0

here it is

[–]jonesrr 3 ポイント4 ポイント

I'm not sure if Harvard didn't accept me because of my interest in science, expecting I'd go to Princeton or MIT, or if I didn't actually get in legitly. With my scores and what I did in HS it seemed weird I didn't, but I wasn't really too interested in going there to begin with.

These colleges only take you so far, you have to take yourself to where you want to go. I am very fortunate to be in a very strong financial position right now where I'm basically retired at 27. Though he now has been handed a fantastic opportunity based upon his race, it's up to him to do something with it.

[–]Hairlesswalkingchimp 15 ポイント16 ポイント

You're missing the point. He would not have gotten in if he was white with the credentials he had. Stop being so goddamn delusional of reality.

[–]foxh8er 6 ポイント7 ポイント

I dunno..I've known white people that have gotten into multiple Ivies with those scores. They just didn't apply to all of them.

You can't know for certain without 1) seeing all of his academic credentials 2) knowing what each admissions officer was looking for.

Stop being so goddamn delusional of reality.

The admissions process is a black box. If you claim to know how much of a pass being black gives you, please enlighten me.

[–]jonesrr 11 ポイント12 ポイント

Getting into Cornell or Brown with those scores is normal, getting into HYP is not. In fact, I doubt a single white person whose dad isn't the CEO of Exxon could do so.

[–]foxh8er 5 ポイント6 ポイント

Found two with sub-35 scores (one 33, one 34) on the first page of the College Confidential Thread.

http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/harvard-university/1586643-official-harvard-university-2018-scea-decisions-only.html

One's Asian, the other's white. Its not hard evidence I'm sure (because the ACT != SAT), but that's just one minute of looking.

[–]jonesrr -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

This is the ACT, and the ACT is different. You'd have to know his SAT II scores to compare them. Furthermore you have absolutely no idea what those people have done and what their CV looks like.

[–]foxh8er 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Furthermore you have absolutely no idea what those people have done and what their CV looks like.

They arguably provide more detail than the USAToday piece. Especially considering the CC tendency to humblebrag.

Just saying.

[–]jolienieweenie[🍰] 0 ポイント1 ポイント

People do not have to do incredible things to get into these top tier schools. They get in because they have incredible potential to accomplish incredible things, and if they already have, it is a bonus. Kwasi is brilliant, and clearly that showed through in his applications.

[–]Hairlesswalkingchimp 9 ポイント10 ポイント

If I had the exact same credentials as this kid at 17 and applied to every Ivy League school, there is no chance in hell that I would ever get accepted to all of them, that's fucking absurd.

[–]jonesrr 4 ポイント5 ポイント

Yeah you don't know what you're talking about ... this is a myth that can only be dispelled when your kid applies to these places himself and you see what happens.

[–]franciumcaesium -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

I had a 2360 on my SAT last year. I'm white. I submit myself as evidence that /u/jolienieweenie knows exactly what he's talking about.

[–]jonesrr 1 ポイント2 ポイント

What evidence are you submitting? You got into HYPS?

[–]jolienieweenie[🍰] -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

I disagree. Most people that get in to these schools do not go to the school with dozens of accomplishments. They go to these schools to nourish their potential and achieve these accomplishments.

[–]jonesrr 5 ポイント6 ポイント

Yeah... this simply isn't true by the stats. You need a lot of shit going for you to get into HYP along with stellar scores.

[–]jolienieweenie[🍰] 2 ポイント3 ポイント

Clearly not, considering Kwasi did it.

[–]lookxdontxtouch 15 ポイント16 ポイント

He wasn't even in the top 10 students at his own high school. I personally think that speaks volumes.

[–]Lowbacca1977 5 ポイント6 ポイント

It is worth noting that the article felt it need to mention how his SAT scores were within one racial group, not overall.

Conversely, they do point out that being male benefited him here as well, because males are underrepresented and so there's a corrective force to try to give males a step up.

[–]foxh8er 12 ポイント13 ポイント

2250 is actually 99th percentile for all SAT takers, not just African Americans.

Source

[–]Hereibe [score hidden]

They really should have added that in the article, what poor writing.

[–]foxh8er [score hidden]

Yeah, I agree. His accomplishment is not because of his race - got in to an Ivy because he's qualified and intelligent. He got into all Ivies because he's lucky.

[–]iltl32 [score hidden]

His credentials are in the article it seems you didn't read. They're like ever high-school honors student ever. The schools also specifically mention that him being black was a factor. He wasn't even the top of his class. Did the other 10 students ahead of him also get offers?

Just read the article, it's like 6 paragraphs.

And by the by, this is like saying "you can't say for certain that cop pulled you over for being black, maybe you did something wrong." Frustrating, isn't it?

[–]foxh8er [score hidden]

Yes, I read the article. I also saw the CBS morning bit about it this morning. It really does not go into much detail - it does not cover ACT scores, subject tests, how the interview went, or how his essays were written.

[–]iltl32 [score hidden]

Well, doesn't that suggest that that's it? Do you think he's been doing ground-breaking research on a cancer cure or something, but they decided not to cover that because the fact that he was kind of near the top of his class in a tiny ass school was more impressive?

He's a slightly above-average student. That's all the evidence there is.

[–]foxh8er [score hidden]

FYI, Subject tests/ACT are required for admission. Its certainly not "it".

I can't make any judgments. I doubt he did research, but he did have some focused ECs - interning at Stony Brook isn't easy for everyone.

Personally, I think that second guessing admissions officers that do this for years is fruitless, especially considering how much of a crapshoot it is.

[–]iltl32 [score hidden]

Fair enough. But keep this conversation in mind the next time you hear a black person accuse a white person of being racist because they stepped on his toe or didn't serve him his food fast enough. It's very similar.

I only say this because I've gone to a lot of diversity type discussions with my SO at colleges and the stories they tell about their experiences with racism... sheash. "Bartender didn't serve me fast enough. Obviously racist." It's so frustrating.

[–]CRISPR 6 ポイント7 ポイント

A first-generation American

Means, he is not, I repeat, not your "African-American" type.

Africans and African Americans are very different.

[–]nealius 12 ポイント13 ポイント

At least he is being accepted for his mental aptitude, and not something ridiculous like gold pockets or sports activities.

[–]The_Dee 7 ポイント8 ポイント

At least he is being accepted for his mental aptitude.

Lol...no. Mental aptitude had little to do with it. A 2250 on SAT is great, not perfect, there people that have scored higher. He's there to add diversity to the campus. He got in because of good old fashion AA.

[–]nealius 5 ポイント6 ポイント

Does anyone even require a perfect SAT score for entrance?

[–]The_Dee 3 ポイント4 ポイント

Not necessarily. But to say mental aptitude got him in is asinine. If you read the article, he's got nothing particularly spectacular in his application, so he didn't get in because he's got a unique backstory. His parents are DOCTORS so he didn't get in because he's disadvantaged. His scores are good, but don't warrant getting accepted into that many schools.

So the only thing to consider is AA got him in.

[–]1337_Mrs_Roberts 6 ポイント7 ポイント

His parents were nurses, not doctors.

[–]nealius 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Possibly. But it's equally asinine to make assumptions.

[–]oz6364 [score hidden]

2250 is pretty avg for harvard. how did all the white kids who scored worse than him get into school? i guess they don't deserve to be there either right?

[–]anewdm [score hidden]

Wow what a brave thing to say. Really going against the grain of reddits typical attitude there.

[–]gwax 0 ポイント1 ポイント

"...if he [were] a white."

[–]reddell 0 ポイント1 ポイント

Change that to "might not" and I think you have a valid point.

[–][deleted]

[deleted]

    [–]pumpkin_muffins 9 ポイント10 ポイント

    My (white) brother graduated 3rd in his class of 800+ with a 4.4 gpa and a 2,270 on his SATs while being varsity soccer captain and tons of community service... Applied to Harvard, Yale, Brown, and Princeton and didn't get into a single one. But you bet the number 20-something African American girl in his class with a 4.0 gpa and a decent sat score got in!

    [–]chknfngrs -4 ポイント-3 ポイント

    That name is a gold mine.

    [–]Hairlesswalkingchimp 3 ポイント4 ポイント

    Thanks bro.

    [–]DownvoteDaemon -4 ポイント-3 ポイント

    Oh my god. As a black redditor I better stop reading now before my blood pressure goes up.

    Here is why I think affirmative action is good:

    Think about it this way. In America white people are 63 percent of the population(73 percent if you include white Hispanics like those from spain). Institutionalized and systematic racism doesn't happen because white people hate other groups...let me explain. Being a part of the majority comes with many benefits.

    The concept of homogeneity dictates that humans are more likely to be friends with, mate with and unconsciously give favoritism to those with similar traits. It is the reason most white people prefer to date white people. It is not because they are racist but because they prefer those similar to them. It could be similar in race or socio-economic background. There are white people who would rather only hire whites because of racism but they are probably a smaller group than the ones who do it unconsciously. White people run most institutions by virtue of being the majority.

    Affirmative action is not perfect but it tries to correct for this bias. There is no perfect way to fight institutionalized racism. If black people were 63 percent and white people were 13 percent you better believe there would be something to protect the white people. It is supposed to give a minority a chance against a white person of equal credentials. Does it hurt a few white people? Sure and it's not perfect.

    [–]Wiggles7 [score hidden]

    "It's not perfect and might not be fair but it helps me out, so why not?"

    [–]DownvoteDaemon [score hidden]

    You know of a better way to correct for institutionalized racism? You deny that being part of the 63 percent majority comes with benefits? I could easily say that you don't think my black parents worked hard to graduate from Yale. I worked hard as well for my two college degrees. I worked just as hard as you.

    [–]Wiggles7 [score hidden]

    So because somewhere someone might be racist the government and all of these institutions should give handouts based on race? You dont see an issue with that? Well let me ask you this, when will it end? Do we need African Americans to have a population burst or white people to have a massive die off event to finally end AA? Or more likely will people like you just fight to keep it around because you like the advantages it gives you whether or not it is still necessary?

    [–]DownvoteDaemon [score hidden]

    When would you deem it not necessary? You think we are all on an even playing field? Even if each race had an equal amount of people that wouldn't solve it. If black people were 63 percent and had a history of treating white people bad you had better believe yall would have something protecting you.

    [–]groggyduck [score hidden]

    As a mixed redditor, you know what I think would be better? Anonymous applications. You'd turn your college application in to a program that removes all traces of your name, race, gender, sexual identity, and any other personal identifiers. It wouldn't remove the lines completely, just cover the relevant words up, and then you'd be assigned an applicant number. The Admissions board would then get your application package that would be marked with your application number and they'd decide whether or not Applicant 49628 should be part of their freshman class.

    Would this currently put kids from poor areas at a disadvantage? Yes, but AA isn't the answer, improved K-12 education is. Set up more Charter schools, have some high schools that focus on the Arts for kids who want to be an Art Major, some schools that focus on Science for kids who want to be a Science Major, etc., etc. Instead of the current distribution of education funding, pool it all together for each state and give $X/student to try and balance out the funding between the hoity-toity school and the broke-as-fuck school to give poor students a fair shot. Once the framework is there, it's up to the students to utilize it and try to make something of themselves, it shouldn't just fall into anyone's lap.

    [–]DownvoteDaemon [score hidden]

    As a mixed redditor, you know what I think would be better? Anonymous applications.

    The problem with that is that there have been peer reviewed studies that show those with black or ethnic sounding names often have their applications thrown out or disregarded. I wish it was an equal playing field. I like your idea but it doesn't correct for institutionalized racism.

    [–]_you_suck_ [score hidden]

    Did institutionalized racism make you name your kid Dayquan? This isn't brain surgery.

    [–]_you_suck_ [score hidden]

    Oh my god. How much barbecue sauce did you get on your keyboard copying and pasting this response? Or is it the white man's fault that you have to keep copying and pasting the same load of bullshit? Your comment history is pretty hilarious.

    [–]DownvoteDaemon [score hidden]

    Cool bro lol. I am not held down by the white man nor do I think most white people are racist. I have only been treated well by white people despite living in the south. The white man had nothing to do with me getting two college degrees.

    [–]AliasSigma -2 ポイント-1 ポイント

    Seriously. His ranking wasn't even that great. Middle-upper class white kid in my graduating class was somewhere in the top 5 with a perfect ACT score and didn't get into any.

    [–]oz6364 [score hidden]

    you dont really think that idea is unpopular here do you? nah, you're a rebel

    [–]Raidicus -3 ポイント-2 ポイント

    Maybe the right white girl, in a rare one-a-century event could pull it off. A white male of typical european ancestry? Nope.

    [–]InsaneChihuahua -4 ポイント-3 ポイント

    So fucking true.