top 200 commentsshow all 470

[–]monkyboy74 537 ポイント538 ポイント

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I have a theory about these girly magazines. They intentionally give terrible relationship advice on behalf of their sponsors/advertisers. Most of the ads in girly magazines are things to make a woman's appearance "better," like makeup, clothes, acne meds, skin cream, weight loss supplements, etc. When a woman is single and, assuming she doesn't want to be single (not always the case) she is going to spend more money buying those products that are advertised in that magazine.

[–]ibillius 306 ポイント307 ポイント

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I can't remember where I read this, but I heard a theory once that the point of television was to induce fear and self-loathing in the audience and then present products via commercials as the solution. It's an interesting way to look at it.

[–][deleted] 48 ポイント49 ポイント

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If you want to see a great dissection of television and its effects on our lives, outlook and behaviour, look up Charlie Brooker's How TV Ruined Your Life.

A great series all round, the first episode titled "Fear" focuses on this very thing, and when taken with episode 3 "Aspiration" has your other aspect: self-loathing.

[–]RevClamJuice 13 ポイント14 ポイント

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[–]pakap 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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[–]greqrg 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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What's it about? I'm seeing it labeled as a comedy. Ironically it's a TV show itself.

[–][deleted] 18 ポイント19 ポイント

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It's dryly satirical (but factual) comedy, in the vein of satirical analysis. think Daily Show, the bits where Jon comments on ridiculous news coverage.

Charlie does the same thing, but he brings all kinds of TV shows into it as well as news, incl comedy itself if I remember right.

[–]greqrg 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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Sounds promising; I'll check it out.

[–]mrpeabody208 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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It's very good, so long as you relish cynicism. He's had several series that do that. Screenwipe was a running series where he took daily television to task. Newswipe did a similar thing with news programming. He has a new one, I think called Weekwipe, which seems like a less promising premise. I haven't seen that one yet. Then he has some satirical fiction series like Dead Set (Big Brother with zombies), Black Mirror (sort of like The Twilight Zone but focused on aspects of the media), and Touch of Cloth (an Airplane!-esque take on police procedurals), which I think he just produces.

[–]bcwalker 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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Weekly Wipe finished its run a month or so ago. Charlie's now doing 10 O'Clock Live, again with the same crew he's collaborated with for the two previous series- and in good form.

[–]monkyboy74 170 ポイント171 ポイント

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Marilyn Manson said something similar to that in Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine Starts at about 1:15 EDIT: added start time of interview

[–]DEVi4TION 114 ポイント115 ポイント

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Damn. That guy is intelligent.

[–]MrBald 155 ポイント156 ポイント

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The very end of it got to me. "I wouldn't say a single word to them. I'd listen to what they had to say and that's what no one did"

[–]rathatz 45 ポイント46 ポイント

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This quote (hearing it several years back) gave me so much more respect for Marilyn Manson.

[–]xerdopwerko 22 ポイント23 ポイント

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I became a teacher because of this very quote. I listen to high school kids every day. I myself could have been like Klebold and Harris.

[–]ep1032 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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Wish I could upvote you a few more times. keep doing good work.

[–]Mikav 191 ポイント192 ポイント

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Reddit's rule of manson: every time manson is brought up, this quote is jerked every time without fail.

[–]MrBald 89 ポイント90 ポイント

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First time I actually hear that quote. In any case, I apologise for circle jerking if that was indeed what I was doing there.

[–]Mikav 52 ポイント53 ポイント

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It's not a bad quote, it's just sometimes people act like it's the only thing he ever said.

[–]iambukowski 40 ポイント41 ポイント

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Yeah man, he also said "it's time for cake and sodomy." Never gets the recognition it deserves.

[–]holymotherogod 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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Right after he kindly requested that white trash get down in your knees.

[–]SaulsAll 24 ポイント25 ポイント

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You forgot the downstroke of the circlejerk, where he told parents if they weren't willing to take time to raise their kids, he'd do it for them.

[–]man_gomer_lot 9 ポイント10 ポイント

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If you could speak directly to the commenters who do this, what would you say?

[–]PantsGrenades 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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I'm not disagreeing with your sentiments, but some quotes are good enough to be repeated.

[–]MaverickTopGun 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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Didn't they ask about the victims though? Which means this quote doesn't really make much sense, although it is very good when referring to the perpetrators.

[–][deleted]

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[deleted]

    [–]DejaBoo 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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    Except if they had asked, (Columbine Shooter 1) would have simply lied because he was a smooth-talking psychopath with a God complex, and (Columbine Shooter 2) would have lied to protect (Columbine Shooter 1) because he was depressed and relied on the affirmation (Columbine Shooter 1) gave him.

    ftfy

    [–][deleted]

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    [deleted]

      [–]YaviMayan 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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      I'm sorry, but this isn't a jerk.

      I have literally never even heard this before.

      [–]mrpeabody208 14 ポイント15 ポイント

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      It is interesting, but not necessarily true, or not true without some some fine print, anyway. TV has been used for all sorts of nefarious purposes, but I don't think any of those nefarious purposes is the point of television.

      Fear-mongering probably entered the equation in political advertising. There might be examples that pre-date the "Daisy" commercial used by the Johnson campaign in 1964, but it's the most famous early example. Even then, when that thing aired, there was a huge outcry against it and it was pulled. Today it's a hell of a lot more pervasive and there's less willingness by the media to take the fear-mongering to task.

      GoldenWyvern pointed out Fear and Aspiration via Charlie Brooker's "How TV Ruined Your Life". Those are two sides of the same coin and advertising uses them more or less in the way that theory suggests. Use fear to make your audience run from something and toward a product or use aspiration to make them run toward something and its associated product. Children and young adult program and its advertising is often aspiration-based (Be like your favorite Disney heroine and buy these travelling pants.) Political and news programming and its advertising is often fear-based (Vote "yes" on Prop 51, so the immigrants don't take your job and leave you destitute./Buy our security package so that someone doesn't crawl in your window and murder your children.)

      [–]spudboy1 8 ポイント9 ポイント

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      Oh, yes, indeed. This is not just TV, but all advertising in a nutshell. Not so relevant anymore, but years ago MTV seemed to be specifically designed to make a 19-year-old feel unhip and out-of-touch. The prescription? Purchase the following products so that you may experience youth and beauty. The underlying message of any ad is that your life is not complete without (whatever).

      [–]DivineRobot 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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      The only TV show I watch is Game of Thrones right now, so should I be buying lemon cakes and building higher fences?

      [–]TyIzaeL 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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      Hardly bad investments!

      [–]antidense 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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      Nina Vanhorn's speech on Just Shoot Me?

      [–]unknown_poo 9 ポイント10 ポイント

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      Pretty much. It's all about feeding the ego, which is our faculty that is concerned with self preservation and so operates according to a sense of insecurity. An inner sense of insecurity is insatiable if it is activated by no external threat but instead by an abstract inadequacy with oneself. That can be used to make profit for companies that can take advantage of people's egos by saying "here, buy this and you'll become attractive". But I guess for that to work people would have to prioritize attractiveness to such a high degree. So when you're sold a culture that associates value with attractiveness then there is an underlying association with the things we buy and becoming valuable. We know we are valuable in society when our attractiveness bears certain fruits that are held in high esteem by social standards, such as having lots of sexual relationships, being able to hang out with people that are considered cool and popular, receiving certain types of attention, and so on. In that way it's almost as if people are reduced to a sort of item or object which has a value determined by outward considerations. Every social system has an 'ideal type'; the sort of social actor that all others should emulate. This is how social cohesion occurs. Those who most closely resemble the 'ideal type' achieve a higher social status in society. So if our ideal type is defined by material goods, and if social status (resemblance to the ideal type) is associated with ones value in society, in order to achieve a sense of value in society one would need to acquire to a degree material goods. If there is a strong association between media and corporations, and if the media is the most efficient way to influence culture, then it seems most logical that the media would want to influence culture in a way that would produce for them a strong consumer society. Since the strongest consumer society would need to be insecure and ego driven, then it makes sense that such a culture that produces such people is a goal of the media, or rather, those who operate through it that stand for profit. Of course, this is not a grand conspiracy. It is merely the natural flow or tendency of a society that is driven by strong capitalistic inclinations. Oops I didn't mean for that to be so long...I just started typing without paying attention. Sorry. Hopefully I was coherent enough or this made some sense. Just to add, societies today are pretty complex with potentially more than on 'ideal type'. Moreover, people can mismatch priorities and ideals to create separate social groups.

      [–][deleted] 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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      I thought this was obvious. The best salesmen know the insecurities of their audience and will do everything capitalize on them.

      [–]ezekielziggy 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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      The point of television is to make money, they produce programs that viewers demand and advertisers wish to appeal to the users, there is no great conspiracy.

      [–]cheeseybees 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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      Well they do say that the secret to good advertising is to sell the problem along with the solution!

      One of my favourite ones are the adverts for washing up powder saying "Are you proud of how white your children's school uniforms are? WELL YOU SHOULDN'T BE YOU GRUBBY FUCKER!"

      [–]Dogsafe 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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      That's fnord an interesting idea. Sure I've heard something fnord similar somewhere.

      [–]DrDerpberg 81 ポイント82 ポイント

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      It's not just women's magazines. Men's fitness magazines do exactly the same thing: every month, a new "bicep buster" or "core annihilator" or "56 new foods that will make your six-pack pop".

      The basic strategy is the same: a magazine which provides only the best advice would be limited to maybe 5 issues and then they'd be out of things to say. For Cosmo it would be "don't be a psycho, stand up for yourself but be reasonable, talk about your feelings so you don't play bullshit games based on manipulation and dishonesty" and for men's fitness it'd be "eat less garbage, lift more, and worry more about your personality than trying to six-pack your way into a woman's pants". So instead they focus on the nauseating details of mental manipulation or quadra-super-setting your triceps right and getting exactly 27.6 grams of protein within 5 minutes of working out, their clients don't get the desired result, and they remain customers.

      [–]McMurphyCrazy 15 ポイント16 ポイント

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      Every single men's magazine always has a miraculous way to loose your beer belly too.

      [–]DrDerpberg 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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      " one trick that will melt your gut!"

      (*trick burns 5 calories a month)

      [–]Theshag0 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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      I like that beer belly is a problem with the solution right in the name. Don't want a beer belly? Don't drink beer.

      [–]PanicPilz 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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      Don't drink beer? I'm not sure I've ever seen those words used together like that to convey meaning. Is that even proper grammar? Are you trying to say do drink beer?

      [–]roxxe 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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      Meh i like to masterbrate to the cover and im not gay

      [–]DrDerpberg 41 ポイント42 ポイント

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      Try super-setting your masturbation sessions with cups of green tea to really get those anti-oxidants into your bloodstream.

      [–]Taliesintroll 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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      Since you're losing fluids, drink an energy drink to replenish those electrolytes.

      [–]xovi 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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      Circlejerking.

      [–]msg_V2 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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      This is the same reason why Over the Top is my favorite movie. I totally love to masturbate to Stallone in that movie, but in a very not-gay way.

      [–]utnapishtim_guy 18 ポイント19 ポイント

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      I think they tell women what they want to hear, rather than the truth. Sadly, most women who read these magazines want to hear that their bad behavior, cheating, is not really their fault, and even if it is, it's not a big deal.

      [–]TryingToUsurpSatan 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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      It isn't just Cosmo that does this. A lot of things sell by convincing people whatever situation they are in is not their fault--it's fault of some other group of people.

      Most political campaigns are won by this tactic, nevertheless something as insignificant as a magazine.

      [–]RogerMexico 18 ポイント19 ポイント

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      Actually, the writing style of Cosmo is just antiquated. It was a huge part of the sexual liberation movement of the 1960s and was extremely progressive at the time. However, times have changed and Cosmo hasn't. If you haven't heard of her yet, I strongly recommend that you read up on the recently deceased former editor of Cosmo, Helen Gurley. Her book, Sex and the Single Girl, was the main influence of both Sex and the City and Mad Men.

      [–]dirtypaws 7 ポイント8 ポイント

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      Never thought about that, but it's a really good theory.

      [–]thehungrynunu 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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      This is disturbingly closer to reality then you can guess

      Open up any of those magazines, there's a boatload of subliminal messages in them

      As for advice columns, you give too much credit. They have conflicting articles constantly but the way they are written is to reinforce the predetermined ideas that are already in the reader's head

      [–][deleted]

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      [deleted]

        [–]Metal_Guitarist 78 ポイント79 ポイント

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        For some reason the title of this post seems to imply it would be hard to "decimate" that article.

        [–][deleted]

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        [deleted]

          [–]CupBeEmpty 21 ポイント22 ポイント

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          dec·i·mate [des-uh-meyt]

          verb (used with object), dec·i·mat·ed, dec·i·mat·ing.

          1. to destroy a great number or proportion of: The population was decimated by a plague.

          2. to select by lot and kill every tenth person of.

          3. Obsolete. to take a tenth of or from. (emphasis added)

          We aren't Romans. Language evolves.

          [–][deleted]

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          [deleted]

            [–]ponimaju 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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            tell that to the people who have a problem with football being called soccer in north america

            [–][deleted] 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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            Hahaa. I saw one of you "evolving languages" guys on here once arguing that plethora and dearth could be used interchangeably.

            [–]zipzopzoobitybop 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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            /u/FormicaArchonis literally killed one tenth of Cosmo's advice.

            [–][deleted] 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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            The people on that subreddit take Cosmo's advice way, way more seriously than Cosmo's readers do.

            [–][deleted] 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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            And gettimg some of that sweet sweet reddit gold.

            [–]FormicaArchonis 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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            It's more snark and rant, at least as far as what I do, but I will gladly accept anyone calling it analysis.

            [–]HeroicGomez 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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            It's not relevant or particularly interesting to anyone who understands the shittiness of Cosmo's material.

            [–]FormicaArchonis 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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            Nope, it's not relevant or interesting at all. A trivial bit of frippery for those who like to sit about and rant about it. But then, that's rather the premise of the sub.

            [–]Illivah 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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            For some people, the over analysis is a reflex.

            [–]wurz81 270 ポイント271 ポイント

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            My girlfriend had a one-off indiscretion. She made out with a dude while loaded at a party. She confessed everything to me at her first opportunity. After some rocky times we worked through it. Still together 3 years later and all is good.

            Complete honesty and humility is the only chance for redemption.

            [–]FourLokoKills 105 ポイント106 ポイント

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            If she had fucked him, what would you have done?

            [–]wurz81 199 ポイント200 ポイント

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            Probably left her. Can't say for sure but I'd imagine I'd have a mental hang up that wouldn't let me get over it.

            [–]kutNpaste 438 ポイント439 ポイント

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            Self respect is not a mental hang up.

            [–]wurz81 78 ポイント79 ポイント

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            Absolutely correct.

            [–]dahahawgy 54 ポイント55 ポイント

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            Dear God that's quotable.

            [–]Dear_Occupant 34 ポイント35 ポイント

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            I'm enlightened by his intelligence.

            [–][deleted] 30 ポイント31 ポイント

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            Could you say you're euphoric?

            [–]Dear_Occupant 39 ポイント40 ポイント

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            In this moment, yes.

            [–]theorys 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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            And definitely not by some phony god's blessing.

            [–]3DBeerGoggles 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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            Eh?

            [–]Keyserchief 19 ポイント20 ポイント

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            [–][deleted] 10 ポイント11 ポイント

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            Self respect is not a mental hang up. Self respect is a goddam star lion.

            [–]tito617 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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            same here same situation but girl wont admit to it even if it meant her life and she knows that i know but denying it to the fullest

            [–]wurz81 13 ポイント14 ポイント

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            I couldn't deal with that. For all we've been trough, I still feel that I can trust her.

            [–]ChaostheSir 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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            Are you still with her?

            [–]iaro 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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            How do you know she didn't lie?

            [–]wurz81 34 ポイント35 ポイント

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            I can only trust her. She was upfront with me about it happening so I had the trust in her that she was telling me the whole truth.

            [–]fatalismrocks 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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            I've both cheated and been cheated on, and been forgiven and forgiven people (not all the same person). I don't think everyone's necessarily cut out for monogamy (or at least not the way most people mean it these days, one person from now till forever), and I've loved people who I don't think that kind of monogamy is probably suited for. I know that no matter who they sleep with, we still have something very special, and I'd be stupid to forget about that because of sex.

            That said, I get jealousy, of course, and I don't know if I could handle something like an open relationship.

            [–]redditeyes 127 ポイント128 ポイント

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            If you are not monogamous, don't be in a monogamous relationship. Either make a deal with your partner to be in an open relationship, or leave that partner to find someone who is more compatible with your sexuality. It's just not fair to lie to your partner in her/his face.

            This is not about jealousy, this is about trust.

            [–]ibillius 56 ポイント57 ポイント

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            I've been waiting for someone else to say this! If you don't want to be monogamous, that's totally fine, but your partner needs to know about what you're doing, at the very least from a health standpoint. We live in an age where there are all kinds of nasty STDs, some of which are fatal and/or essentially incurable (AIDS and herpes come to mind). If you are having sex with on person and then have sex with another, you MUST tell them. Period. Otherwise you are asking them to accept a risk they are not fully aware of, which is flatly unethical no matter what your thoughts on monogamy are.

            [–]draconic86 26 ポイント27 ポイント

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            And just as importantly, if you are already in a monogamous relationship, don't be a fucking cheat. End the relationship first, then go sow your wild oats or whatever.

            [–]Shenaniganz08 19 ポイント20 ポイント

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            If you are not monogamous, don't be in a monogamous relationship.

            Best quote in this thread. It's just that fucking simple

            [–]Not_So_Funny_Meow 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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            I could probably love someone who wasn't cut out for monogamy, but I doubt I could get too attached to someone who wasn't cut out for honesty.

            [–]royrese 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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            I think maybe you're looking at this wrong. I don't believe anybody is "cut out for monogamy". We're all biologically wired to not be monogamous. The entire point of this artificial construct of marriage (and many artificial constructs of society) is that we make personal sacrifices and hold back instinctual urges for the benefit of others.

            If you think marriage is a stupid idea, that's one thing, but I don't think you should be mistaken in thinking that some people are more "cut out" to stray and sleep around. I think it's simply degrees of self control.

            [–]addictedtohappygenes 20 ポイント21 ポイント

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            I don't think think it's fair to say that none of us are wired to be monogamous. There are plenty of theories about how love was evolutionarily advantageous because it helped us stay with one partner our whole life.

            [–]TrumpetsRaining[S] 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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            I completely agree. I am happiest in long-term, monogamous relationships. I have never wanted casual sex or to be casually dating a number of people. Monogamy may not be for everyone, but it certainly is for me.

            [–]fatalismrocks 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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            Yeah, I'm not talking about monogamy in terms of marriage, I've never been married and don't plan on it, I don't think. I'm talking about young people figuring out what they want to do, the person above me spoke about his girlfriend, I think.

            [–]beepborpimajorp 28 ポイント29 ポイント

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            This is a magazine that advises women to nibble warm donuts off their boyfriend's wieners. Bad advice central. Why is anyone still reading it?

            [–]coozay 21 ポイント22 ポイント

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            nibble warm donuts off their boyfriend's wieners

            sounds good to me

            [–]furiousBobcat 38 ポイント39 ポイント

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            TIL that people still take Cosmo seriously enough to waste their time refuting 'advice' given out by Cosmo.

            [–][deleted]

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            [deleted]

              [–]Acidpants220 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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              That subreddit is primarily about comedy, not some campaign to right the wrongs of cosmo.

              [–]ministryoflabor 17 ポイント18 ポイント

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              I remember a girl in high school reading this same advice in Cosmo 10 years ago and she was enraged that the advice said to hide it. For me, and I'm guessing most people, the fact that I was lied to is worse than the fact you did something hurtful towards me.

              [–]the_liebestod 76 ポイント77 ポイント

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              The odd thing is that /u/FormicaArchonis isn't attacking the argument head on, but just the tone of it: It doesn't tell women that they're pieces of shit for cheating, I guess, and that's bad? But lacking in her rant is actual alternative advice that's predicated on the assumption that you want to preserve the relationship rather than grovel and self-flagellate. And yeah, maybe cheating girlfriends should grovel and self-flagellate in some broader sense, but that's not what the article is about and I'm not sure if it should be.

              [–]DEVi4TION 70 ポイント71 ポイント

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              It's one of those subs, they don't bother with much rebuttal anymore because they all know. It would be preaching to the choir. They are essentially just mocking cosmo for entertainment.

              [–]the_liebestod 20 ポイント21 ポイント

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              Yeah, fine, but then it's the OP here who's misleading in saying that the argument is decimated. The article wasn't addressed directly, there's just a bunch of hand-wringing about its tone.

              [–]DEVi4TION 7 ポイント8 ポイント

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              Agree. Most of it was sarcastically, "yeah do that, because that's smart". Reads like every mocking sub (as we all know, SRS, for example)

              [–]memumimo 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              Right on! I bet the upvotes are from people who wish Cosmo's arguments would get decimated.

              [–]imbored53 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              Nah, that article already decimated itself.

              [–]insertnickhere 19 ポイント20 ポイント

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              I set fire to my house yesterday. How do I make it not burnt down?

              [–][deleted] 36 ポイント37 ポイント

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              Well, you didn't do anything wrong because your house should have known that you wanted a fireplace for setting fires.

              Houses are fickle things so it's probably burned down by now. Dump some wood on your property so it can rebuild itself, and in a few weeks check back to see if it has built a fireplace. If not, it's okay to set it on fire again.

              [–]FormicaArchonis 28 ポイント29 ポイント

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              The odd thing is that /u/FormicaArchonis isn't attacking the argument head on, but just the tone of it

              It's kinda what I do.

              It doesn't tell women that they're pieces of shit for cheating, I guess, and that's bad?

              Sorry if that's how it came across. It's not that it's not down on women, it's that it's... well, kinda pricky. If a guy fucks around and then blames his wife because his "needs aren't being met at home" that's the most stereotypical portrait of the cheating douchebag husband ever. This is literally that exact same advice being directed at women.

              If you want to argue Cosmopolitan is doing some sort of avant-garde criticism of sexism via gender reversal, more power to ya, but otherwise it's advising a woman to be the kind of man she would advise her friends to leave.

              But lacking in her rant is actual alternative advice that's predicated on the assumption that you want to preserve the relationship rather than grovel and self-flagellate.

              Because I'm not a marriage counselor, or a psychologist, or anything better than "random jerk on the Internet". I don't have a good idea of what to do, but I know a bad idea when I see it. I don't have to be able to install a fireplace to know that the chimney can't stop in the attic.

              Where would I personally start? Honesty? Discussion? Trying to keep one's ego out of it? Not deflecting all of the blame? Not treating your partner like shit? Acting like an adult? But I don't know, I've never been in that situation. Maybe I'll get myself killed with my ideas of how to proceed. Fair enough but I don't want anyone else charging down the path with me thinking I know what I'm doing.

              And yeah, maybe cheating girlfriends should grovel and self-flagellate in some broader sense, but that's not what the article is about and I'm not sure if it should be.

              I don't know what the article should be about either, but I stand by my basic premise that advising someone to act like the worst example of the archetype is never a good idea.

              [–]the_liebestod 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              Where would I personally start? Honesty? Discussion? Trying to keep one's ego out of it? Not deflecting all of the blame? Not treating your partner like shit? Acting like an adult? But I don't know, I've never been in that situation.

              The only thing on your list which the article seems to avoid recommending here is "honesty", which is in fact bad advice if you plan to continue cheating! Not deflecting blame can be encompassed under beginning for forgiveness, not treating him like shit can be encompassed under trying to boost his ego, etc. Again, that's why it just seems like you're objecting to the framing of the argument - it's telling women to act conciliatory and apologetic but not necessarily to be conciliatory and apologetic.

              [–]FormicaArchonis 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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              Again, that's why it just seems like you're objecting to the framing of the argument - it's telling women to act conciliatory and apologetic but not necessarily to be conciliatory and apologetic.

              I don't find that framing, though. Telling someone to apologize and 'stroke their poor baby's ego' is making the "don't BE apologetic" part of the core argument. Admit fault without accepting fault. Advising someone to act one way and be another is not good advice for a relationship.

              [–]MAC777 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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              I disagree.

              I think Archonis' comments about the tone of the article were passing and superficial; the real beef was with the perspective implicitly advocated by the article. I think Archonis was bothered by the seemingly innocent "You go girl" catharsis of that perspective, and was elucidating the impossibility of it ever offering a practical remedy to the situation of cheating on your significant other.

              I mean the article never really addresses taking ownership of your own transgressions. Instead, it comes from this mindset of making excuses about what women do when they're neglected, or what the "poor boy" will need.

              You don't really need to present a better solution just to point out a flawed perspective. Feminism has been doing it for decades that way, and they're getting along fine. And if you pushed FormicaArchonis for an answer, I think they'd say "any other perspective would be better than this one."

              Also, it's a "Shit *** Says" sub, so grain of salt.

              [–]FormicaArchonis 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              And if you pushed FormicaArchonis for an answer, I think they'd say "any other perspective would be better than this one."

              Thank you, yes.

              Well, most perspectives. I'm sure if I tried I could write worse advice. Maybe involving guano.

              [–]the_liebestod 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              I think Archonis was bothered by the seemingly innocent "You go girl" catharsis of that perspective, and was elucidating the impossibility of it ever offering a practical remedy to the situation of cheating on your significant other.

              Maybe. I mean, I think a lot of the advice is very practical, and that's what makes it objectionable - it's basically about acting conciliatory and apologetic without actually being so. It's like if you had a guide for sociopathic men on how to manage relationships (arguably this is /r/seduction or whatever, yes)... it would come off as objectionable to a lot of people whether or not the advice is good, because it would end up recommending heavy-handed emotional manipulation and people as a rule will object to that. And critics will say "well relationships just can't work unless people like this change themselves", but that seems like a pretty weaksauce response. Maybe they can and maybe they can't. Maybe it's not worth the trouble of changing one's self, etc. In that case, let a thousand flowers bloom.

              [–]LvS 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              The odd thing is that /u/FormicaArchonis isn't attacking the argument head on, but just the tone of it

              I think that's the genius part of it. There is no judgement on the cheating person's actions.

              The only thing that is questioned is the justification for the actions. This gives the cheater the chance to rethink her arguments and try to come up with better ones (or stand by them and live with the implications of being a sociopath and asshole). You can only use this way of argument if you are sure that there is no possible justification that works and that the cheater has no way to redeem herself and that by trying to come up with one she will essentially work herself into the ground. Which makes the argument so powerful. It turns the cheater onto herself.

              [–]SlightlyStoopkid 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              True, I really wouldn't consider this "best of" material. However, I can't think of any advice for a cheating partner--man or woman--beyond "admit you fucked up, and either beg for forgiveness or end the relationship." I've never cheated, but I'd like to think if I ever sank so low that I'd at least have the courage to admit it and walk away from the relationship that apparently meant so little to me.

              [–]penteyrn 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              I think it presumes a certain moral stance, sure, that the victim's right to be aware has a higher moral priority than the perpetrator's right to continue the relationship. I think the argument goes that the article takes on the perspective of a sociopath - it's entirely self-serving to the detriment of moral stances and to the manipulation (not support) of the victim's emotions.

              It's an article telling women to behave like a sociopath, and I think that's what people take issue with.

              [–]PantsGrenades 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              No offense, but somehow I feel like you're bothered by the implications of the reply, not the content. He/she didn't cover 'alternative advice' because most of us would consider cheaters dubious and sheisty by default. The obvious alternative advice would be "Tell the truth and own up to it."

              [–]wolftwang 72 ポイント73 ポイント

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              Story time. My ex cheated on me when she went to study abroad in Europe and didn't tell me until I was screwing around one day and made her think her friend had told me something she didn't want me to find out. The old "your friend told me about the shit you did in Europe, were you planning on mentioning any of that?"- to which she replied "it didn't mean anything, I made a mistake." To which I was like "whoa, what the fuck is this all about". So what was supposed to be me poking fun ended up being a long discussion about some fucking Italian that bought her dinner and she fucked him.

              I guess I'll get on with this though: women bitch and moan about how men are fucking disgusting and will cheat the second the opportunity presents itself and how there are no good men left, but that's bullshit. And when one of them gets caught cheating, it's because the guy wasn't giving enough attention, was never around, wasn't providing enough, etc. where the guy is just branded as a fucking asshole. Take responsibility for your fucking actions, women, and quit making everything a scapegoat for your shitty behavior.

              Fuck you, Shannon.

              [–]starryrach 47 ポイント48 ポイント

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              It's because nobody ever sees themselves as a bad person.

              Cheaters are bad people. I'm not a bad person. Therefore, I'm not a cheater, I just did this because of something he did to me. He started it!

              I'm a woman and I've been cheated on by a boyfriend before. It's always because of some perceived injustice.

              [–][deleted] 25 ポイント26 ポイント

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              Both sexes cheat at equal rates. End of story. It's just as wrong for women to claim all men do it as it for men to accuse all women. There are a lot of cheaters, but it has nothing to do with gender.

              [–]Chiggero 13 ポイント14 ポイント

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              I agree with the numbers; men cheat, too. That's not the point. The point is that there is this horrible tendency these days amongst women to try and excuse themselves when they do; they blame their partners for "ignoring them." Read the article in question; it's case-in-point.

              [–][deleted] 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              From the Cosmos article:

              "Ask yourself why you did it," advises Weiner. "Then let your boyfriend know what you need from him." But still, do not confess.

              I can't believe the level of self-entitlement, ego being injected into people. In this story she fucks someone, but it is only because boyfriend had faults. Then in return she tells him what he needs from him.

              So you get cheated on, and in return you get list of demands from your girlfriend, so that she can stay with you.

              A better idea: Why the hell won't you talk about those needs before? No relationship is perfect, all needs repairs, bargains...etc. But giving cheaters that idea of entitlement of cheating, how they have no fault...etc? What the fuck is wrong with these people?

              [–]brownmatt 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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              To be honest you were playing a pretty weird game with her in that story.

              [–][deleted] 6 ポイント7 ポイント

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              Darn it, Shannon stop giving Shannon 's a bad name.

              Source : My sister's name is Shannon and she is a swell gal.

              [–]2hearts 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              The generalisation. It hurts.

              [–]IHappenToBeARobot 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              I think it has a lot to do with the victim mentality. Oftentimes people that cheat feel like they need to justify what they've done, so they project some sort of fault onto their partner that would defend their actions. Whether that is because "I wasn't getting what I needed." or any other host of crappy excuses, the point is that they are trying to justify their unjustifiable actions. I've found that women are more vocal and take the fragile victim stance when being cheated on, wheras men more often are less vocal and thus get almost trampled on by their partener's excuses. You, however, realize that it was her that had the issue, not you, and for that I applaud you. Nobody deserves to be cheated on.

              [–]RIPPEDMYFUCKINPANTS 7 ポイント8 ポイント

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              How about people just don't cheat on their SOs? Is it that difficult to keep legs closed/sausages tucked in?

              [–]SamSlate 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              the number of trackers on cosmo's site is unreal. ghostly picks up 24.. wow.

              [–]BootlegV 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Imagine if this was an article directed towards men about women. Feminists would be all over this shit. Sexist pigs everywhere, amirite?

              [–]francohab 33 ポイント34 ポイント

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              On a side note, "to decimate" actually means to reduce something by one tenth.

              [–]FormicaArchonis 11 ポイント12 ポイント

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              I didn't quote the entire article. So I might've decimated it. I might've only dimidiated it, though.

              [–]memumimo 23 ポイント24 ポイント

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              In its origin. In common English speech it means about the same as "obliterate".

              [–]alphabeat 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Same as "literally" now means the opposite and it's original meaning? Fuck that evolving lexicon!

              [–][deleted] 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              I don't think so. I think it still rather refers to damage that is done to a group of things rather than to an indivisible entity.

              [–]memumimo 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              Dictionaries consider that meaning obsolete or only relevant when referring to Roman history.

              [–][deleted] 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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              "To destroy a great number or proportion of" indicates that there is a degree of divisibility. There might be some ambiguity here regarding whether the concerned object has to be a definite plural, but I find it inappropriate when using it in the context of debasing an article.

              [–]Pandamana 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              I read their definitions, and I think the only 'obsolete' part is assuming decimate means a precise 10% reduction. I think ursulus is correct in saying it still implies the reduction of a divisible population. Not really synonymous with 'obliterate,' though thesaurus.com disagrees.

              [–]Pandamana 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              I don't know why you're being down-voted. I came here to see this, and to make sure people know they consistently use this word incorrectly.

              [–]kanders 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              Which, really, is what they did. They only addressed a small part of the article.

              [–]liesthroughhisteeth 9 ポイント10 ポイント

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              I'm sorry, but getting all indignant about something written in Cosmo is about as constructive as getting pissed at Maxum magazine for their lack of intelligent articles, reporting and insight.

              [–]CGord 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              Now you're standing there tongue-tied

              You'd better learn your lesson well

              Hide what you have to hide

              And tell what you want to tell

              [–]crossfitjnky 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              Ya cosmo's advice is usually freaking stupid. Ya if you are happy with a %50 divorce rate then take relationship advice from a magazine that encourages readers to cheat on your s.o. or how bout "flirt with random guys at the bar and take that sexual energy back to your husband" or my favorite "flirt with other guys when your on a date so your bf will see how desirable you are" cosmo is trash ladies.

              [–]jaemann 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              In all fairness, Cosmo has never written anything that wasn't complete tripe.

              [–]redDIDitnotme 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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              A friend of a friend I know had their fiance cheat on them, she didn't tell him. He got married to her. 1 year later she divorced him and he found out he was HIV positive (he had never been with anyone else). Cosmo advice FTW?

              [–]Knetic491 18 ポイント19 ポイント

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              As long as she strokes the poor boy's ego afterwards, everything is ok.

              [–]SabineLavine 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Wow. He should buy a lottery ticket. The chance of a man getting HIV from a woman that way is about "1 in 100,000 or .001% possibly even less than that," according to this HIV info site

              [–]geckahn 5 ポイント6 ポイント

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              That's per act. Since he married to her they were probably fucking a lot. And the chances are much higher if you fuck her right after she got infected, which is likely in this case

              [–]macncheezeplz 21 ポイント22 ポイント

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              This isn't worthy of bestof.

              [–]NotSoGreatDane 14 ポイント15 ポイント

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              There is way too much pro-male sex advice that gets posted here for no other reason than the subject.

              [–]monkeybanana14 17 ポイント18 ポイント

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              It's not even that, he's just bashing shitty advice from a shitty magazine. Nothing super special at all. This sub has kinda started falling lately.

              [–]lustigjh 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Lately? You weren't here during the orgasm description period, were you...

              [–]FeNgArAeRiTh 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              So glad we banned the default subreddits!

              Now let's ban critiques of bad advice. Not to worry, if you enjoy content like this you can subscribe to /r/BadAdviceCritiqueGems

              [–]NotSoGreatDane 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Yeah, that too.

              [–]seieibob -1 ポイント0 ポイント

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              Also, I thought decimate means to kill one of every ten. It's not terribly effective, is it?

              [–]hiyosilver64 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              I stopped reading Cosmo very early on. Terrible magazine.

              [–]nc_cyclist 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              What kind of dumbass people take advice from a social magazine?

              [–]thesorrow312 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              Cosmo is anti feminist. It teaches women they have to look and act an artificial and manufactured way in order to be desirable. Dont be yourself, be who we tell you to be, it is better.

              They give shitty advice so girls will not enjoy success , keep buying the mag and buying into more shit advice and ads for products to buy.

              [–]GenerationKILL 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Cosmo advice or no advice at all, the simple fact is that the initial reasons for cheating on somebody are impulsiveness mixed with arrogance. Thats not a ground breaking revelation that needs to be dissected in magazines or on reddit.

              You cheat on somebody, you're a selfish asshole with an impulse control problem. If you get cheated on, you need to collect your self esteem and move on, rather then "attempting" to patch the hole in the sinking ship, using rag-tag advice from magazines that just generalize everyone's problems into specific brackets.

              End of story.

              [–]edgarde 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              Cosmo:

              Sometimes cheating happens.

              See? It's not the reader's fault.

              [–]jcatleather 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              How about just... not cheat??

              [–]utnapishtim_guy 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              Statistically, females have a much higher rate of infidelity than males. This is true across most species which practice monogamy.

              (Bring on the down votes)

              [–]Random_Fandom 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              (Bring on the down votes)

              I won't downvote you, but I'd definitely like to see some sources for that claim.

              Determining which gender supposedly cheats more is weird to me. I grew up hearing older women's 'advice' about "keeping the man happy" - with the underlying premise that men very easily cheat when they're dissatisfied. Really fucked up. What made it worse was hearing so many guys confirm it, with a "boys will be boys" nod.

              As life has it, a little growing and experience made me see that people are people, and there is no formula to reveal which person will do what. I must say, lol... reddit is my first exposure to so much rhetoric about cheating females.

              It isn't that I'd never heard or believed that females cheat. It's that my impression is the majority in reddit who talk about cheating seem to believe it's far more inherent in females. I wonder why, and where that comes from.

              [–]sdayotte 3 ポイント4 ポイント

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              Statistically, when people start a sentence with statistically they are statistically more likely to not post a cited statistic.

              [–]brokenscope 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              dat citation

              [–]J_Sto 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              [–]blehm98 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              Here's the basic thing as i understand it: If it's a one-time mistake, you'll never repeat it, it was not some cry for help or an escape from a miserable relationship, especially if you have kids, you have a duty to protect those you love. This means that guilt you feel is yours to bear, and yours alone, and if you share it you're just taking the easy way out

              if it happens multiple times, if it's an escape, or if you don't have kids, i think you should strongly consider telling because it's not going to resolve itself. Even two separate incidences is enough of a pattern that i doubt it's never gonna happen again

              If you don't love the person do what you want, but you can do it with knowledge you're a bad human being

              [–]phycologist 8 ポイント9 ポイント

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              For me the rule is - cheating? Single.

              [–]Mighty_Cunt_Punter 12 ポイント13 ポイント

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              The problem is that it is always a "one time mistake." Nobody likes to admit to themselves that they're a cheater. It was always just an accident, or the alcohol, or out of character, or whatever other excuse they come up with at the time (And trust me, the excuses will be brilliant and convincing).

              The type of person who would cheat once is the type of person who would then try to keep it a secret. That type of person is a cheater and dishonest. There is absolutely no reason to believe that this wouldn't be a pattern of behavior, especially if they feel justified in it.

              Wait, what the fuck am I doing here? People are honestly defending cheating and lying about it? Fuck!

              [–]blehm98 3 ポイント4 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              if you have kids you're not the only person involved. I would never cheat in the first place, the only cheaters i've ever known have done it over and over again, never just a one-time thing. Hypothetically it makes complete sense, but i know i'd never get there anyway, which is why it makes sense for me

              [–]ponchato 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              It doesn't matter if it happens once or ten times. A cheater is always a cheater, and if you ever take a cheater back, that's a fucking CLEAR open invitation to "Please fuck someone else again, I'll take you back."

              [–]shodanx 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              so, 9/10 of the argument is still good ?

              [–]Djloudenclear 2 ポイント3 ポイント

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              He lined up all the Cosmo writers and killed every tenth one to teach the rest a lesson

              [–]shodanx 4 ポイント5 ポイント

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              What !!? I thought you were suppose to make the other 9 Cosmo writers kill the tenth one !

              [–]pretty_innocuous 1 ポイント2 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              I can see this is an unpopular opinion, but the linked comment does nothing but attack the premise the situation and the wording of the advice, not the advice itself. The premise is that cheating happened, which everyone will agree is shitty, but nowhere in his response does he address why it is a good idea to admit afterward.

              As a side-note, I agree with cosmo here. Confessing is selfish, and in the paradigm of a woman who fucked up and wants to stay in the relationship, it serves no purpose other than to clear the guilty party's conscience.

              My personal policy is one strike you're out. So if a girl were to cheat on me, realizes the mistake and wants to stay in a relationship, she better make damn sure I never find out, because that girl would immediately be out on her ass. The fact that I found out from her would only make me despise her more.

              [–]notreallyswiss 1 ポイント2 ポイント

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              You and i are apparantly the only two people in the world who think cheaters should stay mum. I would break up with someone who told me they cheated simply to forgo the weepy drama of it all. And if i, for some reason i can't imagine, told someone i had cheated on them, i'd grow to disrespect them for keeping me around.

              I have no idea what these people are thinking.

              [–]Mule2go 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              And all this time I just thought Cosmo was a collection of advertising with some useless articles thrown in. With just enough "you're not pretty enough" and "you're not getting laid enough" messages that the weak of mind come lurching back for more.

              [–]PenguinBomb 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              I thought I hated Cosmo, but now I know for a fact. lol

              [–]PunchingBag 0 ポイント1 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              Cosmopolitan: Advice on the Best Way to Trigger a Divorce.

              [–]zeugenie 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              not to tell*

              [–]phoncible 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              "Destroying" shit cosmo says is like Mike Tyson "destroying" a bobo doll.

              [–]erogbass 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              So. angry. just. so irritated. gah!

              [–]Whyver 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              If you cheat, you carry the weight of it. Don't cheat and then decide to unload the guilt. You're not helping your partner, you're selfishly lightening your load.

              [–]deusexnox 0 ポイント1 ポイント

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              Fuck Cosmo.

              [–]has_a_3_inch_penis 0 ポイント1 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              Good God, that is a horrible layout. So confusing and difficult to figure out what's going on. The page navigation was absolutely unintuitive. Mr Cosmo Web Designer, you really thought image gallery style navigation was good for paging text? And don't get me started on the retarded behavior of the vertical scrolling. Wtf.

              Also, I don't think she decimated Cosmo's advice at all. She merely brought up an opposing viewpoint. This is not an issue with a clear and decisive solution. It's complex and very difficult and brings about different solutions because every situation is unique.

              [–][deleted] 0 ポイント1 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              I think we're all forgetting that Cosmo, or their subscription base, doesn't care.

              [–]zach_75 0 ポイント1 ポイント

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              If my man cheated, I would forgive him. It's true, partners get boring in regards to sex. That's the way it is sometimes. I know we at both pretty lacklustre in bed, but I love him and always want him around. If he were to go out and have sex for sex sake, then fine with me, just don't tell me all the details. And anyway, it's not cheating, it's just sex. But everyone's different. People should do what they feel is right.