still writing | |
The invention relates to type-bar machines of the "visible writing" class, such as top-strike : and front-strike machines. In such machines the types are necessarily assembled closely side by side, and in consequence the type-bars are apt to clash; especially when the machine is in rapid operation. To a great extent, such clashing is due to the proximity of type-bars or types which are not only frequently used, but are also often written in immediate succession; there not being sufficient time for. one of such types to come to rest before the next is operated, so that the types strike or catch one upon another, which of course is a great objection.
Stickney wrote in patent filed at 1904, about adjacency of typebars and liability of clashings to be trouble, and when, he limited the boundary of sayings with in front-strike machine and down-strike machine..
Why didn't he mention about up-strike?
How far are the adjacent typebars on up-strike machine in prototype era?
www.google.com/patents/about?id=t7YAAAAAEBAJ&dq">
Patent US79265 - IMPROVEMENT IN TYPE-WRITING MACHINES - Google Patents
Of any suitable material (we use and prefer steel) make as many type bars or hammers o as types to be used or slots in the disk. Pivot the outer ends of the type-bars in the slots in the outer edge by a wire laid in the groove in the periphery circumscribing the disk. On the upper sides of the inner ends of the type-bars cut in relief the types to be used. Make all the type-bars of the exact length of the radius of the circle of the disk, so each type on the inner ends, when thrown up into the radial grooves, will strike against the central point. (See Figs. 1, 5, and 7.) Fasten the disk thus combined with the typebars in the circle in the cover of the case, as shown in Figs. 1 and 7, by anyconvenientmeans not interfering with the working of the typebars. (We set it on wire posts fastened to the bottom of the case.) In the case, on a suitable frame, put a key-board similar to the keyboard of a piano, having as many keys L, plus one, as types to be used, as shown in Fig. 1, each key reaching from the front in under or opposite the type-bars and pivoted toor vibrating on the fulcrum or beam M, as- shown in Fig. 7. On the inner end of ench key, excepting the space-key, fasten a finger «-, made in any convenient way, (we use a stiff wire,) or bend the inner ends of the keys so the fingers will be part of the keys to reach the corresponding type-bar, so that, when the front end of the key is pressed down it will strike and throw the type-bar up into its radial groove and its type-end against the central point, as shown in Fig. 7. The ends of the fingers will thus be in a circle corresponding to the circle of the disk and type-bare. Within and below the circle of the fingers and typebars set a cushion or rest q, of any material for the type-bars to fall back and rest on after having been thrown up against the central point, as shown in Fig. 7. Over the central point of the inner circle of the disk suspend a solid anvil or post O' in any firm manner, as by the arm I), fastened to the edge of the case and reaching out to the anvil, as shown in Figs. 1 and 7. In the bottom of the anvil make a spherical cavity or bowl. Make a platen G of any hard smooth substance (we use metal) with the bottom or face finished smooth and level, and with the top spherical to fit the .bowl in the bottom of the anvil. Fit and attach the spherical end of the platen in and to the bowl of the anvil, thus making of the connection a universal joint, and making the platen self-adjustable. (See Figs. 1 and 7.) What we claim as new and useful in our invention, and desire to secure by patent, is-
1. The key-levers L, vibrating on the fulcrum M, with the inner ends or fingers u reaching under the type-bars, so that the keys will act directly on the types, substantially as and for the purpose described. " *
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Patent No.:118491
IMPROVEMENT IN MECHANICAL TYPOGRAPHERS
LATHAM SHOLES
Patent number: 118491
Issue date: Aug 29, 1871
You see here not wire-string but something like wire-spring push-up the typebar..
Let's see what reads on this patent document, later on..
Sholes' or someone's drawings of kick-up or wires or linkages connected between typebar to key.. and relateds.. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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There may be two kind of keys..
One is for S like piano keys, ,, the drawing shows only one of keys, though,,
What's kick-up? and What's not? - The actuality on - QWERTY history
and the other, for U currently we call typebar.. looks like..
Patent US118491 - IMPROVEMENT IN MECHANICAL TYPOGRAPHERS - Google Patents
S represents a series of keys, pivoted on a fulcrum below the ratchets J K, to reach under and work the types. T represents a slotted disk, fastened above the rear ends of the keys and directly under the main axle B. U represents a series of keys, pivoted in the slots of the disk T so as to strike at a point in the center thereof, directly under the main axle B.
still writing, patent, drawing | |
http://www.google.com/patents?q=Sholes&scoring=2&lr=&sa=N&start=30
Patent number: 79868
Issue date: Jul 14, 1868
Patent number: 79265
Issue date: 1868
IMPROVEMENT IN MECHANICAL TYPOGRAPHERS
Patent number: 118491
Issue date: Aug 29, 1871
You see here not wire-string but something like wire-spring push-up the typebar..
Let's see what reads on this patent document, later on..
Patent number: 182511
Filing date: Mar 30, 1872
Issue date: Sep 19, 1876
Patent number: 200351
Filing date: Jan 16, 1874
Issue date: Feb 12, 1878
Patent number: 207559
applied date: March 8, 1875
Issue date: Aug 27, 1878
Patent number: 207558
Issue date: Aug 27, 1878
Patent number: 207557
Issue date: Aug 27, 1878
WILLIAM K. JENNE
Patent number: 349349
Filing date: Aug 12, 1879
Issue date: Sep 21, 1886
ALBBET M. DA COSTA
Patent number: 229386
Filing date: Feb 28, 1880
Issue date: Jun 29, 1880
Patent number: 558428
Filing date: Dec 31, 1881
Issue date: Apr 14, 1896
Patent number: 559756
Filing date: Feb 18, 1890
Issue date: May 5, 1896
Patent number: 559755
Filing date: Feb 18, 1890
Issue date: May 5, 1896
Patent number: 408061
Filing date: Jun 23, 1879
Issue date: Jul 30, 1889
Patent number: 199263
Filing date: Nov 19, 1875
Issue date: Jan 15, 1878
still writing, keyboard | |
Do you believe Rosch's saying "no relation between typebars to keys in their placement."?
Rosch says in the Bible of PC of his own like as, "the arrangement of the type bars has no direct relationship to the arrangement of keys."
Winn L. Rosch "the arrangement of the type bars has no direct relationship to the arrangement of keys."
The Winn L. Rosch Hardware Bible - Winn L. Rosch - Google ブックス
It says just for the time when the key layout changed from something like"A to Z" order to non-simple-A2Z-order.
That might be happen while the American type writer was introduced into the "Porter's Telegraph College" around 1868, and just the after.. till July 1872 at latest, which at the bigining of this kind of machine, it might have simulated keyboard of Type-Printing Telegraph.
This insisting might be started by Griffith or Noyes or Koichi Yasuoka or so..
Hughes Type-Printing Telegraph（1919だっけか）とThe American Type Writer（１８６８） - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
(cf.Hughes Type-Printing Telegraph)
Hughes Type-Printing Telegraph - Google Search
Telegraph
Hughes Telegraph
Dumoulin - Froment a Paris
Mid 19th Century
Operated on the Paris - Milan line
It might be started from "A to M" and "N to Z", or from "A to Z". Anyway, they might have alphabetically simple sequential order on key layout.
The traditional story says because of increasing typebar troubles as typing speed geting faster,
the rearranging started to change the alphabetical order..
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concerning to early typewriter documents, Remington Rand Corporation Records at Soda; Densmore letters in Milwaukee; Sholes' in Madison
The earliest use of the terms "Remington # 1 Type Writer" by the marketer (at that time = Wyckoff, Seamans and Benedict) of the machine I can document is 1883.
Peter
Yahoo! Groups
APKY says at Soda House , some are there.
17-letter-boxes of "Remington Rand Corporation Records", at Soda House, Hagley Museum and Library, .
Hagley Museum and Library: Welcome!Remington Rand Corporation Records | yasuokaの日記 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
- Mrs. M. V. Longleyの『Caligraph Lessons』(Cincinnati, 1882年)
- The keyboard layout documents to show transforming from "Remington & Sons","Wyckoff, Seamans & Benedict","Remington Standard Typewriter Manufacturing Company", to "Remington Typewriter Company".
History of the Typewriter
Advertisements,
1876-1945
Box 1: 1
Sholes Letters,
1872
Folder 15
(Includes copies of three letters written by Christopher Latham Sholes. Two letters to a Mr. Markoe describe typewriting and arrange a sale. The third letter, to “Friend Barron,” expresses the inventor's apprehension that the typewriter would be a passing fad.)
- Caligraph (Typewriter),
- 1882-1970
- Folder 24
- Centennial Exposition,
- 1876-1947
- Folder 25
- (Includes Correspondence about Remington typewriter displayed at exposition, copy of advertisement, 1876 letter typed at exposition and 1939 letter from owner of that typewriter.)
- Illustrations,
Remington Rand Corporation, Records of the Advertising and Sales Promotion Department1876-1956
- Instruction Manuals,
- 1882-1926
- Folder 5
- (Contains instructions for touch-method and “Type-Writer Lessons for the Use of Teachers and Learners Adapted to Remington's Perfected Type-Writers.”)
Densmore Collection, in Milwaukee Public Museum. seems like as much as by letter box counting 20 boxes as much.
コメント#1357234 | Sholes & Glidden Type-Writerの活字棒の配置 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
ArCat: Library Catalog - Full View
- Author/Creator: Sholes, Christopher Latham, 1819-1890.
- Title: Letters, 1869-1889.
- Quantity: 0.1 c.f. (1 folder)
- Summary: Copies of letters written by Sholes of Milwaukee, to James and Amos Densmore, describing his work in improving and perfecting his invention, the typewriter.
Keys of QWERTY might be in Milwaukee&Madison Wisc. - 霊犀社２If we could see the typewriter had brought to Remi - 霊犀社２Analizing Sholes’ letters,Madison locates at best! - 霊犀社２ｆｏｏｔｎｏｔｅｓ２２ａｎｄ２６
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David Sadowski >This is in the run-up to "Black Friday," September 24, 1869 when Jim Fisk's
attempt to corner the gold market failed.
Yahoo! Groups
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Outline of typewriter history
Outline of typewriter history :: Trade Catalogs and Pamphlets
http://b.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110121#bookmark-28416798
http://digital.hagley.org/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/p15017coll10&CISOPTR=5696&CISOSHOW=5675
http://digital.hagley.org/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/p15017coll10&CISOPTR=3929&CISOSHOW=3923
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Do you use a word "impossible" for it while you've ever seen it even if but just once at least so far? APKY*1 says McGurrin almost did.
McGurrin said "impossible", for what..
The fingering is the most important requisite for learning to operate without looking at the keyboard. All the fingers should be used, thus practically covering the entire keyboard. (The Remington machine is referred to, as it is impossible to acquire this faculty on any other double case writing machine now in use.)
QWERTY People Archive
He McGurrin has competed with Traub, who is a man,who APKY says in Japanese so-called "Tacchi or Tatchi or Tatti(in Japanese in Romantic-chara) typist," so-called "touch typist" in a current our wordings, at typing Caligraph No.2, a double case writing machine.
Before he wrote letter to this article in late 1888, he had competed with Traub in July 25,1888.
What had he McGurrin seen then? Traub typing without looking at the keyboard?
What a wonderful wordings APKY is doing with as his profession of the charactor-code -academic! sometimes using in Japanese, or English on the other..
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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What a precious experience of APKY*1 who is almost the only man of living existence being able to testify not jamming ever on S&G and Rem 2 to the people in the land of where there are very few up-strike machines being tried typing for checking if to get jammed or not,it is! The land's name is called Japan.
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
still writing | |
Mr. Louis Traub and Mr. Frank Edward McGurrin, at the typewriter competition on July 25, 1888.
The Truth of QWERTY
on the typewriter competition at almost Traub's office, I remember in vague.
will be cititng here
It seems that Traub might set up the place to compete. Or McGurrin dared to come to Traub's to compete.
Did McGurrin use his own machine? or not? Where did he live, that time? Did he come by train with his machine?
McGurrin says in interview that he restart from feeling and confirming the position of "G", then it's alright every time.
will be cititng here
That was once newsed as by intuition, though..
Mr. Traub had visited the 1887 Indiana State Fair in Indianapolis, where he exhibited his typing skill on Caligraph No.2 with a blank keyboard (cf. History of Cincinnati and Hamilton County, Ohio; S. B. Nelson, Cincinnati (1894)).
The Truth of QWERTY
Mr. Traub was an eight-finger typist on Caligraph No.2 (not Calligraph) as I mentioned before.
The Truth of QWERTY
In the next few days after the event between Traub and McGurrin, an analysis was on a paper.
will be cititng here
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On documents I've found jamming, even I've nener seen upstrike by my own eyes, though. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
- I've found jamming or so.
- 1895 Fairfield on patent
- 1895 or around by Ottolengui on mystery novel
- Clashing as a problem.
- 1868 or Sholes & fellows as interfere patent
- 1875 Jenne & Clough patent
- 1878 Sholes patent
- 1888 Barron patent
still writing | |
Type-basket arrangement historically comming next to "A to Z" order.
Ordinary story says,
And this is why Darryl Rehr (DR) says
the Sholes hand-made prototypes dating prior to 1872 or so!
Yahoo! Groups
They should be in "A to Z" order, while the machine had a keyboard of two-banks, on both of keyboard and type-basket.
There is some possibility.
As I said,
NO;DE;ST;HI;TU;OP;RS;AB;EF are the frequent adjacent pairs, if typebars in order of "A to Z" on basket.
NO;DE;ST;HI;TU;OP;RS;AB;EFare the most frequent bigrams,if typebar in alphabet
Yahoo! Groups
Reading ”The Truth”: alphabetical order nexting bigram frequency in bar chart
At first, one letter of the pairs should move at least, or both on some pairs.
NO;DE; ST ;HI;TU ;OP;RS;AB;EF O, E,rSTu, I,(U), AorB, O, E, ST , I, U , B,
These might be targeted on to move at first.
And if the typewriter keep having two-banks of keyboard, then what happen?
And the keyboard have numberkeys..or not..
maybe
QWE.TYIUO-
U
2 4 6 8 .
OESTI are especially frequent target.
O, E, ST , I, U , B,
Switch S with B in position?
Then OETIU are the most? ?? not this...
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Nick>Probably a case of an academic reading to much into a comparatively simple question with lots of empirical evidence, if he cared to look at an old typewriter?
I support your probable casing mostly, but if he would have read just only a patent:
- TYPE-WRITING MACHINE
- JOHN M. FAIRFIELD
- Patent number: 566302
- Filing date: Nov 16, 1895
- Issue date: Aug 25, 1896
http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=ibJnAAAAEBAJ
Patent US566302 - TYPE-WRITING MACHINE - Google Patents
That writes "preventing the accidental jamming""together of two type-bars" with upstrike machine drawing in 1895.
Without touching and even seeing the upstrikes, on documents of mainly on patent, I might have found some JAMMING and CLASHING as a problem.
http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110115/1295022472
I suppose you might be a man who collaborate with him APKY*1..
academic reading vs. empirical evidence
http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110114/1294966186
~rj
still writing | |
Jay>I've not heard any mention of the factor of inconsistency of touch.
Jay>
Jay>I bet the only thing that saved the machines existence was that, regardless of
all the inconsistencies, speed and legibility increased enough over that of
handwriting that people were willing to put up with it.
Yahoo! Groups
Might you want to say with fulfilling all the controvarcial things and braking through with balance , or so?
raycy @ wiki - The Psychology Of Everyday Things”fit all the constraints that worked” - Google ????The Psychology Of Everyday Things Donald A. Norman - p.145:
"THE TYPEWRITER: A CASE HISTORY IN THE EVOLUTION OF DESIGN "
Among all the mechanical inventions for which the age is noted, none, perhaps, has more rapidly comeinto general use than the typewriter
The time is coming when it will almost, or quite as much, supersede the steel pen as that has the good, gray goose quill. "3
The history of the typewriter is the story of dedicated inventorsin many countries, each striving to develop a machine for rapid writing .
They tried many versions in their struggle to get the one that fit all the constraints-that worked, could be manufactured at reasonable cost, and could be used
Amazon.co.jp： The Psychology Of Everyday Things: Donald A. Norman: 洋書
Possibility of typebar clashes to re-arrange typebar series.
It is not the only reason
Sholes & Glidden Type-writer Questions; and models in Smithsonian - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Jay>all the inconsistencies, speed and legibility increased enough over that of
handwriting
Yahoo! Groups
"two typebars between the t and h bars"? Out of Dickerson's regularity? - The actuality on - QWERTY history
I've never used the word "legibility". Sounds good to use..
Early typewriters might be introduced instead of the penman, so legibility is one of the important point, I see.
~rj
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Page not found | American History Lives at American Heritage
Sholes and Glidden typewriter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Revision as of 21:10, 29 September 2009 Revision as of 21:14, 29 September 2009 Elcobbola Elcobbola The consequent increase in correspondence created a need to compose messages clearly and expeditiously.[23] The consequent increase in correspondence created a need to compose legible messages expeditiously.[23] [23]MacKenzie, I. Scott, et. al. (2007) 6–7. Text Entry Systems: Mobility, Accessibility, Universality. Academic Press. ISBN 0123735912
Sholes and Glidden typewriter: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Revision as of 19:43, 5 October 2009 Revision as of 15:00, 6 October 2009 Elcobbola Elcobbola Shorthand, although capable of being written quickly, required special training to comprehend. The typewriter addressed both the need of speed and legibility. When legibility was important, a typesetter would be employed—a slow and expensive process. The typewriter was successful because it simultaneously addressed both issues.[36] [36]Campbell-Kelly, Martin (2005). "The User-friendly Typewriter". The Rutherford Journal (University of Canterbury) 1.
Sholes and Glidden typewriter: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaPrehistory
The first commercially successful typewriter was the Remington No. 1, first sold in 1874. This was, in fact, about the fiftieth writing machine to be invented, but it was the first to achieve commercial success because it solved both of the critical problems in writing machine design—the legibility of typescript and the speed of operation.
The Rutherford Journal - The New Zealand Journal for the History and Philosophy of Science and Technology
legibile OR legibility Sholes & Glidden - Google Search
still writing | |
Mr. Traub was an eight-finger typist on Caligraph No.2 (not Calligraph) as I mentioned before.
The Truth of QWERTY
Is there any evidence to show us that Traub is an eight-finger operator of Caligraph No.2?
Wouldn't you mind to show us where the evidence is ?
So my partner, in life as well as in business, thought and realized, when, in transferring our Shorthand and Typewriter Institute to our successor, Mr. Wagner, our pupils called upon us, with their floral tributes, and spoke their kind words of good-bye, saying they were so sorry to part with us, and how they would miss us in the school room.
QWERTY People Archive
It says Wagner as successor of Longley's.
Is Japanese article, you APKY wrote as:
2006 , April, 09
Longley's Shorthand and Type-writer Institute in Cincinnati transformed to successor. Longley's disciple of Wagner and Traub
シンシナティのLongley's Shorthand and Type-writer Instituteの経営は弟子のWilliam H. WagnerとLouis Traubに託されていた。
1888年7月25日のタイピング・コンテスト | yasuokaの日記 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
You say Wagner as disciple of Longley, how about Traub?
Is Traub a pupile of Mrs. Longley? or only Wagner you mean, and not Traub? or both? Which do you mean?
Did Traub and Mrs. Longley have personal direct communication?
Is it sure Traub use Longley's method at Caligraph No.2?
Did Wagner and Traub make partnership?
google:now and for some time past conducted by Messrs. Jack & Traub
QWERTY People Archive
On Japanese articles and on your book published, you say Traub as touch-typist or typist with touch-method or currently so-called touch-typist.
Why don't you say touch-typist on this site "The truth of QWERTY" ? and say eight-finger or something?
2005 ,June, 10
Louis Traub who operate 'Caligraph No.2' with touch method
『Caligraph No.2』をタッチメソッドで操るLouis Traub
19世紀のタイプライター | yasuokaの日記 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
2006 , April, 09
Louis Traub who touch-type at Caligraph No.2
Caligraph No.2をタッチタイプで操るLouis Traub
1888年7月25日のタイピング・コンテスト | yasuokaの日記 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
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In 1888 Mr. Louis Traub was a principal of Longley's Shorthand and Typewriting Institute, Cincinnati (cf. "The Challenge Accepted", The Cosmopolitan Shorthander, Vol.9, No.6 (June 1888), p.155). He had been an eight-finger typist on Caligraph No.2 since Mrs. Longley moved to Los Angeles in May, 1885 (cf. "Elias Longley's Farewell", The Cosmopolitan Shorthander, Vol.6, No.11 (November 1885), p.200). Mr. Traub did not challenge Mrs. Longley, but he vindicated her eight-finger method.
The Truth of QWERTY
Did Traub become in 1885 without contact with Mrs.Longley?
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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I've understood you APKY*1 so good quality-full perfect English writer too much enough judging from watching your writings and readings,
so I wonder why you go talk in TYPEWRITERS@yahoogroups.com with about something you searching or so.
As Darryl Rehr might say,
If you are interested in Early Typewriters, the best place to participate in group discussions is via the TYPEWRITER E-MAIL LIST. To visit, click
You can join and post messages, questions or whatnot... or you can lurk and just read all the fun stuff. Either way, you will be welcome.
--Darryl Rehr, Editor Emeritus
ETCetera
TYPEWRITERS@yahoogroups.com is one of the biggest and most active talking group of these on the earth of the web.
There should be a man you've collaborated with :
I understand that the said academic, whom I believe was interviewed by Stephen
Fry on 'Fry's English Delight' (BBC Radio 4) which I also talked in also
...
Probably a case of an academic reading to much into a comparatively simple question with lots of
empiracle evidence, if he cared to look at an old typewriter?
Nick
Yahoo! Groups
I think he misunderstood of yourAPKY's something. You APKY've been acquainted with those alternation of "l" for "1" used to be in those days with, for sure. And I suppose you have tested typing of some antiques of those.
But I wonder if you APKY have tried typing enough to say something about jamming.
rj>I little bit wonder if "never jam" had happened while a true human-being typing enough to say something at those typewriters, as you mention, mini-mini minee wonder.
rj>For your convenience, I'll attach a tag to the testimony, affirming the existence of the "jam".
rj> * http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47833
Yahoo! Groups
By the way, what does he mean by these:
Probably a case of an academic reading to much into a comparatively simple question with lots of empirical evidence,
Yahoo! Groups
I can feel the meaning in vague though.. I should have get translated in Japanese.. or rewrite some..
too much readings for too deep into things fitting solved in empirical not by readings.
I feel sympathy with Nick as he looks on APKY's thinking ways like as with too much reasoning-will.
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Hmm? Had deleted already? Might be a spectre*2..
To something spectre of comment sent from so-to-say "KoichiYasuoka"at 2011/01/12 11:08 : - The actuality on - QWERTY historyraycy’s fotolife - http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110112/1294799943
I've experienced something like this once ever, when citing sayings at Marx of something..
To something spectre of comment sent from so-to-say "KoichiYasuoka"at 2011/01/12 11:08 : - The actuality on - QWERTY history
安岡孝一先生のご研究ぶりには,つい目を剥かせられちゃった?(バ冠拝領)似たふるまいがマルクスにあったし私にもあろう。失礼、久方ぶりにコメントをいただいていたようなのだが、ブログをちょこっと書き換えているうちに、なぜか消えちゃってました。せっかくのコメントなのに、葉仮名raycy - KliologYあちきこちとらの手違いで消えたのか、投稿者ご自身で消したのか、。まあ、 安岡孝一氏あるいは一般KYの中のマルクス的論難手順 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
When I was writing here, I thought around here "of whom" or just write "what", those are XXX or ○○○, in here the name of a person's and his web site in here. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*2：spectre specter http://thesaurus.com/browse/specter http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/archive?word=spectre
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Neither whatever you may intend to, nor not , TYPEWRITERS watch you. - The actuality on - QWERTY historyraycy said...
I little bit wonder if "never jam" had happened while a true human-being typing enough to say something at those typewriters, as you mention, mini-mini minee wonder.
For your convenience, I'll attach a tag to the
testificationtestimony, affirming the existence of the "jam".
I've just sent a comment to the Japanese blog too, there you'd testified that S&G (and Rem2 also) do not jam,for letting things go smooth.
- http://kunio.sblo.jp/article/38767446.html#comment
- comment that Posted by raycy at 2011.Jan. 10 14:10
Monday, January 10, 2011 3:10:00 PM
The Truth of QWERTY
Jam reporters of three of them. People who say CLASHING is also a problem: DR,Peter,,, - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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"Never jam" exists in Japen under below APKY*2, not in US.
"Never jam" happens in Japen under APKY, not in US.
"Never jam" have been informed since around 2005 through APKY but in Japen, not in US or other.
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What's the difference between US and Jp.? Having APKY*3 or not.
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On documents I've found some jamming, even I've nener seen upstrike.
Accidental jamming had occurred in 1895 in patent documentary of upstrike machine. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
On Caligraph 2, i & z of typebars adjacent? - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Patent US79868 - IMPROVEMENT IN TYPE-WRITING MACHINES - Google Patents
”when the collision is released” - Google Search
”less liable to collide” type-bars - Google Search
How is Rehr's revision? "adjacent typebar is the matter." Barron might think so. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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I suppose to have known when the jamming increased sudden, that time, Underwood took with QWERTY for front-strike.
Stickney's patent filed in 1904 says.
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Raycy, you should talk other topics at other places. In this post I argued against Dr. George Tilghman Richards about the fable of Mr. Amos Densmore. Wednesday, January 12, 2011 4:47:00 PM http://yasuoka.blogspot.com/2011/01/this-typewriter-is-one-of-those.html#c6377100118177263991
Because of Darryl Rehr saying at this article, it should be the right place here to attach this comment.
Let's talk about:
>"the Sholes hand-made prototypes dating prior to 1872 or so!"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47769
Before the layout on Sientific American 1872, after alphabetical "A" to "Z" almost straight order begining to get rearranged.
Not after 1873, if you want say the origine of the QWERTYs..
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*2： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*3： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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On Caligraph 2, i & z of typebars adjacent?
I've read a short part of some paragraphs of mystery novel,
' A SINGULAR ABDUCTION ' a story in a book of"Final Proof", page 141 .by Rodrigues Ottolengui
http://manybooks.net/pages/ottolenguirother09FINAL_PROOF/141.html
It says :
I felt certain that this letter had been written upon a Caligraph. In that machine the bar which carries the letter 'i' is next to that which carries the letter 'z.'
I felt certain that this letter had been written upon a Caligraph. In that machine the bar which carries the letter ’i’ is next to that which carries the letter ’z.’ - Google ????
It is not an uncommon thing when a typewriter is out of order for two bars to fail to pass one another.
It is not an uncommon thing when a typewriter is out of order for two bars to fail to pass one another. - Google ????
Are they sure to be adjacent?
Final Proof, page 141 A SINGULAR ABDUCTION .by Rodrigues Ottolengui
i & z , An example of an adjacent pair of typebars on Caligraph 2 - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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I'm in presenting side, he's in "presented and not refute and never modify" side.
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Koichi Yasuoka said...
Sorry, raycy, I cannot understand what you meant in your word-salad-spam comments at all. Anyway in this post on May 14, 2009, I had argued against Prof. Stanley Coren, not for/against Prof. Peter M. Weil or someone else.
Wednesday, January 12, 2011 9:19:00 AM
The Truth of QWERTY
This is usual way of his. To make argument to aiming at a very small point of mistake of the whole statement what the auther like Coren wanted to say or something. Up or front? Not might be VERY small, though.. hawwwh..
APKY*1 deleted my comments to link to all the three of yours of S&G-got-jammed-testimony..
Here is one of the "your(means 'my', rj's) word-salad-spam comments" that "I(APKY) cannot understand at all"
<\del>
raycy said...
I little bit wonder if "never jam" had happened while a true human-being typing enough to say something at those typewriters, as you mention, mini-mini minee wonder.
For your convenience, I'll attach a tag to thetestificationtestimony, affirming the existence of the "jam".
I've just sent a comment to the Japanese blog too, there you'd testified that S&G (and Rem2) do not jam,for letting things go smooth.
Monday, January 10, 2011 3:10:00 PM Page not found
- http://kunio.sblo.jp/article/38767446.html#comment
- comment that Posted by raycy at 2011.Jan. 10 14:10
He looks to have made up his mind not to hear any almost, (in English).
The comment I've tried to send to , this time:
Wouldn't you mind to remember this:
Neither whatever you may intend to, nor not , people in TYPEWRITERS@yahoogroups.com watch you.
I tried to send a comment to :
Blogger says "Post a comment," and I tried, and it says:
So, I(rj)'m not a member of the team of APKY, you see , was proven? and,
I'm in presenting side of evidences, he's in "presented and not refute and never modify" side.
~rj
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APKY*2 vs, TYPEWRITERS@yahoogroups.com ?
Neither whatever you may intend to, nor not , TYPEWRITERS watch you. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
To something spectre of comment sent from so-to-say "KoichiYasuoka"at 2011/01/12 11:08 : - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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For your covinience of watching here, I wonder if to be or not, I'll try to translate downer comment supposed to be of APKY*3's, later on.
KoichiYasuoka 2011/01/12 11:08
まだわからないのか。「strike a person」の意味は「誰々を殴りつける」だぞ。Prof. Peter M. Weilに対してそんな失礼なコメントを書くのは、いったいどういう料簡なんだ？
- (I rj am trying to translate APKY's comment above from Japanese to English..)
Haven't you understand ever? "Strike a person" means "hit at or batter someone as boxers do." Why do you(rj) write such rude comments to Professor Peter M. Weil (PW), with you rj's thought of what?
2011-01-12 - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Hmm? Had deleted already? Might be a spectre..
raycy’s fotolife - http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110112/1294799943
I've experienced something like this once ever, when citing sayings at Marx of something..
安岡孝一先生のご研究ぶりには,つい目を剥かせられちゃった?(バ冠拝領)似たふるまいがマルクスにあったし私にもあろう。失礼、久方ぶりにコメントをいただいていたようなのだが、ブログをちょこっと書き換えているうちに、なぜか消えちゃってました。せっかくのコメントなのに、葉仮名raycy - KliologYあちきこちとらの手違いで消えたのか、投稿者ご自身で消したのか、。まあ、 安岡孝一氏あるいは一般KYの中のマルクス的論難手順 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
How can you keep your blog and arguments interactive with your blog setting in :
"Comments on this blog are restricted to team members."
Neither whatever you may intend to, nor not , TYPEWRITERS watch you. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
And what for the blog is? Web v1.0? or ealier..
Koichi Yasuoka said...
Sorry, raycy, I cannot understand what you meant in your word-salad-spam comments at all. Anyway in this post on May 14, 2009, I had argued against Prof. Stanley Coren, not for/against Prof. Peter M. Weil or someone else.
Wednesday, January 12, 2011 9:19:00 AM
The Truth of QWERTY
PW says ,:
The Truth of QWERTYPeter Weilにどやされ、Darryl Rehrに諭される、、なんで こちとらがあ、、濡れ衣だ ぁぁあぁぁあー - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYPeter Weilは何といっているのかな？ 誰に対して、。 こちとらに？それとも Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka ie. APKYに？ - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYWed Jan 5, 2011
What strikes me is that no matter what evidence is presented you, you make no modification to your argument or what you are primarily arguing on your web site. This would be alright if you refuted the evidence presented to you, but you do not. You just keep repeating the same thing.
Peter
Yahoo! GroupsI wonder of whom have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? Which one do you think?
What have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? - The actuality on - QWERTY history
PW says ,"his" assertions (Can we say it as arguments? when in in-interactive..) on the web site there, are fixed as they were written from the beginning of the articles , and haven't been changed or modified any. Many evidences were shown to "him," , "he" does not refute them but ignore and delete sometimes. Keeping the same thing.
Who is "he?"
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To TQ Tuesday, January 11, 2011: http://yasuoka.blogspot.com/2011/01/this-typewriter-is-one-of-those.html
Let's talk about :
"the Sholes hand-made prototypes dating prior to 1872 or so!"
Yahoo! Groups
Let's talk about:
>"the Sholes hand-made prototypes dating prior to 1872 or so!"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47769
Before the layout on Sientific American 1872, after alphabetical "A" to "Z" almost straight order begining to get rearranged.
Not after 1873, if you want say the origine of the QWERTYs..
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I've just seen your truth when I could see my comment of upper,
you might have just changed your blog setting for comments,
it reads, just say,
"This blog does not allow anonymous comments. "
Blogger: The Truth of QWERTY - Post a Comment
Oops, it deponds on article each?
This blog does not allow anonymous comments.
Comment moderation has been enabled. All comments must be approved by the blog author.
Blogger: The Truth of QWERTY - Post a Comment
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>:title>
Koichi Yasuoka said...
Raycy, you should talk other topics at other places. In this post I argued against Dr. George Tilghman Richards.
Wednesday, January 12, 2011 4:40:00 PM
>"the Sholes hand-made prototypes dating prior to 1872 or so!"
Yahoo! Groups
This citing is from DR's, that is DR writen concerning to this article, but I feel it generaly can say to your arguings,
but, you may not agree, because of the Japanese article of year nubmer analisys.
there you say the first typewriter to commercial in the world is S&G,
and rearranging things happen to be started there.. but seems oddly conflicting with the other your articles..
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This blog does not allow anonymous comments.
Comment moderation has been enabled. All comments must be approved by the blog author.
Blogger: The Truth of QWERTY - Post a Comment
Deleted again.
>:title>
raycy said...
I've just seen your truth when I could see my comment of upper,
you might have just changed your blog setting for comments,
it reads, just say,
>"This blog does not allow anonymous comments. "
Wednesday, January 12, 2011 4:23:00 PM
He ocnce said "He APKY hates APKY's own comments deleted off from some blog, of this ,, or something blaablaa.."
apjの『Is it illegal-access？』で議論していたところ、いきなり同ページを白紙化される、ということが起こった。
同ページに書いた私のコメント26個が、全て白紙になるというのは、私(安岡孝一APKY)としてはかなりイヤなので、ここに記録しておくことにする。
Re: 不正アクセス禁止法違反？ | yasuokaの日記 | スラッシュドット・ジャパン
still writing | |
When I was writing here, I thought around here "of whom" or just write "what", those are XXX or ○○○, in here the name of a person's and his web site in here.
The Truth of QWERTYPeter Weilにどやされ、Darryl Rehrに諭される、、なんで こちとらがあ、、濡れ衣だ ぁぁあぁぁあー - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYPeter Weilは何といっているのかな？ 誰に対して、。 こちとらに？それとも Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka ie. APKYに？ - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYWed Jan 5, 2011
What strikes me is that no matter what evidence is presented you, you make no modification to your argument or what you are primarily arguing on your web site. This would be alright if you refuted the evidence presented to you, but you do not. You just keep repeating the same thing.
Peter
Yahoo! GroupsI wonder of whom have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? Which one do you think?
What have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? - The actuality on - QWERTY history
PW says about"do-not-modified arguments and the web sites",
so I've sent PW a question
Thu Jan 6, 2011
Re: on your web site. you make no modification
Which web site do you mean?
I'm raycy. Mine? or other's?
Yahoo! Groups
which I haven't recieved the answer yet.
Then I've asked to you , is that your web site , or my web site ? Which one do you think?
Your web site? or my web site? yours or mine,
What do you think?
Which web site do you think?
Whose web site do you think?
Of whom do you think?
KoichiYasuoka 2011/01/12 17:03
今日のエントリにコメントすると、いきなり削除されてしまうようなので、こっちに書いておく。http://yasuoka.blogspot.com /2009/05/with-older-manual-typewriters-each.html の「I wonder of whom have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours?」ってコメントは何のつもりだ。どう読んでも「一体全体、誰を殴りつけたんだいピーターウェイルは、ウチの身内かオマエんとこの身内か？」としか読めない。そんな失礼なコメントを書いていくような人間には、私は金輪際まともに相手する気はない。
- (I rj am trying to translate APKY's comment above from Japanese to English..)
You rj seems to delete my comments suddenly if I(APKY) send to articles for today, I(APKY) comment to old article here.
What is your perpouse to say like this:
I wonder of whom have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours?
What have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? - The actuality on - QWERTY historyI(APKY) can take only one meaning,
"What's up?
- To whom of eather family Peter Weil had struck?
- Of which family Peter had hit to? of your family or of my family?
- Which family of member Peter had hit to? of your family or of my family?
- To whom Had Peter Weil struck of ether family? of my family? or of your family?
- At whom Had Peter Weil struck of ether family? of my family? or of your family?
Whose family of whom had PW struck either? my family of whom or your family of whom?
What a rude commet you put out.
I will never treat you as a humanbing ever.
2011-01-09 - The actuality on - QWERTY history
It sounds bit funny to me that you've said.. I haven't intended to delete your comments, though..
I can remember just only one comment of yours I'm still pending to be public, in that comment you sent there is a name which you supposed me to be, I'm not sure that was right or not..
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Thanks for your kind suggestion you gave me with, wouldn't you read my sentences above posted at Sunday, January 09, 2011 11:25:00 AM , with changing done?
Please replace and change and read as follows:
<\del>striked<\/del> ---> struck
<\del>of whom<\/del> ---> whose ( argument or what primarily arguing on his web site )
What have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours?
I wonder if whose (argument or arguing primarily on its web site) have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? Which do you think?
Or both of us?
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*2： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*3： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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APKY*1 assert O U adjacency by only one "evidence". Even if taking it, it does't mean the keyboard had four banks automatically.
It could be two banks or three banks or four banks..
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I've not owned S&G ever, I haven't touched ever, I've never even seen it with my eyes.
Talking about jamming of upstrike machine,
Accidental jamming had occurred in 1895 in patent documentary of upstrike machine.
I found a patent to show us there should be "jamming" occurred as problem to prevent.
There were the accidental jamming together of two typebars. or Anti Yasuoka maze, Anti Yasuoka's illogic - The actuality on - QWERTY history”preventing the accidental jamming””together of two type-bars” - Google SearchPatent US566302 - TYPE-WRITING MACHINE - Google Patents
In the year of 1895, Fairfield proposed a patent to prevent accidental jamming together of typebars , we can know it for upstrike machine because of the drawings of upstrike machine with.
The way was inter-locking neighboring keys from current ascending not to move and wait.
It may be also a solution to target on neighboring key? typebar?
CLASHING was a problem for Barron in his patent filed in 1888, and he wrote about adjacent, adjacent accending typebars.
How is Rehr's revision? "adjacent typebar is the matter." Barron might think so. - The actuality on - QWERTY history必ずぶつかるといっているんではない。Sholes「less liable to collide」、Barron"apt to""possibility"FAIRFIELD「the accidental jamming together of two type-bars」 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYBARRON「not be apt to collide with an adjacent ascending type-bar」
W. J. BARRON「type-bar」 「the longer arm of the type-bar」「type-arm」「type lever」Patented May 26, 1891.Filing date: Sep 26, 1888 Issue date: May 26, 1891 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
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Main story say
adding year number
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
still writing | |
In April 1870 he arrived at a four-row, upper case keyboard approaching the modern QWERTY standard, moving six vowels, A, E, I, O, U, and Y, to the upper row as follows:[7]
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 - A E I . ? Y U O , B C D F G H J K L M Z X W V T S R Q P N[7] Koichi and Motoko Yasuoka: Myth of QWERTY Keyboard, Tokyo: NTT Publishing, 2008. pp.24-25 http://books.google.com/books?id=tEsAMggMKoMC&pg=PA20
QWERTY - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
If so,
the key layout determining process had already begun that time, and it's in 1870 or ealyer.
Then why you APKY can say thought of Sholes and fellows' decision makings at 1870, by explaining or analizing of typewriters of 1880s?
We have to suppose the liability of clashing or jamming on the machine in 1870 or earlyer.
You also have to discuss the difference of clashability or jammability between having keyboard of two-banks and four-banks.
still writing | |
Re: Jam vs. not collector of testifying S&G or so: three to one, now
Yahoo! Groups
" - " means no reports so far.
| name | on prototype | S&G | Rem2 | RemStd2 | upstrike general |
| Darryl Rehr(have owned four of S&G) | maybe jammy more | jam | still jam(, still. far less though) | - | jam . They don't jam in 1880s is OK, but not never. (lesser on models as later on the year) |
| Peter Weil | jam | - | - | - | |
| APKY*2 | Nnneeeever | not or not ever | not or not ever | not or not ever | never or at least in 1880s http://yasuoka.blogspot.com/2009/05/with-older-manual-typewriters-each.html |
| lb | jam | jam | jam | "And it doesn't matter if they're S&G, Remington, Densmore,Caligraph or Smith Premier, they clash and get tangled up and neither G-d nor Darwin can do a thing about it." http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47815 | |
| line for someore else | jam | jam | jam | jam | |
| line for someore else | jam | jam | jam | jam | |
| line for someore else | jam | jam | jam | jam |
still writing | |
Who had spoken general with only "one evidence", is not only me but also...
Who'd insisted only "one evidence" for general with, is not only me but also...
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And he is who wrote quite different of'QWERTY revisited' from Rehr's, independently.
Two of 'QWERTY revisited' by Rehr/Yasuoka saying to Dickerson's proof different
And their saying tones are different:
Koichi Yasuoka’QWERTY Revisited'(2005） vs. Darryl Rehr'QWERTY REVISITED or revisited'(1997) concerning to Dickerson(1989) - The actuality on - QWERTY historyTwo of 'QWERTY revisited' by Rehr/Yasuoka say Dickerson different - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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jammable jamlous jamilus jammilus jamulous jamos jammmm.....mmm mu..
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I little bit wonder if "never jam" had happened while a true human-being typing enough to say something at those typewriters, as you mention, mini-mini minee wonder.
For your convenience, I'll attach a tag to the testification, affirming the existence of the "jam".
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47833
I've just sent a comment to the Japanese blog too, there you'd testified that S&G do not jam, for letting things go smooth.
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Thanks to all of you, I could send a messege to the "never jam" article with three of "jam" affirmative testification.
http://yasuoka.blogspot.com/2009/05/with-older-manual-typewriters-each.html#c3849670147015158153
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Jay>By the way, on my Rem 7, there are two typebars between the t and h bars.
Yahoo! Groups
Do you have Remington Standard Typewriter No. 7 ， as on the video following, you mean for Rem 7 ?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IS0PYl3TIEo&feature=player_embedded
I wonder, "two typebars between the t and h bars"?, because it seems far out of Dickerson's regularity or Yasuoka's observation sketch.
Don't you mean type-levers in stead of typebars? If not, it's interesting.
Because I'm wanting to draw type-basket history as jamming lessening history. or tried some.
Dickerson's writings or Sholes patent 1881 apply. says.
Dickerson says T and H on almost far opposite side of type-basket of S&G.
Let's see Dickerson's drawings of S&G:
Sholes and Glidden type basket. The original letter arrangement around the basket was:
where * represents a number or a punctuation mark. The lower two rows of the keyboard alternate along the half of the type basket nearest the operator, from left to right, and the upper two keyboard rows alternate in a similar manner around the back rim of the basket. -- Richard E. Dickerson: "Did Sholes and Densmore Know What They Were Doing When They Designed Their Keyboard?", ETCetera, No.6 (February 1989), pp.6-9.
The Truth of QWERTY
Let's see mine of the same thing:
博物館所蔵ショールズ・アンド・グリデン・タイプ・ライター安岡孝一氏観察タイプバスケット共通配置で検討 - 霊犀社２
multiple lemma
balance and breaking through
Norman says
legibility
about typing speed
Porter who had been using the typewriter of Soule & Densmore's scince 1868,
he had tested 25 to 50 of typewriters half of each prototyped
(I'm not sure to read what the original document say.)
in autumn 1872
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*2： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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A spectre is haunting Japan ― the spectre of "Upstrike(generalｌy? or in 1880s?) never, S&G and Rem2 NOT jam." - The actuality on - QWERTY history
With "at least", he narrows the targeting,
and this is his exceptionally weak expression than his usually having done,
and most of stronger expressions have written in Japanese,
very often he kindly comes to each sites or blogs to assert his theory,
Re: 安岡孝一 (安岡孝一) 2007-07-09 18:50:17
ん？ 呼びました？ それとも私とは別の「安岡孝一」さんのことかな？ 安岡孝一 - 霊犀社２
His usual strong expressions mean GENERALY up-strike machine's typebars do not jam.
| possible trasnlation to English from original Japanese | sounds of jp | original Japanese expression |
| do not jam | karamanai. | 絡まない。 |
| do not jam ever (It is slitely containing mind that arguing like"jam" on upstrike is nonsence.) | karandarishinai. | 絡んだりしない。 |
Additionally, he APKY doesn't mind CLASHING as problem to make "developer Sholes or fellow"'s mind determine rearranging typebars.
So, his "jam" never contains the meaning of "CLASHING" at most, that is him what I've understood.
And APKY says that
in the prototype era of "developing Sholes & the fellows" before massproduction model manufactured in late 1873 or so,
because the final relation between keys and typebars are desined by Jenne or "Cough or so" of Remington engineers,
there are almost no relation between key layout and typebar arrangement, (differ than mass-models),
so if typebars in trouble, they could only change typebar arrangement, without any affection to key layout means having never to change key arrangement.
His "NO RELATION" evidences are
He have reported typebar arrangement of two S&Gs in
Those are not prototype but (after) (mass-?)production models, though.
博物館所蔵ショールズ・アンド・グリデン・タイプ・ライター安岡孝一氏観察タイプバスケット共通配置で検討 - 霊犀社２
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During I (rj raycy.japan there in yahoo.groups) am talking with at TYPEWRITERS.yahoo.groups, received some comment.
I had once communicated with Peter Weil some weeks ago before this time.
Wed Nov 24, 2010
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47197
Peter Weil "So, yes, they could and did jam. Beyond this, if they were not perfectly positioned on the ends. ""In addition, the alignment on the S&G easily gets messed up in a position. ""Use and vibration made clashes a mor
Now, this time..
Peter Weilにどやされ、Darryl Rehrに諭される、、なんで こちとらがあ、、濡れ衣だ ぁぁあぁぁあー - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYPeter Weilは何といっているのかな？ 誰に対して、。 こちとらに？それとも Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka ie. APKYに？ - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYWed Jan 5, 2011
What strikes me is that no matter what evidence is presented you, you make no modification to your argument or what you are primarily arguing on your web site. This would be alright if you refuted the evidence presented to you, but you do not. You just keep repeating the same thing.
Peter
Yahoo! Groups
I wonder of whom whose(argument or arguing primarily on its web site going on without any modification under without any refutations to evidences presented to it) have struck Peter Weil, mine or yours? Which one do you think?
Or both of us?
still writing | |
cf.A spectre is haunting Europe ― the spectre of: In Japanese in stead of spectre, ghost or monster is into there.
still writing | |
Typewriters in the 1880s with QWERTY keyboard had typebars to swing up to hit the back of paper.
The Truth of QWERTY
I may explain for some readers why you APKY*2 say "the typewriters in 1880s with QWERTY" while talking about key layout determing process.
On your historical time table, QWERTY keys of alphabetical letters is fixed at 1882.
This is why you bring out 1882, I gess.
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Two couple of hundreds of S&Gs are estimated existing from a Darryl Rehr's web page, one of them is at Kikutake college in Nagoya Japan.
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*2： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*3： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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To cite this article:
Koichi YASUOKA. “QWERTY Revisited”. Journal of Information Processing and Management. Vol. 48, No. 2, (2005), 115-118 .
ERROR
Yasuoka wrote 'QWERTY Revisited'(2005)
and he said not other Japanese than He had surveyed bunch of academic results until very recent that time, and cited Dickerson's work(1989).
And accused others citing ancient theory older than 20 years ago like:
The theory given numeric liable denying proof at some of the work that Dickerson(1989) done in it, had got a proposal to revise from Darryl Rehr'QWERTY REVISITED or revisited'(1997).
http://www.aquaporin4.com/etcetera/ETC.38.pdf
http://home.earthlink.net/~ajrehr/archive.html
タイトルかぶっちゃった？、、単なる偶然なんでしょうかね、たぶん、。The twos of the "QWERTY revisited", one on ETCetera(Mar. 1997だっけか) , the other on(2005). （英語タイトル、変えといたほうがよかったのではないかな、、それともリスペクト、トリビ
- 1997 Mar. : No. 38 - Mar. '97 - QWERTY revisited,ETCetera No. 38 - Mar. '97 -
- 2005 May. : Koichi Yasuoka: "QWERTY Revisited", Journal of Information Processing and Management, Vol.48, No.2 (May 2005), pp.115-118)
- 安岡 孝一. “QWERTY配列再考”. 情報管理. Vol. 48, No. 2, (2005), 115-118 .
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Nick>whom I believe was interviewed by Stephen Fry on 'Fry's English Delight' (BBC Radio 4)
Yahoo! Groups
Ya, he is who, APKY*1:
He is who says "upstrike (generaly? or in 1880s?) never, S&G and Rem-2 not jam" and aired on? BBC Radio 4. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
He has collected bunch of docs academic or non-, at Musiam of GB UK or at Milwaukee US or to-and-fro..
that makes things more bothersome..
And synsethizing his all experiences, he concludes:
A spectre is haunting Japan ― the spectre of "Upstrike(generalｌy? or in 1880s?) never, S&G and Rem2 NOT jam." - The actuality on - QWERTY history
In Japan, typebars never jam, cause of few up-strikers, especialy few S&Ger.. One of reasoning, maybe..
wanna say Darwin modified or even abandoned, some web site never ever.
I(rj) sometimes modify my articles.,, like a Darwin :)
Darwin modified greatly. And you don't.. Who are "YOU"? me? or someone else.. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Israel Houghton - Just Wanna Say Lyrics and Video
Madonna - Like A Virgin (video) - YouTube
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Two of 'QWERTY revisited' by Rehr/Yasuoka saying to Dickerson's proof different
And their saying tones are different:
Koichi Yasuoka’QWERTY Revisited'(2005） vs. Darryl Rehr'QWERTY REVISITED or revisited'(1997) concerning to Dickerson(1989) - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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ショールズの「Ｉ（アイ）のうつろい」
①プロトタイプ機１８７２年 ＞＞②いわゆる製品初号系＞＞③ショールズ後年の改善配置
７ ８ ９ ① ② ③raycy @ wiki - タイプライターの1900年問題？ ショールズの“Ｉ”のうつろい
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I think jamming theory means that mechanical restriction was.
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On Yasuoka's definition, QWERTY had done and fixed at 1882 of Rem std2. which places XC and M the same as current.
We may say so. But ..
Uuummm... That's too late enough.. to think about the departing point from prototype to mass-pro.
*1： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
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like
Which do you believe? : Rehr's recognition. vs. experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka, ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO. - The actuality on - QWERTY historyTypewriters in the 1880s with QWERTY keyboard had typebars to swing up to hit the back of paper. They are called upstrike typewriters and their typebars never jam.
The Truth of QWERTY
experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka
Which do you believe? : Rehr's recognition. vs. experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka, ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO. - The actuality on - QWERTY history私個人の経験になるのですが、少なくともSholes & Glidden Type-WriterやRemington Type-Writer No.2の「活字棒」(typebar)は、絡んだりはしないのです。そりゃ同時に押したら「活字棒」が衝突することはあるんですが、いわゆる jammingは起きない。ですので、「活字棒が絡まる」っていう時点で、それはすでにフロントストライク式なんじゃないかと。
Posted by 安岡孝一 at 2010年06月13日 15:10
『キーボード配列QWERTYの謎』安岡孝一・安岡素子著、NTT出版: テクニカルライターKの日常Google 翻訳（My id:raycy's translation with free machinery）
Speaking by my experience,I can say,My ( APKY*2 ) personal experience can't stop me speaking,
at least, typebars of 'Sholes & Glidden Type-Writer' and 'Remington Type-Writer No.2' do not tangle ever.
If pressing multiple keys simultaneously, typebars may conflict,
off*3 of course. But the jamming does not occur on typebar, or typebars do not jam.So I think when talking about the phenomenon "typebars are entwined", it might mean front-strike typewriter story .
Posted by Koichi Yasuoka June 13, 2010 at 15:10
Peter Weilにどやされ、Darryl Rehrに諭される、、なんで こちとらがあ、、濡れ衣だ ぁぁあぁぁあー - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
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Darwin, Peter Weil, Koichi Yasuoka, (or to me?) - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Peter Weil points out "your" or "someone's web site" as:
I wanted to say with Darwin's case:
Darwin modified greatly. And aren't you? "you"? Who? me? or someone else...Who are "YOU"?
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"NO;DE;ST;HI;TU;OP;RS;AB;EF" might matter greater in mind for next day of typewriter on some early time-stage from alphabetical keyboard to something other, than "TH;ER;,..."
"NO;DE;ST;HI;TU;OP;RS;AB;EF" might matter greater
than "TH;ER;,..."
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How does BBC introduce him?
Professor Koichi Yasuoka of Kyoto University, a world expert on the development of the keyboard.
BBC News - Why do we all use Qwerty keyboards?
PKY or
Koichi Yasuoka
# Occupation: Associate Professor
APKY
A spectre is haunting Japan ― the spectre of "Upstrike(generalｌy? or in 1880s?) never, S&G and Rem2 NOT jam." - The actuality on - QWERTY history
- Of upstrike typewriters (made during?) in 1880s, typebars on those never jam. or
- Generaly?, on upstrike typewriters, their typebars never jam.
*1：spectre specter http://thesaurus.com/browse/specter http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/archive?word=spectre
*2： (Associate) Professor Koichi Yasuoka cf. http://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110107/1294382212
*3： In Japan, here is a band named "OFF COURSE" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Off_Course http://www.emimusic.jp/offcourse/ . Just now, I(id:raycy) have found this spelled as "OFF".
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NO.
Yahoo! Groups
I might missunderstand your thought, and might express odd in those:
Peter Weil adds conditions.
Yahoo! Groupshttp://qwerty-history.g.hatena.ne.jp/raycy/20110103/1294028611
Which do you believe? : Rehr's recognition. vs. experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka, ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
OK, I will modify my expression later on. that is like:
Peter Weil adds:
Which do you believe? : Rehr's recognition. vs. experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka, ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO. - The actuality on - QWERTY historyThe Typebars, in ***perfect*** mechanical order and alignment, still occasionally jam. The whole "engineering" experiment was done with no types on the typebars. The types add length and conflict at certain angles. While not frequent, it was a problem in the design.
Beyond this, the typebar baring for each typebar regularly became loose. The result is that they got out of alignment easily, This was not an accident, but part of the design.
The history of non-advertising comments about the Sholes and Glidden at the time it was used is fairly regular complaints about clashing typebars and the frequent mal-alignment of the printed letters because of the baring design.
Yahoo! Groups
Peter Weil, you says:
What strikes me is that no matter what evidence is presented you, you make no modification to your argument or what you are primarily arguing on your web site. This would be alright if you refuted theevidence presented to you, but you do not. You just keep repeating the same thing.
Yahoo! Groups
Do you say "you" in above sentences, for me(raycy) or for Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka of Kyoto Universty?
If later, this is Japan now,,, you see?
Darwin says in his autobiography:
Darwinが信じないことにしたタイプの とてつもなく長大な演繹的議論、 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYI cannot remember a single first-formed hypothesis which had not after a time to be given up or greatly modified. This has naturally led me to distrust greatly deductive reasoning in the mixed sciences. On the other hand, I am not very sceptical,--a frame of mind which I believe to be injurious to the progress of science.
The life and letters of Charles Darwin, including an autobiographical chapter
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Thanks for your kind suggestion , DR. :)
Yahoo! Groups
- or to refute the letter-placement hypothesis for the origin of the QWERTY keyboard.
- You would offer us a better discussion if you either
- 1) presented truly useful information to refute or support the hypotheses or
- 2) presented an alternate hypothesis.
Now, let me try.
”Is this paper thick enough?” - Google Search
In the famous letter that Sholes delightly wrote with pencil about the success type-writing on the Thick enough Paper, there we might see typing trouble between N and O, which is most frequent letter pairs when typebars in alphabetical order. (Bcause of some trouble with, an "A" is far left out of frame also, I guess.)
kicking-upキックアップ式機のキーとタイプバーの配置関係になら、自由度は乏しかろう。 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYno title
This might be one evidence that jam had occurred on the Sholes and the fellows' early stage typewriter.
And another might be on the other letters typed by Sholes or Desnsmore or so, in Milwaukee or so.
On two bank keyboard stage, there might be strong relation between key-order and typebar arrangement.
There should be the very next stage from the alphabetical order to, to marumarumaru times3○○○ means like X, next X, next stage something.
In alphabetical order, NO; DE; ST; HI; TU; OP; RS; AB; EF are the most frequent letter pairs.
And those pairs might be targeted to be separated on the next stage of the typewriter development.
- 1867年あたりだか 「3579NOPQRSTUVWXYZ(下段へ)2468ABCDEFGHIJKLM」
QWERTY - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia- 3 5 7 9 N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z
2 4 6 8 . A B C D E F G H I J K L M- 1868年あたりだか 「ABCDEFGHIJKLMN(このあたりで折り返して下段へ右から左へとつらなる…)OPQRSTUVWXYZ
」
Re: to: dcrehr からのRe: - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYQWERTY配列 - Wikipedia
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0AqzxPHll8XJldDFDbFZqMFVzYmlHd293Y1dCYWg0QVE&hl=en&output=htmlReading ”The Truth”: alphabetical order nexting bigram frequency in bar chartradar
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?hl=en&key=0AqzxPHll8XJldDFDbFZqMFVzYmlHd293Y1dCYWg0QVE&hl=en&gid=14葉仮名raycy - KliologY
ショールズらの初期タイプライター 二段キーボード時代においては、タイプバーの隣接関係とキーの左右の隣接関係が、ほぼ一致しており、kicking-upキックアップ式機のキーとタイプバーの配置関係になら、自由度は乏しかろう。 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologYMalling-Hansenのタイプライターならば、キーの隣接関係とタイプバー（と呼んでもいいかな…）の隣接関係が一致している、、。ショールズら初期の二段キーボードでも、、 - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
Ａ Ｂ Ｃ Ｄ Ｅ Ｆ Ｇ Ｈ Ｉ Ｊ Ｋ Ｌ Ｍ Ｎ Ｚ Ｙ Ｘ Ｗ Ｖ Ｕ Ｔ Ｓ Ｒ Ｑ Ｐ Ｏ
still writing | |
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What strikes me is that no matter what evidence is presented you, you make no modification to your argument or what you are primarily arguing on your web site. Yahoo! GroupsWhich web site do you mean? I'm raycy. Mine? or other's?
ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO.
# Weil's additional conditions to make Yasuoka's model truth...? still far away..
* ***Perfect*** operation and ***perfect*** machine
* NO. The Typebars, in ***perfect*** mechanical order and alignment, still occasionally jam. Which do you believe? : Rehr's recognition. vs. experience of Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka, ps. Weil's additional conditions and still NO. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
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Yahoo! Groups
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"dcrehr" <dcrehr@...> says :
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TYPEWRITERS/message/47769
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Hello & thanks dcrehr. You may be Mr. Darryl Rehr..
I am who received e-mail answers from you, last year.
Mr. Darryl Rehr answered to my questions. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
To make reply for your comment, please give me for a while, this time also.
（試訳）dcrehr からのRe: - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
jamming liability up, up to higher as way- backing to Remington No.2 to S&G , and might be more higher jammability on Sholes' prototype. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Please let me re-speak your announcement, as a title.
S&G owners... try this out on your machines. Hit keys with adjacent type
bars quickly in succession and observe the clashing. Now, hit keys with type
bars separated by one position and see how the problem virtually disappears.
Yahoo! Groups
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Let's take a look at this. From the posted website:
Yahoo! Groups
Let me do that from more deeper:
Thursday, May 14, 2009
With the older manual typewriters each keystroke caused a metal bar to swing down or forward to hit the paper. If the typist worked too quickly, the metal typebars would collide and jam the mechanism. The design solution was to relocate the keys so that letters often typed immediately after one another, such as "i" and "e," would be placed on opposite sides of the machine. -- Stanley Coren: The Left-Hander Syndrome, Free Press, New York (1992).
Swing down or forward? No. Typewriters in the 1880s with QWERTY keyboard had typebars to swing up to hit the back of paper. They are called upstrike typewriters and their typebars never jam. Furthermore, in English, the most frequently-used letter sequence is "th". On QWERTY keyboard, you see T and H are adjacently placed. The second is "er" + "re", also placed in neighborhood of one another.
The Truth of QWERTY
Stanley Coren says "jam the mechanism", means make the mechanism disorderd, maybe. It does not only mean jamming together of typebars. Don't you think so?
Coren says clashing make worse disorder of the mechanism of the typewriter.
Coren minds the problem in more broad way than Koichi Yasuoka sets.
Koichi Yasuoka narrows the situation almost just only to the incident of typebar tanglement.
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Let me take a look at this. From the posted website:
Thursday, May 14, 2009
The design solution was to relocate the keys so that letters often typed immediately after one another, such as "i" and "e," would be placed on opposite sides of the machine. -- Stanley Coren: The Left-Hander Syndrome, Free Press, New York (1992).
Typewriters in the 1880s with QWERTY keyboard had typebars to swing up to hit the back of paper.
posted by Koichi Yasuoka
The Truth of QWERTY
I know Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka insists the day alphabet key layout of QWERTY determined in 1882.
But here,
Coren argues when the key placement done of "i" and "e," in apart , that was done in 1872 or earlier to 1874.
If it should have "QWERTY", the key layout at 1874 have "QWERTYUOIP" in it.
So Associate Professor Koichi Yasuoka may not have to bring the 1880s to this discussion.
Let's talk about just before the S&G sold out, and the coming way to the point of the time.
Typebars on S&G, they Do clash and jam, Rehr and Weil testify.
So, please show them, Rehr and Weil and me, not or never jamming S&G machine you Professor Yasuoka had tested.
Millwaukee's and Kikutake's ?
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Yes, the first typewriter was sluggish. Yes, it did clash and jam when someone tried to type with it. But Sholes was able to figure out a way around the problem simply by rearranging the letters.
Why QWERTY was Invented
He, Darryl Rehr scince 1998, He have kept his opinion.
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://home.earthlink.net/~dcrehr/whyqwert.html
and He says:
Yes They Do clash and jam.
"Adjacent type bars" means two type bars that are next to each other inside the machine.
They DO clash and jam.
Mr. Darryl Rehr answered to my questions. - The actuality on - QWERTY history
Typewriters in the 1880s with QWERTY keyboard had typebars to swing up to hit the back of paper. They are called upstrike typewriters and their typebars never jam.
The Truth of QWERTY
私個人の経験になるのですが、少なくともSholes & Glidden Type-WriterやRemington Type-Writer No.2の「活字棒」(typebar)は、絡んだりはしないのです。そりゃ同時に押したら「活字棒」が衝突することはあるんですが、いわゆる jammingは起きない。ですので、「活字棒が絡まる」っていう時点で、それはすでにフロントストライク式なんじゃないかと。
Posted by 安岡孝一 at 2010年06月13日 15:10
Google 翻訳（My raycy's translation with free machinery）
Speaking by my experience,
I can say at least, typebars of 'Sholes & Glidden Type-Writer' and 'Remington Type-Writer No.2' do not tangle.
If pressing multiple keys simultaneously, typebars may conflict. But the jamming does not occur on typebar, or typebars do not jam.
So I think when talking about the phenomenon "typebar is entwined", it may be front-strike typewriter story .
Posted by Koichi Yasuoka June 13, 2010 at 15:10
Peter Weilにどやされ、Darryl Rehrに諭される、、なんで こちとらがあ、、濡れ衣だ ぁぁあぁぁあー - 葉仮名raycy - KliologY
Peter Weil says when Yasuoka's testimony realize with additional conditions as follows:
"Yasuoka's model" - The actuality on - QWERTY historySo,
YasuokoYasuoka's model may be technically accurate for a combination of
- one-finger
- slow
- typing and
- perfect alignment of both
- the typbars and
- the type on the end of each.
Peter
Yahoo! Groups
Peter Weil says:
Darwin, Peter Weil, Koichi Yasuoka, (or to me?) - The actuality on - QWERTY historyNO. The Typebars, in ***perfect*** mechanical order and alignment, still occasionally jam. The whole "engineering" experiment was done with no types on the typebars. The types add length and conflict at certain angles. While not frequent, it was a problem in the design.
Beyond this, the typebar baring for each typebar regularly became loose. The result is that they got out of alignment easily, This was not an accident, but part of the design.
The history of non-advertising comments about the Sholes and Glidden at the time it was used is fairly regular complaints about clashing typebars and the frequent mal-alignment of the printed letters because of the baring design.
Yahoo! Groups
