“Our goal is not to build the most computers. It’s to build the best.”
That was Apple COO Tim Cook two days ago during Apple’s quarterly earnings call. Sure, it may sound like spin from an executive who doesn’t have a better answer as to why Apple isn’t competing in the low-end of the market, and thus, gaining market share. But it’s not.
You need look no further than numbers released today by NPD to understand Apple’s strategy. Its revenue share of the “premium” price market — that is, computers over $1,000 — is a staggering 91%. This means that 9 out of every 10 retail dollars that is spent on PCs in that price range, goes to Apple, as Betanews’ Joe Wilcox points out. That, for lack of a better word, is insane.
Analysts and journalists are often quick to point out Apple’s relatively low overall market share (less than 10%). But that completely misses the point of Apple’s Mac business. If Apple wanted to make a range of low-end computers, it absolutely could. And such machines would sell like crazy, boosting Apple’s market share. But there would have to be some trade-off in quality, and perhaps more importantly to Apple, to its high margins. And as it has proven time and time again, it has no desire to give up either.
Instead, Apple is content to keep churning out its high-quality, high-margin machines, and watch the profits roll in. If it happens to gain market share as a byproduct of that, that’s great. You can’t be so naive to think that Apple doesn’t care about that at all, of course it does, but it’s clearly a secondary goal, which most people don’t seem to understand.
It’s a metaphor that’s often used, but a way to think about it is if Windows-based PCs as a whole are thought of as a top selling car like the Toyota Camry, Apple’s Mac computers would be more like a luxury car, like a Porsche. Porsche sales are just a fraction of Camry sales because it does not sell any models in the low-end price range. But at the same time, Porsche makes more money on each car sold and maintains a premium branding. If Porsche started selling cheap cars, it would move a lot more units, but it would no longer be the Porsche brand that we know.
That’s not to say the Camry sucks or that the Porsche is perfect. They’re just two different cars that cater to different markets. And they represent the two different goals that most Windows-based PCs have (market share) versus Apple’s Mac computers (high-end revenue share).
And that’s why Microsoft’s recent Laptop Hunter commercials really never made a lot of sense. Sure, from a marketing perspective, I understand the idea: It’s a down economy, lets play up the fact that our computers are cheaper. But in many of the spots, the shopper’s stated desired computer was simply not something that Apple even made. In the famous first commercial, Lauren wants a laptop with a 17-inch screen for under $1,000. Okay, Apple doesn’t make that product. So of course she’s not going to buy a Mac.
The real point is that people who are shopping for computers where price is the key factor, were never going to buy Macs anyway. They never have. There is a reason Apple still has less than 10% market share. Did Microsoft need to spend millions of dollars on commercials to tell us that?
Instead, those commercials set up a narrative around the bifurcation of the computer-buying public. And today’s NPD numbers are the perfect ending to that story. If you’re a consumer looking for a bargain computer, you’re happy to save money buying a PC. If you’re looking for a premium computer, you’re happy to spend more money buying a Mac.
Natural Born Microsoft Haters
let’s call them typical fanboys.
MG,
1) you do know that porsche was having difficulties and had to be bought out by VW and some qatar people yesterday?
2) If apple is not interested in the windows range why are they so aggressively trying to undermine the pc market?
3) It’s all about what fits our needs. I only use my mac when i have to do some development on it. I need to be able to run linux and many windows programs so when i m on the go i always take my dell with me (which by the way is way faster than a mac). Plus some mac features, such as the absence of keyboard shortcuts and the damned mouse deceleration are awfully annoying.
It’s not about what costs less. or else, everyone would be buying old Macs (which run virtually any mac program i know more than adequately). Microsoft’s ads missed the spot, but MS is generally not good at promoting their brands
yeah, porsche is a really bad example
Actually the Prosche example is a great one. Up until their recent attempt to buy VW, (which ended in a merger because of the downturn) Porsche was the most profitable car maker. Read it again porsche made more money than Toyota or any other automobile manufacturer, selling a fraction of the cars.
Porsche was so strong financially that they tried buying VW (the second largest car manufacturer) which recently ended in total failure mainly because of the downturn. Maybe Apple should learn from that – Don’t jump to high, and so far they haven’t.
Ummm so strong financially that it’s now crippled by debt and being forced to be bought out by the co. it was trying to take over? The fact is, it was doing well, but overplayed its hand by buying VW options. Options which incidentally made up most of the profit that it reported.
Also, the Cayenne was Porsche’s move downmarket into mass-market SUVs (think X5, ML etc.). It was the Cayenne that was driving growth recently. Ergo, MG’s argument is incongruous.
Further, Porsche sales have been hit extremely hard by the recent financial downturn.
Well, not really. Porsche has stockpiles of cash, and tried to buy the entire Wolkswagen group. At one point they had 51 % of Volkswagen shares. They ended up with a merger, where owners of Porsche now will own 40 % of Volkswagen.
http://www.expr...-merger/493209/
yeah, ending up with 10 billion in debt. great buy
I think people are over thinking this Porsche example…
Porsche bought VW, not vice versa~
in reality it’s a merger. but VW wins. at least that’s what the financial times say: http://www.ft.c...?nclick_check=1
VW always had a good deal since it was partially gov’t-subsidized.
Anyway, I don’t know why Microsoft would want to take pot-shots at Mac owners — they also tend to buy Windows, and at a higher profit margin (for M$) than the OEM manufacturers give them. I have Windows installed (in a VM) and paid for it… and use OS X as my primary OS. It all comes down to a matter of choice. I like how OS X works, ‘cos I’ve been using it long enough that all well-written OS X apps ARE pretty intuitive. The things Windows convertees sometimes don’t like when moving to Mac are often some of the things that I see as a benefit.
Plus navigating the filesystem is just so much better on OS X than Windows. I can just drag files or folders to most apps to show where I want to save, partially name a file, etc… there are tons of tricks hidden in the OS when you get used to it. Windows makes me cringe when I have to launch it.
Porsche’s crisis came about because they played around with their credit (not unlike everybody else). Over the last year or two they took on GINORMOUS amounts of debt to buy up VW. And also made some bad bets on financial markets. This has nothing to do with their core automotive business. That, still rocks and is the envy of most if not all other car manufacturers.
who could say porsches are not good?
which hammers home the point that comparing computers to cars is not a good analogy. anyone can start a computer brand by buying lego parts from taiwan. try doing that with any car.
if apple macs were cars, they would require separate lanes on the road and use a different fuel than anyone else, and their owners would always scold those driving on the main lanes for using those noisy cars.
Perhaps that was true once, but Macs now run on the same architecture and, in fact, are able to run Windows XP natively using Boot Camp. Most tests even show that Macs have a speed advantage over PCs when running XP.
So, now a Mac is a car that can drive on your road AND it’s own special roads, and can use your fuel or it’s own. Don’t get me wrong, the only mac I have is the one my work gave me, and my 5 home machines are all PCs. But a fact is a fact no matter how much you repeat this old Mac attack.
Great reply!
That’s exactly what happens. Mac people are always superior and state that the Mac way is the right one. The simple opening of a file (or application) in finder you have to press two keys instead of just “Return”. Mac people say it’s the correct way! “It makes much more sense that when you press return you want to change its’ name”. (???)
It’s true that Windows still has its’ flaws, but Leopard also fails a lot more than it should. Try working with heavy images in freehand and InDesign and you’ll be rushing to a PC right away because it can’t print, or it takes too much time to export to PDF.
I still think that Mac OS is a bit more stable than Windows because it can be tested in every hardware they make. Try doing that with Windows in every motherboard, every graphic card, every memory brand…
oh sure because PRINTING is better in Windows … LMAO. Next thing you’ll claim is color management as well rawks in Windows.
Anyway. Claims and claims. Whatever works for your work it’s no sense in attempting to claim one ups.
I can’t help but laugh when I see PC users desperately trying to run down Macs. I have to ask why are you so obsessed with a machine that’s 10% of the market? Why is it so import for you to scream from the mountain tops that “PC’s ARE BETTER THAN MACS!!!!” Calm down and go enjoy your cheap piece of plastic and your viruses and malware and bluescreens of death.
Jim
Enjoy your kernel panics, your easy to hack 5minute Operating System, and a computer that hardly lets you truly customize it. Yeah, that overpriced Apple computer sure sounds great eh?
Oh, by the way, Macs get viruses too.
http://www.msnb...om/id/12537279/
Hey 10things.me it is clear you don’t really know anything about a mac.
)
1. Porsche was a merely metaphore, who cares about its current problems?
2. Apple is only stating that they do better things. And, surprise, they do. Win7 is going to introduce (hu, ho!) 9 years after OSX, … the Dock. Pretty stunning, hu?
3. There is no absence of keyboard shortcuts at all, and the mouse deceleration is is something you can setup from sp. It looks to me you don’t really try to understand or focus on the mac platform.
The real key, is: why are you all win users obsessed with mac? Use win and enjoy it.
(Until Google comes out with Chrome Os
#2 is answered easily- upselling. Buy better, not more. Apple would prefer to sell (in the end) more product to the customer on average than MSFT/Dell/etc would.
how bout a creating a model like gap inc (with old navy and br) why not create 3 brands (or designated models) that is cheaper to more expensive?
Gap has those brands to segment their market based more on age than on quality. You can’t really market computers to different age groups like you can fashion styles.
“Absence of keyboard shortcuts”???? Are you serious? Maybe you should check out macosxhints.com. You obviously need a little education on using Mac OS X.
lol I can just see it now:
“DAMNIT, WHY DOESNT MY CONTROL KEY WORK!? STUPID MACS AND YOUR STUPID NON SHORTCUTS!!!”
In reality though, everyone Ive ever known that has worked with PC’s for years and switched to a Mac hated the Command key at first. Once they got used to it however, all of them would much rather use their thumbs to hit command than use their pinkys to stretch for the control key.
Fastest XP/Vista notebook is the Macbook Pro.
Lack of Mac keyboard shorcuts? Return to earth and actually use one before you start talking next time.
If you want to believe that – it was true for a short time while Apple got a hardware bump (which they don’t do too often) but shortly thereafter EVERY other laptop mfg got their hands on the same or better hardware and continually bump it and now Apple can’t claim that (although they still do – but shouldn’t.)
And quite honestly, I don’t think they’re the best built – great build? OH yes. . . definitely! The best? Well, that’s a qualitative statement and to be honest, I don’t think so.
Why? Well, for one they leave out a LOT of features that should be IN a laptop of the highest quality:
VGA port – a laptop is all about taking it places, making presentations, etc. When you have to take along a little wire thingamabob in order to plug in to nearly ALL of the world’s projectors in colleges and conference rooms, that’s a lack of a BASIC feature.
Keyboard – lots of people like them, but they are not ergonomic and a LOT of people hate them. Chicklet is not a term of endearment and, to me, it’s a significant drop in their quality. It means, to me, that they don’t want to put the time and effort in to creating a quality keyboard with feedback and human factors.
Screen – first they go glossy screen and now they are going back to Matte? Something about the quality of the image in normal usage. . . yeah, another knock on their quality.
Do they make them extremely well? Yes – build quality is excellent – but then so does Lenovo. Thinkpads are legendary for their quality and when they build just as solid a laptop as Apple – AND they include a good keyboard (routinely rated in the top three keyboards), exceptional screens, VGA ports, etc. . . well, that’s a more quality machine than one without. . .
To me it is just funny that an article like this brings out such a strong dispute …I mean let’s stick to the real issue here, the fact that quality vs. quantity targets two very different consumers. And there are two VERY different types of consumers, hence the quote:
“Our goal is not to build the most computers. It’s to build the best.”
“Instead, Apple is content to keep churning out its high-quality, high-margin machines, and watch the profits roll in.”
Hahahaha, totally agree. Mac hardware is NO better than cheaper alternatives. I am sick of this quality debate, and that sentence only highlights this article’s obvious bias.
Should change it to:
“Instead, Apple is content to keep churning out its pretty-cased, high-margin machines, and watch the profits roll in.”
EXACTLY
Indeed, the idea that Mac hardware is better is laughable. The chassis and whatnot are doubtless better than a £30 case from ebuyer, but the hardware that actually does the *computing* isn’t anything special – in fact, it’s the same pile of silicon sitting in a PC.
I wouldn’t mind people preferring Macs if they realised that immutable fact. Preference is one thing, but smug ignorance is quite another.
If by “hardware” you are talking about the discrete components then yes they are much the same as those in a typical budget PC but you would be wrong to compare the Apple computer as a whole to a typical PC. I’m an electronics graduate with nearly 30 years industry experience and I can tell you straight that the logic boards, chassis and other aspects of the enclosure are way better than any ebuyer special or even a higher end PC laptop! I have taken apart numerous laptops both PC’s and Mac laptops and the Mac’s are a joy to work on with loads of little details which only an engineer can truly appreciate in my opinion. They are so well engineered and beautifully assembled it is no wonder that the have proven time and time again to be at the top of the reliability tables. Note that I say this as someone who has worked with PC’s since the Amstrad PC1512 and only switched to Mac two years ago.
Also, you may or may not be aware that Apple have huge influence on the other vendors they work with (eg. Nvidia, Intel, ATI etc) and work very closely with their engineers to produce custom variants of CPU’s, GPU’s, chipsets and firmware so improve the level of integration so in fact it is NOT the “same pile of silicon” that they use. Add to that the fact that they control the operating system and every other component and you can start to understand why these machines on the whole, “Just Work”.
I don’t expect you to appreciate what I am saying but to accuse others of “smug ignorance” is a little hypocritical I would say…
Yes, yes, it’s the same hardware that’s in the PCs, whatever.
However, while it IS the same hardware that goes into the PCs, I believe the hardware is tested by Apple beforehand to ensure top quality performance.
Ridiculous.
Just based on the numbers, I bet you the majority of readers of Techcrunch started on a PC. Given the pervasiveness of the PC, and the relative explosion of Macs in the last 10 years, most of us were naturally born microsoft users. If we came to hate them, then that’s their fault.
Actually, I started on a Commodore 64.
I think you missed the point of Microsoft’s Hunter commercials. It wasn’t about the fact that PC’s are cheaper, everyone knows that. It was about the idea of why you would pay more for a Mac? You’re Porsche analogy is a good one. Have you noticed Porsche owners seem to be overcompensating for something? I think the same logic applies to Mac owners.
I would rather pay several hundred dollars more for something that never gave me any headaches or “hidden fees”, as I like to call them. When you buy a PC for seven hundred dollars, you buy the basic stuff. It runs pretty well, tad slow ect. When you come in to fix it two months later because you were surfing ligitimate sites on the internet and somehow got a virus, you shell out, lets say, another hundred bucks, because the computer repair is guys is a friend of your cousin’s and gives ya a 50% discount or something.
You then think to yourself, “Hmm, maybe I should purchase this profesional piece of virus-fighting technology that Micrisoft has been constantly been berating me with?” So off you go, reaching into your poor, abused wallet to take out another hundred dollars to buy an overpriced program that would not have been needed at all on a Mac.
So, several weeks or a few hours later, if you’ve chosen to download the bloated file, you receive said piece of virus-fighting technology. You are quite happy for a few weeks until lo!: you encounter a flash of blue as your computer dies. Screaming in frustration, you turn it back on to realize that one of Micrisoft’s own products caused the crash.
You uninstall the program, a valuable art-editing program you needed for work, yet the blue screens continue. Finally, after much anger and many therapy sessions, you go back to get your friendly neighbor hood computer repair shop to learn that your cousin’s friend had been let go due to drug addiction. You sigh, and pay the full, three hundred dollar charge to get it “fixed” yet again.
Fast forward to several years later. You’re shiny, cheap PC is so riddled with viruses you’re surprised it doesn’t explode while booting up. You paid over eight hundred dollars for repairs before finally giving up. As your nephews birthday approaches, you disclose it to you’re “favorite” little guy, throwing in a fistful of cash to make sure you’re rid of the damn thing.
You’re family disowns you. You enter a stage of severe depression.
All because you didn’t want to pay a few more bucks for something that looks better, runs better, and is nearly immune to viruses because of how it’s internal code is written, not because, as nearly every PC user seems to think, the people that cook up computer viruses are to lazy to create effective ones that cover a “”mere”" ten percent of the total world’s total computer amount.
Trust me. Personal experience. Get a Mac.
. . . sad for the price of the imac I can build a computer far beyond a piece of crap mac lol
You know, it’s funny how people don’t want a MacBook because (partly) there’s no firewire port. I was at Best Buy the other day looking at the mac section, then to the PC section. None of the PC laptops had firewire. None. Don’t beleive me, go see for yourself.
Except the bargain computers are far better than the Macs…
You can say that again
It’s Funny MG mentioned Wilcox because when i read Wilcox article all i thought about is how horrible this guy is with his fanboism all over the article and he sounded as bad as MG of TechCrunch.
I think what we’re really talking about here is MAC OS vs. Windows? The hardware is rather irrelevant considering I can run Windows on my MAC.
I did buy a PC laptop for one reason, and one reason only… Price.
I mean, I picked up a nice Toshiba laptop for $300 brand new.
I definitely prefer working on a MAC for my heavy lifting (design, development, programming, etc).
I used to use a PC, but got tired of hitting Ctrl+Alt+Delete every hour because of some unforeseen hiccup that always happens on a PC.
What absolute FUD again about Windows.
I have used a Dell Desktop PC for the past 5 years for web design, graphics development, media encoding and editing, gaming and more and I have never had a problem. I use a Dell XPS 630i Quad Core with nVidia dual 9800GT SLI video cards and two 24″ LCD screens, 6GB RAM, 2 x 500GB hard drives, X-Fi Xtreme Gamer 5.1 surround sound and running Windows 7 64bit.
It is twice the value (price for power) of a MAC and I have never had a bluescreen or any application problems whatsoever. In fact prior to Windows 7 I ran Vista and I also NEVER had any problems so wish people would stop trying to spread this FUD about MAC vs Windows.
1/3rd of people I know who own a Macbook are running Windows 7 on it and around half of those in media and film making are now also running Windows vs a Mac. So you can also ditch the stereotypes of creative’s owning Macs.
Creatives don’t need a mac. Any computer would do for them. Only fools that don’t know they are not creative needs a mac to show they are creative but, in fact they are not.
Your buddies in the high school A/V club don’t count as “those in media and film.”
Yeah try saying that when at creative schools a Mac is required along with Final Cut and Logic
Like the Camry is a better car than a Porsche. Which I agree with for practicality. Do you idiots even read the articles? Or do you just see MG’s name and scream bias?
actually, i read the articles because i know it will be biased
Bargain PCs better than Macs? Not when PCs don’t have Expose, Spaces, an excellent terminal, Quicklook, magsafe connectors for the power cord… just to name a few things you don’t get with a PC. You PC people don’t know what you’re missing. You should check it out before mistakenly assuming you are comparing the same thing.
why are mac fans always so fussy while pc people are not?
you know what that sounds like? “you people have never tried gay sex, you don’t know what you’re missing” ; it’s not a matter of what you think it is, it’s what people choose. it’s a free market, so you can’t really blame anyone for malpractice.
Not just gay sex. Gay sex that costs 3 times as much and uses the same “hardware”.
Actually you hit the nail on the head, I bought a Mac because I’m fussy and like the tight integration of all the Apple stuff I use.
If I was mainly using Dell stuff, I’m sure I’d have one of those too.
You are correct, us Mac fans are a bit snobby about it, so what? Perhaps we all (Mac fussy types and don’t give a damn PC types – I believe you said you’re not fussy) should grow up a bit.
So, back to school boy antics, what you’re saying in your comment is you think about things in terms of being gay?? :p
Best,
J.
Hey J!
All I know is that I’m not the biggest Apple fan – I hated how the first round of iPods had clear defects, and clearly didn’t pass QA back in ‘03/04 which lent to Apple being so generous with their guarantees. But I confess to being mesmerised by my MacBookPro. As my friend Shaun says, ‘It just works’. I have 6 active laptops incl this one, and it only took 3 weeks from purchase this February to become (emotionally/functionally) totally dependent upon it. And I’m a financial IT person so this is after I ported all my spreadsheets over. Yes. Mac Rules.
@10things.me
Seriously, you don’t know what you’re missing.
LOLed
Try everything once except incest and songsmith, and I mean it.
Why are PC people so obsessed with Macs? The fact is, most Mac users used to be PC users and switched. Most of the people here running down Macs have never even used one. It’s like the people that say Fox is biased and admit that they never watch it. Get a life guys. If you want to use a PC then have fun. Nothing you say will ever change my personal experience that has proven to me that Macs blow PC away in every single regard.
Jim you hit it bang on, I have been a PC user since the begining and have just switched to Mac, and I am with you that “nothing you say will ever change my personal experience that has proven to me that Macs blow PC’s away in EVERY single regard” My wife and I have both got MacBook Pro’s now and we have never looked back, and I just bought a Dell six months ago which is up for sale now… MAC Rocks…
you’re so wrong…first off all these things are unnecessary and/or redundant (except the power cord, i agree the power cords are awesome, but not reason enough to pay hundreds more for the same damn specs). If you love the os so much, you can install the os on any pc without spending that extra money for the apple logo. Quicklook is a feature that can be emulated on PCs, altho opening a file is certainly easier than previewing it, how hard is it to open a file and close it again? Expose is a visual ALT+TAB (windows 7 has the same thing as expose, and you can emulate it with freeware in xp), and spaces is similar to expose and also can be emulated by freeware on xp. Windows 7 will blow away Mac OSx. I have to point out that Macs ARE PCs, and you’re all idiots if you think differently. Since mac switched to intel, their hardware isnt even special anymore. Macs are overpriced computers with a logo. Their OS is different than XP, but who cares? Apple computers have very few tools to help diagnose problems (which they do have, often)…anyways im tired of caring, just read maddox
http://www.theb...cgi?u=macs_cant
No, actually Macs provide a much better computing experience overall in comparison to PCs (in part of course because the hardware is so tightly controlled). 95% of the developers I know who have tried both prefer using a mac with OS X. It’s great that you’re looking forward to Windows 7 so much though. Must be kind of a relief after Vista turned out to be such a pos.
By computing experience you mean browsing the web and listening to mp3s
You suck big time..!
Good developers dont care what they use at home to browse the web for cheap porn or download stuff off torrents. They just need something that looks snappy just that and most dont care about vfm and they make big bucks working on windows pcs on say, visual studio at work. Just think about it..!
What about those Porche SUVs, what’s up with that?
The money made on the Cayenne was spent on developing and expanding Porsche’s lineup which brought us the (almost) perfect Caymen. So all is forgiven in my book.
However…
The profits also got Porsche seriously drunk with success and we’re seeing the result of that lately with all their much publicized debt/executive troubles.
Some executive had to sell his/her 911 after the child was born, and forced some engineers to create something scary.
Drive a Cayenne and you’ll know what’s up with that. They’re stunna!
I like how they created a ‘premium’ segment to justify Mac’s high prices.
Mac Mini
fail
Also, may I ask, what “quality”? “Perceived quality”?
No… read my other post about the features you get on a Mac that you don’t get on a PC.
those are OS features – not quality as in build quality. macs are pretty, and the mac pros are reliable, but when it comes to the MBPs and iMacs, we’ve only got a handful out of 2-3 dozen that have NOT had to be serviced under applecare. build quality and longevity is not where it needs to be in premium hardware.
read some pirsig. even he had trouble defining quality, but the concept is real
Apple users have been convinced by Apples advertising machine to actually spend the extra dollars. Good for them, excellent positioning.
Apple has managed to attach their products to a lifestyle statement. Similar to driving a BMW or Lexus. It’s no longer about the quality of the products but about the statement you make about yourself by using them.
Fail how? Mine works just fine, as does my parents’ and my wife’s grandfather’s.
Fail? I got a tower of 5 of them daisy chained as a Logic Plug In processing farm… it hasn’t failed me once. My In-laws love it as their main computer.
Nice try but ….
This has been thoroughly discussed, and fully debunked as PR-garbage over at Hacker News:
http://news.yco.../item?id=719631
Welcome to an hour-or-so ago.
sure, but even if its just retail, point still stands. after all, laptop hunters take place in retail stores. as I note, this is on the consumer end, business end is obviously different.
Are you trying to debunk a Microsoft ad or give us an idea of the market?
If you’re trying to debunk a Microsoft ad, that’s…okay, but an odd thing for this site to be obsessing about.
If you’re trying to give us an idea of the market without including Dell…that isn’t very useful.
what about dell? they’re just one of many PC makers. not even the biggest.
Dell is second (to HP) in PC market share and is primarily sold online. It should be fairly obvious that to ignore most of their sales does not give an accurate picture of the PC market.
But Dell is multiple times as big as Apple. Thus the 91% number is TOTAL bull. According to the cock and bull, oops brick and mortar NPD, I do not exist. Even though my last 5 computers have been Dell’s, and over 1000.
Point: shit stats say nothing.
I don’t get why people love Dell so much. Do they even have an R&D department? To me, it looks like they just make some really nice cases.
Do some research and google “who makes the dell (insert your dell motherboard, monitor, printer, storage) and then talk about THAT company.
“Its revenue share of the “premium” price market — that is, computers over $1,000 — is a staggering 91%.”
That number is purely BS.
Your point does not still stand. You based the whole article on this whopping 91% statistic that isn’t even true. Get the real percentage including non brick and mortar then come back.
@Me above: PC (or Mac) making is just like joining lego pieces. Let’s say that PC manufacturers all use the colored lego parts, while the white ones are reserved for Apple. None of them requires important research to build. I doubt HP’s notebooks are created in the HP labs. People like Dell because they sometimes balance things well, plus they have great worldwide support. Plus they don’t overload their designs with needless stuff.
@me: have you heard of Foxconn etc.? Apple doesn’t make its own computers either. No matter which brand you buy, that’s all you’re buying – a brand. They all outsource their manufacturing.
Alex, Apple is roughly 6 times as big as Dell and has enough free cash on hand to write a check for Dell this afternoon. Apple’s market cap (value) is $140 billion and rising while Dell’s is $25 billion and falling.
Josiah, thanks for the link. Explanes a lot.
Ha. I love how MG’s Apple fanboy-ism shines through so easily.
MG – This report shows why Apple’s strategy is the right one.
Comment – Report is based on flawed methods.
MG – Whatever. Apple rules.
Yeah with about $30 billion in cash and a $140 billion market cap — higher than Google — Apple’s strategy clearly sucks.
you’re taking this too far, literally comparing apples to oranges now. i would admit that, although counterintuitive, apple’s strategy of creating well-built but expensive products worked.
Wrong. Apple must surely doing something right.
It’s MG and Wilcox… I mean you should read Wilcox articles, they make you vomit as much as MG articles, Well a least most of MG articles(about 91% of them). Wilcox is worse than MG though.
Hey, you’re free to read and comment on what you want, but if you hate them so much, er, why do you bother reading at all?
J.
Maybe he’s a compulsive eater, desperately needs his daily puking.
Just a thought.
Apple DID make a range of low-end computers called the Macintosh classic back in the 90’s. It was a HUGE deal – Sculley and the marketing and advertising claimed “it is time to bring Macintosh to the masses.”
The result? I think Apple picked up one point in market share. That’s because in any mature market the number one product and brand takes mass share and number two takes a minimal share.
Apple is a premium brand for a premium price. Having been the MacOS product manager and a user of Windows for years now both platforms have their pluses and minuses. I use a Mac in my recording studio and it is great. I use a Thinkpad for business and it is awesome.
That said, I am certainly tired of Apple commercials telling me I am stupid and geeky for choosing a PC when it is working quite well for me. You don’t win customers by insulting them.
yes but Apple in the 90s might as well have been an entirely different company. and it almost died because of it.
You said two things in the article that make me really think you are missing Brian’s point:
“If Apple wanted to make a range of low-end computers, it absolutely could. And such machines would sell like crazy, boosting Apple’s market share.”
…and…
“It’s a metaphor that’s often used, but a way to think about it is if Windows-based PCs as a whole are thought of as a top selling car like the Toyota Camry, Apple’s Mac computers would be more like a luxury car, like a Porsche.”
The first is completely wrong, and you actually proved how wrong it was with the second statement. Historically, every time Porsche has made a cheap model, no one has bought it. No one wants a cheap Porsche! If there going to get a cheap car, they might as well get a Chevy or Ford. Why? More availability, cheaper parts, cheaper labor, and so on. Plus, no one wants to be the loser with the cheap Porsche (see http://members....ore/history.htm)!
Apple’s products are prestige products. People buy them because their “cool” and “artsy”. If they want something cheap – a workhorse – they just go buy a PC. No one wants to be the loser with the cheap Apple, so Apple doesn’t make any cheap products. (And please don’t tell me that the iPod Shuffle is cheap and successful. For what you get it is not that cheap and at least part of its success is based on form factor).
that’s what corvettes are for
I have a Mac Pro and am the exact opposite of artsy. Not many people know I own a Mac other than a few friends (I work from home). Please don’t make generalizations.
I prefer Mac OS X over Windows and that is the main reason why I run a Mac. Sure, I could run Mac OS X on a PC but that wasn’t the route I took. Perhaps in the future, but in any case, I didn’t buy it to be “cool” and “artsy.”
Who the hell is missing the point here? I bought a Mac because I wanted a computer that worked. I was fed up with troubleshooting windows problems and having to reinstall windows. I was sick of try to defrag and clean registry and all the other things you have to do to keep your windows machine from slowing down to a crawl. I got a Mac because I wanted a workhorse that would be reliable. I got exactly that.
Brian, you are pretty much spot on.
My laptop is a MacBook, my desktops are PCs. I get to keep my PC software running on my desktops, and I get a long battery life and cool OS features on my laptop.
I’m willing to spend $1100 (education discount) on a laptop, but not $3000 on a desktop. I look at what I want, then go see what’s out there. My laptop is more expensive than my desktops. They both work perfectly for what I want them to do. And that’s what matters for me.
Oddly, though, people have said you can get things like the multiple desktops and Expose on a PC, yet I was never able to get any of the freeware to work.
excellent point. i dislike those commercials also. Apple doesn’t make a sucky product. so sorry. shop elsewhere.
91%? That’s pretty incredible. Great figure to bring to light, MG. What’s even more shocking is that less than 10% of computers are above 1k. This means that the bulk of users are running some relatively light specs in the grand scheme. It goes to show that we are getting closer and closer to working fully in the cloud actually making sense.
Dude you really didn’t believe this bullshit? I mean IBM thinkpads are above 1000 dollars and are all around. I see them everywhere, more than Mac even in Starbucks. So please before you drink the juice freaking learn add. Now if you want to confirm someone posted the DEbunking of this… here ya go…
http://news.yco.../item?id=719631
Nick, because YOU see them everywhere, and even more so in Starbucks doesn’t make the statistics false. I wonder if you even understand how polls/statistics are carried out?
There is very little details about this so-called report from NPD.
Apple sold 2.6M computers in Q3.
ASP of Apple computers = 1400$
2.6M x 1400$ (ASP) = 3.64B$.
Using NPD numbers, this 3.64B$ is 90% of the total gross revenu of the sales of 1000$+ computers. So total gross revenu of 1000$+ computers would be 4.044B$.
10% of 4.044B$ = 404M$. That would be the total gross revenue of non-Mac PCs costing 1000$+. We already see how ridiculous this “report” is.
Now assuming the ASP of non-Mac PCs costing more than 999$ is 1000$, that would mean *all* PC manufacturers have sold only ~404K PCs costing 1000$+, per quarter, worldwide. (If we have used an higher ASP for non-Mac PCs costing more than 999$, we would have an even lower number of units sold per quarter.)
According to this article:
http://www.elec...30;..m.q2.2009/
the total computers shipment worldwide in the Q2 was 66M units. Minus, say, 3M Macs and you have 63M PCs sold worldwide. Out of total 63M units, only 404K units were priced at 1000$+? Worldwide???
That doesn’t make sense at all.
Again, there are lots of unknowns about this “report”. But Apple fanboys and the tech media (Apple stories make money) are feeding on it no questions asked.
File this as Apple propaganda.
Naaa… study makes total sense…
How many people do you know that own PC’s… almost everybody… cool.
Of those “everybody” how many of them spent over a grand on it?…. about 10%… sounds bout right.
How many people do you know that own Macs… just a couple… cool.
Of those “couple” how many of em paid over a grand? All of em….
There you go.
10% of “everybody” is much more than 100% of a couple of people.
There you go.
Haha. I can’t believe the love TC has for Apple. Try again MG… your posts are getting ridiculous by the day…
You = love TC
TC = love Apple
Simple Algebra therefore proves that:
You = love to love Apple.
You biased bastard!
Every iPhone is a Mac – as time goes on folks will see desktops as workstations, thus Apple is in the right space for the long run. However if you sell cheap desktop machines Chrome will kill you – so I’d be more worried about the fate of Windows as an OS.
The commercials make sense in my mind. Consumers aren’t fully rational and if they are surrounded by others with macs, they might decide they have to have a mac (And also don’t realize how cheap PCs can be). The commercials remind them (over and over) that computers can be had for under $1000.
I think your theory has some weight. iPhones are taken with you and therefore are exposed to more people (who want to be cool like you). Your desktop/laptop mostly stays at home, but your immediate friends/family will still see it and will be influenced.
I don’t know if the commercials sway this one way or the other, but it does re-enforce the “frugal” values people have.
Watch out folks, iPhone and the App Store’s success is ensuring that more and more developers are developing on Macs. As the momentum picks up, the Mac numbers will become huge. Just wait a few quarters, there is going to be a big surge in Mac sales. I guess every iPhone will end up selling 2 Macs
There is no iPhone SDK for windows?
Unfortunately, no… Apple are driving computer sales by tempting people with the prospects of riches through $1 apps.
iPhone development can only be done on a Mac
And what if you’re a consumer who doesn’t know what you want? Isn’t that who those commercials are targeting too?
even if a consumer doesn’t know what they want, i’d have to imagine they have a price point in mind. those commercials have basically nothing to do with features (windows isn’t even mentioned til the end), it’s all about price. so are you saying consumers need a commercial to tell them how much want to spend?
Actually, absolutely. I have had many family friends ask me to help them buy/build computers (usually for a young son or daughter). I’d ask “how much do you want to spend?” And they’d more often than not respond with: “I have no idea? What do we need? What’s good enough?” etc.
What I’m saying is, not everyone will have a price in mind. And these commercials can suggest to them that the price could/should be under $1000.
Sadly, a lot of consumers have absolutely no idea what they want when it comes to computers.
They have a vaguely range of price point, but that number usually can be swayed quite effortlessly, just use any combination of three current buzz-words ( Twitter, video-sharing, portability etc ), then you demand they obey. unless there are real financial difficulties.
When asked, I always deploy this routine to get my relatives/friends to switch to Mac, and I have been successful.
They paid more ( sometimes way more than they initially willing to shell out), got a neat new machine. Saved me tones of free tech supports.
This article so made me laugh. I agree with Josiah. This is totally buying in Apple’s spin. There is nothing that shows the hardware that Mac’s use are of a better quality then what a PC uses especially since they use a lot of the same parts and OSX will work just as well on a home brew Mac.
Apple charges more for their pc’s and laptops because consumers are willing to pay more. They by into the hype that because it costs more it mus be better.
I have a 17″ widescreen laptop with blueray and HDMI, 4 gigs of ram and a terabyte of hard drive space. i paid $1100 for it. are you telling me that that’s not as good as a Mac? Did i get less quality? I don’t think so. It runs great and I haven’t had any problems with it. Plus, I got a 2 year warranty from Costco.
First of all, NPD obviously has no affiliation with Apple so it’d be a bit odd if they were doing “spin” for them based on data. Second, certainly which computer you think is better is subjective, I’m mainly saying that Apple is perfectly content to own the high-margin market – even marking up its computers more than it needs to, like you point out. That’s the game it’s playing.
i was referring more to your article and how it ignores some key points. Points that have already been mentioned a few times now. Less then 10% of the market consists of laptops over $1k so 91% of less then 10% is not a great stat to be proud of.
Let me know how that works out for you in two years with the virus’s, fan noise, oh and that upgrade to Windows 7, the blue screen of death, the hooking up of you new printers, cameras, etc…
Apple products just work. Bought a new 3Gs last weekend and needed to move everything over from the orig. iPhone.
I was expecting to swap out sim card, lose some apps, lose my settings, lose my pref. but it took about 5 minutes to sync up and that was just for the files to come across, clicking the sync button took about .25 seconds.
When it finished I clicked call home and it worked. Not one hiccup.
The same thing happened when I upgrade my OS on my MBP. Put in the cd ran it done. Everything was where I left it. My printers worked, my camera worked, etc…
Flawless!
Oh, and anyone reading this post don’t take advice from anyone who hasn’t owned a MAC in the last 5 years and a PC.
Perceived quality? Seriously?
Yeah, but try and step outside of how Apple deems you should use computers and see what happens. I think only a fool would deny the great UI and usability of Apple products, but some of us strive for more control and flexibility. Windows does offer that – not as much as Linux, but most people aren’t geeks.
I often step outside the ‘Apple control’ and I’m just fine. It’s built on top of Unix and there is a terminal just like Windows and Linux.
Running MAMP for test sites, using terminal for mysql, etc.
I really don’t know what you could possibly need to control that you’re not allowed to with an apple. Have you used OS X? It’s a better organized OS built on top of a great kernel.
If you’re referring to hardware, then yes, you can’t build your own machine. But that allows Apple to control pricing and components.
Agreed! I use Ubuntu at work and Mac at home and I love how seamlessly I can work between them. Most things that I can do on Linux also work on mac even though they might not be part of “Apple’s Control” or things normal users would do. The underlying framework of OSX is rock solid and it’s flexible enough to handle whatever you want to throw at it.
Being a PC advocate for years before switching to Mac it was hard to see Apple users as anything other than fanboys. But once you take the plunge to the Apple side, it only take a couple weeks before even the biggest PC lovers will be mac fanboys too. We are vocal and “obsessed” because the product is just THAT good. You can’t understand that until you try it.
I’m a geek… and prefer Apple to maintain my geekdom. I can control every aspect of everything my computer does…. all within terminal.
@John.
Absolute FUD.
If you had a BSD background you would not be spreading such lame rumours.
But you haven’t. Your argument is baseless.
I’ve been using computers since 1984. It’s not like I’m a novice. I don’t know what your talking about fan noise. My HP dv7 is super quiet, my other laptops have been, too. And blue screen of death? I’ve only seen it a couple of times in the past 5 years and that was because i was using a sketchy piece of software. If your smart and don’t buy crap hardware from the bargain bin it’s not an issue. Most BSOD’s are cause by bad drivers or bad software. For example, installing that packaged software you got with your new digital camera. It’s not necessary for it to work, Windows will recognize it as soon as you plug it in. And Macs have viruses/exploits, too. don’t be crazy.
One your next point. Sim Cards? Any gsm phone comes with sim cards and they all work the same. I have 4 or 5 gsm phones at home. When i get bored with one phone, i can swap the sim card to a new phone and all my contacts and other data goes with it.
Your last point, owning a mac. I have, my friend owned a mac. I do like them. There are pros and cons to both systems. My mac in california I sold two years ago. It had final cut pro, two 28″ (27″ maybe?) cinema screens, 8 gigs of ram and and 4 terabytes of hard drive space. it was a beautiful machine and i loved to just sit in front of it and stare. It seriously rocked and it was hella fast.
Both OS’s have their pros and cons, like I said. I don’t think Mac’s are worth the extra dollars you have to spend, though. It’s simple psychology. You raise the price to create perceived value. Windows big failure is that it is an open system that is hugely popular and has to work with every dick and jane’s hardware company and joe blow software company that writes some piece of crap driver or software application for it. so, when it crashes because of someone elses screw up they get the blame.
LOL i wish i could record the fan on my Thinkpad T60p I have for work. It’s sooo obnoxious. Lenovo is making shitty computers these days.
HaHaWaHa – “Windows big failure is that it is an open system” – HaHaWaHa. Sorry, that made me laugh way too much. Maybe after another 25 years you’ll understand the difference between open system and Windows.
I got a mac and a pc, the pc is 3 yrs old, no virus, just as fast as the mac, no bsod.
I guess you had to buy antivirus software for the PC, huh?
nope, I just know how to use computers.
Blue Screen of Death? What’s that? Virus? What’s that? I’ve never seen those on my PCs.
For the record we regularly get home clients who can’t hook up there new printer to a mac because there is no drivers. We have to then start messing around trying to get cups to work
When you talk about fan noise etc shall we list some of the faults apple have had over the last few years?
http://www.tuaw...urning-yellow/2
http://www.enga...ire-down-under/ I can only find that one example but I’m sure I read a few more articles about similar faults.
http://discussi...81&tstart=0 — Mac Book Air Hinge Defects
In fact I’m bored of finding these links just go to http://www.appledefects.com and browse.
Show me the same issues happening on that kind of scale with Dell, HP or IBM?
Good luck in two years with your MAC.
“This article so made me laugh. I agree with Josiah. This is totally buying in Apple’s spin. There is nothing that shows the hardware that Mac’s use are of a better quality then what a PC uses especially since they use a lot of the same parts and OSX will work just as well on a home brew Mac”
Only the way the whole thing is out together, like the enclosure, is better, I’ll admit that a some of the internals are the same. That being said, for an equivalent specced PC the price is pretty much the same. I just bought a 2.8Ghz 15″ Macbook Pro, for me to put together an exact same specced PC I had to do a high-end alienware gaming laptop that was the EXACT same price at $2,000. The price difference is a myth especially now after the across the board drop of roughly $500. I am paying less now for a pro mac than I ever have going back 10 years.
Yeah, but there-in lies the point. You spec’ed an Alienware to match the Macbook, which (granted) makes the Macbook look like good/better value, but are you ‘really’ going to need things like the dual graphics cards and the other pros/limitations when if you’re after a well spec’ed laptop you can get just as good in the grand scheme of things for much less?
Exactly. The main reason people buy a Mac is because of all the media hype. Apple reported that they sold 5.2 millions iPhones last quarter. Do you think those people bought those phones because they did the research and found that the hardware is better? No! It’s because it’s the “cool” phone to buy.
Of course, the iPhone happens to be a leader in technology, but the same principle applies to the Macs. People don’t care what’s in them. As long as it has the Apple logo, they’ll buy it.
Apple as a company is some of the most arrogant people I’ve seen and they have a way of instilling that in their true devotees.
Who’s the fool here, the one who spends $600 on a laptop that has everything they need or the one who spends $1000 simply because it’s cooler?
LOL, +1
Uhm, we’re fan boy geeks; cooler is best, always. Duh!
J.
Sorry, sweetie, but no $600 laptop could ever have “everything I need” as long as it runs Windows.
Centrino or Duo processor? How fast is the processor? The front-side bus? DDR2 or DDR3 RAM? Integrated or discrete video?
Yeah, I’m willing to bet that a $1,100 computer from Costco isn’t as good as a Mac.
This makes some sense, but the $1000 price cutoff is strange. I imagine if you drop that price cutoff even by 20% (to 800) the market share of PCs would be much higher. The reason mac dominates the +1000 market share is because it is hard to find a PC, even really good PCs, that are that expensive. You basically have to be talking about a gaming rig (which is nice and has its place) to be getting past $1000 for a PC. If you want to spend that much, great…but it doesn’t make any sense to do so for 99% of the market (and it doesn’t make any sense for most mac users since a $900 PC gives you more than enough power). The only reason to spend more than $1000 on a computer is if you are a gamer or a professional video editor…and those systems cost well over $2000 and should not even be considered in the same category.
Basically, these numbers simply prove that there is a high mac-tax to be paid.
Would I like to have a super expensive computer compared to a less expensive one…sure…but for what I need (minor video editing, photoshop, etc.) a $800 desktop is plenty of power for now.
I just got a Dell XPS Studio 13 with Intel Core 2 Duo P9600 (2.66GHz/1066Mhz FSB/6M L2 Cache), 4 GB DDR3 1067 MHz 2 RAM, NVIDIA® GeForce® 9500M SLI and 120 GB Solid State drive all for $1350. This is better than any 13 inch MAC out there no matter at what price point. So it is really stupid to say that MAC has better high end computer. They have mindshare and perception on their side and they were also helped by poor MS marketing till now.
My two favorite laptops are the dell xps and the apple macbookpro (I own the latter). When it comes to buying ‘premium’ computers, I think more people would prefer a premium os. I just recommended an hp dv7 ($1400) for a client. I set it up for her but just didn’t understand why anyone would pay that much for a computer running vista (no matter how great the hardware).
That’s what I was thinking, I own a MBP for development/testing purposes, and while it’s a nice piece of hardware, I can’t understand why anyone would pay that much for a Mac purely for the OS. Ubuntu blows OSX out of the water.
Ubuntu blows OSX out of the water? BUAHAHAHAH.
That’s what I said.
Your dell is made of plastic. I bet you can put some nice engine upgrades in your Saturn too…. its still a saturn and its still a dell. I own a 3 year old macbook pro… and it still kicks ass. I own a 6 month old Alienware m15x (DELL!) and it renders games well but still has a cheap plastic body… and cost more then my macbook did at that.
Dell have used magnesium chassis and aluminium in their top-spec laptops for ages now.
Granted they don’t have the Alu-unibody, but then so what? They cost half the price!
I believe that apple will never be mainstream. You can’t be mainstream and have high quality product.
10% of people are holding 90% of all money in the world. And that is a sweet spot where Apple wants to stay.
2 years ago I switched all my computers in company, 4 of them, to macs and only wild horses could drag them away and replace with PC
The 91% number is clearly wrong. Think about it — most computers are purchased by businesses, and most of those are Windows PCs. It may be true of computers purchased in retail stores, given Apple’s wide retail footprint, but that’s a somewhat meaningless distinction.
not only that but what about those high end Dells and Lenovo(Thinkpads amongs the most popular in business). Every Hp Pc i liked has been above the 1,000 dollar range and let’s not even bring Sony into this cause we all know their price range.
That’s because these stats were taken only at retail stores. Most businesses by their bulk orders at online stores or order direct, so they wouldn’t be counted. I’m guessing even at the $1000+ level, if you counted online and direct sales (given your point about businesses ordering the VAST amount of those notebooks), Apple’s marketshare would be below 50%, maybe far below.
Apple caters more to ‘non techy’ people who want a ‘great’ computer but dont want to go through the hassle of customizing, downloading, and option setting their computers. You can do everything a mac can on a low end computer, but requires more strain such as finding the right ‘duplicate’ products and going through the hassle of installations and possible bugs.
For the range that Apple is fighting for, theres like an inverse relationship with Microsoft in comparison to what I just said up there; the 1k market Microsoft wins with educated tech people; buying custom, hardcore components which easily match if not way exceed the performance of macs in that range, whereas Apple’s core audience are not techys but rather have everything set out and running.
I think you would be surprised to find out that a large portion of “educated tech people” are choosing Macs over PCs in many industries including web/software development, graphic design, video editing, etc. Most of the educated tech people I know (I’m a computer engineer) are either using macs, or wish they could use them for their jobs. The exception would be those people are are also heavily into gaming.
That’s interesting about software developing. I guess that there are more software developed for PC than for Mac and it still going to be like this. So, software engineers use PC with Windows or Linux for this purposes. In graphic design and video editing PC definitely sucks.
MG – I wouldn’t say that “The Mac Versus PC Debate Has Never Been Clearer” this clarifies some market share questions. But the ease of use [for a person that doesn't know what the hell all those specs that @Rohit listed are] is still an issue. Macs are still more user friendly. Unless you’re a .Net dev.
That statistic is misleading. First of all, unless you know how big the premium “pie” is, it could be that the revenue of the premium market is 5% of the overall PC market, which would mean Apple is a big fish in a little pond.
Funny how the original article and this TC article both lack that critical piece of data.
As I note, the point of the post is not to see how big the overall premium “pie” is (market share). Apple is making billions of dollars each year of its share of that piece of the pie, it simply doesn’t matter how big or small it is here.
Well Siegler as much a great writer that you are but a horrible fanboy, I think you failed to make your point.
Totally agree. MG might as well work for Goog and Apple. I hate reading his garbage, but I like scanning through the comments to see if others see the constant fanboy too.
Yes, but the misleading part of the statistic is related to the decline of the size of that “premium” slice, so it does matter how big or small.
For example, you state that Apple makes billions because 9 out of every 10 dollars is used on one of their products. But as the proportion of people purchasing $1000+ laptops decreases, even if they get 19 of every 20 dollars or 49 of every 50 dollars, the total amount of money is slowly decreasing.
The point is, Microsoft is saying “The price point of a laptop that does what you need is below $1000. Will your best choice be a PC, or a Mac?” And the answer right now is clearly PC, because there just isn’t a good solution for Mac at sub-$1000 range. The Laptop Hunters commercials say this every time – that if you’re “normal” then the price point for a laptop has dropped for you, and the only reason to buy a Mac is “aesthetics” or “software”.
“it simply doesn’t matter how big or small it is here.”
Yeah, right.
And guess what, Apple has 100% market share of all the Macs being sold in all the price ranges.
PCs, Macs, they’re both computers. Buy the one you like and get on with your life.
+1
+2
+3 and oh MG Seigler totally sucks.
best comment in the whole section right after miguel alvarez’s “because i know how to use my computer” response.
the way i see it i think it is ultimately a fight about thinking process and the way a person behaves. i’m not the smartest person and i can tell i am out of my league coming to TC and reading all these postings to become more knowledgable about tech…but i actually learn more from the comments section than the actual articles themselves. no offense to TC. i am an average end user and i grew up on the pc, but i use mac’s for art class at school and my art job, but i use a pc at home. my pc’s & dell, toshiba, hp laptops has never given me the problems that apple users often think they do…just like when i use the mac’s at school or work i’v e actually experienced some of the failures apple users would often like to sling at pc’s. it’s about the hardware. if you know your computer you are likely to know how to be a better user to avoid all the pitfalls…and that goes for both apple products and pc’s. while the average consumer probably won’t think further than what is presented in some commercials, people who use their brains will purchase either a pc, or a mac depending on the benefits the product provides for the consumers needs. the whole point is that it doesn’t matter. it’s an endless circular argument that i think needs to be layed down. i never bought the apple commercials, although the always made me laugh and i think they are very smart in recognizing ms inability to market itself better, but anyone who likes to use their mind and asses what personally benefits them, will work out that you don’t need to pay X amount to purchase the latest apple gadget. it makes no sense. stick to whatever works best. also the article is a little interesting, like some have pointed out because is this about the actual hardware or about the os systems.
because if so then that’s two different arguments. i think people have already pointed this out.
i also like the parching of words but that 91% number although sounds sensible in this article seems a little dubious and i think people have pointed out why as well. yeah apple is a premium brand and sells to premium buyers, and yeah it definately has the market and the influence&affluence behind it, but that means that lol there’s only 1% left for all the other computer companies that sell their laptops and desktops in the same price points as everything apple…i don’t think it works out. i never knew dell was so out of fashion. it must mean that all businesses have switched from whatever computer brand they use and have gone apple. that’s kind of hard to believe.
Surely you would think that for those ridiculous prices, Apple could afford to give you TWO mouse buttons.
You’re joking, right? The Apple mouse does come with two buttons… no, make that 5 buttons. Why does this stupid myth persist that the Apple mouse only has one button? Good grief!
he meant to say to useful buttons!
because for a long time it did and it was fun for people to joke about and needle fanboys. just like fanboys like to say “windoze” or “windo$e” or complain about BSODs which rarely happen in the real world. if you can’t handle a little needling then you better quit reading mac vs pc articles (i mean flamebait).
You forgot M$.
just like all the the myths that are still out there concerning pc’s and apples.
the mouse design is not my taste, but even i know lol that that the mouse has been updated.
The life of Brian
Pretty ridiculous you are comparing a a windows-based PC to a Toyota Camry and a Mac to a Porsche.
I have used both for everything from everyday tasks to Web-design and all types of media editing and I was thoroughly unimpressed with the Mac.
That said, I love my iPhone, but I wouldn’t come near a Mac with a 10-foot pole if I could avoid it.
Not much of a designer are you
HAHAHAHAHA….
thoroughly unimpressed with the mac for media editing? is that a joke? you sound like lauren the ‘filmmaker’ who uses movie maker lol.
hahahaha +1
Except that Porsche just fired their CEO and CFO because they are bleeding cash and need to merge with VW. Which, if you take the analogy to its extreme and remember where VW came from, you could say that Apple will eventually merge into Microsoft!
fair enough. insert any other premium car brand of your liking, or consider it porsche of the previous decade
If the author says that M$ ads are ridiculous for the reasons he gives. What about the Apple ads? I do not see Porshe luring Camry/Accord buyers. Both are ridiculous ads based on the analogy, author is just showing his bias nothing else.
Sanjath, you can’t be serious?! I’ve had many a laughs at the BMW commercials talking about how crappy Kia’s are, and I just love the spoof ads Volvo ran that mocked Oldsmobile.
I have not seen any of them, but I am not ruling them out. My point is if the author claims that M$ ads are ridiculous for showing price conscious customers comparing Mac with PC, other thing is also true! But, I think M$ ads do make more sense in this analogy, because the ad is trying to say “you get more for your money”, whether that is true or not is a different point. But ads are to the point! (guess beyond comprehension of Apple fanboys!)
I’ll echo what several others have said here. I’m a PC guy, but no fanboy. I have no particular hatred or loathing for Apple (I have an iphone, for example). But the commercial pc commercials DO resonate with a lot of people. Not because of marketshare – people don’t buy products to improve the marketshare of the company, or to hurt a competitors. They buy products that fit their needs and offers the best bang for their hard earned buck. These commercials point out some of the key factors that a vast majority of buyers what – Large screen, enough RAM and CPU to make their computing chores tolerable at a reasonable price. These commercials show that you don’t need to spend over a grand to get that with a PC, but you simply can’t do it in the Mac world. Would we all enjoy being given a Porsche? Absolutely, but when it comes to spending our own money, most of us don’t buy Porsches.
This is made evident twice in this article. First, Macs still maintain a single digit overall marketshare, but a whopping 90% marketshare of $1000+ notebooks. This shows that a small fraction of all consumers spend less than $1000 on their notebooks, and since Apple refuses to offer a decent set of stats at a reasonable price, only the rich and frivolous are prone to buy Macs.
That single digit marketshare, btw, is the reason there’s so little software for Macs vs PC. As long as they keep ignoring marketshare, that will always be the case. And Apple, more than anyone, should see from the iPhone app store that ‘Applications are King’. They will ALWAYS be the redheaded step-child of computing until they realize that.
Why is there no ‘edit’ feature on these blog comments? My god, I butchered the English language in that post
yes. you did.
Huh? I think the applications available for the Mac are better than the applications available for the PC. They also seem to be cheaper. There seems to be a group of high quality, fanatical developers, like “Smile on my Mac”, that develop great, low-cost apps exclusively for the Mac platform. Plus, since the inception of OSX, Mac users and the Mac development community have access to the wealth of code assembled by Unix community, which with very little, if any, modification can be run on a Mac.
“…a way to think about it is if Windows-based PCs as a whole are thought of as a top selling car like the Toyota Camry, Apple’s Mac computers would be more like a luxury car, like a Porsche.”
I didn’t quite buy in to the Camry analogy. Those things have been rated high in quality for their class over the years. Maybe if you said Ford Focus or possibly Honda Civic instead…
Heh sure, as with the Porsche, insert any low-priced car in there
But not all low priced cars are crap… the Camry is a great car, as are some low priced PC’s… I think that’s the point of the article. Apple just knows a shopper in the market for a cheap car won’t venture onto a lexus lot, and that’s fine with them.
Well all OS’ have their flaws, and yes Mac Do Crash (if not explain to me that kernel panic on your screen.. right) So I do not get the great debate because people have certain needs to what machine they need. There is no war only fanboys.
I like to add whatever components i wish when building a PC…..and I can build a waaayyyy more powerful machine than any MAC out there for at least $500 cheaper.
So why isn’t there a report on how powerful a machine you can buy vs price?
It all depends on what your priorities are. For some people (like yourself apparently) you are concerned mostly with power. Other care about software/OS. Some people care about the physical build of the laptop (look, feel, noise, etc). There’s always compromises when you build a machine that has raw power… it might be cheaper but maybe the case isnt as sturdy or you have to run Vista….. If you buy a Mac you aren’t getting the customizable options that you get with a PC and maybe not the full range of ‘power’ options either. But, the other benefits are seamless hardware/software integration, a sleek design, and Mac OSX. It’s all about trade offs.
High end components and Ubuntu. It’s time for the world to embrace the nerdy world of Linux…
Pssst…MG, you spend so much time MS bashing that your getting out scoped on other blogs.
Even as I post!!!
“scoped”? sounds painful.
haha
….I expected Techcrunch to copy this story. But what made me sad was that non of the other blogs / news sites thought about doing a little research / digging.
For instance a call to suppliers… A few good friends of mine work at global suppliers for the PC industry and they told me this does not seem right. What about the VAIO product line or the Lenovos above USD 1,000) 10% Market Share..?
Glad that at least in some forums you find some answers as to how the study was done… http://news.yco...=719631< thanks for the link: @josiahcole
You’re confusing market share with revenue share.
Jeez it’s not like you ever misspell words …rolling eyes…
There’s not much of a difference between the two when the market is segmented by price.
I.e.
91% market share of >$1,000 PCs is probably close to 91% revenue share.
But “retail” only is significant modifier, because when you take enterprise into account there’s no way Macs have a 91% share.
This statistic is utter garbage. First of all, as a few others pointed out, it’s retail stores only. I don’t have any hard numbers but I’d say it’s completely reasonable to assume that at least half of all computer sales are over the internet.
Second, where the hell do you find a PC for over $1000? They are few and far between, and many of the ones under $1000 are perfectly great computers. Not the cheapo $300-$500 range, but starting around $700 you can get some damn nice computers (laptop or desktop) on the PC side. Even if you could find a PC for over $1000, there’s generally just no need to spend that much.
Like I said, this statistic is pure bullshit, and typical Apple marketing.
I love the way it paints pc’s as cheap… and mac’s as superior? Yes there are some very cheap pc’s… but there are also some high quality pc’s?! I mean Northwest falcon builds some really great pc notebooks… i would not consider them cheap, actually would consider them higher end then mac’s.
Got to love MG’s Apple fan-boyism and smugness.
Apple also sold 100% of the Apple computers bought last quarter.
That $1000 line is a misleading one to draw if the average sold price of all brands is much lower.
This is actually a fantastic “out-of-the-box” tell-it-as-it-is analysis. Good work MG!
It’s a simple concept that many don’t understand and you put it plainly in words with a great example
The only problem with your analysis is the fact that Apple has been relying on anti-PC and anti-Windows ads for years now. If Apple really was catering to a different market, they wouldn’t be attacking Microsoft and PCs, just as Porsche doesn’t compare itself to anything made by Toyota.
Following the logic of this blog post, it furthers the perception that Apple is for elitist while PCs are for the mass. The consumerization of the PCs has done more bood for business, education and consumer markets than Apple could, yet you think that is a bad thing? Ridiculous.
Let’s make this more real: while Apple may have a 91% share of the $1,000+ market, that matter little to consumers, developers, h/w manufactures, ISVs, etc. that want to sell their products to the masses.
If Apple is satisfied with being the big fish in a small pond, so be it. But there’s no reason for everyone else to jump in there with them, and the overall PC penetration in the market proves that the majority isn’t willing to.
I work in both worlds daily and have for years. I find that both platforms have pros and cons. I do find the Apple experience cleaner, UI fresher and more intuitive and certainly the upgrade process (OS) waaayyy simpler on Mac (OS 7 to 8 to 9 to OS X and now in Leopard) than what I experienced going from XP to Vista to Windows 7.
When I need a cheap machine – I buy a Dell or a netbook. For my primary critical and premium machine I always buy Mac. They both do their jobs (writing this on a Dell running XP in IE 8).
This is a worthless, wildly uninformed article.
Macs don’t corner the low end market simply because they’re hideously overpriced. That’s not an opinion, it’s a fact that can be backed up by countless spec/price comparisons. PCs don’t corner the high end market because they have a disjoint marketing department.
The only excuse Apple can offer for its extravagant prices is that Macbooks have a hardy exterior design. But it’s not enough justification, and for desktops, it’s a moot point. Internally, Macs are just as prone to malfunction as PCs. I work for a university’s IT support, and we get just as many Macs as we do PCs in our hardware repair shop, perhaps just as many Macs as THINKPADs.
Besides, price isn’t even the main debate in the Mac vs. PC “war”. Macs offer a few benefits over a PC: its unix environment, and its user-friendliness. This interestingly makes it desirable for the strongest and weakest computer users on the market. However a strong computer user who does more than monkey with code is going to want configurability (on a UI) and, more importantly, compatibility that exists in a windows machine. Weak users can make an argument for a Mac, but why do they want an expensive computer if they can’t use it well (and can’t play most retail games on it)? Essentially, Microsoft has just as good of an argument as Apple for Apple’s PRIME constituency!
you just explained why i don’t have a mac and why i have a pc at home. i use macs at school and work along with pc’s and i agree about the user benefits and streamlined, but i want to know how to use my computer…i don’t want my computer to do all the work for me and basically hold my hand and lead me through the navigation of the os. there’s two different arguments and it’s pc hardware vs apple hardware, then ms os and apple os. because like it’s already been mentioned people can go and purchase a computer or build a computer and be very happy with what they have never buying an apple computer in their lifetime. it’s not that inconceivable. apple is good for some things and ms is also good for some things. i think those i’m a mac commercials although beneficial to apple’s pockets kind of did a disservice to people everywhere who like to use their brains to discern facts instead of having psuedo facts presented to them. it’s too easy.
Microsoft makes software so the dollar share of the PC market is less important to them than the unit share. The one issue with PCs moving down in price is that it likely puts pressure on what Microsoft can charge for their Windows and Office software.
And according to the BetaNews article you cite, the PC share of unit volume is over 90 percent. That’s not a bad number for Microsoft to target with its operating system and software.
Most of the Windows people here are missing the overall big picture. Apple sells a premium product for a premium price. And because of this, they are reaping large profit margins. The big PC sellers, Dell, HP, Acer, etc are left fighting over the remaining very price sensitive market on which the margins are very slim. As a result of that, many of the PC makers only make money by selling a lot of units. When the economy goes bad, or they can’t compete on the price as good as their competitor, they get in trouble really quickly. Look at how bad Dell has been doing lately. This is the direct result of them fighting for the bottom of the barrel. Look at how Dell purchased Alienware, I doubt that purchasing them has helped them at all. Most serious gamers (who spend way more than $1000 on their computers) tend to build them up themselves. Its a rough market for PC makers out there, all of them would love to have the profit margins that Apple enjoys.
Yeah… one thing I see run constant amongst Window’s users is hater-ism. But its expected. When you have frustrations with your life you take it out on those that don’t deal with that frustration. Same way gang bangers take out their frustrations of their living conditions with those who live in the suburbs. Makes sense… It takes to much energy to engage in an argument over which billion dollar company cares about us more… so I sit back and watch the spew spew so to speak. Great article MG.
Yeah… Try going on any message board and mention a single negative thing about Macs and see how much hate you get back. Just something simple like “Mac cost to much lolz!!1″ Just watch how irate your suburban dwelling peace loving crowd gets. If anything I see much more knee-jerk defensiveness and deep seeded anger issues from the people who dumped $1400 on a laptop. People with lots of money have just as many frustrations in life than those without it. But I don’t think you know anything more about that than you know about why gang-bangers do what they do.
you don’t know shit about me or what I know… I just served 5 years in the Feds and wouldn’t have made that comment if I didn’t have reasoning to base it on… again, spew your spew…. It’s fun to watch.
and this can be thrown right back at apple users. it’s the same both ways.
More fanboy rants on Techcrunch? I’m shocked, no seriously I am, honest…
I’m going to bet there will be a Twitter post in the next 24hrs too. The Register is clearly the better option for “quality posts over quantity” once again.
Your assumption is wrong. People, in general, don’t know that Macs are more expensive and is a premium brand. Us techies do.
The commercial is great at pointing that out. If you’re just looking for a computer, and you want it cheap, than PC’s are the way to go.
It’s almost like the Mac commercials. We techies know that Macs are less buggy and are easier to use (for non-techies), so why have those commercials? Again, same deal – techies know it, but your average joe doesn’t.
speaking as an average person with no tech experience, i would say you probably think that most people have fallen for the apple commercials and talking points about their products and i have to say that isn’t the case. if people didn’t know that macs are more expensive and a premium brand, why is it that when i go to a computer store i see people avoiding the mac sections and i overhear them saying oh this looks so cool and it works so well but i can’t afford this price…and then see them heading over to look at hp’s, sony, toshiba, acer, plus other computers, some definately cheaper than the mac’s offered but some also just as expensive as a mac laptop. i would rather build my own computer than purchase a mac desktop.
i think average consumers also know that macs are more user friendly and more streamlined, but their customer service isn’t all that they rave about. i use pc’s at home, and macs at school and work and i’ve never made the switch to actually purchasing a mac, even if i can afford it. i actually don’t own anything apple…nothing against them. i love their commercials and i think their ad department and their pr are top notch…but i don’t like being spoken to as a consumer as someone who doesn’t know anything. i would rather research something/test something before i buy it and i buy according to what i need. people always say well are you comfortable with that lod fan noise you get from pc’s…and i always think what fan noise. geez. and always this blue screen of death deal. same with people switching from ctrl+x to commands…and it’s all just really dumb. mac’s are good and so are pc’s. apple os & ms os are just as good and poor as well. it’s all relative.
Apple wouldn’t be around long if they relied on that 91% of the overpriced computer segment you’re praising as a genius strategy. The market for $1,000+ computers is shrinking rapidly, and getting smaller every day. As people get less wasteful they are realizing quiickly that all they really need is something to get on the internet, take care of some business, stay in contact with friends, watch a movie or two. More and more stuff like this is done entirely on the web, and before long it’s going to be the norm. Selling $1000+ computers is not a wining strategy long term and it’s definitely not the future anymore. Sure some people will buy them, but not in big enough numbers to sustain a large company like Apple, no matter what the margins are.
The reason they are still posting big numbers is because of the affordable devices they still sell– iPhones and iPods. They manage to keep an elite profile with these devices, yet appeal to the masses at the same time. They’ll need to figure out a way to sell more stuff like this I think if they want to continue the success they’re used to.
Nobody mentioned that the MBP’s have a pretty much metal housing. All aluminum. This is a cost consideration. Other than the Toughbooks (which, interestingly are in the same price range as MBP) is there any other metal laptops? Oh yeah, TWO video cards in it too. I use PC at work, but its real humorous that my PC app runs more efficient on my MBP in Parallels (AutoCAD).
Dear Geeks:
This isn’t an article about which is better, PC’s or Macs. You can argue amongst yourselves until you put the rest of us to sleep.
This is an article about which is more profitable — not overall sales, not overall market share, but PROFIT. As in margins. As in return on investment. As in, Apple is a more profitable business for its investors than any other computer company.
Stop whining and go back to scanning your PC’s for malware.
You can make a great profit on certain things, but if you don’t sell enough of them it’s not going to matter. You can get a great return on investment, but if the market for the product gets too small, a business isn’t going to be able to sustain itself. No matter how great the profit margin is, you still need to sell a certain number of them in order to remain solvent. The way the market is trending for just about everything, people are buying fewer and fewer big ticket items when there are cheaper alternatives.
As for the malware comment, you’re only making yourself look like a typical overly defensive Mac owner who’s not really thinking. No one’s talking about that, just about the future of the computer industry.
Overly defensive? I was joking. You know, humor. Wit. Sarcasm. Should I have put a smiley on it so you could understand?
Who’s overly defensive here?
And, uh, look, Apple’s also selling a lot of computers at high prices, too. Lots and lots and lots of them. Conclusion: Apple rocks.
You may go back to scanning for malware now.
P.S. I own both a Mac and a PC. I think PC stands for “Piece o’ Crap.”
Mac stands for “Made of Crap”.
um… you’re missing a letter.
MAde of Crap.
There you go.
I think its not only a question of Apple being profitable for investors – In my old company we boosted yearly revenue a healthy 700% switching to the mac platform. I know this is very selective, but it worked for us – and for some reason the macs seem to last longer. We still have some Colour Classics up and running – I don’t see many 486 around anymore
M$ cutting 5000 jobs
Well, I just went through this whole computer search and wound up with a Sony VAIO based on screen, mainly. In a side-by-side (thanks, Best Buy), it was superior to all, including Macs…low-end Sony better than high-end everyone in that dept, and since I have to stare at it all day…. BUT. Trackpad on Mac was nicer, once I figured out how to set it for tapping and right-clicking. Keyboard nicer. Size v. nice. Chassis nicer than all but high-end Sony. And battery life better than all but Acer. Would have bought an Acer Timeline but store manager @Staples talked me out of it based on customer returns (overheating/hard disk errors). What I found was that the MacBook Pro 13” @$1300ish at top of price range, but not totally out of line vs peers really (compare to SONY SR) when you factor in proc speed/quality, graphics card, DDR3 ram, battery life, etc. It’s hard to find a PC config’d with all the components Macs come standard with. You end up with, yes an Intel Duo Core T6500 but DDR2 ram and integrated graphics or something. I got more RAM for my money in the end, but is it really faster? Even the PC guys says prob not with UNIX coding in the Mac OS. BUT, I get real Office (the Mac people completely lie when they say their Office is the same, which several of them did, looking me straight in the eye), and that matters to me.
I didn’t have any trouble with the Vaio recognizing MOST of my driver out of the box, but I wanted to run a LiveScribe Pulse SmartPen and there are all kinds of problems with the OEM (ArcSoft) Webcam drivers conflicting with that…and when I took the problem bloatware off, my router stopped connecting. So… it’s twoo… you don’t nec get plug and play capabilities with PCs. Not a PC issue per se, but you don’t know who you’re sleeping with OEM-wise. On the other hand, people say similar things with Macs and business software. As with Office, you might not get the functionality you want with grown-up applicaitons. So I spent a lot of time looking into this and came away with a big sense of WHATEVER. To me, Macs are good for what they are, but they’re kind of like Whole Foods…do some things incomparably well, but not exactly what they say they are, and they have this following that is kind of annoyingly smug for how uncritically adoring they are.
lol. very true. i have the same experience…not with the viao but with other pc’s and mac’s.
it depends on the user and also smart consumers. people just like not using their brains.
waste of time article
+1
obviously. but no it should be -1 just for the fact that the person actually thought about submitting that comment, and actually took time to type it out and click on add comment. geez.
Thanks for taking time out of your busy day to make that incredibly useful comment.