Third Degree given NJ who wanted Post Office money order
Posted by debito on August 18th, 2008
Hi Blog. Here’s something I got through email the other day. Anonymized, reproduced with permission. Debito in San Francisco
Debito, this a statement / comment …
Am I the only personl who absolutely HATES changing cash from yen to cash in the Post Office.
Just bought an item on E-Bay. Cost was $65.00. Watch. Person does not accept PayPal. Fine. Went to convert cash at the Post Office. Should be easy … right. Well, it was, yet again, a living hell.
Cost to convert from yen to dollars: 2000 yen.
Wasted well over 90 minutes there, and once it took over 3 hours to convert about $50 (they ran out of paper, machine needed to be cleaned, etc … total nightmare !).
I think they are either incompetent as hell, or they really hate me. I get there to change the cash. They want my Alien card. Fine. Once they got it, they contacted the City Hall to make certain I’m legal. I showed them my meishi which said I am full time at a university and explained I am a permanent resident of Japan. Nope. They could care less. Person spent forever on the telephone too. I went to the guy saying … can I head out to eat … will be back in 2 hours and perhaps you will be finished by then. Nope. Did not want me to leave.
I had to rewrite their damn paperwork numerous times — directions were confusing. They wanted my FULL name in the box, JOSEPH, and would not accept the name JOE. They wanted my middle name too, as it was on the Alien card. Why ??? They demanded my home address on the form and not my work address on the application form. They it was my home address in one area and my work address in another area of the form. I was really treated as a criminal there, far far worse than immigration at Narita ever treated me (never a problem w/ Japanese immigration). I think they ran the equivalent of a US FBI check on me, and to remind you this was only to convert a lousy $65.00.
And, then when all finished, and I spent just under 10,000 yen for the $65 money order (recall that extra 2000 yen charge) and wasted over 90 minutes. Then came the question. That QUESTION . They asked me what the cash was for. I said it was for a watch.
They then said to me: “Is it a North Korean watch?” (while making the cross sign meaning this would be illegal if it were). “WHAT !!” I screamed. I was FURIOUS! First, the person getting the MO was located in Texas, USA, as they checked the name and location on their money order perhaps over a thousand times. Second, the person’s name was “Johnson”, hardly a Korean name. And finally, even if the watch belonged to Kim Jong Ill himself, WHO DA F–K CARES !!!!!!
This is only for a damn $65 to purchase a friggin watch !!!!!
Anyway, point. Have you a better way to convert $65.00?
Thought about this, and here is my solution, and feel free to post this on your web site. I will head to the bank and purchase Traveler’s Checks. The lowest demonimation I can get is for $150 — three $50 Traveler’s Checks. Then I will get $100 in cash, all 1s, 5s, 10s, and 20s. All at the proper exchange rates. When I get an item on E-bay (and many sellers do not take personal checks or Pay pal), I will send them Traveler’s Checks worth $50 and the rest in cash. I will then send it via EMS, which is expensive but pretty safe, and moreover it allows me to avoid the ripoff charge of 2000 yen just to be harassed by those bigoted loser bureaucrats!!
Oh, just a note to you, and to anyone who chooses to read this should you post this on your website.
Oh, last note: If there is a problem with the Postal Money Order, it takes over 10 months, and perhaps longer to get a replacement. And yes, it happened to me. I sent to my credit card company about three years ago (before I set up direct transfer via the Internet) a letter along with the Postal Money Order. The Credit Card Co opened and read the letter and accidentally tossed the MO.
Fine.
I eventually worked it out w/ the credit card company. Went to the Post Office and wanted a replacement. They needed to do a “investigation” and this investigation would last about 10 months.
Nothing I could do to expedite the process at all. Of course, if I left Japan never to return, I’d never see the money again, that a guarantee.
OK, all to report for now. L8r. Joe
August 18th, 2008 at 11:59 pm
Uhm… ridiculous.
I don’t know where this person lives, but most banks in Tokyo do money exchanges no questions asked.
August 19th, 2008 at 3:02 am
Back up a minute. Money orders to sellers on eBay? No way. That’s an easy way for a fool and their money to be parted. Stick with credit cards–that way you can dispute the charges if there’s a problem. If the seller doesn’t take plastic, don’t mess around with them.
Easiest payment solution for a foreigner in Japan who has no overseas accounts and can’t get credit: Go to Suruga Bank and get an account with a VISA debit card.
That said, I have never gotten this sort of lousy treatment when requesting a postal money order in Tokyo, even for much higher amounts of money. In this sort of situation it’s probably best to speak to a manager.
August 19th, 2008 at 11:29 am
Joe, I am afraid you took the more arduous path on this one. The P.O. is a tad cumbersome for this kind of transaction, and not really suited for it. A M.O. on e-Bay is “iffy” too. The VISA Debit sounds like a good idea, but, surely there are other ways to do this? Surely? Worst case scenario, the fee for a bank draft is about the same at a chartered bank, and they don’t ask all the questions. Good luck next time!
August 19th, 2008 at 11:35 am
I’ve been changing yen to a USD money order at my same local post office in Tokyo for 10 years. I did the form the same way every time. No problems.
Then, the documents changed a little in 2008. The price increased. Now they copy my alien card every time, they also demand the exact name as it is written on my alien card (which no one knows me by).
I refused to do the exact name thing. Ten years, no problems I said. The first time I refused the name change, the lady explained the entire system to me in Japanese, most of the Japanese I did not understand. But it was loud enough to alert the seven people waiting in line.
Finally, to make this horror end, I gave in. I said, in Japanese, to show me exactly where to add my middle name. She explained and explained and then traced my name in the location! I scratched in my middle name. The two male clerks who always processed my money order without questions or troubles, were amused.
Since then, I have waited in line for these two guys and refused to go to the same woman. But now, the guys also insist on copying the alien card. (There’s going to be quite a pile of my alien card copies there.)
If you look at the money order form instructions, you’ll see it was changed in 2008 to require your exact name as it is on your official identification.
The form has always asked the purpose, which I believe is similar to the money transfer laws in the USA. So if it turns out you lied about the purpose on the form, something bad can happen to you.
I send the money to my bank. Don’t we mostly do that? I write “bank deposit”. They don’t understand. Sigh.
Once I made the mistake of writing “credit card payment”. Well, since the credit card system in Japan is different, the postal clerks need a long explanation about monthly payments.
Money order lost in the system? Happened to me once also. I started the investigation procedures, it took months. In the end, they could not confirm whether the money order had been processed and cashed.
August 19th, 2008 at 11:37 am
While there is no excuse for poor service, interpersonal skills go a long way towards preventing problems at the post office, or resolving them once they happen - it seems like Joe has a chip on his shoulder, and that may be part of the problem.
However, the staff at bank in small city where I used to live could be pretty annoying (giggling when the foreigner - me - came up to do a transaction), which is very unfortunate. You need a thick skin to live in Japan and good Japanese language skills.
August 19th, 2008 at 3:35 pm
don`t get me started on the ill-trained people at the post office when it comes to money orders. have been doing it for over 13 years and as of yet not a pleasant experience. i have sent money orders to sellers on e-bay and yahoo auctions also to my bank, credit card companies. now, out here in the provinces there are only 2 or 3 post offices in each city that is allowed to do them. you`d think that those 2 or 3 po`s would have trained their workers but….nooooooooooo.
a note to emily - this is postal money order. try it sometime - if you have a half a day you want to waste. banks and cash money on the other hand run quite smoothly.
August 19th, 2008 at 4:44 pm
I haven’t had any problems sending money home. They even give me the form and leave me to fill it , then only check it and take the money.They asked for my name as written on the ARC, but have never copied the card itself.
One of my friends, however, had pretty nasty experience. He is from Iran and just got his PhD in Architecture. They asked hime if the money will be used for nuclear research…But Joe’s experience tops it!
August 19th, 2008 at 7:04 pm
The red tape is due to international bureaucrats obsessed with fighting against money laundering after 9/11.
Financial Action Task Force on Money Laundering (FATF)
http://www.fatf-gafi.org/document/28/0,3343,en_32250379_32236930_33658140_1_1_1_1,00.html#Measures_to_be_taken
recommendation 5
Financial institutions should undertake customer due diligence measures, including identifying and verifying the identity of their customers, when:
carrying out occasional transactions: (i) above the applicable designated threshold; or (ii) that are wire transfers in the circumstances covered by the Interpretative Note to Special Recommendation VII;
Special Recommendation
VII. Wire transfers
Countries should take measures to require financial institutions, including money remitters, to include accurate and meaningful originator information (name, address and account number) on funds transfers and related messages that are sent, and the information should remain with the transfer or related message through the payment chain.
August 19th, 2008 at 10:56 pm
Governments are really putting the screws on banks and other organisations that deal with sending money across borders in terms of the information they now demand.
These demands need to be balanced with the need to provide good customer service. It appears that the post office has failed miserably on this occasion.