1v1: Shadow Priest vs. Frost Mage (with video)
One of the most balanced 1v1 fights in the game is:
1v1: Shadow Priest vs. Frost Mage
Before clicking on the download link, I would suggest that you read through the entire post, so you know what to look for, and how to not make the same mistakes I made.
So you don’t get bored before you get to the fights, I’ll list the most important things to note in a 1v1 with a frost mage.
1.) Ideally, you want to fear both the mage and his pet, even if it doesn’t break a cast. The earlier you get a fear off, the better (especially if it’s before he uses Freeze, but they usually cast that instantly so… whatever). If you have to decide between fearing the mage and his pet fear the pet.
2.) Shadow Word: Death the initial Polymorph(s). It sucks if he fakes it, but if he doesn’t then you’re screwed anyway.
3.) Use range to your advantage. You’re the one that can do damage while being a million yards away. Both him and his pet have to be in range to cast.
4.) Make a self dispel macro. Dispelling is like half of what you’re going to cast, and you don’t want to waste time targetting yourself and retargetting him. On top of this, always dispel everything off yourself, even Winter’s Chill (if it gets too high stacked anyway). The worst situation to be in is in a Nova or Freeze with a Frostbolt -> Icelance coming your way, and you have 5/5 Winter’s Chill, a Frostbolt, and a Nova debuff on you. That’s an almost sure way to lose. So dispel the dispel buffers and don’t be caught in a situation like that.
5.) In an arena situation, it’s much easier to 1v1 frost mages. There’s almost 0 chance of losing if you’re using line of sight to your advantage and you have sufficient gear. I’m saying this before people are like “Well, you can’t range in arenas, what are you going to do then!?”. The fact is, a 1v1 in a non-LOS area is the best environment for a frost mage to duel. And the only way to beat them in a duel is to use range to interrupt casts so… do it!
6.) Devouring Plague. It helps a lot. I wouldn’t say it’s necessarily “required”, since I only have to use cd’s on good frost mages to beat them. Against most, it’s relatively easy to maintain range and avoid damage. But yes, I would consider it a necessity if you’re dueling good frost mages.
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Download the video here: http://files.filefront.com/Noxn+FrostMageFightswmv/;9729874;/fileinfo.html
There are 3 clips in the video.
Length: 4 min 33 sec
Size: 74.9 MB
Track is listed at the end of the video.
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Now, since I was too lazy to edit a commentary into the video, I’ll explain them here!
Fight #1 — Shadow Priest Win
It was a solid start, but I wasn’t really expecting the double Polymorph. I was saving trinket in case I got my holy school locked with a nova on me. Notice after the first Frostbolt, I dispel it off myself _before Imagez gets out of range of his pet_. This is so I can get a fear off on both him and his elemental.
As the fight goes on, also notice that I prioritize keeping myself alive over doing damage to imagez. Self dispels before offensive dispels against Frost Mages. He was also smart not to Ice Block my Devouring Plague, because he knew a Silence was waiting for him right as he got out. Unfortunately, when I do Silence a bit later, it misses his Frostbolt cause I’m awful, but it would have been a good Silence if it hit.
When he Ice Blocks, I take that time to move to his pet to get another fear off. Now is the time when I try to put out my damage. Now that all of his shields are down, he has 0 pushback resistance. I take advantage of this by putting my Shadowfiend on him, giving me time to either damage him or recover from a burst (there wasn’t much burst in this fight).
A few seconds later, when I get Imp CS’ed in a nova, there’s nothing I can do, so I take that time to get off a wand shot so as to not waste a GCD or two. When I see his elemental is down, I take that time to get a couple of bandage ticks off so he’s pressured more into breaking the channeling with an Ice Lance.
And finally, mind flay a bit and killed him. It was a lot better than the next two fights…
Fight #2 — Shadow Priest Barely Win
I’m going to be honest here, I probably would have lost this one if I didn’t resist the Frostbolt at the end. We’ll never know if it would’ve crit or not though!
At the beginning, he faked the Polymorph, then was going to get a full duration one on me, so I used Silence so I wouldn’t get caught in a burst situation. After his next Polymorph, I trinket, dispel once, then try to get range.
He Ice Blocks my DoTs, knowing his Freeze was down so he couldn’t catch up to me, and my Silence was down from earlier. I use this time to pop Devouring Plague on him.
As the fight progresses, notice that I’m constantly keeping my HP in a safe zone. I can get mana back from Shadowfiend, so mana isn’t that big of a concern right now. Looking back, I should have dispelled the Nigh Invulnerability Belt (and Dampen Magic earlier), but I was being really safe with my HP.
During my second Silence, I try to recover. Noticing his shield is down again, I put my Shadowfiend on him, fake a Mind Flay, and bandage during the Imp CS. Now I try to dispel the Frostbolt off myself to get another fear on him, but he novas and makes me waste more of my mana dispelling. Since I’m oom, low on HP, and out of ways to regen mana, wanding is the only way to finish him off so I try to gain range and wand when I can. Eventually, it comes down to a DoT + Wand vs. a Frostbolt. And I resist the frostbolt lulz!
Fight #3 — Mage Win
In the third fight, once again he fakes the first poly and tries to get a full duration one on me, so I silence him and _should have_ used this time to DoT him up. For some reason, I thought he was going to Ice Block my VT, so I faked it. Really bad decision and I’m awful (oh yeah I messed up like 50 times in this fight lol!), but anyway…
Knowing he was going to Poly again, and I wouldn’t be able to get a wand off in time, I got off a tick of Mind Flay. If he had Dampen Magic or a shield on, I would have used that time to get another dispel off though.
His polymorph procced a focus, and I saw an opportunity to waste it, so I trinketted the poly. I saw another one coming, so I saved my GCD to SW:D it. He didn’t think I’d hit it, so he instantly summoned his pet, giving me a free fear on it. Unfortunately he Ice Blocked it so it only got the pet. >.<
This is when I try to regain distance on him and let my DoTs do the work. Unfortunately his next Frostbolt procced Frostbite, so he got a free Ice Lance for 1800 on me his next GCD.
Then I try to get more distance, and… then I just die.
<3 u
Anonymous said this on March 1st, 2008 at 2:52 am
opening with a poly in a duel vs shadowpriest makes little sense tbh
kaizhi said this on March 1st, 2008 at 4:14 am
yea since those games i stopped, haven’t dueled a shadow priest worth the effort until noxn, but now i fireblast + fake sheep to bait the SW:D and go from there
images said this on March 1st, 2008 at 4:55 am
But why mage didn’t used spellsteal? For me spellsteal is big problem because they steal evrything that on me - and they i’ve to dispell it from them.Even used 1 rank power word:shield
Deused said this on March 1st, 2008 at 7:59 am
you wont get the best idea from those few matches, but many of the fights i (the mage) come down to very little mana, and if i run oom its games over, ~700 mana per spell steal is far too expensive, it may be more viable next patch, but its usually not worth the global and mana
images said this on March 1st, 2008 at 8:05 am
Noxn, I saw you are useing 4/5 Silent Resolve.
Now I don’t know if the rumours are true, but people have been reporting a bug that it also increases the dispellresistance of things like frostbite (and maybe freeze/nova etc) on yourself aswell.
I do know this shouldn’t happen, and if it happens its a bug…
Have you got any expierence with this? Its my main reason for not speccing into it atm allthough I’d like to.
Akuhei said this on March 1st, 2008 at 2:59 pm
was really disapointed with the video
-first of all the mage is undergeared compared to you
-second he opens with a poly lol thats the worst way he can waste his time he also tries it each duel no variation in the dules at all except in one he uses grenades and engi belt lol
- he doesnt use a second set of cds
- he stays alot of with dots and doesnt block on silence
- if he s so keen on sheeping he should be spellstealing he has a mana jewel and evocate for mana problems.
nihilsinedio said this on March 1st, 2008 at 3:37 pm
(L) @ teh oldskewl music
dr0l3 said this on March 1st, 2008 at 5:30 pm
nihilsinedio a3 944 spell damage means undergeared?What you expect him to have?
And how do you imagine mage evocate-it in duels?It’ really interesting.
Deused said this on March 1st, 2008 at 6:24 pm
nihilsenidio– a few things:
The mage wasn’t undergeared, he has 944 +dmg with the Invulnerability Belt on. I think he also has an Icon, so he would have over 1k damage with all of his +dmg PvP gear on. If he doesn’t use the Icon, he’d have on the Electro something from Karazhan. He has Full Vengeful, Vindicators, ring enchants, and like.. everything. >.< I don’t see how you could have thought he was undergeared?
I’m not going to disagree with starting with Polymorph. However, if he does manage to get one off, it completely screws the shadow priest at the beginning.
If any frost mage has to use a second set of CD’s against a shadow priest in an open area, then something is seriously wrong. The match is slightly leaned towards the frost mage in SP vs. Frost Mage, and very much so if the SP isn’t undead and the frost mage is good. :\ I don’t know how you expect a shadow priest to beat a good frost mage who uses 2 sets of CD’s, regardless of how good the shadow priest is.
I’m not sure what the next point means, but he does Ice Block silences.
That’s a good point, but Spellstealing still isn’t a good idea. Also, notice that he did use mana gems in I think two of the fights, so he was already pressured on mana even without blowing large amounts on spellsteal.
Basically, spellsteal has two purposes: to remove buffs off the priest for future spellsteals in the fight, or to make more dispel buffers for the priest to offensively dispel off the mage. Taking into consideration that Spellsteal only steals one buff for a huge amount of mana, and he still has to deal with dispel resists, and Dispel gets rid of 2 buffs for much less mana, it’s not hard for the SP to “recover” from the spellsteals.
None of the buffs are particularly useful for the mage in that fight either — shadow prot is negated by spell penetration, fort doesn’t give him health, it just adds it on to his max pool, and inner fire / touch of weakness I don’t have to explain.
If he’s doing it to clear buffs for Spellsteals later in the fight, I’d just do what I do vs. shaman and Shield/Mending right as something is about to hit me (Frostbolt, Ice Lance, Lightning Bolt, Shock, etc.). Then if he ever steals Renew, I can just dispel it off him (and lol rank 1 renew!).
Going back to the mana thing, if he’s constantly spellstealing me I’d just play it like a disc priest, and Mana Burn him. On shadow cs’s, I’d just spam heal myself. It would honestly only take a few mana burns to completely cripple him though, after all of the mana he wasted on spellstealing.
I guess it’s kind of hard to explain, and I know I didn’t do very well with it, but the bottom line is, spellstealing is NOT a good idea.
edit: And if he Evocations in a duel, it just gives me lots of time to recover (be it healing up, redotting, bandaging, or running way to eat/drink). And it opens him up to a fear.
noxn said this on March 1st, 2008 at 6:31 pm
So, as a troll priest, I should disregard this, no?
WTB DP~
Muricas said this on March 1st, 2008 at 8:17 pm
Awesome vid, thanks for sharing! Quick question though - what is the mod that you’re using which shows when your target’s cooldowns are up?
Lolsmite said this on March 2nd, 2008 at 4:37 am
Noxn, good post. I don’t think we can beat a mage willing to pop Cold Snap though, so IMO it’s not that balanced, but its a duel I love too.
Now, I’ve been struggling to get a good 4DPS going. If you have nothing better to write on in the next post, could you make one about a shadow priest in 5v5? Targets, swaps, cooldown usage…
Ty, very nice blog
PS: On the gems topic you said you’re getting spell dmg/int gems. I have 3 spell dmg/hit and 2 spell dmg/int heroic gems on my bank, and since we have 4 yellow slots on gear (the 5th goes to +10 resil), how would be the best combination?
kelberott said this on March 2nd, 2008 at 2:12 pm
<3 Noxn
WTB third chapter though! im dying in my pants waiting for it
McDurgle01 said this on March 3rd, 2008 at 1:25 am
i had 3 duels vs a mage last night (2 nagrand, 1 bem), and normally i lol mages to death with dots, los and heals. but this guy used a strat i havent seen before, HE would los kite me, wait for nove + imp cs CDs to be up, then when i have to chase him to dot him.. he novas me around a los (probably my 500ms ping working against me there) then imp CS me, then frost bolt + ice land + shatter me then run back out of los and wait for cds again.
if i ever tried to change los pillar and pull him into open, he’d just eat /drink, and even with my arena water, i couldnt generate the same effect as him.
got any suggestions?
the only thought i have is try fighting more in the open like u did here, but that gives him an advantage, and my high ping hurts again
manifestor said this on March 3rd, 2008 at 2:56 am
Noxn, what’s up with the mages trying to polymorph you all the time? There’s really no use in that.
For when mages don’t start with polymorph:
IMO the best way for a mage to start on you is to pop WE right before the duel starts, and cs + unload the nuking. This mostly gets me to 50% hp before I can even cast a spell (11,6k hp buffed, 451 resi), if I don’t:
- trinket the nova
- silence (same time as cs, since we both spam it).
Trinketing the nova imo is a bad idea, sinc you’ll need it later on when you might be either cssed, debufstacked or too low on hp to afford a dispel.
When you’ve got the silence in first, you can choose to either:
- dispel the mage, and dot him
- dispel the mage, and fear the pet
- nuke the pet, and go on alone vs the mage
Here, nuking the pet would be the best option, since it always has 3k hp, and if you fear the pet, you’ll be out of cc’s for quite some time. If you don’t get rid of the pet, it’ll do too much cc, and your fear will be rendered quite useless vs a good mage (who’ll stay away from you).
If you don’t get the silence off earlier, I’d nuke the pet anyway imo.
Aren’t mages dealing with you in this way?
Daize said this on March 4th, 2008 at 12:10 am
The mages I fight use arcane missiles if they see me trying to run out of range. The also use it during MSD focus procs, which is just evil imho.
skullz said this on March 5th, 2008 at 1:34 am
also makes no sense to use AM against shadowpriests kiting you
you pay full mana cost upfront, but only deal a fraction of the damage if they do manage to outrange you during the cast
also noxn come back to irc ;o
Kaizhi said this on March 5th, 2008 at 5:38 am
I think it’s funny people try to lecture the top rated sPriest on how to pvp. GG
Bring on Chapter 3!
MnilinM said this on March 7th, 2008 at 5:23 pm
how do you beat an [UD] holypriest / [UD] rogue as nightelfs?
fozzy said this on March 7th, 2008 at 9:25 pm
can u make video VS rogue ?
Noxn_fan said this on March 9th, 2008 at 9:55 pm
WTB new entry
lottoafk said this on March 10th, 2008 at 6:36 pm
“I think it’s funny people try to lecture the top rated sPriest on how to pvp. GG
Bring on Chapter 3!”
Because ratings can’t tell you how much skill a player possesses in and of themselves. That’s why. Besides, Noxn doesn’t seem to have a problem with people criticising his play. In fact, he’s his own worst critic. A little less hero worship and a lot more critical thinking would help the priest community fight the nerfs. We can’t let a few high rated priests distort what is actually happening to this class.
That all being said. Thanks, Noxn, for this blog. Yet another nice resource for those who want to better their game. /salute
Domenico said this on March 19th, 2008 at 9:42 pm
“A little less hero worship and a lot more critical thinking would help the priest community fight the nerfs.”
Deal with what you get and roll with it. THAT’s how this guy’s as good as he is. Besides, I don’t know about you, but I didn’t get into sPriests until I saw Noxn’s videos. So yeah, a bit of hero worship can’t hurt anyone.
Nictus said this on March 20th, 2008 at 5:41 pm